Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: Jimbob on 14 May 2018, 07:52:17
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Unusually by car was on the drive, so needed to reverse out....
Was 2.5 oC should it be of relavance.
Clutch felt a little strange, cant be more specific really.
Car stalled halfway out, and I couldnt get it out of reverse to restart it, seemed seized in gear.
Got it out, restarted it, moved it some more, and couldnt get it out of gear to go forwards.
Turned ignition off, got it out of gear, started it again, into first and off it went no more issues.
Tested reverse again once I got to work, and it felt a little rough, but in and out a few times and was fine.
Confused!
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Read the codes? :)
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Not yet.....but will later.
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Manual or slushbox ?
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Manual.
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Oil level ok?
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Oil? Engine or gearbox?
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Oil? Engine or gearbox?
Brake fluid ;)
Have you been playing with the brakes ?
Sounds to me like you have a little air in the clutch slave :-\
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Oil? Engine or gearbox?
Gearbox I would think.
Reading your post again, my first point of call would be gearbox oil.
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Sticking slave :-\
How is the brake fluid level? Any fluid loss noticed?
This could be under the carpet rather than outside...
Also, possible to miss a gear if rushing... you may have got reverse without quite disengaging a forward gear (if left in gear when parked). Bringing your foot slowly off the clutch at idle in this case would cause the stall, and the torque through the box would effectively lock it temporarily... Restart and neutral would reset the status quo.
Gear linkage adjustment or wear would probably be my first port of call if the clutch is otherwise functioning normally...
Gearbox wear is another possibility if it's been driven hard... Not as durable as the Vectra C box.
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So...in conclusion...it could be anything from knackered gearbox to alien interference. ;D
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Well it was fine all the way home, fine yesterday evening, only an EGR code flagged.
Was fine this morning....
until 2 miles from work anyway when I lost my clutch in the centre of Crewe :(
Pushed it to safety, then got a colleague to tow me to work.
Now stranded here :(
:'( :'( :'(
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Release bearing?
I replaced the gearbox on an Astra G I had ..... not I job I'd want to do too often, but do-able on a drive
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No idea, clutch pedal has zero resistance, goes straight to the floor without doing anything
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No idea, clutch pedal has zero resistance, goes straight to the floor without doing anything
Any change in fluid level? I assume it's the usual Vauxhall set up where by the brakes share the reservoir with the clutch :-\
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Cant get at it to tell with what Ive got with me, can see it, and reach it, but cant get the lid off.
Cant see it looking low, and brakes are fine, so would expect to be able to identify if it was only half full.
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Cant get at it to tell with what Ive got with me, can see it, and reach it, but cant get the lid off.
Cant see it looking low, and brakes are fine, so would expect to be able to identify if it was only half full.
There's a 'wall' inside the reservoir so that if you completely lose fluid from a leak in one circuit, you don't lose it in both :D
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Cant get at it to tell with what Ive got with me, can see it, and reach it, but cant get the lid off.
Cant see it looking low, and brakes are fine, so would expect to be able to identify if it was only half full.
There's a 'wall' inside the reservoir so that if you completely lose fluid from a leak in one circuit, you don't lose it in both :D
Ahem...
Clutch feed comes from just above MIN level so that you lose the clutch before you lose the inability to stop ::)
Issue is either failed slave or master, (or possibly a failed pipe/hose on either clutch or brakes).
If when you lift the pedal up, you get a single release from pressing the pedal, then the master has gone, otherwise it's either the slave or the pipe from the master. :-\
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Cant get at it to tell with what Ive got with me, can see it, and reach it, but cant get the lid off.
Cant see it looking low, and brakes are fine, so would expect to be able to identify if it was only half full.
There's a 'wall' inside the reservoir so that if you completely lose fluid from a leak in one circuit, you don't lose it in both :D
Ahem...
Clutch feed comes from just above MIN level so that you lose the clutch before you lose the inability to stop ::)
Issue is either failed slave or master, (or possibly a failed pipe/hose on either clutch or brakes).
