Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: terry paget on 02 December 2017, 12:57:37
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My sister has bought a new Vauxhall Mokka. I used to service her old Meriva, but have never touched her Mokka, dealer does that. She had a puncture last Thursday, luckily near home. Car has no spare wheel, just an aerosol can. She walked home and summoned the breakdown service. The breakdown man recovered the car to a local tyre shop. Initially they could not find the locking wheel nut tool (LWNT), when they did it did not fit. She contacted her garage, who had done the service, and they admitted they must have mixed up the LWNTs. They delivered a box full of assorted LWNTs, none of which fitted. They provided a courtesy car, which she is still using.
Is there a master LWNT for Vauxhalls? How is this problem overcome in the trade?
I suppose another customer has her LWNT, and she has his. I wonder why they did not trace the guy?
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My sister has bought a new Vauxhall Mokka. I used to service her old Meriva, but have never touched her Mokka, dealer does that. She had a puncture last Thursday, luckily near home. Car has no spare wheel, just an aerosol can. She walked home and summoned the breakdown service. The breakdown man recovered the car to a local tyre shop. Initially they could not find the locking wheel nut tool (LWNT), when they did it did not fit. She contacted her garage, who had done the service, and they admitted they must have mixed up the LWNTs. They delivered a box full of assorted LWNTs, none of which fitted. They provided a courtesy car, which she is still using.
Is there a master LWNT for Vauxhalls? How is this problem overcome in the trade?
I suppose another customer has her LWNT, and she has his. I wonder why they did not trace the guy?
probably as well to change all 4 lwnt if she gets no joy. maybe the dealer would stand the cost as they admitted it was their fault
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In the lock nut box or the service book folder should be a lock nut number.
I have been to the dealer with the number and bought a matching lock nut. Still made of chocolate so when you do get them off stick em in the bin.
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£25 for new socket last time I had the misfortune
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Every time I buy a used Omega the first thing I do on getting home is take the wheels off, to make sure I can. After getting the wheel nuts off, I likely as not find the alloy wheels have rusted on and I cannot shift them. Only cure I know is to put back the wheel nuts, half a turn slack, and go for a short drive; that shifts them. Then I wire brush and grease the hubs and replace the wheels, using all standard screws - no locking screws- no-one is going to pinch my wheels. Then I check the spare, check it is legal and inflated, and a steel wheel, 'cos steel wheels are easier to fit than alloys. Check the jack works, add an extensible wheel nut spanner, and have my tea.
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Every time I buy a used Omega the .......
How many times has that been then? :-\
I only ever bought 1 :y
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I worked on my wheels and stupidly left the locking wheel nut in the wheel. I sent a photo to this company and they gave me the code to order the correct one it was a £10. I had been to Merc and the guy had tried all the masters that they had.
The company is www.lockingwheelnutkeys.co.uk
Great service. :y
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Slightly off the subject of Vauxhall lock nut codes etc...
We have just bought a kit for removing lockers and I used it for the first time today. Holy shit this thing is awesome!!!!
So you get a brass thingy. Get the rough size that fits the unique locker shape. Bang it in. Being brass it's soft and adheres to the shape instantly. Brass thing has nut on it. Undo it. JD 👍👍👍
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Every time I buy a used Omega the .......
How many times has that been then? :-\
I only ever bought 1 :y
15 at a guess.
I bought 2 in 2016, none in 2017. I usually but 1 or 2 a year, as my current 6 Omegas die. I expect to buy 2 next year, scrapping them as MOTs become due.
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Every time I buy a used Omega the .......
How many times has that been then? :-\
I only ever bought 1 :y
15 at a guess.
I bought 2 in 2016, none in 2017. I usually but 1 or 2 a year, as my current 6 Omegas die. I expect to buy 2 next year, scrapping them as MOTs become due.
;D
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I'm a moron. I meant to put... :y
.... not ;D
Lol
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Is there a master LWNT for Vauxhalls? How is this problem overcome in the trade?
Most main dealers should have a master set of locking wheel nut keys. They use them when cars come in for service or tyres and the customer either hasn't left or the mechanics can't find the locking wheel nut key. It's usually a case of trying similar ones until they find the one that fits snugly. There is a letter stamped on the end of the key, which will identify it, and from this the correct one can be purchased if you haven't got the code.
If you intend to bin them (as I have), and can't get the car to the garage, I would take a photo of the pattern of the locking wheel nut, visit your friendly Vauxhall garage, and depending on how well you know your them, see if you can borrow the keys that are possibles. Take four ordinary bolts with you, and remove the bolts replacing them with the ordinary ones, before returning the master key.
