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Author Topic: The new milk float...  (Read 6590 times)

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Viral_Jim

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The new milk float...
« on: 12 March 2019, 13:09:22 »

Well, its finally here, so far I've driven it exactly 0.3 miles so I don't have much to say other than its ridiculously quiet. Especially since I drove here in the Terracan this morning.  :y

The leasing company managed to ignore my instructions to deliver it fully charged, so according the golf's brain, it has about 120miles of range with the climate set to 19 degrees and my heated seat on. I doubt that this will be an issue as that's 30 more than my daily commute. Plus I am planning to go and play with a motorway charger on the way home. I want to be able to use them and know the app for my phone works before I pull up at one with <10% in the 'tank'!

I took two very quick snaps as its bucketing it down here:
Exterior
Interior

I haven't embedded them as I am not smart enough to know how to resize them  :-\.

Sunday may be the first test of long distance usage. A friend of mine is working at Cheltenham Festival and needs to get back to London, a round trip of c280 miles. So probably 2 rapid charges.

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aaronjb

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #1 on: 12 March 2019, 13:18:38 »

I'll try not to scratch it later when I pick the OH up  ;) :y ;D

On the dash - the right hand gauge is speed, obviously .. but what's the left hand one with the green bit and 0-10? Warp factor?
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Viral_Jim

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #2 on: 12 March 2019, 13:29:27 »

On the dash - the right hand gauge is speed, obviously .. but what's the left hand one with the green bit and 0-10? Warp factor?

When you start the car, the needle goes to 12 o'clock. The green bit on the left shows energy recuperated via braking/deceleration, the right is a percentage of the maximum amount of available power that's being used at any given moment. Ie. if you floor it, it goes all the way over to the 5 o'clock position.

In summary, its a completely pointless gauge that they invented so the cluster can be the same configuration as a standard golf.  ;D
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aaronjb

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #3 on: 12 March 2019, 13:30:37 »

In summary, its a completely pointless gauge that they invented so the cluster can be the same configuration as a standard golf.  ;D

 ;D ;D ;D

Bit like the flappy needle mpg-meter in older BMWs.. but bigger, and with a negative bit, then.
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tunnie

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #4 on: 12 March 2019, 13:34:50 »

Interesting, did you get this on monthly PCP type thing?

120 miles now, what's range when full?
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Viral_Jim

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #5 on: 12 March 2019, 13:36:41 »

;D ;D ;D

Bit like the flappy needle mpg-meter in older BMWs.. but bigger, and with a negative bit, then.

Yup!

For me, I'm only interested in the speed and the range. All the other information is just pointless. It even has a poxy 'fuel gauge' right next to the digital range readout. Again, copied from the regular golf.
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #6 on: 12 March 2019, 13:42:53 »

What do you expect from the automotive group that only fitted two clusters to everything they made from 1972-1987* :D

*obviously a slight exaggeration, but not by much...
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Viral_Jim

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #7 on: 12 March 2019, 13:46:08 »

Interesting, did you get this on monthly PCP type thing?

120 miles now, what's range when full?

Salary sacrifice lease. The net cost is £411 pcm on a 3yr 75,000 mile lease. That's on a "Just add fuel" basis. Given my commute/business mileage is 20-22k per year, I reckon it will cost me about £120pcm more than running the volvo. Assuming there was no unplanned maintenance to pay for on the swede.

Given we are renovating another house in that time, having not to worry about servicing, tyres or anything else would be cheap at twice the price!
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tunnie

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #8 on: 12 March 2019, 13:55:24 »

Interesting, did you get this on monthly PCP type thing?

120 miles now, what's range when full?

Salary sacrifice lease. The net cost is £411 pcm on a 3yr 75,000 mile lease. That's on a "Just add fuel" basis. Given my commute/business mileage is 20-22k per year, I reckon it will cost me about £120pcm more than running the volvo. Assuming there was no unplanned maintenance to pay for on the swede.

Given we are renovating another house in that time, having not to worry about servicing, tyres or anything else would be cheap at twice the price!

