Topic: Quad electro static speakers. (Read 5126 times)

chrisgixer · « **on:** 30 June 2015, 19:02:45 »

Anyone familiar with these?

Now don't be a wise arse and go off googling, well you can but say so if you did. I just wondered if there's any hifi buffs and general interest on here.

Have acquired a pair of said items. 57s or are they 55s. Doesn't seem to matter, having googled $:-\$

VXL V6 · « **Reply #1 on:** 30 June 2015, 19:17:06 »

Way out of my league. Mind you, all of my HiFi separates have been stored in the parents loft for the last eight or so years so maybe when Mrs VXL and I finally find another house she might just let me..... ......no she wont let me lets be honest and my amp couldn't do those speakers justice.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #2 on:** 30 June 2015, 19:22:08 »

There's talk of more peerfull amps blowing them. As I recall, as my Dad has a pair, they are more known for their subtle detail than outright house shaking. Loud no doubt, but not as loud as the size might suggest. He's always VERY careful not to give them too much welly. Although that might be due to their age. $:-\$

biggriffin · « **Reply #3 on:** 30 June 2015, 20:25:37 »

They build them round these ere parts(or did) along with mission aswell,

D · « **Reply #4 on:** 30 June 2015, 20:58:54 »

Have you actually got a pair of ESL57's?

What are you driving them with?

Bigron · « **Reply #5 on:** 30 June 2015, 21:45:52 »

I nearly had a pair of those back in the 70s, but went for Tannoy Yorks instead, simply on bass performance after protracted auditioning at audio fairs.
The Quads are bipolar speakers and radiate from the rear just as much as from the front, so need very careful positioning to get their full, if limited, bass performance; but their detailing is second to none.
They really have to be driven by a Quad amplifier, as they present a very complex load and not all amps remain stable when driving into them. I suggest a Quad 33/303 pre and main amp combination.
Quad became aware of these short-comings and launched the replacement ELS63 (guess in which year?) with an improved electrostatic section in a phase-delayed concentric-ring configuration for even better detailing, plus fast-acting protection for the speakers in the event of overload.
They will still never achieve "Meat Loaf" friendly volume levels, but your neighbours will love you and if you are more concerned about the music for itself rather than showing off, you will be a happy bunny - Quad are all about the music.......

Ron.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #6 on:** 30 June 2015, 21:58:22 »

Quote from: D on 30 June 2015, 20:58:54

Have you actually got a pair of ESL57's?

What are you driving them with?

A fork lift at the moment

Kettle leads are currently missing. Only thing I have is a home cinema amp.

...or later, possibly a Beosound 9000?

?

chrisgixer · « **Reply #7 on:** 30 June 2015, 22:01:35 »

Quote from: Bigron on 30 June 2015, 21:45:52

I nearly had a pair of those back in the 70s, but went for Tannoy Yorks instead, simply on bass performance after protracted auditioning at audio fairs.
The Quads are bipolar speakers and radiate from the rear just as much as from the front, so need very careful positioning to get their full, if limited, bass performance; but their detailing is second to none.
They really have to be driven by a Quad amplifier, as they present a very complex load and not all amps remain stable when driving into them. I suggest a Quad 33/303 pre and main amp combination.
Quad became aware of these short-comings and launched the replacement ELS63 (guess in which year?) with an improved electrostatic section in a phase-delayed concentric-ring configuration for even better detailing, plus fast-acting protection for the speakers in the event of overload.
They will still never achieve "Meat Loaf" friendly volume levels, but your neighbours will love you and if you are more concerned about the music for itself rather than showing off, you will be a happy bunny - Quad are all about the music.......

Ron.

Thanks Ron. I can't tell exactly what model they are, as the name plate on the back gives no clue. $:-\$ black grills though.

Bigron · « **Reply #8 on:** 30 June 2015, 22:08:19 »

If they look like room heaters and you feel as if you could stand in front of them and warm your arse, they are the early ones!

Ron.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #9 on:** 30 June 2015, 22:33:09 »

Yep, radiators.