It's better however if you can go in the car and do it on their forecourt, but if they know you, then they may help you out by lending you them, but it may depend on how much you've spend over the counter in the past!
I've done this before when I have bought cars without a locking wheel nut key, before finding out the hard way at the roadside with a flat tyre.......
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As possibly told before, I bought an Omega 2.2 Omega saloon at West Oxfordshire Motor Auctions ten years ago. The following day I tried to get the wheels off, but could not find the WNLT. In desperation I searched the documentation for any clue to the previous owner. Amazingly I found one, a document in the service register. It was a man in Bath. I rang him, and asked where the WNLT might be. He said it should be in the glove box; when I told him it was not he offered to ask his wife, as it had been her car. He returned with a chuckle, saying she had found it in her handbag. I drove to his house, and he gave it to me together with a spare box of bulbs.
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That's handy, you probably won't have to chisel them off before chucking them in the bin
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That's handy, you probably won't have to chisel them off before chucking them in the bin
So is that how you remove recalcitrant wheel nuts. Sounds feasible with a steel wheel, but tricky woith an alloy wheel with the nut deep within the wheel.
I learned this morning that my sister now has her own car back, with new locking wheel nuts and the WNLT in a box.I shall endeavour to persuade her to allow me to replace the locking wheel nuts with proper ones, and assist her to obtain a spare wheel..
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There's a few different ways.
The kit I mentioned before does no damage to anything (wheel or lock nut).
I've seen someone put a blob of weld on the locker and then some Irwin stud extractors to wind them off via the aforementioned weld.
Chiselling (though I've never attempted it) I imagine would be difficult depending on how far they're recessed in.
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There's a number of different ways, from chiselling them off(if you have access), drilling them, welding a nut to them, or the various special tools that are guaranteed*** to work every time
*** that's a salesman's guarantee; so some of them work, some of the time. And if you're really lucky, you might manage to use the same tool on all four ;D
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As mentioned above, I have found alloy wheels, with their steel centres, rusted hard on the hubs. I tried kicking them, hitting them with hammers, to no avail. Only way I could shift them was to leave the wheel nuts half a turn loose, then go for a 2 mile drive; that never failed. Steel wheels were no trouble. Once off, a good wire brushing of the hubs, and some grease, ensured I could get the wheels off next time.
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As mentioned above, I have found alloy wheels, with their steel centres, rusted hard on the hubs. I tried kicking them, hitting them with hammers, to no avail. Only way I could shift them was to leave the wheel nuts half a turn loose, then go for a 2 mile drive; that never failed. Steel wheels were no trouble. Once off, a good wire brushing of the hubs, and some grease, ensured I could get the wheels off next time.
Large dead blow hammer works every time.
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As mentioned above, I have found alloy wheels, with their steel centres, rusted hard on the hubs. I tried kicking them, hitting them with hammers, to no avail. Only way I could shift them was to leave the wheel nuts half a turn loose, then go for a 2 mile drive; that never failed. Steel wheels were no trouble. Once off, a good wire brushing of the hubs, and some grease, ensured I could get the wheels off next time.
Large dead blow hammer works every time.
I like a long piece of 4x2. Which means you don't have to be under the car - something that's very important at the side of the road.
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Judging by all the methods of removal outlined here, is there any point in having locking wheel nuts? The great unwashed will already know this and will borrow your wheels in a trice if they want them.....
Ron.
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I appreciate my method presumes I can drive the car 2 miles - i.e. no puncture. Bigger hammer could work, but might damage an alloy wheel. Length of 4X2 good idea, but not something I wish to carry around, but fine for a recovery truck man.
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What, you wallop the crap out of it with the 4x2?
Ron.
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I appreciate my method presumes I can drive the car 2 miles - i.e. no puncture. Bigger hammer could work, but might damage an alloy wheel. Length of 4X2 good idea, but not something I wish to carry around, but fine for a recovery truck man.
The problem is the bare aluminium of the wheel reacts with the steel hub. When they're are tight fit to start with, they become very difficult to separate. If you clean the back of the wheel with some scotchbrite, wire brush the hub faces and apply a smear of coppergrease, you won't have a problem.
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What, you wallop the crap out of it with the 4x2?
Ron.
yes.
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Judging by all the methods of removal outlined here, is there any point in having locking wheel nuts? The great unwashed will already know this and will borrow your wheels in a trice if they want them.....
Ron.
This might have been the case years ago when alloy wheels were a bit of a rarity and were only fitted to more prestige vehicles, but these days most cars have alloys, and usually only base models have steel wheels.