I see  :y

So tyres/brakes etc all covered?  You just top it up with electricity? Be interesting to see what your real world range is like.  :)
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #9 on: 12 March 2019, 14:21:21 »



I see  :y

So tyres/brakes etc all covered?  You just top it up with the free work's electricity? Be interesting to see what your real world range is like.  :)

FTFY  :y

Yup, the only possible extra costs that could come my way are an excess for the windscreen/insurance if I have to claim (£75 and £250 respectively I think).

On the range, I'm going to start from the position that I drive it like any other car, so on the speed limit, upto about 75-80 on the motorway when the cameras allow. Heater, heated seat and radio on, lights and wipers on auto. The internet says real world range is 145 miles ish, but there are so many variables. I assume my way of using the car will give about 115-120 miles, with the option of extending a bit if I need to by slowing down.

Once we are out of the burger van, I will plug in at home, but only to pre-condition the cabin before I set off. Being able to defrost the screens and heat the cabin every morning is one of the things I like the most about the car (I realise its possible in a number of others). And being able to do it from the phone app before leaving the office  :y
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STEMO

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #10 on: 12 March 2019, 14:22:46 »



I see  :y

So tyres/brakes etc all covered?  You just top it up with the free work's electricity? Be interesting to see what your real world range is like.  :)

FTFY  :y

Yup, the only possible extra costs that could come my way are an excess for the windscreen/insurance if I have to claim (£75 and £250 respectively I think).

On the range, I'm going to start from the position that I drive it like any other car, so on the speed limit, upto about 75-80 on the motorway when the cameras allow. Heater, heated seat and radio on, lights and wipers on auto. The internet says real world range is 145 miles ish, but there are so many variables. I assume my way of using the car will give about 115-120 miles, with the option of extending a bit if I need to by slowing down.

Once we are out of the burger van, I will plug in at home, but only to pre-condition the cabin before I set off. Being able to defrost the screens and heat the cabin every morning is one of the things I like the most about the car (I realise its possible in a number of others). And being able to do it from the phone app before leaving the office  :y
Spoilt bastard  ;D
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #11 on: 12 March 2019, 14:31:57 »

Have driven a pfl Leaf at work... Being a small(ish) Japanese city car I expected it to be a cheap, plasticky place to be. It didn't disappoint. Range rarely bettered 80 miles, but that was alot of stop start and constant heater/aircon and lights.

Have spent the day in a far more rudimentary electric vehicle, namely https://goo.gl/images/qerSGR

Heater, wipers and lights on since 6 am and only down to 84% :D

It tops out at 25 mph and weighs 3.5t, so probably wouldn't want to commute in it.
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STEMO

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #12 on: 12 March 2019, 14:33:16 »

Have driven a pfl Leaf at work... Being a small(ish) Japanese city car I expected it to be a cheap, plasticky place to be. It didn't disappoint. Range rarely bettered 80 miles, but that was alot of stop start and constant heater/aircon and lights.

Have spent the day in a far more rudimentary electric vehicle, namely https://goo.gl/images/qerSGR

Heater, wipers and lights on since 6 am and only down to 84% :D

It tops out at 25 mph and weighs 3.5t, so probably wouldn't want to commute in it.
Yeah, but that just a battery on wheels.
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #13 on: 12 March 2019, 14:47:15 »

Have driven a pfl Leaf at work... Being a small(ish) Japanese city car I expected it to be a cheap, plasticky place to be. It didn't disappoint. Range rarely bettered 80 miles, but that was alot of stop start and constant heater/aircon and lights.

Have spent the day in a far more rudimentary electric vehicle, namely https://goo.gl/images/qerSGR

Heater, wipers and lights on since 6 am and only down to 84% :D

It tops out at 25 mph and weighs 3.5t, so probably wouldn't want to commute in it.
Yeah, but that just a battery on wheels.
True, but at least it's rear wheel drive 8)
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #14 on: 12 March 2019, 14:56:14 »

It tops out at 25 mph and weighs 3.5t, so probably wouldn't want to commute in it.

Jeebus! is that all the lead in the batteries?

