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[dave the builder]

there is still no imposed quarantine for people flying into the UK
you may say that it would be too late anyway
but the UK is going back to test,track,trace (containment )

Australia is an island but do better checks ,resulting in better stats

[Doctor Gollum]

A couple of points, the Israelis have a unique take on most things.

Secondly, Australia has always been quite fussy when it comes to letting anything in, so it really isn't news that they have more accurate data than a country that hasn't had an effective border until a couple of months ago. 

Also, however unfortunate, 30, 40, or even 100,000 deaths isn't a significant percentage of 70 million or so.

The border point, here at least is a moot one, lock down should have been done when the first whisper was heard.

But it wasn't. Get over it.

[Doctor Gollum]

That reads a touch more abrupt than it sounded in my head...

I've a fairly low tolerance to lefty media fuelled argumentative 'what if' speculator blame slinging

[dave the builder]

That reads a touch more abrupt than it sounded in my head...

I've a fairly low tolerance to lefty media fuelled argumentative 'what if' speculator blame slinging

BUT 'what if' the UK HAD better border control and WAS quite fussy when it comes to letting anything in 
Like we was all promised before the BREXIT referendum 

threat of Virus epidemic and pandemic is not new , I mentioned SARS 2003 before
that was 17 years ago and handled well   

[Doctor Gollum]

Neither SARS nor MERS made the blindest tangible difference to life in the UK or anywhere else. If they had, then we, as a globe, might have been better prepared for Batflu.

Foot and mouth made more of an impact, certainly as far as travel is concerned.

To say that governments aren't taking it seriously though must be some sort of delusional joke, because they have all but shut down the global economy for what, even now, amounts to a fraction of a percent of the global population.

Let's assume that 10 million people contract it (current official total is 3.6 million, and 5 million people eventually die from it (currently 255,000). That amounts to everyone in Portugal catching it, and Costa Rica or Norway not existing.

So in that context trying to criticise the response is a completely and utterly pointless excercise. Would you or I have done things differently? Possibly, probably even. But we each actively chose not to be in the position to do so.

[STEMO]

That reads a touch more abrupt than it sounded in my head...

I've a fairly low tolerance to lefty media fuelled argumentative 'what if' speculator blame slinging

No, that sounds just right for you. Narky old bastard 

[Doctor Gollum]

 

[Doctor Gollum]

Meanwhile, in other news, Virgin is pulling out of Gatwick...

At any other time, that would make for a witty soundbite 

[Lizzie Zoom]

Neither SARS nor MERS made the blindest tangible difference to life in the UK or anywhere else. If they had, then we, as a globe, might have been better prepared for Batflu.

Foot and mouth made more of an impact, certainly as far as travel is concerned.

To say that governments aren't taking it seriously though must be some sort of delusional joke, because they have all but shut down the global economy for what, even now, amounts to a fraction of a percent of the global population.

Let's assume that 10 million people contract it (current official total is 3.6 million, and 5 million people eventually die from it (currently 255,000). That amounts to everyone in Portugal catching it, and Costa Rica or Norway not existing.

So in that context trying to criticise the response is a completely and utterly pointless exercise. Would you or I have done things differently? Possibly, probably even. But we each actively chose not to be in the position to do so.

Yes, indeed.  Not for the first time I will remind everyone, if they can possibly forget it, that the Spanish Flue of 1918-19 cost over 50 million people; the First World War and the Second one killed something like 65 million+, so what we face now is not much at all in the scheme of things, but if you have lost someone your World is far from good now.  For instance, if WW3 transpires, our problems would be very significantly worse!

And again, absolutely right, as I also have pointed out, if you have no responsibility on your shoulders, it is all too easy to criticise from a nice comfy armchair, especially after the fact!! 

In my book our Boris (who I was a staunch critic of) along with the team of highly qualified medical and scientific experts, plus financial advisors to give an indication of the effect of it all on the economy, have actually done a bloody good job in the circumstances.

Yes, later historians will be critical of certain decisions, specific 'war' plans, but they are with Churchill over many decisions taken in WW2.  But they were not there, they did not have the huge responsibility on their shoulders, and deal with an enemy that was strong, very strong and determined, but with Covid-19 invisible as well!

[Lizzie Zoom]

Lastest:

Virgin Alantic announces 3,000 jobs to go, and they will also pull out of Gatwick

Sorry DG!

EDIT:  DG beat me too it as I was writing!!

[dave the builder]

Neither SARS nor MERS made the blindest tangible difference to life in the UK or anywhere else. If they had, then we, as a globe, might have been better prepared for Batflu.

Foot and mouth made more of an impact, certainly as far as travel is concerned.

To say that governments aren't taking it seriously though must be some sort of delusional joke, because they have all but shut down the global economy for what, even now, amounts to a fraction of a percent of the global population.

Let's assume that 10 million people contract it (current official total is 3.6 million, and 5 million people eventually die from it (currently 255,000). That amounts to everyone in Portugal catching it, and Costa Rica or Norway not existing.