I don't think that alloy wheel theft is an issue today unless your vehicle is some exotic vehicle with rare or particularly expensive wheels.
This was another reason for getting rid of the locking wheel nuts on my Omegas.
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Although a new set of premium tyres, worth more than the car, might be worth nicking.
Ive binned mine too, as they are more hassle than they are worth. :y
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Mine in the bin too. :y
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Should I try the scrappie for ordinary bolts, or are Vx prices sensible?
Ron.
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Most 'sensible' people put the wheel bolts they've removed in the tray in the plastic wheel bolt box with the locking key.
I presume you have looked? :D
Then again it depends whether the previous / first owner was sensible.....
I will guarantee that if you go to any scrappy, and have a look on the ground near any Vauxhall, you will find more than enough for your needs. They are invariably just left where they fell when the wheels are removed.
They have a weight stamped on the head - just make sure they are all the same as your existing bolts.
Failing that, I'm sure most OOFers on here will have a surplus of them.
PM me if you are struggling.....
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Should I try the scrappie for ordinary bolts, or are Vx prices sensible?
Ron.
New ones are about a quid. No need to go to a dealer. Your decision.
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As mentioned above, I have found alloy wheels, with their steel centres, rusted hard on the hubs. I tried kicking them, hitting them with hammers, to no avail. Only way I could shift them was to leave the wheel nuts half a turn loose, then go for a 2 mile drive; that never failed. Steel wheels were no trouble. Once off, a good wire brushing of the hubs, and some grease, ensured I could get the wheels off next time.
Large dead blow hammer works every time.
Just don't do that on a customer's car fitted with Irmscher wheels, else you might piss them off a bit when you've mangled their chocolate wheels (or use 4x2).
With crap wheels like the Irmscher ones, such as Sportstars, or even softer, MFL MV6 wheels, terry paget's idea works best... ...though 2 miles is excessive, I do half the length of my drive, accelerating and braking briskly :y. Only once have I had to do it more than once.
As Nick W says, when the wheel is off, clean up mating surfaces, and smear a bit of quality coppaslip, such as the Molyslip stuff (not the shite like carplan), and problem permenently solved :)
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Should I try the scrappie for ordinary bolts, or are Vx prices sensible?
Ron.
Ron, I may have some spares buried somewhere in my shed. Will try and have a look over the weekend and let you know. :y
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Should I try the scrappie for ordinary bolts, or are Vx prices sensible?
Ron.
Available anywhere, even use from breakers here.
If not coming off a broekn Omega, just check length is right... ...yes, I've driven off with bolts that were too long in one of mine :-[ ;D
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As mentioned above, I have found alloy wheels, with their steel centres, rusted hard on the hubs. I tried kicking them, hitting them with hammers, to no avail. Only way I could shift them was to leave the wheel nuts half a turn loose, then go for a 2 mile drive; that never failed. Steel wheels were no trouble. Once off, a good wire brushing of the hubs, and some grease, ensured I could get the wheels off next time.
Large dead blow hammer works every time.
Just don't do that on a customer's car fitted with Irmscher wheels, else you might piss them off a bit when you've mangled their chocolate wheels (or use 4x2).
With crap wheels like the Irmscher ones, such as Sportstars, or even softer, MFL MV6 wheels, terry paget's idea works best... ...though 2 miles is excessive, I do half the length of my drive, accelerating and braking briskly :y. Only once have I had to do it more than once.
As Nick W says, when the wheel is off, clean up mating surfaces, and smear a bit of quality coppaslip, such as the Molyslip stuff (not the shite like carplan), and problem permenently solved :)
Genuinely never had any irmschers in but point taken :y
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My sister has gone to Dorset today to bury a 100 year old chum, The Mokka has 19" wheels, but 5 screw fitting like the Omega. I imagine an Omega wheel would not fit, but I suppose it might, as long as it did not foul the brake caliper. Does anybody know?
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My sister came round yesterday with her car, and I intended to replace her locking wheel nuts with 4 Omega straight wheel screws - no chance, The Mokka uses nuts, not screws, and in the box containing the LWNRT were no simple nuts, so I could not replace the locking nuts with simple nuts. So next time she gets a puncture, she will again have to phone the AA and let them recover her and car to a tyre shop, and good luck to her.
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Pcd is different on the newer generation of 5 stud vauxhalls, too, sadly. 5 x 120 rings a bell. :(
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Pcd is different on the newer generation of 5 stud vauxhalls, too, sadly. 5 x 120 rings a bell. :(
Certainly the case with the Insignia... wheel nuts are 21 (iirc)mm too :o
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My sister has asked me to get her a spare wheel. From what you say old Vx wheels will not fit, Must it be a new wheel from a Vx dealer?
