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[TheBoy]

Tunnie and I proved yesterday that the old radiator had a problem.  We poured boiling water in it, and the middle section remained cold.  We poured all sorts of stuff in it to clear blockage, and got loads of crap out.  Running a hose through it showed it could cope with the flow of hosepipe on full. However, upon refitting, same problems with the car running too warm, and losing its coolant out of the cap.

So I bought a new rad today, fitted, but, yes, you guessed it, the problem remains  

The car is fine when gently driving around, but as soon as you start booting it, the temperature goes up to 95/96 (on the dash gauge), at which point I lift off a bit.  It pops the cap and loses a cupful or so of coolant.  If I gently drive home/somewhere safe, the cap may be slightly hissing, but removing cap shows no real pressure.

The middle of the gauge is 95 degrees. Omegatoy tells me that they should run 90 - 92 degrees.

I know the viscous fan may be problematic - but does this have much affect at 80mph (surely airflow should be enough??). The ECU is putting in substitute values for coolant temp due to an issue with the sensor/wiring.

Cooling aside, the engine appears faultless.


So far, I have replaced waterpump, thermostat, cap, and radiator.

I really, really am after some ideas and inspiration now.

[Taxi_Driver]

Only my 2 pennyworth......but it does sound a bit like it doesnt have enough pressure....temp will be hotter than the normal if not enough pressure....If you take the top off the coolant bottle when you have just stopped it and its still hot.....i would expect it to chuck hot water outa the bottle for a second....if you dont release the pressure gently.

Tho not enough pressure could be because of the hiss from the coolant bottle top....leaking the pressure.....are you sure that its a known good working top?

Is it the same as your MV6? ie could you swap them over to see what happens?

[TheBoy]

Only my 2 pennyworth......but it does sound a bit like it doesnt have enough pressure....temp will be hotter than the normal if not enough pressure....If you take the top off the coolant bottle when you have just stopped it and its still hot.....i would expect it to chuck hot water outa the bottle for a second....if you dont release the pressure gently.

Tho not enough pressure could be because of the hiss from the coolant bottle top....leaking the pressure.....are you sure that its a known good working top?

Is it the same as your MV6? ie could you swap them over to see what happens?

Its not the cap from MV6 - that car is working and needs to stay that way.  I have, however, tried 3 caps now....

[tunnie]

Only my 2 pennyworth......but it does sound a bit like it doesnt have enough pressure....temp will be hotter than the normal if not enough pressure....If you take the top off the coolant bottle when you have just stopped it and its still hot.....i would expect it to chuck hot water outa the bottle for a second....if you dont release the pressure gently.

Tho not enough pressure could be because of the hiss from the coolant bottle top....leaking the pressure.....are you sure that its a known good working top?

Is it the same as your MV6? ie could you swap them over to see what happens?

Its already had a replacement coolant bottle, bit of a bodge job as the V6 ones have extra pipes compared to the tractors.

Hummm new rad and still hot, well we proved:

The engine temp sensor is fine,
The loom too the ECU is fine
The fans work..
Under tray is removed so should help cooling

Your not going to like it...... ECU?

What happens if you plug an ECU from a pre-miniface lift in your tractor? Would it start? - can you get around the immobiliser problems?

[TheBoy]

Only my 2 pennyworth......but it does sound a bit like it doesnt have enough pressure....temp will be hotter than the normal if not enough pressure....If you take the top off the coolant bottle when you have just stopped it and its still hot.....i would expect it to chuck hot water outa the bottle for a second....if you dont release the pressure gently.

Tho not enough pressure could be because of the hiss from the coolant bottle top....leaking the pressure.....are you sure that its a known good working top?

Is it the same as your MV6? ie could you swap them over to see what happens?

Its already had a replacement coolant bottle, bit of a bodge job as the V6 ones have extra pipes compared to the tractors.

Hummm new rad and still hot, well we proved:

The engine temp sensor is fine,
The loom too the ECU is fine
The fans work..
Under tray is removed so should help cooling

Your not going to like it...... ECU?

What happens if you plug an ECU from a pre-miniface lift in your tractor? Would it start? - can you get around the immobiliser problems?

ECU plays no part in cooling....

[Taxi_Driver]

Only my 2 pennyworth......but it does sound a bit like it doesnt have enough pressure....temp will be hotter than the normal if not enough pressure....If you take the top off the coolant bottle when you have just stopped it and its still hot.....i would expect it to chuck hot water outa the bottle for a second....if you dont release the pressure gently.

Tho not enough pressure could be because of the hiss from the coolant bottle top....leaking the pressure.....are you sure that its a known good working top?

Is it the same as your MV6? ie could you swap them over to see what happens?

Its not the cap from MV6 - that car is working and needs to stay that way.  I have, however, tried 3 caps now....

Ok now ive looked the MV6 coolant bottle cap wont prove anything anyway......

The caps that you have tried.....are they definately the correct ones?