So in that context trying to criticise the response is a completely and utterly pointless excercise. Would you or I have done things differently? Possibly, probably even. But we each actively chose not to be in the position to do so.

I remember SARS Ebola etc being on TV 

Governments should have taken it seriously sooner ,is the point

the W.H.O told all member states about WN-CoV coronavirus on 4th /5th Jan
11th Jan W.H.O gave comprehensive information to member states about symptoms,testing,management etc
by 25th Jan (3 weeks later) coronavirus was on mainstream TV
30th Jan Chief Medical Officers in the UK raise risk to the public from low to moderate.
31st Jan first 2 cases of coronavirus confirmed in UK

28 days later or so 

1st March ,despite the UK having it's thunb up it's arse  we have shat our pot full 
 2nd March for Coronavirus guidance for clinicians and NHS managers,time to order some PPE  oh dear 
3rd Mar UK Gov announces one in five people off work and cancellation of operations etc ,because "Herd immunity"

2 months later  where trying to test, track, trace, and isolate


So in that context trying to criticise the response is a completely and utterly justified  excercise.

[Sir Tigger KC]

A couple of points, the Israelis have a unique take on most things.

Secondly, Australia has always been quite fussy when it comes to letting anything in, so it really isn't news that they have more accurate data than a country that hasn't had an effective border until a couple of months ago. 

Also, however unfortunate, 30, 40, or even 100,000 deaths isn't a significant percentage of 70 million or so.

The border point, here at least is a moot one, lock down should have been done when the first whisper was heard.

But it wasn't. Get over it.

Effective border?  Are you kidding?   

There's a steady stream of illegals motoring across the Dover Straights in small boats and if they are spotted by our 'Border Force' Taxi Service they get a free ride into Dover! 

If they don't get spotted, they beach up and disappear off into the countryside. 

[Sir Tigger KC]

Neither SARS nor MERS made the blindest tangible difference to life in the UK or anywhere else. If they had, then we, as a globe, might have been better prepared for Batflu.

Foot and mouth made more of an impact, certainly as far as travel is concerned.

To say that governments aren't taking it seriously though must be some sort of delusional joke, because they have all but shut down the global economy for what, even now, amounts to a fraction of a percent of the global population.

Let's assume that 10 million people contract it (current official total is 3.6 million, and 5 million people eventually die from it (currently 255,000). That amounts to everyone in Portugal catching it, and Costa Rica or Norway not existing.

So in that context trying to criticise the response is a completely and utterly pointless excercise. Would you or I have done things differently? Possibly, probably even. But we each actively chose not to be in the position to do so.

This is not true.  I have friends who were living in Singapore during the SARS outbreak and it made a significant difference to their lives at the time.  Ironically they are now back in Singapore and he said that the preventative measures are similar to the SARS but more severe.

I flew into Kuala Lumper in 2009 when the H1N1 bird flu outbreak was on and we all had temp checks disembarking from the plane by officials fully suited up in what we now call PPE, and were checked again embarking on the way out. 

I think that because none of these outbreaks, SARS, MERS, H1N1, Ebola etc seriously effected the UK, it has made our officials and politicians complacent. 

As you say though, no point in crying about spilt milk..... 

[78bex]

  I note that BA are saying it will be YEARS before air travel recovers to pre virus levels. It will make the after affects of 9/11 seem like a picnic

good, we fly far too easily in modern times,

Maybe, but think of the consequences of all this on jobs, like Doctor Gollum’s, the Gatwick and Heathrow staff, the service industry, the aircraft maintenance crews, the aircraft builders, etc, etc!

It is going to be horrendous

We can go green, turn our backs on modernity, but then live through the worst recession the World has ever known with people, including children, starving on the streets.  Is that all worth it?

Last week it was rotting corpse on the streets, now it's starving children. Get a f**king grip.

I have got a grip Steve with the knowledge that in distant places, like India, there are already starving kids as the sweat shops, that at least used to pay their employees the local going rate, have shut down due to U.K., and other countries, retailers cancelling orders and not paying the contracted severance money.

Our, Europe’s, and America’s welfare state will support our poorest, made redundant, workers so long, but when the financial situation hits the buffers........already the food banks are overwhelmed...........so yes, even in good old Britain “starving kids” could well be a horrible reality.

If you cannot see that......

If not starving, locally we have kids going hungry before all of this kicked off.  Lower paid, working single parent families have suffered as wages fall behind living costs.
Really struggled to find enough food to put on the table & turning to food banks to top up meager rations.

[Doctor Gollum]

The border point was slightly tongue in cheek, point being that it is laughable to compare our border with Australia on the basis that we're both islands... Australia requires significantly more effort to get to, legally or otherwise.

Dave, that is all as it may be, but what does jumping up and down about it achieve? That's right, nothing.

I appreciate that you have concerns with family members working in the care industry, but you're saying very little about the lack of preparation regarding distancing and ppe from care management. Unless that is also the government's fault...