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My sister has asked me to get her a spare wheel. From what you say old Vx wheels will not fit, Must it be a new wheel from a Vx dealer?
Check that there is actually a space to keep it in before you buy one. That will determine whether you can use an ordinary steel wheel of a similar size(off a Corsa for instance) or need an appropriate space saver. It's also worth checking that you can actually fit one of the proper wheels in the boot.
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My sister has asked me to get her a spare wheel. From what you say old Vx wheels will not fit, Must it be a new wheel from a Vx dealer?
Check that there is actually a space to keep it in before you buy one. That will determine whether you can use an ordinary steel wheel of a similar size(off a Corsa for instance) or need an appropriate space saver. It's also worth checking that you can actually fit one of the proper wheels in the boot.
Thank you. Very good advice there. I guess that means getting the car to my place, jacking it up, taking a wheel off, and putting it in the space in the boot floor, if space there be.
I regard this change of policy on spare wheels as a retrogade step, a silly fashion that will soon revert to the age old system of providing a spare wheel and tools to fit it with every new car.
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Got to agree with you there.Although I'm not a fan of space savers either at least they're better than that stupid can of foam[or whatever it is].Bigger wheel/tyre combinations are I think partly to blame+cost saving to manufacturer+weight saving to claim better mpg to appease the tree huggers.
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I regard this change of policy on spare wheels as a retrogade step, a silly fashion that will soon revert to the age old system of providing a spare wheel and tools to fit it with every new car.
Don't hold your breath: the sheer size of modern wheels, combined with the need to cram all sorts of crap in the spaces previously used for a spare, the costs and weight involved(both seem trival to us, but aren't to manufacturers) guarantee that finding a spare wheel in a new car will be a rare occurrence.
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I regard this change of policy on spare wheels as a retrogade step, a silly fashion that will soon revert to the age old system of providing a spare wheel and tools to fit it with every new car.
Don't hold your breath: the sheer size of modern wheels, combined with the need to cram all sorts of crap in the spaces previously used for a spare, the costs and weight involved(both seem trival to us, but aren't to manufacturers) guarantee that finding a spare wheel in a new car will be a rare occurrence.
I fear you could be right. I blame it all on the alloy wheel. Car wheels are best made from 2 steel pressings welded together; cheap, light, strong. Alloy wheels are in every way inferior, but some people think they look nicer, so they get bigger, the tyres skinnier and the ride harsher. Alloy wheels are more likely to stick on the hubs, harder to change, more expensive, and more prone to damage. They are purely fashion items.
All my Senators came on steel wheels. All my Omegas came on alloy wheels, with steel spares.
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My Seat Ateca has a bloody big empty spare wheel well with just a can of goop sitting in it
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Big diameter wheels and rubber band tyres are a fashion thing, rather than of any real use. Once you reach a certain size that is. The thinking is that a big wheel will mask the huge bulk of a modern car, although it emphasises it to me.
So, like all fashion(a means of expression so hideous we have to change it every six months) that will change at some point. I doubt that we will see the return of spare wheels.
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I bought these, shiney new stuff, do I need them, of course I
dont,do.
http://www.halfords.com/workshop-tools/tools/sockets-accessories/laser-locking-wheel-nut-remover
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I bought these, shiney new stuff, do I need them, of course I dont,do.
http://www.halfords.com/workshop-tools/tools/sockets-accessories/laser-locking-wheel-nut-remover (http://www.halfords.com/workshop-tools/tools/sockets-accessories/laser-locking-wheel-nut-remover)
I've had a bigger set of those for years. Even with six(I think) sizes to choose from, they're still not suitable for many wheel nuts. Any nuts that have a rotating collar need that chiseled off first. These are one of those it's worth a try tools, I've not found them to be particularly effective.
My old boss gave us an even worse set that consists of several tapered 1/2" sockets that you hammer onto the nut. None of us ever managed to get them to work.
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I bought these, shiney new stuff, do I need them, of course I dont,do.
http://www.halfords.com/workshop-tools/tools/sockets-accessories/laser-locking-wheel-nut-remover (http://www.halfords.com/workshop-tools/tools/sockets-accessories/laser-locking-wheel-nut-remover)
I've had a bigger set of those for years. Even with six(I think) sizes to choose from, they're still not suitable for many wheel nuts. Any nuts that have a rotating collar need that chiseled off first. These are one of those it's worth a try tools, I've not found them to be particularly effective.
