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Author Topic: CID in "full" use  (Read 38729 times)

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zirk

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #90 on: 06 August 2014, 22:41:10 »

Ok, (theres a few) but Im on the mobile at the mo, so which link is the one that refers to your board  being made up and I'll have a butchers. ;)
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05omegav6

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #91 on: 06 August 2014, 22:43:56 »

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zirk

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #92 on: 06 August 2014, 23:26:38 »

Here do Zirk...

http://www.opelomegaportal.nl/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=4134  :y
Thanks Al, had a quick look, its in german, so will have to wait tillI get home to translate, by the way is this one of Killer Hardware links, if so I posted something simular about 5 years ago and it got nuked for copyright reasons, sorry just asking.  :-\
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05omegav6

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #93 on: 06 August 2014, 23:59:23 »

Pass :-\ it's from a post by Vega a couple of pages back :y
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #94 on: 07 August 2014, 07:59:09 »

What do these PCB's do?, sorry not been following the Techy bits, theres RGB and CV input on the screens anyway so are we talking about a PCB for switching miltiple inputs maybe?

There is a switch for selecting multiple inputs and a sync separator, the screen needs vertical and horizontal sync signals and your average source does not provide this.
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LC0112G

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #95 on: 07 August 2014, 14:51:10 »

Received an email reply.
They say they can help, but need further instructions as to what I/we need them to do.

I presume machine the board and solder in the major components as a minimum. As some of those ribbon connections look tricky to solder on the very narrow tracks?

PCB train will require PCB design files (typically Extended GERBER files), which means someone has to produce the circuit diagram and PCB layout first. They will then manufacture the PCB's using these design files. AFAIK, they won't do the design work for you - they just manufacture the PCB's and (optionally) assemble them for you. If you get them to assemble the boards they will supply some resistors and capacitors, but you will have to buy and free issue them all the connectors and other components - semiconductors, relays etc. They won't (AFAIK) actually test anything - that's your job - you designed it, you make it work  ;D

Proper PCB's aren't 'machined'. At it's simplest they are done by taking fibreglass panels which are laminated on both sides with a thin layer of copper. The copper is then covered in a layer of photosensitive dye, and a laser is then used to 'draw' the desired layout pattern onto the photodye. Then the sheet goes into a photo developer liquid which removes the dye that hasn't been exposed by the laser. Next the sheet goes into a vat of acid which dissolves the exposed copper, but leaves the copper still covered by the exposed dye behind. This is called 'etching' - but it's a chemical etching not a mechanical one. Once etching is complete the board is washed to remove the remaining dye, and the holes are drilled. If it's a double sided/multilayer board, the inside of the holes is coated with a thin layer of carbon/graphite, and then electro plating is used to coat the inside of all the holes with metal, thus connecting tracks/pads on opposite sides of the board. The final stages are to plate the whole board with something that doesn't corrode (silver or gold typically), paint on a solder resist covering of all the tracks (leaving the pads exposed) and painting on a slik screen for component outlines and part numbers.

The PCB's I saw on one of the web pages did look 'machined' though. This suggests they were home made by someone with an X-Y micro milling machine (like a glorified dremmel). That's fine for cheap prototypes and one offs, but no-one in their right minds would do more than a couple of boards like that.

I do have the tools and tecnology to do the design - but sadly I don't have a CID in my car, and as someone else says I'm reluctant to rip-off someone elses design without their permission. It's really not fair.