If when you lift the pedal up, you get a single release from pressing the pedal, then the master has gone, otherwise it's either the slave or the pipe from the master. :-\
Yep,I reckon definitely hydraulic issue,if fluid is low then concentric slave,if fluid still full then suspect master,really unusual to have pipework fail unless fouled by something
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No idea, clutch pedal has zero resistance, goes straight to the floor without doing anything
I had the same on the trafic I had....it was the slave cylinder....... ;)
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Cant get at it to tell with what Ive got with me, can see it, and reach it, but cant get the lid off.
Cant see it looking low, and brakes are fine, so would expect to be able to identify if it was only half full.
There's a 'wall' inside the reservoir so that if you completely lose fluid from a leak in one circuit, you don't lose it in both :D
Ahem...
Clutch feed comes from just above MIN level so that you lose the clutch before you lose the inability to stop ::)
Issue is either failed slave or master, (or possibly a failed pipe/hose on either clutch or brakes).
If when you lift the pedal up, you get a single release from pressing the pedal, then the master has gone, otherwise it's either the slave or the pipe from the master. :-\
Near enough what I said .....
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Cant get at it to tell with what Ive got with me, can see it, and reach it, but cant get the lid off.
Cant see it looking low, and brakes are fine, so would expect to be able to identify if it was only half full.
There's a 'wall' inside the reservoir so that if you completely lose fluid from a leak in one circuit, you don't lose it in both :D
Ahem...
Clutch feed comes from just above MIN level so that you lose the clutch before you lose the inability to stop ::)
Issue is either failed slave or master, (or possibly a failed pipe/hose on either clutch or brakes).
If when you lift the pedal up, you get a single release from pressing the pedal, then the master has gone, otherwise it's either the slave or the pipe from the master. :-\
Which is why I suggested checking fluid level .....
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Lifting the pedal up should stop the flow to the slave, the level will only drop if it's actually leaking...
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Does it drive if starting on the starter and then shifting by rev matching?
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Does it drive if starting on the starter and then shifting by rev matching?
My daughter was amazed that you could do that when I drove her Seicento home after part of the clutch linkage across the bulkhead broke AGAIN ;D
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i did get it into gear like that at the traffic lights once, but stalled immediately, couldnt do it again to coincide with a green light. in a work car park now without room to test currently.
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You need it in first and then start it, you have no chance with the engine running.
Is there any sign of wetness on the underside of the gearbox?
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And weve found the issue....
(http://images.omegaowners.com/images/Jimbob/IMG_3821r.JPG)
fluid clearly dripping off some bolts onto the floor.
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Slave cylinder then?
Can you pop the battery tray out for a closer look at the pipe work
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Ive zero tools with me, emptied the car to shift furniture and havent refilled it yet.
Cannot shift the lid of the fluid tank.
IF i can get it off, and topped up, safe to drive home?
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What sort of job are we talking? Full clutch change, or easier?
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Yes, as its leaking it will self bleed so brim the res and pump a dozen times, then top up again.
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What sort of job are we talking? Full clutch change, or easier?
Do you reallllyyyy want to know........
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What sort of job are we talking? Full clutch change, or easier?
To get to the slave is a gearbox out job ..... another £100 for the pressure plate & friction plate is a small percentage of the labour. Unless you do it :y
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i think the word is b u g g e r
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I cannot get into the reservoir just cant reach, and turn without removing trim which I've no tools to remove it anyway.
Question is, Can I get the AA to do this so I can get home....
If not, its train home, and drive back tomorrow with tools and fluid.
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I cannot get into the reservoir just cant reach, and turn without removing trim which I've no tools to remove it anyway.
Question is, Can I get the AA to do this so I can get home....
If not, its train home, and drive back tomorrow with tools and fluid.
I'd have thought recovery home by the AA was exactly what they're there for. ???
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It would be without question if I payed recovery.....its free with the bank which has always been enough.
