Omega Owners Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Search the maintenance guides for answers to 99.999% of Omega questions

Pages: 1 2 3 [All]   Go Down

Author Topic: hard to start  (Read 4823 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
hard to start
« on: 13 February 2019, 13:11:47 »

hi guys a strange fault has arisen, when i turn the key she fires but dies again, i have to give her some gas for her to stay running, but it wont idle at fast idle just normal. i can hear the secondary air pump running. anyone got any ideas please.
              thanks all.
Logged
coupe rebuild master

Doctor Gollum

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • In a colds and darks puddleses
  • Posts: 28089
  • If you can't eat them, join them...
    • Feetses.
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #1 on: 13 February 2019, 13:14:51 »

How much fuel in it?

If more than a 1/4, then almost certainly crank sensor  :y

Pedal/Paper clip it and report back :y
Logged
Onanists always think outside the box.

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #2 on: 13 February 2019, 13:36:29 »

its just below 1/4 of a tank how do you paper clip it. :y
Logged
coupe rebuild master

Doctor Gollum

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • In a colds and darks puddleses
  • Posts: 28089
  • If you can't eat them, join them...
    • Feetses.
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #3 on: 13 February 2019, 13:50:00 »

its just below 1/4 of a tank how do you paper clip it. :y
Put more fuel in it and retry... 2 gallons should do it  ;)

Code reading as per guides ;)
2.5/3.0 paper clip, 2.6/3.2 pedal trick :y
Logged
Onanists always think outside the box.

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #4 on: 13 February 2019, 13:57:40 »

ive added fuel in it as when i got it it was just above the red it was ok then. i notiched this last week so put some fuel in it but still the same problem. i have got a new fuel filter to fit. will report back over the weekend.
ive got a snap on code reader this should be ok ? :y
« Last Edit: 13 February 2019, 13:59:40 by nellys coupe »
Logged
coupe rebuild master

terry paget

  • Omega Baron
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Midsomer Norton Somerset
  • Posts: 4633
    • 3 Astras 2 Vectra
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #5 on: 13 February 2019, 14:19:33 »

My wife had this problem years ago on her ex-police 3.2. A change of battery cured the fault, I could not explain why.
Logged

Doctor Gollum

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • In a colds and darks puddleses
  • Posts: 28089
  • If you can't eat them, join them...
    • Feetses.
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #6 on: 13 February 2019, 14:20:28 »

ive added fuel in it as when i got it it was just above the red it was ok then. i notiched this last week so put some fuel in it but still the same problem. i have got a new fuel filter to fit. will report back over the weekend.
ive got a snap on code reader this should be ok ? :y
Unless it's perfectly level below a 1/4, once it doesn't start, it won't without a few gallons in it... You might get lucky by levelling it.

Estates suffer more from this and can take a 4 gallon top up before starting.

Fuel filter, whilst a service item, won't solve the problem.
Logged
Onanists always think outside the box.

Enceladus

  • Omega Knight
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • London
  • Posts: 1057
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #7 on: 13 February 2019, 14:24:08 »

I wouldn't change anything until you've read the codes. Whilst the fuel filter might have crud blocking it's probably the least likely cause of your problems. Get the codes first and then decide what to do.

Snap-on is professional stuff so I would hope that your Snap-on reader would at least read and reset any engine fault codes. Might need a software update?
Logged

TheBoy

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Brackley, Northants
  • Posts: 105838
  • I Like Lockdown
    • Whatever Starts
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #8 on: 13 February 2019, 17:43:45 »

ive added fuel in it as when i got it it was just above the red it was ok then. i notiched this last week so put some fuel in it but still the same problem. i have got a new fuel filter to fit. will report back over the weekend.
ive got a snap on code reader this should be ok ? :y
Unless it's perfectly level below a 1/4, once it doesn't start, it won't without a few gallons in it... You might get lucky by levelling it.

Estates suffer more from this and can take a 4 gallon top up before starting.

Fuel filter, whilst a service item, won't solve the problem.
Saloons don't really suffer this, even with weak pumps. It seems unique to the Estates.
Logged
Grumpy old man

TheBoy

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Brackley, Northants
  • Posts: 105838
  • I Like Lockdown
    • Whatever Starts
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #9 on: 13 February 2019, 17:44:43 »

ive added fuel in it as when i got it it was just above the red it was ok then. i notiched this last week so put some fuel in it but still the same problem. i have got a new fuel filter to fit. will report back over the weekend.
ive got a snap on code reader this should be ok ? :y
Just paperclip it. Forget the snapoff shite for now :y
Logged
Grumpy old man