I was at your place of work on Saturday morning, (Norwegian back from the US). The airport is a pretty efficient place to travel to/from; its just in the wrong bloody place  :D
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #15 on: 12 March 2019, 15:20:37 »

It tops out at 25 mph and weighs 3.5t, so probably wouldn't want to commute in it.

Jeebus! is that all the lead in the batteries?

I was at your place of work on Saturday morning, (Norwegian back from the US). The airport is a pretty efficient place to travel to/from; its just in the wrong bloody place  :D
Surprisingly, or not, the battery is about 1,100kgs :o

How did you find Norwegian long haul?
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #16 on: 12 March 2019, 15:55:52 »

How did you find Norwegian long haul?

No worse than any other trans-Atlantic economy flight I've done and much better than United or Aer Lingus out of BHX. The trump card for Norwegian is the Dreamliners. The leg room, seat width and noise levels are far better than other carriers' older birds. We did the one up from basic tickets where you get fed and get hold luggage. The food was again, no worse than any other and better than some. They also serve alcohol with the meals, unlike the tight b@stards on United.

My only observation is that they depart a bit later than some other flights I've done. So we were absolutely ruined when we got there (about 1900 US time meaning at the hotel by 2200 earliest). But on the way back, taking off at 21.30 meant we got a full day in before going to the airport, and landing mid-morning meant no rush hour to deal with.   :)

On the whole, I'd thoroughly recommend them, especially when you look at their prices!  :y
« Last Edit: 12 March 2019, 15:57:27 by jimmy944 »
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Doctor Gollum

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #17 on: 12 March 2019, 18:30:27 »

Book ahead and you can get to LA and back for under £300 :o
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #18 on: 12 March 2019, 18:59:42 »

Book ahead and you can get to LA and back for under £300 :o

If they're still operating by the time it come to travel that is...  :P  ;D
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #19 on: 12 March 2019, 20:04:48 »

Book ahead and you can get to LA and back for under £300 :o

If they're still operating by the time it come to travel that is...  :P  ;D
:-\ Grounding their 737 Max fleet two weeks before the summer schedule starts could prove dicey... That said, their Dreamliners seem to be behaving themselves at the moment...
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #20 on: 12 March 2019, 20:13:16 »

So I stopped in at Corley services on the way home to test out the charging. I don't need the range but I figured I should make sure it all works before I pull into one with 10miles of range only to find the app doesn't work  ::)

Downloading, installing and setting up the app took 5 mins max. Then I just had to scan a QR code on the front of the charger and it struck up immediately.

I chose the slower of the two chargers so I'm not taking a quicker charge from someone who actually needs it. It would take 2hrs to fully charge - not acceptable as a break in a journey, but that's not how I plan to use the car.

So far I'm very impressed with the whole package.
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STEMO

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #21 on: 12 March 2019, 20:15:28 »

So I stopped in at Corley services on the way home to test out the charging. I don't need the range but I figured I should make sure it all works before I pull into one with 10miles of range only to find the app doesn't work  ::)

Downloading, installing and setting up the app took 5 mins max. Then I just had to scan a QR code on the front of the charger and it struck up immediately.

I chose the slower of the two chargers so I'm not taking a quicker charge from someone who actually needs it. It would take 2hrs to fully charge - not acceptable as a break in a journey, but that's not how I plan to use the car.

So far I'm very impressed with the whole package.
So VW pay for the electrickery used at the services? I'm assuming it's a VW app?
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #22 on: 12 March 2019, 20:31:32 »

So I stopped in at Corley services on the way home to test out the charging. I don't need the range but I figured I should make sure it all works before I pull into one with 10miles of range only to find the app doesn't work  ::)

Downloading, installing and setting up the app took 5 mins max. Then I just had to scan a QR code on the front of the charger and it struck up immediately.

I chose the slower of the two chargers so I'm not taking a quicker charge from someone who actually needs it. It would take 2hrs to fully charge - not acceptable as a break in a journey, but that's not how I plan to use the car.

