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34126

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 13 October 2007, 11:00:12 »

I guess the Lambda depends on whether the SGI system had dual lambda inputs. If it's only got one you've just got to connect it to one of the sensors. There shouldn't be a huge imbalance between the two banks.

I assume it probably only needs the Lambda input for initial calibration / automatic mapping. Once it's set up the injector durations should follow the injector outputs from the OEM ECU so you will effectively be running the lambda corrections from the 2 banks independantly.

Kevin

34127

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 13 October 2007, 01:16:32 »

I would think it would be fine unless you wanted to really give it some large... in which case I suspect you'd want to be running on petrol anyway!

Personally I would err on the side of caution with this, you'll end up melting a valve or similar if it is allowed to run lean for any length of time. The way mine is set up I can bounce it off the rev limiter before shifting up and there is no discernible difference compared to petrol. I'm sure there is a small measurable difference, but it's close enough that I don't notice. I do flick back to petrol when I really want to wring out that last few BHP but that's pretty rare.

I should add that if you're setting it up with an AFR on the wideband lambda it shouldn't be so much of a worry, as you can bounce it off the limiter with the foot on the floor in say 3rd gear, and if it doesn't go lean with the right mapping under those circumstances it'll be fine.

You're right that running lean is bad news, especially in a heavy car like an Omega which can put a lot of load on the engine for long periods of time. Anywhere else on the map you can do what you like to the mixture without killing the engine if you're sensible but if you're going to have your foot hard down for more than a few seconds you need to see a comfortably rich mixture as that will keep the temperatures down.

If you hit the rev limiter the wideband reading will go all over the place as the ECU cuts the injectors, but I mapped my Westfield on public roads using a WB and it was a piece of cake. You could accelerate with the hammer down, watching the RPM and lambda and make a mental note of what needs adjusting at what RPM. If it goes lean come off the gas and add fuel. Tweak it with a laptop and repeat. Plenty of time to take it all in with just under 200 BHP in a 650 kg car, so an Omega should be ok

You can of course datalog it and then look through the logs but I found doing it by eye easier, with a laptop on the passenger seat to tweak the map.

Kevin

34128

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 12 October 2007, 09:26:21 »

Thanks for your input, guys. Hmmm :-/ Decisions...

Kevin

34129

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 12 October 2007, 00:20:42 »

i attacked it from the opposite end engine and ecu first tank later.as a minor point i fitted a tank in the spare wheel space which worked well despite issues with the light cluster.trouble was it only carried 41 litres which gave it a range of 220 miles(cruising)so im now in the process of fitting a 100 litre tank across the rear seats which should double its range( live and learn)

Is that the biggest tank that would have gone in the spare wheel well? Just wondering about tank options. Don't suppose you've got the vertical doughnut tank for sale? Not sure if 220 miles would be enough although I like the idea of not losing the boot space :-/

There is an LPG garage a mile away from work so it may not be so bad.

With the bigger tank is there any prospect of folding down the rear seats and fitting any long objects in the car or does it cover the rear seat aperture completely? Just thinking about when I have to go and buy long bits of wood, etc....  :-/

Cheers,

Kevin

34130

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 11 October 2007, 19:29:48 »

I would think it would be fine unless you wanted to really give it some large... in which case I suspect you'd want to be running on petrol anyway!

Yeah, but running engines lean at wide open throttle is not good, and remembering to switch to petrol when the red mist descends is not going to happen .

Will ask the chap what he reckons. I guess given the power drop on LPG it'll be around the 200 BHP mark anyway.

I could dust off my wideband lambda sensor to set it up, I guess.  :-/ Anyone got an old Lambda sensor that I can butcher for the connector to wire it up?

really disaapointed as the kit didnt turn up today, delivery van broke down

Hopefully it'll arrive tomorrow then you can play at the weekend

Fingers crossed.

Kevin

34131

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 11 October 2007, 15:18:57 »

May be a little marginal for my 3.2 then :-/

Still, have established contact with the guy and he seems helpful.


Cheers,

Kevin

34132

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 11 October 2007, 11:39:59 »

Good luck

Are the nozzles the correct internal diameter or will they need drilling?

Do the nozzles on an SGI setup need sizing for the engine?

Just thinking as the flow rate for petrol injectors has to be reasonably closely matched to the engine's fuel demand so you've got sufficient fuel flow for peak power but not so much that resolution suffers at idle. I guess it's the same if you're injecting gas but kits I've seen just say "good for up to x BHP".