Not the early 55's but late 57's going by this. Year of manufture? Think I see a pattern forming.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Quad_Electrostatic_Loudspeaker

Bigron · « **Reply #10 on:** 30 June 2015, 22:59:30 »

Yep, they are the "face-lift" models; the originals were a sort-of goldy/browny mixture.
What amplifier/pre-amp do you plan to use, Chris?

Ron.

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #11 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:02:50 »

Very nice, Chris.

They sound extremely good, with a couple of caviats, IME.

They don't go that deep in the bass department, but the bass they do do is so fast and tight you might not care. You might prefer to run a subwoofer to help them out in that regard according to taste and what the room can handle.

They need a bit of space around them and the "sweet spot" where the stereo image is best is quite small.

They can be awkward to drive, so a decent amp is a must.

Don't overdrive them.

The diaphragms can need attention occasionally, as can the high voltage power supply.

Be happy to take a look over them if you are nervous about firing them up.

They are a bit of a marmite thing, but well worth a try at getting them sounding good.

If you don't like them, give me first refusal.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #12 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:05:47 »

Quote from: Bigron on 30 June 2015, 22:59:30

Yep, they are the "face-lift" models; the originals were a sort-of goldy/browny mixture.
What amplifier/pre-amp do you plan to use, Chris?

Ron.

Only have a Sony strdn1040 $:-\$

Suitable? Don't want to over power them.

http://www.sony.co.uk/electronics/av-receivers/str-dn1040

....I don't actually know if they work. Do they have thin membranes or some issue? Polythene?

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #13 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:06:42 »

Did I mention that I have a quad 405?

chrisgixer · « **Reply #14 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:11:05 »

Quote from: Kevin Wood on 30 June 2015, 23:02:50

Very nice, Chris.

They sound extremely good, with a couple of caviats, IME.

They don't go that deep in the bass department, but the bass they do do is so fast and tight you might not care. You might prefer to run a subwoofer to help them out in that regard according to taste and what the room can handle.

They need a bit of space around them and the "sweet spot" where the stereo image is best is quite small.

They can be awkward to drive, so a decent amp is a must.

Don't overdrive them.

The diaphragms can need attention occasionally, as can the high voltage power supply.

Be happy to take a look over them if you are nervous about firing them up.

They are a bit of a marmite thing, but well worth a try at getting them sounding good.

If you don't like them, give me first refusal.

Ayup. Kevs on.

As mentioned earlier, my Dad has a pair. Either side of the fire place. B and o amp iirc. Huge great thing.

He had a pair of acoustic research speakers. Little corner shaped things, weighed a ton. But no2 son blew them with said amp.

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #15 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:11:59 »

Quote from: chrisgixer on 30 June 2015, 23:05:47

....I don't actually know if they work. Do they have thin membranes or some issue? Polythene?

Instead of having cones that are driven in and out by an electromagnet, as in a conventional speaker, they have very light plastic membranes which are alternately attracted to and repelled from conductive meshes by a high voltage signal derived from the amplifier output.

This eliminates a lot of the distortions caused by conventional speakers, and adds a few quirks of its' own. But, the membranes can become damaged by the high driving voltage flashing over, or can be contaminated with dust.

They also need a mains supply because a high voltage "bias" voltage needs to be applied to charge the membranes before they will behave in the way described.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #16 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:18:25 »

Yes sounds familiar actually. Think Dad had his referbished due to some issues.

The owner of these had the Beosound 9000 as his main unit. Not sure where these where positioned in the room. They may have been surplus to requirements and he just refused to let them go. I'll ask the family if the kettle leads are around.

Of course, your more than welcome to come and play. Do they require a certain amp type or is it just a quality / safety concern...?

chrisgixer · « **Reply #17 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:19:50 »

Suspect they could do with the grills off and a clean. They have that aroma of dry dust about them. Or is that just the wooden innards?

Bigron · « **Reply #18 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:23:18 »

UNLESS you have a Quad amplifier (303 or 405), limit the amplifier power to about 10 watts - they don't require much power to drive them anyway as they are voltage-driven. Too high a drive voltage and you can get flash-over inside the speakers, maybe killing both speakers and amplifier.
Yes, they are difficult to drive, position and even live with, but in the right location and circumstances they are wonderful!
But all the above difficulties ware why I opted for my Tannoy Yorks, large bass reflex cabinets with 15 inch dual-concentric motor units with a very solid and precise sound image - ALMOST as good as the Quads.......