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #10 on: 14 February 2019, 13:37:52 »

hi folks thank you for the help treid to read the codes this morning but i some how left the boot adjare >:( and the battery was nearly dead so its on charge know. ive treplaced the battery that was on it for one from my audi deisel which spinns it over very easy, so iam going to leave it on over knight and try in the morning. :y
Logged
coupe rebuild master

atann

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Canterbury
  • Posts: 214
    • Vauxhall Omega 2.6 CDX
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #11 on: 15 February 2019, 23:27:32 »

its just below 1/4 of a tank how do you paper clip it. :y
Put more fuel in it and retry... 2 gallons should do it  ;)

Code reading as per guides ;)
2.5/3.0 paper clip, 2.6/3.2 pedal trick :y

What is the pedal trick?
Logged

Doctor Gollum

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • In a colds and darks puddleses
  • Posts: 28089
  • If you can't eat them, join them...
    • Feetses.
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #12 on: 16 February 2019, 00:18:36 »

It's in the guides ;)
Logged
Onanists always think outside the box.

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #13 on: 16 February 2019, 20:27:12 »

hi folks i plugged the code reader in on friday nd with the engine ont running i get code 31 no rpm sighal.with the engine running i got this data.
hall sensor off
engine speed pulse yes,
knock signal load no.
mixture 1 lean.
mixture 2 rich..
not sure what to make of it weather it is a crank sensor or something else. :y
Logged
coupe rebuild master

Paddy Flannery

  • Intermediate Member
  • ***
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Hertford, Hertfordshire
  • Posts: 435
    • 2003 2.6 V6
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #14 on: 16 February 2019, 21:38:14 »

hi folks i plugged the code reader in on friday nd with the engine ont running i get code 31 no rpm sighal.with the engine running i got this data.
hall sensor off
engine speed pulse yes,
knock signal load no.
mixture 1 lean.
mixture 2 rich..
not sure what to make of it weather it is a crank sensor or something else. :y
I don't know much but I believe code 31 is normal when engine isn't running.
Someone with more knowledge will be along soon.
Logged

Doctor Gollum

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • In a colds and darks puddleses
  • Posts: 28089
  • If you can't eat them, join them...
    • Feetses.
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #15 on: 16 February 2019, 21:40:07 »

ive added fuel in it as when i got it it was just above the red it was ok then. i notiched this last week so put some fuel in it but still the same problem. i have got a new fuel filter to fit. will report back over the weekend.
ive got a snap on code reader this should be ok ? :y
Just paperclip it. Forget the snapoff shite for now :y
And report back
Logged
Onanists always think outside the box.

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #16 on: 16 February 2019, 21:40:53 »

hi folks i plugged the code reader in on friday nd with the engine ont running i get code 31 no rpm sighal.with the engine running i got this data.
hall sensor off
engine speed pulse yes,
knock signal load no.
mixture 1 lean.
mixture 2 rich..
not sure what to make of it weather it is a crank sensor or something else. :y
I don't know much but I believe code 31 is normal when engine isn't running.
Someone with more knowledge will be along soon.
:y
Logged
coupe rebuild master

TheBoy

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Brackley, Northants
  • Posts: 105838
  • I Like Lockdown
    • Whatever Starts
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #17 on: 17 February 2019, 19:36:42 »

hi folks i plugged the code reader in on friday nd with the engine ont running i get code 31 no rpm sighal.with the engine running i got this data.
hall sensor off
engine speed pulse yes,
knock signal load no.
mixture 1 lean.
mixture 2 rich..
not sure what to make of it weather it is a crank sensor or something else. :y
That's meaningless I'm afraid, as they will vary by millisecond.

Get the MAF readings, and also the BLMs.
Logged
Grumpy old man

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #18 on: 17 February 2019, 20:40:54 »

hi folks i plugged the code reader in on friday nd with the engine ont running i get code 31 no rpm sighal.with the engine running i got this data.
hall sensor off
engine speed pulse yes,
knock signal load no.
mixture 1 lean.
mixture 2 rich..
not sure what to make of it weather it is a crank sensor or something else. :y
ok ill do it tomorow if i get a chance  :y
That's meaningless I'm afraid, as they will vary by millisecond.

Get the MAF readings, and also the BLMs.
Logged
coupe rebuild master

Enceladus

  • Omega Knight
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • London
  • Posts: 1057
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #19 on: 18 February 2019, 15:16:37 »

Is there a code associated with 'hall sensor off'? The camshaft sensor is a Hall effect sensor. So why would it be 'off' with the engine running?
Logged

atann

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Canterbury
  • Posts: 214
    • Vauxhall Omega 2.6 CDX
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #20 on: 18 February 2019, 23:26:54 »

It's in the guides ;)

I cannot find it. Can you post a link please?
Logged

Doctor Gollum

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • In a colds and darks puddleses
  • Posts: 28089
  • If you can't eat them, join them...
    • Feetses.
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #21 on: 18 February 2019, 23:59:18 »

FAQs ::)
Logged
Onanists always think outside the box.