Anyway, hope the conversion goes well, Jay W. Keep us updated

Kevin

34133

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 04 October 2007, 19:38:04 »

He's only 40 mins drive from me too.  :-/

Kevin

Possibly do yours/my installations together? Maybe see if Martin is free to come down also?

I have some spare inlets we can drill, to keep the cars mobile...

Whoa! some catching up to do. Soulds like a plan! Would certainly be good to get a couple of manifolds modified for the nozzles. Is the manifold the same across all models?

Might be worth seeing how Jay W's kit pans out- or at least wait for it to arrive and see what it looks like.

I'm also concerned about getting the installs certified and I don't want to end up with a liability with respect to getting insured. Has anyone determined if the seller can do this or are there any other ideas on this?

Cheers,

Kevin

34134

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 03 October 2007, 23:58:09 »

He's only 40 mins drive from me too.  :-/

Kevin

34135

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 03 October 2007, 23:39:25 »

.. or three?  :-/

Kevin

34136

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 27 September 2007, 10:13:47 »

In my opinion LPG fitting musn't be done as DIY

Being an enginner I dont accept any amateur work on that subject.

I disagree, as long as the LPG install is certified by an LPGA approved centre before going on the road I can't see an issue. Most people doing a DIY job will want it to be a good one and hence take extra care.

That's like saying only a professional garage should change a wheel bearing, in case a wheel falls off if an ameteur fits it...

Hear Hear! There's too much talk of WHO can do what these days. My father has a degree in Electrical and Electronic engineering from one of the top universities, he's a Chartered Engineer, a fellow of the Institute of Electrical Engineers (or whatever it's called nowadays) and spent his career in the electrical / electronics industry. Yet he can't do simple wiring in his own house.

It's the standard to which the job is completed that matters, not who did it.

The rush to have registered people to do X,Y and Z is the result of lobbying by trade associations who like to create work for their members, IMHO. It must be stopped before we are not allowed to lift the bonnets of our cars any more (let alone build a kit car, for example).

Kevin

34137

General Discussion Area / Re: LPG kits....some Questions?

« on: 22 September 2007, 18:22:41 »

He was actually quite well rated and has done good jobs on Jaguars, but he messed up quite a bit on my last car.

It's always the same. Someone gets a good name for doing a good job, ends up with more demand than he can cope with, so recruits some knuckle draggers to do the work while he "supervises".

Kevin

34138

General Discussion Area / Re: Sell or strip!!!

« on: 01 October 2007, 13:08:32 »

I had a go in a Westfield, an SEight (which is what I want to build), at the factory. Its incredible how they just give you the keys!

It was nowhere near as good as the Dax Rush because its not evolved and is a bit behind the times.....

The Dax is a nice kit too. Didn't successfully blag a test drive there, just a ride, but a mate of mine built a 270BHP Rush of which I have intimate knowledge. I'd say the Dax is best if you're looking at V8 / Turbo levels of power. It handles big power better than the Westfield chassis and the engine bay is roomier but it's a big beast and quite draggy which, IMHO, would make it less entertaining at more modest power levels.

If I were to do it again they'd be the 2 kits I'd be considering (assuming I couldn't afford an Ultima).

Mate of mine bought his kit part-built  from a guy who'd given up and it's an excellent way to get a bargain. I think he paid 3k for a rolling chassis plus bodywork, wheels, tyres, the whole drivetrain. Essentially everything he needed bar a few details. Unmolested cossie Turbo engine with 6K miles on it, ecu, T5 gearbox, etc. etc. A bit of tidying up, some paint and an SVA test. Job done. One sports bike-eating car

Kevin

34139

General Discussion Area / Re: Sell or strip!!!

« on: 01 October 2007, 09:46:46 »

The Stoneleigh show is pretty good from a point of view of looking at what's available. Every may bank holiday Sunday / Monday.

Kevin

34140

General Discussion Area / Re: Sell or strip!!!

« on: 30 September 2007, 02:28:30 »

If I were you I'd get yourself down to Kingswinford and blag a test drive in a Westfield. They are very happy to let you have a play

It's a one way street though

Feel free to drop me a PM if you want to discuss the options or check out my other haunt: http://boardroom.wscc.co.uk/cgi-bin/ikonboard.cgi

Kevin