So far I'm very impressed with the whole package.
So VW pay for the electrickery used at the services? I'm assuming it's a VW app?
or not...

https://www.ecotricity.co.uk/for-the-road/our-electric-highway
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STEMO

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #23 on: 12 March 2019, 20:45:55 »

So I stopped in at Corley services on the way home to test out the charging. I don't need the range but I figured I should make sure it all works before I pull into one with 10miles of range only to find the app doesn't work  ::)

Downloading, installing and setting up the app took 5 mins max. Then I just had to scan a QR code on the front of the charger and it struck up immediately.

I chose the slower of the two chargers so I'm not taking a quicker charge from someone who actually needs it. It would take 2hrs to fully charge - not acceptable as a break in a journey, but that's not how I plan to use the car.

So far I'm very impressed with the whole package.
So VW pay for the electrickery used at the services? I'm assuming it's a VW app?
or not...

https://www.ecotricity.co.uk/for-the-road/our-electric-highway
I see  :y Makes perfect sense, now I think about it.
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #24 on: 12 March 2019, 21:48:56 »

The car does come with its own app, but it controls the car's functions, reports on its state of charge etc. I find it really handy, even having had it for a very short time as otherwise I'd worry whether the car was charging properly.  ::)

As DG linked, the ecotricity app is what I installed, seems to work well. You can even report issues with the chargers through it.
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #25 on: 12 March 2019, 22:55:51 »

The car does come with its own app, but it controls the car's functions, reports on its state of charge etc. I find it really handy, even having had it for a very short time as otherwise I'd worry whether the car was charging properly.  ::)

As DG linked, the ecotricity app is what I installed, seems to work well. You can even report issues with the chargers through it.

mmm confused of wiltshire here ... :(

The ecotricity website link above specifically states "You’ll be able to charge your electric car for a maximum of 45 minutes using our Electric Highway charging stations."

You stated above "It would take 2hrs to fully charge"

Now, I may be just a simple boy from the local grammer school .. but that means you'll get less than 50% of the charge you need, and you were no where near empty .. so if getting empty and actually needing power ... you won't get very much at all !!

and you say it "works well"   :(   amd I missing something here ??  :-\ :-\ :-\
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #26 on: 13 March 2019, 07:31:05 »

You're more or less correct. Although due to the way that batteries charge, 45min on the slower machine would take you from about 10% to about 50% adding maybe 50 miles. But it would only charge you from 80% to around 90%.

The fast machine on the other hand would take you from 10% to 80% on that time. How many of each machine is at a services depends on the infrastructure.

The point is, that ecotricity don't want me to sit on a machine for 2hrs, they want me to charge and go so someone else can jump on. In a similar way I suppose to adding £10 of petrol at £1.50p/litre to get you home so you can fill up at sensible prices. It's about taking on a bit and then charging when you get to your destination.

For example, one 20minute stop would be enough to take me from home (Birmingham) to somewhere north of Carlisle.
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #27 on: 13 March 2019, 08:58:20 »

Looks very nice Jimmy, I hope you enjoy it!  I certainly enjoyed the Leaf I had a few years ago.  Strange that the new one has no steering wheel rake adjustment as the one I had did.  That said it is a minor niggle I had with the Ranger too, maybe there is something else going on which is making it unattractive for manufacturers to include it :-\
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #28 on: 13 March 2019, 10:52:10 »

Are chargers always available or will you need to queue for hours to get one during busy periods?

Will the manufacture of new chargers keep pace with the number of new milk floats?

How will the national grid cope if we go 100% electric?

Is it exciting to drive? ::)

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #29 on: 13 March 2019, 11:02:34 »

Are chargers always available or will you need to queue for hours to get one during busy periods?

I read an article once where someone had worked out the rate of energy transfer supported by a large motorway service station during a busy period, and calculated the equivalent energy consumption in kW that the electrical supply would need to sustain if it were charging the equivalent number of EVs. It was quite a large number. A "not going to happen" number, in fact. ;D

Once we're all driving milk floats, we'll need to forget about mobility as we know it.
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #30 on: 13 March 2019, 11:10:13 »

The car does come with its own app, but it controls the car's functions, reports on its state of charge etc. I find it really handy, even having had it for a very short time as otherwise I'd worry whether the car was charging properly.  ::)

As DG linked, the ecotricity app is what I installed, seems to work well. You can even report issues with the chargers through it.

mmm confused of wiltshire here ... :(

The ecotricity website link above specifically states "You’ll be able to charge your electric car for a maximum of 45 minutes using our Electric Highway charging stations."