Enceladus

  • Omega Knight
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • London
  • Posts: 1057
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #22 on: 19 February 2019, 00:02:31 »

It's listed in the index page in Omega Help Area>Maintenance Guides>Maintenance Guide Index
« Last Edit: 19 February 2019, 00:13:15 by Enceladus »
Logged

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #23 on: 20 February 2019, 13:26:58 »

hi folks i plugged the code reader in on friday nd with the engine ont running i get code 31 no rpm sighal.with the engine running i got this data.
hall sensor off
engine speed pulse yes,
knock signal load no.
mixture 1 lean.
mixture 2 rich..
not sure what to make of it weather it is a crank sensor or something else. :y
That's meaningless I'm afraid, as they will vary by millisecond.

Get the MAF readings, and also the BLMs.
this is the data for the mass air flow voltage is 0.8 v air flow is 15kg/h.
not sure what you mean by blb,
Logged
coupe rebuild master

aaronjb

  • Guest
Re: hard to start
« Reply #24 on: 20 February 2019, 13:37:31 »

BLM - Block Learn Multiplier; basically the long & short term fuel trims. (Either expressed as a %age or an absolute number, depending on age of car IIRC)
Logged

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #25 on: 20 February 2019, 14:01:52 »

BLM - Block Learn Multiplier; basically the long & short term fuel trims. (Either expressed as a %age or an absolute number, depending on age of car IIRC)
ill plug it back in tomorow as its nearly time fore work, :y
Logged
coupe rebuild master

Webby the Bear

  • Omega Queen
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Northampton
  • Posts: 12722
    • 2000 (W Reg.) 2.5 V6 CD
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #26 on: 20 February 2019, 14:22:06 »

Re Snapoff scanner. Ours doesn’t work on my Omega.  ::)

As said paper clip is the way forward. Iirc crank sensor is a code 19 but don’t quote me on that.
Logged
RIP Paul Lovejoy

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #27 on: 23 February 2019, 21:14:44 »

Re Snapoff scanner. Ours doesn’t work on my Omega.  ::)

As said paper clip is the way forward. Iirc crank sensor is a code 19 but don’t quote me on that.
mine works with no problem.
ok so this is the injector duration its between 3and 3.1 m/s but i belive i may have solved the problem. i put some more fuel in the tank on friday went to start it this morninfg and fired straifght into life and run on fast idle, so i think its either weak fuel pump or the filter is blocked, got a new filter to fit tomorow along with a new rear box which has got a hole in it. so fingers crossed all should be good. ;)
Logged
coupe rebuild master

Nick W

  • Omega Queen
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Chatham, Kent
  • Posts: 10834
  • Rover Metro 1.8VVC
    • 3.0l Elite estate
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #28 on: 23 February 2019, 23:13:05 »

Re Snapoff scanner. Ours doesn’t work on my Omega.  ::)

As said paper clip is the way forward. Iirc crank sensor is a code 19 but don’t quote me on that.


mine worked OK, read all the live data, trans codes etc. Do you have the appropriate key for it? That's how Snap-on  further stitched up buyers of their tools: not only did you have to stump up huge amounts of cash for the scanner, but you needed four figure sums invested in the keys to use the bloody thing effectively. There's probably 3 dozen keys and assorted leads in the box with my now knackered Solus.
Logged

TheBoy

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Brackley, Northants
  • Posts: 105838
  • I Like Lockdown
    • Whatever Starts
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #29 on: 24 February 2019, 09:26:59 »

MAF looks in right ballpark for a v6 with AC on. Shade high if AC is off (assuming engine warmed up)

If its a 2.5/3.0, the BLMs I'm interested in are the Partial Load two, and the Idle stepper - all on an 8 bit scale of 0-255, midpoint of 127.

If its a 2.6/3.2, The BLMs I'm interested in are LTFT, expressed as a signed percentage, with 0% being midpoint.
Logged
Grumpy old man

nellys coupe

  • Junior Member
  • **
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • buckinghamshire
  • Posts: 150
    • hyundai coupe
    • View Profile
Re: hard to start
« Reply #30 on: 24 February 2019, 20:30:58 »

MAF looks in right ballpark for a v6 with AC on. Shade high if AC is off (assuming engine warmed up)

If its a 2.5/3.0, the BLMs I'm interested in are the Partial Load two, and the Idle stepper - all on an 8 bit scale of 0-255, midpoint of 127.

If its a 2.6/3.2, The BLMs I'm interested in are LTFT, expressed as a signed percentage, with 0% being midpoint.
that is with the ac off the problem has been cured seams there was not enough fuel in the tank of its got a weak pump. i changed the fuel filter today it had a little water in it but noting significant. so its back to getting her ready for mot and a few mods inbetween. :y
Logged
coupe rebuild master
Pages: 1 2 3 [All]   Go Up
 

Page created in 0.054 seconds with 18 queries.