Ive found part numbers for petrol engine caps, U25TD, X25TD and Y25TD caps
So whats the difference?  :-/ Different shapes....dont know....
Different pressure release valves?.....dont know

Just a thought....

[Omegatoy]

Tunnie and I proved yesterday that the old radiator had a problem.  We poured boiling water in it, and the middle section remained cold.  We poured all sorts of stuff in it to clear blockage, and got loads of crap out.  Running a hose through it showed it could cope with the flow of hosepipe on full. However, upon refitting, same problems with the car running too warm, and losing its coolant out of the cap.

So I bought a new rad today, fitted, but, yes, you guessed it, the problem remains  

The car is fine when gently driving around, but as soon as you start booting it, the temperature goes up to 95/96 (on the dash gauge), at which point I lift off a bit.  It pops the cap and loses a cupful or so of coolant.  If I gently drive home/somewhere safe, the cap may be slightly hissing, but removing cap shows no real pressure.

The middle of the gauge is 95 degrees. Omegatoy tells me that they should run 90 - 92 degrees.

I know the viscous fan may be problematic - but does this have much affect at 80mph (surely airflow should be enough??). The ECU is putting in substitute values for coolant temp due to an issue with the sensor/wiring.

Cooling aside, the engine appears faultless.


So far, I have replaced waterpump, thermostat, cap, and radiator.

I really, really am after some ideas and inspiration now.

90 to 92 cruising mate booting it goes up to about 96 97  but it doesent loose coolant at all,  and cools back down if i return to gentle throttle, you still got bubbles in the header tank? cos the only time i have come across something similar was when i had a car in that constantley threw its coolant out after booting it, afer much headscratching and searching i found he had mixed his antifreeze up with his windscreen washer fluid(both blue) and it ran fine till you booted it then it would throw water out!!! course when we completely drained the system (had to do it 3 times)and refilled it it stopped doing it!!

[JamesV6CDX]

Tunnie and I proved yesterday that the old radiator had a problem.  We poured boiling water in it, and the middle section remained cold.  We poured all sorts of stuff in it to clear blockage, and got loads of crap out.  Running a hose through it showed it could cope with the flow of hosepipe on full. However, upon refitting, same problems with the car running too warm, and losing its coolant out of the cap.

So I bought a new rad today, fitted, but, yes, you guessed it, the problem remains  

The car is fine when gently driving around, but as soon as you start booting it, the temperature goes up to 95/96 (on the dash gauge), at which point I lift off a bit.  It pops the cap and loses a cupful or so of coolant.  If I gently drive home/somewhere safe, the cap may be slightly hissing, but removing cap shows no real pressure.

The middle of the gauge is 95 degrees. Omegatoy tells me that they should run 90 - 92 degrees.

I know the viscous fan may be problematic - but does this have much affect at 80mph (surely airflow should be enough??). The ECU is putting in substitute values for coolant temp due to an issue with the sensor/wiring.

Cooling aside, the engine appears faultless.


So far, I have replaced waterpump, thermostat, cap, and radiator.

I really, really am after some ideas and inspiration now.

90 to 92 cruising mate booting it goes up to about 96 97  but it doesent loose coolant at all,  and cools back down if i return to gentle throttle, you still got bubbles in the header tank? cos the only time i have come across something similar was when i had a car in that constantley threw its coolant out after booting it, afer much headscratching and searching i found he had mixed his antifreeze up with his windscreen washer fluid(both blue) and it ran fine till you booted it then it would throw water out!!! course when we completely drained the system (had to do it 3 times)and refilled it it stopped doing it!!

Pretty sure Jaime has flushed the system many times...

[TheBoy]

Tunnie and I proved yesterday that the old radiator had a problem.  We poured boiling water in it, and the middle section remained cold.  We poured all sorts of stuff in it to clear blockage, and got loads of crap out.  Running a hose through it showed it could cope with the flow of hosepipe on full. However, upon refitting, same problems with the car running too warm, and losing its coolant out of the cap.

So I bought a new rad today, fitted, but, yes, you guessed it, the problem remains  

The car is fine when gently driving around, but as soon as you start booting it, the temperature goes up to 95/96 (on the dash gauge), at which point I lift off a bit.  It pops the cap and loses a cupful or so of coolant.  If I gently drive home/somewhere safe, the cap may be slightly hissing, but removing cap shows no real pressure.

The middle of the gauge is 95 degrees. Omegatoy tells me that they should run 90 - 92 degrees.

I know the viscous fan may be problematic - but does this have much affect at 80mph (surely airflow should be enough??). The ECU is putting in substitute values for coolant temp due to an issue with the sensor/wiring.

Cooling aside, the engine appears faultless.


So far, I have replaced waterpump, thermostat, cap, and radiator.

I really, really am after some ideas and inspiration now.

90 to 92 cruising mate booting it goes up to about 96 97  but it doesent loose coolant at all,  and cools back down if i return to gentle throttle, you still got bubbles in the header tank? cos the only time i have come across something similar was when i had a car in that constantley threw its coolant out after booting it, afer much headscratching and searching i found he had mixed his antifreeze up with his windscreen washer fluid(both blue) and it ran fine till you booted it then it would throw water out!!! course when we completely drained the system (had to do it 3 times)and refilled it it stopped doing it!!