Ron.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #19 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:29:32 »

Quote from: Kevin Wood on 30 June 2015, 23:06:42

Did I mention that I have a quad 405?

Woo. Tell me more...

Designed for the quads?

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #20 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:39:55 »

Yes.. ish.

The issue with amps is that the impedance of the electrostatic speakers drops at high frequencies, which is the opposite of the behaviour of most conventional speakers, so some amplifiers struggle to drive them even though they require only modest power.
Another issue is that they have a draconian protection circuit which crowbars the output of the amplifier if the air around the panel starts the ionise, the precursor to a flashover. This requires good current limiting in the amplifier or it can go pop.

And yes, they can be damaged by too much power quite easily, and modern amps are much more powerful than what was around when they came out. (as is the Quad 405, but there was a way of limiting its' output)

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #21 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:42:51 »

This is how to do it, by the way:

chrisgixer · « **Reply #22 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:51:26 »

Quad quads

Seen some mounted over and under in a rack. Bit 60's looking but imagine the sound.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #23 on:** 30 June 2015, 23:52:09 »

55's presumably?

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #24 on:** 01 July 2015, 00:00:01 »

57's IIRC, with some software to generate 4 channels from 2 by adding delays and mixing a little. Makes that sweet spot a bit larger.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #25 on:** 01 July 2015, 00:05:56 »

Interesting to hear how they compare to more modern stuff. In the same room with the same source. My home cinema speakers aren't anything special but Dads always fairly impressed with the sound. Generally he keeps commenting on how good modern speakers are but I wondered, after a certain point, if it was the source that was key. He was very much a vinyl man. Until CD/DVD arrived.

...and by arrived I mean in his life, not "on the market"

Marks DTM Calib · « **Reply #26 on:** 01 July 2015, 08:34:07 »

Good modern speakers are.....very good.

The old electrostatic speakers setups I always found worked best on a valve amp and vinyl source mainly due to the rich (read even harmonic distortion) of the amp and the fact that vinyl was always very much more crisp in the top end. The problem with the valve amps was always the crowbar protection tended to goose the output stages if it kicked in however, they do tend to handle the odd impedance characteristics better and output power is usually fairly low.

This makes them a bit of a niche but gives some variation to the modern over precise sounds we are used to with CD and Mosfet amps.

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #27 on:** 01 July 2015, 09:58:23 »

Sources and amplification have pretty much "been done" these days IMHO, unless you're talking about vinyl, where the source is electromechanical, so you have some interaction between turntable and its' suspension, the tone arm and the cartridge to play with. You can spend and spend on the latter and get little improvements. Depends where you want to stop!

Get a few competent digital sources together and you'll struggle to hear much between them. The same is true of amplification. I went to a hi-fi gathering a few weeks ago where we must have listened to half a dozen amps, both valve and solid state. Really, the only thing you could glean was slightly looser bass on some of the valve amps. Oh, and smoke coming out of one of the older solid state ones! Still sounded good, mind.

I've heard quads with both valve and solid state amplification and I think they actually work well with either. The great thing about them is that there's very little colouration in the midrange, where a conventional speaker has to have a cross over somewhere in this region, and the effects can be difficult to hide, because that's where our hearing is the most sensitive. Quads don't do the extremes of bass or treble that well, so can sound a bit "old fashioned". You can always add a tweeter to extend the HF response and the aforementioned sub, of course.

They are kinder to valve amplification because they don't need a lot of damping, something that can cause valve amps to sound a bit muddy in the bass. I've never heard valve amps deliver bass as "fast" as with ESL57s.

The most important factor is how the speaker and room interact, though, especially for dipole designs like the ESL. Put the best speaker you can buy in a room that doesn't suit it and it won't sound great.

Bigron · « **Reply #28 on:** 01 July 2015, 10:34:23 »

Mark, I always like your well-presented and reasoned input, so I'm not sure if I'm disagreeing with you here or not.....
"The old electrostatic speakers setups I always found worked best on a valve amp and vinyl source mainly due to the rich (read even harmonic distortion) of the amp"
...but my understanding is that even harmonics are cancellelled in the push-pull output transformer of a valve amplifier, leaving only the fundamental (of course!) and the nicer-sounding odd harmonics which do not spoil the enjoyment like the harsher even harmonics. Psycho-aural experts will be able to explain why: I can't!