I would also be really, really reluctant to supply anything except assembled units. Those connectors ARE beyond the capabilities of all but the most expert of home enthusiasts to solder down without lifting pads or causing shorts. It's just not worth the aggro.
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Vega

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #96 on: 07 August 2014, 17:04:01 »

Here do Zirk...

http://www.opelomegaportal.nl/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=4134  :y
Thanks Al, had a quick look, its in german, so will have to wait tillI get home to translate, by the way is this one of Killer Hardware links, if so I posted something simular about 5 years ago and it got nuked for copyright reasons, sorry just asking.  :-\

Its in Dutch. ;D
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zirk

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #97 on: 07 August 2014, 17:10:01 »

Here do Zirk...

http://www.opelomegaportal.nl/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=4134  :y
Thanks Al, had a quick look, its in german, so will have to wait tillI get home to translate, by the way is this one of Killer Hardware links, if so I posted something simular about 5 years ago and it got nuked for copyright reasons, sorry just asking.  :-\

Its in Dutch. ;D
Dutch, German, Flemish, you all sound the bloody same to me  ;D, actually shouldn't take the p*ss, as German was my first Language, cant speak a word of it now  ::)
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chrisgixer

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #98 on: 08 August 2014, 20:14:27 »

I'm being asked;

Do you have Gerber files? Or do you need to have them made for you?


Wtf? ;D
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05omegav6

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #99 on: 08 August 2014, 22:21:35 »

I'm being asked;

Do you have Gerber files? Or do you need to have them made for you?


Wtf? ;D
Fooked if I can make head nor tail of it, but, this might help...

http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gerber_format  ;D

I suspect you will need them made for you ::)
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #100 on: 11 August 2014, 08:05:47 »

Lol, yes, Gerber files are an output from a PCB layout tool as used by PCB houses to fabricate circuit boards.

Oh yes, they wont use a laser to expose the PCB photosensitive material as it would be far to slow and hence expensive, they use a high intensity UV light and a set of masks (masks being very cheap to produce these days thanks to modern printing methods).

Its possible to DIY PCB's using OH transparencies, UV light and developer and etch solutions.
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LC0112G

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #101 on: 11 August 2014, 10:25:21 »

Lol, yes, Gerber files are an output from a PCB layout tool as used by PCB houses to fabricate circuit boards.

Oh yes, they wont use a laser to expose the PCB photosensitive material as it would be far to slow and hence expensive, they use a high intensity UV light and a set of masks (masks being very cheap to produce these days thanks to modern printing methods).

They don't make old style Photoplots anymore (like big photographic negatives). PCB train work on a batch principle using PCB panels that are 550mmx400mmm. They collect everybodys (small) PCB's and make one huge PCB containing everything. They then cut the one huge PCB up into the smaller individual parts, and send everyone their bit. In this way, they can pool the costs for several small jobs to make one large job. You only pay for the square inches of PCB that your part actually uses.

None of the PCB manufacturers we use have made Photoplots for around 20 years. They all use lasers straight onto the copper foil.

Its possible to DIY PCB's using OH transparencies, UV light and developer and etch solutions.

I've still got a bottle of Ferric chloride, some copper clad, and a Dalo pen in the cupboard. Yes you can make PCB's that way, or even the UV way you suggest. But why, if you can get a professionally made, double sided, plated through, solder resist and silk screened board for £50?
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LC0112G

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #102 on: 11 August 2014, 10:31:12 »

I'm being asked;

Do you have Gerber files? Or do you need to have them made for you?


Wtf? ;D

Gerber files are the 'output' files from the PCB design software. If you want, I can make these for you from the circuit diagrams here :http://www.hardwarekiller.bplaced.net/dvbtG.htm

However, you need to get permission from "Hardware Killer" first.
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #103 on: 11 August 2014, 10:42:41 »

I've still got a bottle of Ferric chloride, some copper clad, and a Dalo pen in the cupboard. Yes you can make PCB's that way, or even the UV way you suggest. But why, if you can get a professionally made, double sided, plated through, solder resist and silk screened board for £50?

Simple, because you can produce one from the info we have available here rather than re-capturing the design into a layout tool  :y

What does need checking is how available the sync generator IC's are as I seem to recall such devices getting hard to source a few years ago.
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: CID in "full" use
« Reply #104 on: 11 August 2014, 10:48:39 »

Looks to be available still, good old TI, the benefits of owning your own fab plants.!

I note that TI do 'samples' (they have always been good for that!  :y)

The relays are nothing special in fact the circuit is very simple.

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