Mine seems to want to go up to 94 ish, maybe 95, easily. Boot it (fairly lightly and for only a short time), and it goes up and up. Don't like to see it above 96/97 so I back off, but it struggles to cool back down.  :-/

I am completely out of ideas.

[TheBoy]

90 to 92 cruising mate booting it goes up to about 96 97  but it doesent loose coolant at all,  and cools back down if i return to gentle throttle, you still got bubbles in the header tank? cos the only time i have come across something similar was when i had a car in that constantley threw its coolant out after booting it, afer much headscratching and searching i found he had mixed his antifreeze up with his windscreen washer fluid(both blue) and it ran fine till you booted it then it would throw water out!!! course when we completely drained the system (had to do it 3 times)and refilled it it stopped doing it!!

And it has been flushed through several times

[Omegatoy]

your not going to like this but i wonder if  the thermostat you fitted could be to hot? cos i remember you saying you bridged the fans and dit made no difference?haqve you bridged the fans with the new rad fitted?

[TheBoy]

your not going to like this but i wonder if  the thermostat you fitted could be to hot? cos i remember you saying you bridged the fans and dit made no difference?haqve you bridged the fans with the new rad fitted?

I have not had fans on with new rad....

I have the Q&H part number for the stat if someone has the ability to cross reference?

[JamesV6CDX]

Tunnie and I proved yesterday that the old radiator had a problem.  We poured boiling water in it, and the middle section remained cold.  We poured all sorts of stuff in it to clear blockage, and got loads of crap out.  Running a hose through it showed it could cope with the flow of hosepipe on full. However, upon refitting, same problems with the car running too warm, and losing its coolant out of the cap.

So I bought a new rad today, fitted, but, yes, you guessed it, the problem remains  

The car is fine when gently driving around, but as soon as you start booting it, the temperature goes up to 95/96 (on the dash gauge), at which point I lift off a bit.  It pops the cap and loses a cupful or so of coolant.  If I gently drive home/somewhere safe, the cap may be slightly hissing, but removing cap shows no real pressure.

The middle of the gauge is 95 degrees. Omegatoy tells me that they should run 90 - 92 degrees.

I know the viscous fan may be problematic - but does this have much affect at 80mph (surely airflow should be enough??). The ECU is putting in substitute values for coolant temp due to an issue with the sensor/wiring.

Cooling aside, the engine appears faultless.


So far, I have replaced waterpump, thermostat, cap, and radiator.

I really, really am after some ideas and inspiration now.

90 to 92 cruising mate booting it goes up to about 96 97  but it doesent loose coolant at all,  and cools back down if i return to gentle throttle, you still got bubbles in the header tank? cos the only time i have come across something similar was when i had a car in that constantley threw its coolant out after booting it, afer much headscratching and searching i found he had mixed his antifreeze up with his windscreen washer fluid(both blue) and it ran fine till you booted it then it would throw water out!!! course when we completely drained the system (had to do it 3 times)and refilled it it stopped doing it!!

Mine seems to want to go up to 94 ish, maybe 95, easily. Boot it (fairly lightly and for only a short time), and it goes up and up. Don't like to see it above 96/97 so I back off, but it struggles to cool back down.  :-/

I am completely out of ideas.

Rather than post up before thinking much about it, markie and I are going to have a chat about this tonight and see if we can pull any ideas together. I can't promise, but it can't hurt to try.

Initial questions though:

1) Have you done a compression test?
2) Have you put an exhaust sniffer in header tank? Needs to be eliminated.
3) Have you substituted the HBV for a known good one (I can bring one over if you don't have one)
4) When you give it a hard rev, does the temp drop at all, or just relentlessly keep rising?
5) Can the Tech2 talk to the CTS now it's been changed?

[TheBoy]

1) Have you done a compression test?
2) Have you put an exhaust sniffer in header tank? Needs to be eliminated.
3) Have you substituted the HBV for a known good one (I can bring one over if you don't have one)
4) When you give it a hard rev, does the temp drop at all, or just relentlessly keep rising?
5) Can the Tech2 talk to the CTS now it's been changed?

1) No - I really, really don't think its HG. Omegatoy has seen it, perhaps he can comment on HG likelyhood?
2) No - as 1)
3) No. Not sure if its the same as V6. Certainly easier to get at, and is not leaking.
4) Revving it on the driveway doesn't heat it up much, needs to be under load to be honest, that means driving it.
5) CTS not changed, looks like wiring issue. M_DTM and I have just been going through the wiring diagrams.  This needs to be resolved, but I'm not convinced this is the issue. M_DTM is less convinced though.

[JamesV6CDX]

I agree that HG is unlikely.. but for the sake of getting a 5 min test done, it would be something you could definitively tick off the list...

This is one of those pain in the ass problems.....

Which will turn out to have a stupidly simple solution...