Ron.

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #29 on:** 01 July 2015, 10:40:40 »

My view:

The distortion signature of a push pull valve amplifier with negative feedback isn't that different to a solid state amplifier IME, although there will inevitably be more distortion there, assuming both are competent designs.

But.. many valve aficionados will argue that going push pull negates all the "benefits" of a valve amp and that you should use a single ended triode without feedback. Then you have even order distortion in spades!

Marks DTM Calib · « **Reply #30 on:** 01 July 2015, 10:52:25 »

Quote from: Bigron on 01 July 2015, 10:34:23

Mark, I always like your well-presented and reasoned input, so I'm not sure if I'm disagreeing with you here or not.....
"The old electrostatic speakers setups I always found worked best on a valve amp and vinyl source mainly due to the rich (read even harmonic distortion) of the amp"
...but my understanding is that even harmonics are cancellelled in the push-pull output transformer of a valve amplifier, leaving only the fundamental (of course!) and the nicer-sounding odd harmonics which do not spoil the enjoyment like the harsher even harmonics. Psycho-aural experts will be able to explain why: I can't!

Ron.

The problem is Ron that it will only cancel at certain frequencies due to the real world fact that the transformer has inductance and hence a far from linear frequency response. Consequently it still gets through

Bigron · « **Reply #31 on:** 01 July 2015, 11:17:46 »

Mark, I am fearful of hi-jacking this topic for an esoteric debate on a non-Omega topic, but the THD produced by a good vale amplifier, especially if it has an Ultra-Linear output transformer configuration, would be better than 1% across the spectrum - unless overloaded!
My greater concern regarding the effects of non-linearity in the output stage(s) would be the creation of IM products, which even to my old ears would be more noticeable.

However, I think I hate you because you have got me considering making a Mullard 5-20 valve amplifier! Now, where will I get the valves, decent transformer....where did I put my old Q-Max cutter?............

Ron.

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #32 on:** 01 July 2015, 11:37:44 »

Watford Valves
Langrex
etc.

Canterbury Windings
Sowter (deep breath as you open your wallet!)
Danbury
etc...

Can't help you on that one.

In that order.

I built a pair of 5-20 clone monoblocks about 15-20 years ago. They are still languishing in the loft. THD was about 0.05% at 1KHz and rated output, IIRC.

Bigron · « **Reply #33 on:** 01 July 2015, 11:53:16 »

Thanks Kevin. Um, I'm guessing my pension won't run to those items AND keep my Omega alive! Ah well...........

Ron.

Marks DTM Calib · « **Reply #34 on:** 01 July 2015, 11:58:23 »

Quote from: Bigron on 01 July 2015, 11:17:46

Mark, I am fearful of hi-jacking this topic for an esoteric debate on a non-Omega topic, but the THD produced by a good vale amplifier, especially if it has an Ultra-Linear output transformer configuration, would be better than 1% across the spectrum - unless overloaded!
My greater concern regarding the effects of non-linearity in the output stage(s) would be the creation of IM products, which even to my old ears would be more noticeable.

However, I think I hate you because you have got me considering making a Mullard 5-20 valve amplifier! Now, where will I get the valves, decent transformer....where did I put my old Q-Max cutter?............

Ron.

No no, its all good and interesting, its been a flipping age (read to long!) since the grey matter considered audio design!

The distortion and harmonics are obviously very dependent on the output stage as you stated earlier, a push pull with (overpriced) top notch output transformer will cancel many of the even harmonics problem. Trouble is that the THD is not a great measure of performance as its does not allow for the reality of higher order harmonics sounding bad when compared to the lower order portions (I noted many moons ago some companies adding a square law type approach to the weighting but, I suspect it got a bit difficult for many to understand).

If your considering building an amp, there are some reasonable kits out there for not to much money which are good starting points plus, the Russians are still building reasonably quality valves.