Given when I ring, there will be nowhere open, theres not many places to recover it too
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Ah :-\
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You can drive without the slave cylinder if you really have to. I've had to do it a few times. You look like a tool though when you start the engine in first at the lights and the car kangaroos forward. Then it's just a case of rev matching to change up and down the box. You'll get a couple of crunches until you get used it. Try not to stop, so plan ahead and slow for things as much as possible. If you have to stop, knock the engine off, into first and then start it in 1st and off you go again.
But if you can get the AA out, you might as well as it'll save the hassle. Having said that, the AA won't come out for it a second time, so you'll either need to drive it yourself or get them to drop it off at a garage for you.
I've done both the engine & box up and out and subframe down one side method. I think the latter is easier and sometimes (depending on engine and box, you don't need to completely drop the offside of the subframe.
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It would be without question if I payed recovery.....its free with the bank which has always been enough.
Given when I ring, there will be nowhere open, theres not many places to recover it too
Ring your garage or ring around now, then drop it there closed. Stick key through letter box, if they know it's coming, you should be fine.
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found enough tools at work to get to reservoir :) nipping out for fluid.
Least it gets me home
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res filled, pumped brake and clutch pedal a lot, engine on and off, pedal still sinks straight down?
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The leak could be anywhere, Jimbob. Sure, you've found where it's getting out, but it could be coming from much higher up in the engine compartment and running down to that point.
The good side of this: It may be a pipe or union somewhere.......no engine out. :y
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res filled, pumped brake and clutch pedal a lot, engine on and off, pedal still sinks straight down?
I feel for you mate :(
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res filled, pumped brake and clutch pedal a lot, engine on and off, pedal still sinks straight down?
Has the level dropped much? Is there a bigger leak underneith now?
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res filled, pumped brake and clutch pedal a lot, engine on and off, pedal still sinks straight down?
Sounds like a pipe or seal has given way and all you are doing is pumping fluid, not building up any pressure .... :(
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res filled, pumped brake and clutch pedal a lot, engine on and off, pedal still sinks straight down?
Has the level dropped again and the fluid puddle got bigger?
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Level is still full to the brim
Puddle no bigger
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The only good thing about VW is that they use an external slave rather than a concentric one... ::)
Budget for three part clutch kit and flywheel...
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Level is still full to the brim
Puddle no bigger
Hmm....can you get the battery and tray out? (10mm and 13mm)
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Level is still full to the brim
Puddle no bigger
Leave the pedal down for five minutes and report back ;)
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Cant get battery out. Only have a screwdriver with torx adaptor!!!
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Pedal wedged.
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Got a tyre inflator?
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a crap slow noisy one, but yes
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So pop the output of it into the top of the res with the pedal wedged down and use your hand to create a basic seal, run the inflator for a bit.
Your not trying to create huge pressure, just enough to try and force some fluid through (you really need to pressure bleed upwards on these setups but you cant get the battery tray out)
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Well made a bit of a mess, but not done a lot either :(
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pedal down not done anything either :(
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If it's run dry, master might also be shot...
Just had this very conversation about my Merc as they cannot get it to bleed...
Slave failure on my Altea had a similar net result, but fortunately that was under warranty. Clutch master on the Omega seems to suffer abuse more readily... :-\
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They are a shit to bleed, I could only ever get it to work reliably working bottom up with a syringe......... ::) ::)
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They are a shit to bleed, I could only ever get it to work reliably working bottom up with a syringe......... ::) ::)
I saw something suggested about reverse bleeding from the NSF brake caliper using the brake servo to do all the work... Sounds pretty crafty as it also keeps the reservoir topped up (after the initial pipe fill of course) 8)
That is if it actually works :-\
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As soon as the pedal moves down slightly then the port from the reservoir into the cylinder closes so you cant force fluid through the way you were trying. Got to be with the pedal up. Would have to be a serious leak for this to work anyway.
If you can get to the bleed screw and bleed the system...or ideally push fluid IN through the bleed screw until it comes out of the header then you should have a working clutch for a day or so.