My old boss gave us an even worse set that consists of several tapered 1/2" sockets that you hammer onto the nut. None of us ever managed to get them to work.
i only bought them because they looked nice, and I don't have a welder, and there was nothing else that I liked,so seemed silly to leave empty handed. ;D
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I`ve got a very slow punture on the NSR & every week it`s losing about 6 to 8 psi.
Jacked her up & removed the wheel, but can`t see anything obvious stuck in the tyre ???
What will the tyre depot do if thay can`t find nowt, apart from charging me of course ;D
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Check around the rim with slightly soapy water (look for bubbles). If it's coming out around there, unmount tyre, clean up corrosion (ideally have wheel refurbished) and remount tyre.
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Big diameter wheels and rubber band tyres are a fashion thing, rather than of any real use. Once you reach a certain size that is. The thinking is that a big wheel will mask the huge bulk of a modern car, although it emphasises it to me.
So, like all fashion(a means of expression so hideous we have to change it every six months) that will change at some point. I doubt that we will see the return of spare wheels.
I wouldn't mind if they actually utilised the space for something, in the Juke my wife has.
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Check around the rim with slightly soapy water (look for bubbles). If it's coming out around there, unmount tyre, clean up corrosion (ideally have wheel refurbished) and remount tyre.
I sprayed on some soapy, but it`s difficult to tell with the wheel back on the car; I`ll jack her up again tomorrow & swap it for the spare. I can lay the wheel flat on the ground & try again :)
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That's where all of the wheels on my old Omega used to leak.. and my old M3.. and all the Jag wheels on the kit car ;D
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My sister Kathleen accepts she needs a spare wheel. She brought her car here this afternoon. The spare wheel space is 29" diameter, 9" deep. Road wheels are 26" diameter 8" deep; so far so good. She does not plan to change a wheel at the roadside at 77. so does not want jack or wheelbrace.
On e-bay I have found a Mokka steel wheel rim for £64.95 and a wheel with tyre for £144.85, both free delivery.
Has anyone any better suggestions?
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Yes, go to a breakers and get one complete - it only has to do a few miles until the puncture in the normal wheel has been repaired.
Ron.
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Yes, go to a breakers and get one complete - it only has to do a few miles until the puncture in the normal wheel has been repaired.
Ron.
As the Mokka has not been around long, I wonder if there are many being scrapped yet
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Why mess around?
VAUXHALL MOKKA SPACE SAVER SPARE WHEEL 16" TYRE + Jack & Wheel Spanner, (Fits: Vauxhall Mokka)
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Why mess around?
https://www.ebay.co.uk/sch/i.html?_from=R40&_trksid=p2060353.m570.l1313.TR3.TRC1.A0.H0.XVauxhall+mokka+spare+wheel.TRS0&_nkw=Vauxhall+mokka+spare+wheel
Fixed for linky ;)
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Yes, go to a breakers and get one complete - it only has to do a few miles until the puncture in the normal wheel has been repaired.
Ron.
As the Mokka has not been around long, I wonder if there are many being scrapped yet
I can't believe the wheel size is unique to the Mokka, so I'm sure plenty of Vauxhall models will yield a suitable spare. Make a note of the wheel size and what space saver sizes would be suitable and pop in to a scrappy and pick one up much cheaper than eGay. :y
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I have used these people in the past:-
https://www.breakerlink.com/quotes/
They put out tenders to all of your local breakers and email you a list of those who have what you are looking for, with prices.
Ron.
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My sister Kathleen accepts she needs a spare wheel. She brought her car here this afternoon. The spare wheel space is 29" diameter, 9" deep. Road wheels are 26" diameter 8" deep; so far so good. She does not plan to change a wheel at the roadside at 77. so does not want jack or wheelbrace.
On e-bay I have found a Mokka steel wheel rim for £64.95 and a wheel with tyre for £144.85, both free delivery.
Has anyone any better suggestions?
Hunt around, you can get a Mokka spare wheel with tyre and tool kit for about 130-140 (sometimes less but depends on timing/luck), no other Vx spare fits sadly.
There is a spare wheel well and it will fit the 18 inch wheel with a deflated tyre, 19 inch should also fit although obviously you can just pop it in the back for the short trip to get it repaired/replaced.
And yes, as per many of the newer GMs. they are a stud and nut fixing which get torqued to 140Nm (from memory)
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And yes, as per many of the newer GMs. they are a stud and nut fixing which get torqued to 140Nm (from memory)
So also pack Weetabix ;D