A did knock together an amp with a Valve (2A3) based pre-amp stage followed by a nice rugged Mosfet output stage which worked pretty well.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #35 on:** 01 July 2015, 12:13:31 »

Aaaah a nice technical thread

If only I understood even 1/5th if it

Bigron · « **Reply #36 on:** 01 July 2015, 12:26:09 »

Some say that nostalgia is best left in the past, but I cut my teeth on valve circuits so this topic has given me a warm, cuddly feeling!

I do agree with your comments, though, especially concerning the unbalnced ratio between orders of harmonics. so we ARE on the same page, basically. Still in regard to the Quads, unless you spend that fortune that we don't have of top-notch transformers, I reluctantly admit that a decent MOSFET amplifier would win on transient response, which the ESLs would capitalise on.

Chris, I can only apologise that you feel left out; I used to teach Electronics, so I could start a fresh class for you? I dare not waste any more Forum time explaining harmonics, distortion, non-linearity and intermodulation products, all of which are factors affecting audio quality - please accept that good values in each of these parameters cost lots of beer vouchers to achieve!

Ron.

Marks DTM Calib · « **Reply #37 on:** 01 July 2015, 12:48:47 »

They certainly do on valve amps!

Less so on solid stage thankfully where a good PSU will cost double that of a good output stage.

I have in the loft an S5 K12M which, despite some of its short comings (which make it interesting as they can be improved on), was reasonable money for what it is.

Bigron · « **Reply #38 on:** 01 July 2015, 13:27:15 »

Yes, and really nudging into another area - valve amps for guitarists....perfect?
We both know the reason, but I'm not expanding on that for fear of alienating most of the membership....apart from Essex Big Al, who is a fine player. My Tannoy Yorks would suit him down to the ground, but he ain't 'aving 'em!

Ron.

Marks DTM Calib · « **Reply #39 on:** 01 July 2015, 13:34:36 »

Give the softer 'clipping' characteristics of a valve compared to the hardness of a solid state version, they clearly have a key place on a hard driven guitar amp or a distortion unit (although a good old diode in an opamp feedback loop is pretty reasonable!)

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #40 on:** 01 July 2015, 14:00:17 »

Back when I was still at school our window cleaner was a guitarist. Something he spotted in my bedroom window (probably the bloody great Tektronix 546 oscilloscope or the ham radio gear!) prompted him to ask if I was any good at fixing valve amps.

Well, how hard can it be, so I said yes. The next week he turned up with a 100W Marshall stack, much to my parents' delight.

An hour or two probing around identified the faulty valve and off it went.

Cue a phone to my mate who, unlike me, actually had some musical talent, and a guitar.

"Guess what I've got here?..."
"Right. I'll be over. I'm bringing my guitar"

chrisgixer · « **Reply #41 on:** 01 July 2015, 14:20:38 »

Oh that's quite alright Ron. The other guys know full well, there's no point explaining these things to me in such detail as I need to be hands on, from scratch, to take these things in properly and understand them. Sadly I have had so little need for electronics in my life that I have sub zero experience of it. Explaining to me would need another server in TB's office I think.

But I do trust the end results of these conversations so please, fire away

chrisgixer · « **Reply #42 on:** 01 July 2015, 14:26:17 »

...although I'm sort of picking some of it.

Bigron · « **Reply #43 on:** 01 July 2015, 16:57:45 »

Marks, it's not the clipping characteristics that guitarists love - so I'm told, anyway, I ain't a musician, I can only play the fool - it's the massive reserve for short durations as when a string, particularly bass string, is plucked. Because of the space charge in the output valves, the peak-to-average power ratio is very high and allows for a high dynamic range and hence an impressive performance.
I hope any guitarists on here will chip in and confirm or deny the above, please?

Kevin, what a day for nostalgia! In my early days as a design engineer, those Tektronix 'scopes were like Rolls Royces; we had TWO of them, but we still fought over them!

Thanks for your forbearance and comments, Chris. I do understand your difficulty from what many of my students have said, along the lines of - "Well, we can't see what's going on insude electronic things like we can in the mechanical workshops".

Ron.