You stated above "It would take 2hrs to fully charge"

Now, I may be just a simple boy from the local grammer school .. but that means you'll get less than 50% of the charge you need, and you were no where near empty .. so if getting empty and actually needing power ... you won't get very much at all !!

and you say it "works well"   :(   amd I missing something here ??  :-\ :-\ :-\
You can see the irony there, can't you, Nigel?  ;D
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #31 on: 13 March 2019, 11:21:36 »

The car does come with its own app, but it controls the car's functions, reports on its state of charge etc. I find it really handy, even having had it for a very short time as otherwise I'd worry whether the car was charging properly.  ::)

As DG linked, the ecotricity app is what I installed, seems to work well. You can even report issues with the chargers through it.

mmm confused of wiltshire here ... :(

The ecotricity website link above specifically states "You’ll be able to charge your electric car for a maximum of 45 minutes using our Electric Highway charging stations."

You stated above "It would take 2hrs to fully charge"

Now, I may be just a simple boy from the local grammer school .. but that means you'll get less than 50% of the charge you need, and you were no where near empty .. so if getting empty and actually needing power ... you won't get very much at all !!

and you say it "works well"   :(   amd I missing something here ??  :-\ :-\ :-\
You can see the irony there, can't you, Nigel? ;D

Yeah......everyone knows it's gramma skool. :)
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #32 on: 13 March 2019, 11:26:45 »

Are chargers always available or will you need to queue for hours to get one during busy periods?

I read an article once where someone had worked out the rate of energy transfer supported by a large motorway service station during a busy period, and calculated the equivalent energy consumption in kW that the electrical supply would need to sustain if it were charging the equivalent number of EVs. It was quite a large number. A "not going to happen" number, in fact. ;D

Once we're all driving milk floats, we'll need to forget about mobility as we know it.


At least that will be environmentally friendly. ;)

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #33 on: 13 March 2019, 11:56:04 »

Isn't the world ending on the 29th of March, anyway? No need to worry about electrocity, then :y Bit like Venezuela..
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #34 on: 13 March 2019, 12:22:33 »

Isn't the world ending on the 29th of March, anyway? No need to worry about electrocity, then :y Bit like Venezuela..

If your Cobra ever gets finished it will destroy the climate all on it's own with a 7.6 litre lump of Detroit V8. :)
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Viral_Jim

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #35 on: 13 March 2019, 12:28:29 »

Is it exciting to drive? ::)

About as much as any other golf I've driven, other than the R, obviously. What I value far more highly, given my journeys mostly start at 0530 and 1830 is the extreme quiet and how easy it is to commute in.

Are chargers always available or will you need to queue for hours to get one during busy periods?

I read an article once where someone had worked out the rate of energy transfer supported by a large motorway service station during a busy period, and calculated the equivalent energy consumption in kW that the electrical supply would need to sustain if it were charging the equivalent number of EVs. It was quite a large number. A "not going to happen" number, in fact. ;D

Once we're all driving milk floats, we'll need to forget about mobility as we know it.

Why on earth would that be the case?

Truth be told my golf is already a generation behind in terms of battery capacity. The latest Hyundai Kona will do double the range on a single charge. The VW ID (out in 2020) is likely to do three times as much. Comparatively few people will want or need to charge at high speed because you'll do it at home, or at your destination, overnight, when we have lots of spare generation capacity. Electricity on the motorway is expensive, just like the fuel is, so people will only use it in extremis.

Average car mileage in the uk in 2017 was 7800 miles according to the RAC, or 18,000 for company cars. That means a VW ID would, on average need to be charged once every two weeks, or once every 5-6 days as a company vehicle.
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Doctor Gollum

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #36 on: 13 March 2019, 12:35:34 »

God alone knows where they drummed that mileage from :o

I do 300 a week just commuting...
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #37 on: 13 March 2019, 12:50:16 »

God alone knows where they drummed that mileage from :o

I do 300 a week just commuting...

Indeed.