Fuse19...do you want me to bring the engine beam on Thursday??? ::)
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If it's run dry, master might also be shot...
Just had this very conversation about my Merc as they cannot get it to bleed...
Slave failure on my Altea had a similar net result, but fortunately that was under warranty. Clutch master on the Omega seems to suffer abuse more readily... :-\
You will never bleed the Merc normally,peice of rubber hose from nearside front wheel bleed nipple to clutch slave nipple,open both nipples and pump brake pedal a few times,fluid won't need topping up as it ends up back in the master anyway,this works a treat on A class as I've done it :y
edit ,too late again ,already been done :-\
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If it's run dry, master might also be shot...
Just had this very conversation about my Merc as they cannot get it to bleed...
Slave failure on my Altea had a similar net result, but fortunately that was under warranty. Clutch master on the Omega seems to suffer abuse more readily... :-\
You will never bleed the Merc normally,peice of rubber hose from nearside front wheel bleed nipple to clutch slave nipple,open both nipples and pump brake pedal a few times,fluid won't need topping up as it ends up back in the master anyway,this works a treat on A class as I've done it :y
edit ,too late again ,already been done :-\
I was staring at a fiesta after changing it's clutch recently and thought , how the bloody hell do you reverse bleed the bastard, I wish I'd thought of that ...genius solution :y
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They're fitting a new master... Tbh, it had crossed my mind to change it as well as a) it's done the same mileage as the slave, and b) on the Altea both had failed and it saves a second garage visit :y
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AA due by 8....Wish me luck!
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AA due by 8....Wish me luck!
I thought you were meaning me for a minute :D
Good luck James :y
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Lol. Cheers!
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Had to upgrade my AA cover to get a tow. But I’m home!
Ahh well. Still been cheaper than buying better cover every year
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I do the sane, free basic AA via Halifax. Topped up to relay, mainly if the MrsT breaks down with the kids...
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res filled, pumped brake and clutch pedal a lot, engine on and off, pedal still sinks straight down?
Sounds like a pipe or seal has given way and all you are doing is pumping fluid, not building up any pressure .... :(
When my manual Omega exhibited the same symptoms it was the flexi hose that had failed. Still had to drop the gearbox to change it ::) I didn't change the slave cylinder and it was still working fine when I got ride of the car.
I drove that home using clutchless gear changes without too much drama :y
I imagine that a split hydraulic hose might close up tight and prevent fluid escaping under gravity but open up when real pressure is applied :-\
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Need to get the battery tray out and have a look at the fluid lines now its home. :y
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Nowt I can see...
(https://www.dropbox.com/s/2vo0xwsntp0d8my/IMG_3827r.JPG?dl=1)
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Got a syringe or easibleed?
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got an easybleed.
What are you suggesting....Easybleed onto that nipple, force fluid back to header tank...
Pedal sorted.
However, what does that actually give me, short term fix assuming I ensure level always full?
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Once it's working as normal, you can check all the pipework over to see if there is any obvious leaks. If not and you are still dripping fluid, then it's probably gearbox out time.
EDIT
You wouldn't want to take a box out to find it's a pipe outside the box.
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Exactly that, force fluid in and get a peddle, keep it topped up as a short term fix.
Also proves where the failure is and what it is
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Connected it all up, opened nipple, no fluid seemed to go anywhere though? what am I doing wrong?
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If it's anything like the Astra clutch nipple it is very fiddly and difficult to know if it is actually open. IIRC the astra one took a fair bit more than the 1/4 turn the brake nipples took.
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If it's anything like the Astra clutch nipple it is very fiddly and difficult to know if it is actually open. IIRC the astra one took a fair bit more than the 1/4 turn the brake nipples took.
Correct....Now bled, pedal used while bleeding too.
Tank full, normal, if not stiffer pedal.
Closed all up, used pedal some more, can see no leaks in the bay.....should I be peering up underneath, or nowt to see there anyway?