Rods2 · « **Reply #44 on:** 01 July 2015, 18:06:30 »

Quote from: Bigron on 01 July 2015, 16:57:45

Marks, it's not the clipping characteristics that guitarists love - so I'm told, anyway, I ain't a musician, I can only play the fool - it's the massive reserve for short durations as when a string, particularly bass string, is plucked. Because of the space charge in the output valves, the peak-to-average power ratio is very high and allows for a high dynamic range and hence an impressive performance.
I hope any guitarists on here will chip in and confirm or deny the above, please?

Kevin, what a day for nostalgia! In my early days as a design engineer, those Tektronix 'scopes were like Rolls Royces; we had TWO of them, but we still fought over them!

Thanks for your forbearance and comments, Chris. I do understand your difficulty from what many of my students have said, along the lines of - "Well, we can't see what's going on insude electronic things like we can in the mechanical workshops".

Ron.

Always a central part of my life, when designing computers working for the MOD. Storage scopes were really useful for capturing and analysing what was going on.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #45 on:** 02 July 2015, 21:40:57 »

Well, kettle leads are no more. So need to source those.

Looking forward to firing these up.

Bigron · « **Reply #46 on:** 02 July 2015, 22:33:54 »

No old computers with spare leads, Chris? I think Poundland still do them, if not. Please report back on how you get on.
Promise me that you won't listen to the "reproduction", listen to the music - that is what Quads are all about.

Ron.

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #47 on:** 03 July 2015, 05:56:04 »

I have a feeling the Quads don't have standard IEC mains cables. Trying to remember. $:-\$

Oh, and I still have the 546, hgave managed to keep it in working order and still fire it up every so often. Not usually at this time of year, mind. My study in the loft gets quite hot enough without all those valves - 500 watts worth! Due to the mammouth tube it has a much brighter, clearer trace than any other analogue scope I have access to, and the large front panel means the controls are easier to locate IMHO.

Bigron · « **Reply #48 on:** 03 July 2015, 09:35:21 »

Kevin, stop making me feel old! In my early engineering days, those 'scopes were the first ones I had ever come across with dual timebases and they fascinated me, as a teenager, the way I could use the "A delayed by B" function to examine a small part of a complex waveform.
Nowadays such features are commonplace, of course, and with much less heat!
I have no idea how much it cost, but annual maintenance by Livingstone Laboratories (do you know them) used to take the 'scope, clean it in an ultrasonic bath, replace all of the valves, regardless, and calibrate it fully. The plug-in Y-Amplifiers were terrific, too - such high quality construction.
I do apologise to members for this piece of self-indulgent nostalgia.....

Ron.

D · « **Reply #49 on:** 04 July 2015, 11:07:36 »

Didnt they use bulgin plugs. I think the latter ones had IEC conectors? Or perhaps the IEC was a owner retrofit? A lot of these are modified by previous owners.

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #50 on:** 06 July 2015, 15:00:27 »

Quote from: D on 04 July 2015, 11:07:36

Didnt they use bulgin plugs.

I think you might be right.

Rods2 · « **Reply #51 on:** 06 July 2015, 15:39:37 »

Something like this?

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Quad-Hi-Fi-Equipment-Power-Plug-Bulgin-3-Pole-Pin-Mini-Plug-CN102a-/160652493769?_trksid=p2141725.m3641.l6368

chrisgixer · « **Reply #52 on:** 07 July 2015, 21:58:52 »

Thanks Rods. But normal kettle plug type leads.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #53 on:** 07 July 2015, 22:02:18 »

Presumably a newer pair.

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #54 on:** 07 July 2015, 22:39:51 »

Quote from: chrisgixer on 07 July 2015, 22:02:18

Presumably a newer pair.

Or someone has modified them. Good news, because they are much easier to get hold of. Got a stack of them hanging up here...

chrisgixer · « **Reply #55 on:** 07 July 2015, 22:54:12 »

Found one.

Do they take one lead each or are they wired in series...?

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #56 on:** 07 July 2015, 23:49:49 »

One lead each into a mains socket.

They can take a while to charge the panels fully after powering up, so turn them on then grab a cuppa before starting to listen to them.