I would assume its MOT data (best way to estimate IMO, keying errors aside) or insurance data? I'm up on 22-25k per anum.

I'm quite interested how the battery holds up TBH, going from 10-100% charged 5 days a week 45-48 weeks a year should put it through its paces.
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STEMO

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #38 on: 13 March 2019, 13:16:46 »

Well.....the government, or someone, will have to put arrangements in place for people like me and my neighbours and the tens (hundreds?) of thousands others like us, who have nowhere to put a charging point at home.
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aaronjb

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #39 on: 13 March 2019, 13:23:53 »

Well.....the government, or someone, will have to put arrangements in place for people like me and my neighbours and the tens (hundreds?) of thousands others like us, who have nowhere to put a charging point at home.

No they won't.

You'll just have to stay at home :P
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #40 on: 13 March 2019, 13:46:57 »

Well.....the government, or someone, will have to put arrangements in place for people like me and my neighbours and the tens (hundreds?) of thousands others like us, who have nowhere to put a charging point at home.

No they won't.

You'll just have to stay at home :P

Barnsley is the Utopia of the North. He'll be fine. :)
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #41 on: 13 March 2019, 13:57:18 »

Well.....the government, or someone, will have to put arrangements in place for people like me and my neighbours and the tens (hundreds?) of thousands others like us, who have nowhere to put a charging point at home.

Given that its a big problem in London, on street charging does get attention  ::). One solution proposed is converting lamp posts to LED lighting and then installing charge points in them. There are a hand full in use already in London, should be in Barnsley-Wakefield by 2055 at the latest.  ;D
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #42 on: 13 March 2019, 13:59:39 »

God alone knows where they drummed that mileage from :o

I do 300 a week just commuting...

Indeed.

I would assume its MOT data (best way to estimate IMO, keying errors aside) or insurance data? I'm up on 22-25k per anum.

I'm quite interested how the battery holds up TBH, going from 10-100% charged 5 days a week 45-48 weeks a year should put it through its paces.

One thing I consistently hear........

The average battery pack has a 'usable' life expectancy of 5-7 years, and  the current price of a replacement battery pack means the car will uneconomical to repair.

I would be very wary of buying an electric car with a 5 year old battery.

 
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dave the builder

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #43 on: 13 March 2019, 14:21:27 »

Well.....the government, or someone, will have to put arrangements in place for people like me and my neighbours and the tens (hundreds?) of thousands others like us, who have nowhere to put a charging point at home.

Bluetooth jump leads  :y

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #44 on: 13 March 2019, 15:57:49 »


One thing I consistently hear........

The average battery pack has a 'usable' life expectancy of 5-7 years, and  the current price of a replacement battery pack means the car will uneconomical to repair.

I would be very wary of buying an electric car with a 5 year old battery.

It may be consistently said (in these parts it certainly is!), but I doubt the reality is the same. Manufacturers certainly don't think so.

The big players all offer an 8 year warranty on the battery (typically 8 or 10 years in the US depending on the state) with varying mileages:
VW  100,000 mile
Tesla unlimited mileage
Hyundai 125,000 mile
JLR 100,000 mile

There is no way the manufacturers would offer warranties like this if they thought the batteries would keel over in 5-7yrs. Rather, they'd just warranty them like the rest of the vehicle (3yrs, 60k mostly).

The reputation damage was done by the 1st generation Leafs which, due to poor thermal management could shed 25-30% of their capacity in 5 years. The only big(ish) data set available (as far as I know) is on Teslas, showing that they will lose around 6% of their capacity over 160,000. So for a Tesla 75d (the lowest range) this will take you from 225 ish real world miles down to 212. I could probably live with that.  :y

Also, its often not the case that a battery pack dies rather some of the cells in them die. So you aren't necessarily on the hook for a 5 figure bill, just because the main battery has issues.

Article here: https://electrek.co/2018/04/14/tesla-battery-degradation-data/

All that said, I'm very glad that there is a lot of media talk around the subject of battery degradation. Hopefully it will help to drive down the cost of the 2-3yr old I-pace I'll be looking for when the golf lease is up  8)
« Last Edit: 13 March 2019, 16:08:04 by jimmy944 »
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Field Marshal Dr. Opti

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #45 on: 13 March 2019, 16:58:16 »


One thing I consistently hear........

