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Author Topic: Help - I know the code!  (Read 4107 times)

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Albatross

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Help - I know the code!
« on: 24 March 2008, 20:16:22 »

I recently had an EML light on situation. I took it down to my local friendly mechanic who attached a cheap Tech2 device and we established I had an error 0421 (I think that was the number, but I've lost the peice of paper now)

I repeat and acknowledge; I may have got that number above wrong, but we looked it up in the code fault guide for the 3.2 V6 at the time and it said that the problem was exhaust fuel mixture related. Apparently the difference between the O2 reading before the CAT and the O2 reading after the CAT were not sufficiently cleaned enough.

It suggested a number of possible causes:

Fuel too rich
Lambda (O2) sensor problem
CAT problem

We cleared the orange warning light and then everything has been EML light free for the last 4 or 5 days until about 10 minutes ago coming home when it has come on again.

What's the 1st step and how do I isolate this problem and fix it without throwing money unnecessarily at spares I may not need?

If it is the lambda switch/sensor, how can I tell which of them and what sort of price am I looking at?
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #1 on: 24 March 2008, 20:20:22 »

I suspect it was 0420....in which case ignore it as it will be the pre-cat getting tired but, wont affect any part of the emissions.

You could run some cataclean through it.
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Albatross

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #2 on: 24 March 2008, 20:24:27 »

Quote
I suspect it was 0420....in which case ignore it as it will be the pre-cat getting tired but, wont affect any part of the emissions.

You could run some cataclean through it.

It was 0420 now I think about it.

I don't want an orange light on my dash, it bugs me and what more important is that I won't know if it tries to tell me something else is worthy of a warning.

Surely the warning light is there to prevent you damaging your engine??

I remember TB saying something about this CAT too when he Tech2 scanned my miggy and fitted the CID.

How can i fix it? Do I need to replace?

The car's done 90K miles
« Last Edit: 24 March 2008, 21:02:26 by Albatross »
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TheBoy

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #3 on: 24 March 2008, 21:47:45 »

Try cataclean as suggested, also better quality fuels may help.  It seems the precats are a bit rubbish on the 3.2s
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Albatross

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #4 on: 25 March 2008, 06:49:34 »

Quote
Try cataclean as suggested, also better quality fuels may help.  It seems the precats are a bit rubbish on the 3.2s


OK thanks, but now I have some quick questions:

How does cataclean work? (i.e. how do you use it?)

Will cataclean's effects last for any length of time?



Can I "de-cat" the preCAT from the car?

Is there a way of switching off the EML light for that error, but still have it work in case of other errors?

How do people who have de-cat straight through exhausts deal with the EML light issue?

What if I wanted to replace the faulty cat, any idea on the best route? new? refurb?

What sort of price?



Is my logic of wanting the EML light to be off, but still work to tell about problems unreasonable? I don't feel safe just "ignoring it", because I may be ignoring other issues. :-[

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TheBoy

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #5 on: 25 March 2008, 14:22:23 »

I think it goes in tank, similar to injector treatment - it have helped some (but not all) people with this issue.

Not sure if anyone has decatted a 3.2 on here yet - the pairs of lamdas work in pairs to check the precat is working (presumably a sign the main cat is?)

No way to 'turn off for just this one code'
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VXL V6

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #6 on: 25 March 2008, 14:28:44 »

Don't think you can decat the pre-cats, the first lambda either side is responsible for mixture control.

TBH just reset the lamp whenever it gets on your nerves! Mine sailed through the emissions test on it's MOT today (As good as new apparently!) and the lamp comes on every 8 or so weeks. Cataclean will help (NB. 1 bottle to 15L of petrol) but it'll never be enough to stop the lamp completely.

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Kevin Wood

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #7 on: 25 March 2008, 14:31:14 »

Mine has started coming on more regularly of late. (at 60K miles). It seems to be the curse of all 3.2s. ;D

On many but not all occasions it has done so a few miles after filling up from empty, with a cold engine, at an unusual petrol station. It does make me wonder if fuel trim has an effect and that suddenly changing some aspect of the fuel's quality makes a difference. It also always stores a fault for both banks (0340 and 0440 IIRC), suggesting it's something common to both banks. I have been trying to fill up only at my regular petrol stations, and only when the tank's 1/4 full rather than on vapours. So far it's worked (I just know the damned thing's going to come on tonight having said that!).

It's certainly nothing to worry about. TADTS. ::)

Kevin
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VXL V6

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #8 on: 25 March 2008, 14:33:12 »

Quote
(0340 and 0440 IIRC)

Find it's P0420 and P0430 on mine.  :y

Running the scanner on mine seems to say that it's generating codes randomly before the light comes on (A threshold level has to be reached before the lamp is lit).

As said before, it's really nothing to worry about, the only time to worry is if the lamp flashes rather than stay illuminated.
« Last Edit: 25 March 2008, 14:36:28 by VXL_V6 »
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Kevin Wood

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #9 on: 25 March 2008, 14:35:02 »

Quote
Don't think you can decat the pre-cats, the first lambda either side is responsible for mixture control.

TBH just reset the lamp whenever it gets on your nerves! Mine sailed through the emissions test on it's MOT today (As good as new apparently!) and the lamp comes on every 8 or so weeks. Cataclean will help (NB. 1 bottle to 15L of petrol) but it'll never be enough to stop the lamp completely.

 


The mixture control lambdas are before the cats, so they don't actually care if there's a cat downstream of them or not. The engine will run quite happily if the mixture control Lambdas are present but the cats removed. You will get an EML unless the cat efficiency Lambdas see activity while the cats are cold, and see that activity cease as the cats come up to temperature. Only way around that I can see is to make a circuit to generate a signal to fool the ECU (I may well do that just to stop the damned light coming on).

Kevin
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Kevin Wood

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #10 on: 25 March 2008, 14:35:55 »

Quote
Quote
(0340 and 0440 IIRC)

Find it's P0420 and P0430 on mine.  :y


Yep. them's the ones.  >:(

Kevin
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #11 on: 25 March 2008, 14:37:07 »

Or re-position the sensors after the main cats.....mgiht not get hot enough though.
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Kevin Wood

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #12 on: 25 March 2008, 14:43:26 »

Quote
Or re-position the sensors after the main cats.....mgiht not get hot enough though.

That's a point.  :y The sensors are heated so it might work.

My WBO2 works from a cold start if you let the sensor heat up before starting. (not recommended as any condensation in the exhaust will kill it)

I assume the ECU has a timeout after which it expects the pre-cats to be up to temperature. Not sure the main cats would be working that soon, but it can't make matters any worse. In any case, it might not be the warmup issue that throws the fault code. Could be that the pre-cats lose effectiveness under heavy load when gas flow is high.

Kevin
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #13 on: 25 March 2008, 14:49:14 »

Yes, should be reasonably straight forward to weld an extra set of boses in after the cats as a trial.....you can fit bungs (sump plugs) in the old holes and swap them as required.
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TheBoy

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Re: Help - I know the code!
« Reply #14 on: 25 March 2008, 15:01:56 »

Wonder if slapping the latest engine firmware on would help?  Has anyone got the latest on yet, and still suffering?
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