If they've been stored in cold or damp conditions, give them a day in the house before powering them too.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #57 on:** 07 July 2015, 23:53:59 »

Ooh. So I could fire one up? Banana jacks. Craplins? Just over the road from work.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #58 on:** 07 July 2015, 23:54:44 »

There's a plug setting on the back in the pic. Presume that's correct at 240 volts?

chrisgixer · « **Reply #59 on:** 08 July 2015, 00:04:16 »

http://www.maplin.co.uk/p/maplin-gold-plated-banana-plug-red-l72az?gclid=CL_8jMGQysYCFUjHtAodZ4YDmw

?

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #60 on:** 08 July 2015, 09:35:34 »

Yep, something like that will do.

Make sure they are both set for 240 volts.
Connect the banana plugs to your amp and wire up as for a normal speaker.
Power them up and let them charge up for a few minutes. If you get any crackly arcing sounds, strong smells of ozone or if there's any smoke turn them off, obviously.

Once they've been on a few minutes, play some music and advance the volume control from nothing until you can hear music. Don't be tempted to crank them up too high, especially until they've been on for 30 minutes or so, as they don't reach full sensitivity until they've been on for a while and this can take even longer if they haven't been used for a while.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #61 on:** 08 July 2015, 18:42:57 »

Right. Power .... ON

Bigron · « **Reply #62 on:** 08 July 2015, 19:11:53 »

I wait with breath abated, Chris!
If no untoward sounds or smells, I agree with Kevin that you wait at least a few hours before offering them a signal; they will still be in a delicate state after the long sabbatical that they have had and will need tender treatment.....

Ron.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #63 on:** 08 July 2015, 19:34:10 »

These need laser sights on the top to get the aim right.

Initially I thought your having a laugh, in comparison to my set up. Empty, week and very quiet.

BUT, tilt them forward with an inch and a half book under the rear foot, move them further apart and aim them DIRECTLY at my arm chair, and yes they do impress.

Accurate, tight as mentioned and within that small aim is an entire band. Easily picked out is each element. Ramble on by Led Zeppelin offers a tappy Tom-toms on the left, guitar on the right, and Robert Plant singing right in the middle where there's no speakers at all.

However... Are they that much better than my current 5.1 set up. Over all? No, the 5.1 gives a slightly fuller more vibrant and FAR wider spread of sound. For general use, no not the quads.

But for personal more selfish use. Like a man cave or personal listening area. Yes, even in simple stereo over the various sound fields in the home cinema.

Source is MP3 over wifi to amp and then quad speakers. Crisp hiss less sound.

Try a CD later.

I am a bit concerned how quiet they are though. They need about a third more volume. $:-\$ (eeek)

chrisgixer · « **Reply #64 on:** 08 July 2015, 19:35:17 »

Quote from: Bigron on 08 July 2015, 19:11:53

I wait with breath abated, Chris!
If no untoward sounds or smells, I agree with Kevin that you wait at least a few hours before offering them a signal; they will still be in a delicate state after the long sabbatical that they have had and will need tender treatment.....

Ron.

Yes steady as she goes.

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #65 on:** 08 July 2015, 23:26:06 »

Yes, the "sweet spot" can be quite small. But within it, and with some Zep playing...

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #66 on:** 08 July 2015, 23:26:40 »

Now try it with a valve amp.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #67 on:** 08 July 2015, 23:40:59 »

Yes I found a PDF owners manual on line that states quite strongle that they should be used with the correct amp, or damage will eventually result.

Dad been using his with a non valve amp for years iirc. With no issues, although I think he had them refurbed a while back. $:-\$

Kevin Wood · « **Reply #68 on:** 08 July 2015, 23:42:39 »

Quote from: chrisgixer on 08 July 2015, 23:40:59

Yes I found a PDF owners manual on line that states quite strongle that they should be used with the correct amp, or damage will eventually result.

Dad been using his with a non valve amp for years iirc. With no issues, although I think he had them refurbed a while back. $:-\$

They'll be fine as long as you don't try to turn them up to nightclub volume levels.

chrisgixer · « **Reply #69 on:** 08 July 2015, 23:48:32 »

Ok good news.

Is the third more volume to achieve similar output levels normal?

News:

Author Topic: Quad electro static speakers. (Read 5126 times)