The average battery pack has a 'usable' life expectancy of 5-7 years, and  the current price of a replacement battery pack means the car will uneconomical to repair.

I would be very wary of buying an electric car with a 5 year old battery.

It may be consistently said (in these parts it certainly is!), but I doubt the reality is the same. Manufacturers certainly don't think so.

The big players all offer an 8 year warranty on the battery (typically 8 or 10 years in the US depending on the state) with varying mileages:
VW  100,000 mile
Tesla unlimited mileage
Hyundai 125,000 mile
JLR 100,000 mile

There is no way the manufacturers would offer warranties like this if they thought the batteries would keel over in 5-7yrs. Rather, they'd just warranty them like the rest of the vehicle (3yrs, 60k mostly).

The reputation damage was done by the 1st generation Leafs which, due to poor thermal management could shed 25-30% of their capacity in 5 years. The only big(ish) data set available (as far as I know) is on Teslas, showing that they will lose around 6% of their capacity over 160,000. So for a Tesla 75d (the lowest range) this will take you from 225 ish real world miles down to 212. I could probably live with that.  :y

Also, its often not the case that a battery pack dies rather some of the cells in them die. So you aren't necessarily on the hook for a 5 figure bill, just because the main battery has issues.

Article here: https://electrek.co/2018/04/14/tesla-battery-degradation-data/

All that said, I'm very glad that there is a lot of media talk around the subject of battery degradation. Hopefully it will help to drive down the cost of the 2-3yr old I-pace I'll be looking for when the golf lease is up  8)

It looks like US cars have a superior a battery warranty to UK cars...... :-\ F*ucking yanks. ::)

It also depends how manufacturers decide what constitutes a battery failure, and what is considered normal wear and tear. My understanding is that anything up to a 30% loss in battery capacity is considered normal wear and tear.
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Field Marshal Dr. Opti

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #46 on: 13 March 2019, 17:04:45 »

My guess is a Tesla battery will last longer in sunny California than when used in equally desirable Kidderminster. ::) ::) ;)
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STEMO

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #47 on: 13 March 2019, 17:13:26 »

My guess is a Tesla battery will last longer in sunny California than when used in equally desirable Kidderminster. ::) ::) ;)
Hence the longer warranty.
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aaronjb

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #48 on: 13 March 2019, 20:59:06 »

Look what I spied earlier, stealing the company electrons... https://photos.app.goo.gl/akfb8kwJiFL4C8Jx8 ;)

I was in my highly environmentally friendly 4.8L V8 at the time, making up for you..  ;D :y
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STEMO

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #49 on: 13 March 2019, 21:01:21 »

Look what I spied earlier, stealing the company electrons... https://photos.app.goo.gl/akfb8kwJiFL4C8Jx8 ;)

I was in my highly environmentally friendly 4.8L V8 at the time, making up for you..  ;D :y
Nice jumper  ;D
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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #50 on: 13 March 2019, 21:22:15 »

Look what I spied earlier, stealing the company electrons... https://photos.app.goo.gl/akfb8kwJiFL4C8Jx8 ;)

I was in my highly environmentally friendly 4.8L V8 at the time, making up for you..  ;D :y
Ha!

I still don't know who owns the red Tesla that's upstaging me  ;D.

Trust me, if I lived as close to Rye Hill as you do, I'd be opting for something with at least 8 cylinders  :y

Didn't your OH wonder why you were photographing some random car? She probably thinks you've turned into an EV spotter  :D
« Last Edit: 13 March 2019, 21:23:48 by jimmy944 »
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aaronjb

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Re: The new milk float...
« Reply #51 on: 14 March 2019, 09:33:10 »

Didn't your OH wonder why you were photographing some random car? She probably thinks you've turned into an EV spotter  :D

I think the conversation went something like "Oh look, remember that bloke I mentioned on the car forum who works at your place? That's his new e-Golf.."
Her: "Does look a bit weird though, stopping to take a picture of it" ;D ;D
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