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If it's anything like the Astra clutch nipple it is very fiddly and difficult to know if it is actually open. IIRC the astra one took a fair bit more than the 1/4 turn the brake nipples took.
Correct....Now bled, pedal used while bleeding too.
Tank full, normal, if not stiffer pedal.
Closed all up, used pedal some more, can see no leaks in the bay.....should I be peering up underneath, or nowt to see there anyway?
Look at where the engine joins the gearbox,thats where it will drip from,if its a very slow leak it could be months before you need to top up,try it and keep eye on level :y
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Use it a bit and check the brake fluid level regularly, should buy you some time :y
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What do we actually think is broken then? And in what way?
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What do we actually think is broken then? And in what way?
Is the bleed nipple that plastic POS like on the astra?
If so it could be that. I suspect mine is fubar as occasionally I get the same symptom you had but only when it has been standing overnight. Once the clutch is depressed a second time it is resolved. The plastic POS nipple is slightly loose and even though there is no leak it can move in and out by a few mm. So I assume that the first press of the pedal in the morning is building up the pressure which pushes the part fully out and the second depress is moving the clutch fully. I wonder if yours is the same it could also be leaking on the underside and it is tracking to the bottom of the bellhousing?
I need to get around to replacing it but the give-a-carp-o-meter is flicking very firkin low on it right now.
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Yes. Plastic nipple. Obviously wet now but was bone dry when I started
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(https://workshop-manuals.com/vauxhall/astra-h/images/astra-h-13296.jpg)
Did you check underneath where is meets the block to check it was dry?
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Had a good a look as I could from above and nothing looked like it had leaked.
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What do we actually think is broken then? And in what way?
Its most likely to be the concentric slave leaking,you'll know how much after a day or two's use
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What do we actually think is broken then? And in what way?
Its most likely to be the concentric slave leaking,you'll know how much after a day or two's use
Yes, that.
They're no more reliable than an external slave, but require gearbox removal rather than a £20 part attached with a couple of bolts and needing 30 seconds worth of bleeding. We did one in the street outside the previous owner's house in the dark, while he put the kettle on. The look on his face when he came out with the coffees to find that Richard was test driving the car was priceless.
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Right. So what shouldI be looking at.
1st clutch & Dmf did 80000 and 6 years
this one has 56000 and 3 years under its belt.
Should I be just getting this slave done, or given the work involved, everything while its in bits?
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To add insult to injury I dropped the battery as I went to put it back in. Acid all over the drive now and more expense.
If it wasnt for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all :'( :'( :'(
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To add insult to injury I dropped the battery as I went to put it back in. Acid all over the drive now and more expense.
If it wasnt for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all :'( :'( :'(
Want to buy an A Class :D
Do the lot :y
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To add insult to injury I dropped the battery as I went to put it back in. Acid all over the drive now and more expense.
If it wasnt for bad luck, I'd have no luck at all :'( :'( :'(
Look on the bright side, it never landed on your foot.
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Connected up my spare battery after charging it.
I have have a pedal that feels like a clutch pedal, but it doesnt work too well!
Got it into reverse and out the drive fine, round the corner fine, out of gear at junction and stall! struggle to get it out of gear,
restart, into reverse move a bit, stall, and stuck in reverse again.
cant restart it in neutral without it stalling, so into first to start and move together, out the road into a big enough circle to drive back in, and back on the drive!
Can see fluid on the road where I was attempting manoeuvres
Not gonna move it again until its going in for repair, with someone to tow if needs be.
fluid level is ok, but its clearly still loosing, and nowt to see in the bay.
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Booked in for next week.
Just got to try a ‘fun’ drive to get it there. I’ll pick a quiet time!
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Booked in for next week.
Just got to try a ‘fun’ drive to get it there. I’ll pick a quiet time!
Whose doing it?
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The usual local garage I use for MOT's etc
Given its virtually undrivable, im fairly limited in where I can get it.
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The usual local garage I use for MOT's etc
Given its virtually undrivable, im fairly limited in where I can get it.
:(