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[henryd]

I've just read a review of the new Grand Insignia, top of the range 2.0 petrol (250 bhp) Elite, 4x4, 8 speed auto, Nav. Price - about £28k.

That's significantly LESS than the Omega Elite price at launch, in 1994, some 23 years ago ...

Interesting, very interesting.......

It was possible to pay the best part of £20k for a Cavalier at one point!

I once bought a Vectra 2.5 CDX Full leather... Auto .... Around 2000 yr iirc .... about £23k new ... 9 months and 6k miles on it £12k  ex Vx management....
Had a race once with Subaru Impreza (on a private race track of course!) .... The Vx held its own and was only when the vx locked the torque converter up at 125mph ... that the Subaru started to gain distance on me.....Still not bad for not a sports car with an auto box 
Annoying point of the autobox I remember was it used to put the g/b in to N when sitting still....So go for for a quick get away and the g/b used to thump into 1st ......

My 3.0 cdti Signum used to do the neutral at idle bit,as you say bloody nuisance when in a hurry

[TD]

I'm looking at Zafira Touers. Around £10k gets me say 1.4T Elite on around 63 plate with sub 20k miles, so very good value.

Properly test drive one first.  That little 1.4 turbo is a great little engine, but a Battlebus is big, heavy and as aerodynamic as a brick.

Not driven that combo before, but would imagine you might have to wring its neck a bit  .  In a (lighter, more aerodynamic) Astra, it does seem to pull well from 2000rpm (relatively speaking)

I guess the manu's are just fitting bigger turbos....to get the power output....im still not sure what that does to engine in long levity states.. 

It might get fuel consumption up and exhaust emissions down.....but a 1.4T or even a diesel 1.6T like mine.....getting near 300k 
Which I'm sure some of the 3.2's 2.6's Omega are capable of.....or even a 2.0TD.....

My 1.6TD is on 160k....and still going strong.....even after the cambelt snapped.....new cambelt kit fixed it....don't think that would happen on an omega tho 

[tunnie]

I'm looking at Zafira Touers. Around £10k gets me say 1.4T Elite on around 63 plate with sub 20k miles, so very good value.

Properly test drive one first.  That little 1.4 turbo is a great little engine, but a Battlebus is big, heavy and as aerodynamic as a brick.

Not driven that combo before, but would imagine you might have to wring its neck a bit  .  In a (lighter, more aerodynamic) Astra, it does seem to pull well from 2000rpm (relatively speaking)

Yes, this is huge concern of mine. The bugger is petrol + auto = 1.4T engine, there is no other petrol auto combination. 

Forums say it's actually ok for around town and A roads and does not feel underpowered, but, that Turbo will be working hard all the time. 

The S-Max has a much more acceptable 2.0 Turbo Petrol, with around 200 ponies.

I'm looking at Zafira Touers. Around £10k gets me say 1.4T Elite on around 63 plate with sub 20k miles, so very good value.

Properly test drive one first.  That little 1.4 turbo is a great little engine, but a Battlebus is big, heavy and as aerodynamic as a brick.

Not driven that combo before, but would imagine you might have to wring its neck a bit  .  In a (lighter, more aerodynamic) Astra, it does seem to pull well from 2000rpm (relatively speaking)

I guess the manu's are just fitting bigger turbos....to get the power output....im still not sure what that does to engine in long levity states.. 

It might get fuel consumption up and exhaust emissions down.....but a 1.4T or even a diesel 1.6T like mine.....getting near 300k 
Which I'm sure some of the 3.2's 2.6's Omega are capable of.....or even a 2.0TD.....

My 1.6TD is on 160k....and still going strong.....even after the cambelt snapped.....new cambelt kit fixed it....don't think that would happen on an omega tho 

Positive to hear, it might just be a mindset thing of: 1.4 + Big car = No 

[Kevin Wood]

1.4 Turbo with a slush box in a Zafira?

Well, if the objective is to make the Passat seem less dull.

[tunnie]

1.4 Turbo with a slush box in a Zafira?

Well, if the objective is to make the Passat seem less dull.

I like these...

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201702182454470?price-from=10000&radius=1500&postcode=tw89de&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&model=S-MAX&fuel-type=Petrol&sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&make=FORD&page=1

But they aint cheap, same price gets me a much newer and low miles Zaf.

[Viral_Jim]

No experience of the Zaf, however I once drove an S-max from Munich down to Bruneck in Italy and back again for work. I had it 3 weeks in all, did about 600km all up. I found it very refined and comfortable for the type of car, it also swallowed 5 adults plus skiing/snowboarding gear with ease once the middle middle seat of the middle row was folded (I do miss the factory at the foot of a ski slope!).

Cost must certainly be a factor, however I would give an s-max serious thought!

[Lincs Robert]

No experience of the Zaf, however I once drove an S-max from Munich down to Bruneck in Italy and back again for work. I had it 3 weeks in all, did about 600km all up. I found it very refined and comfortable for the type of car, it also swallowed 5 adults plus skiing/snowboarding gear with ease once the middle middle seat of the middle row was folded (I do miss the factory at the foot of a ski slope!).

Cost must certainly be a factor, however I would give an s-max serious thought!

Interestingly, Ford regard the SMax as the "same" vehicle as the Mk4 Mondeo. Ok, different panels etc, but the floor pan and all mechanicals/electrics are Mondeo Mk4 estate based.

If interested, then use Google to Find Ford & Etis, this will bring up a page where you can enter a Ford reg number & it will give the vehicle spec as built - rather useful if looking to buy as many adverts are misleading. HTH

[tunnie]

No experience of the Zaf, however I once drove an S-max from Munich down to Bruneck in Italy and back again for work. I had it 3 weeks in all, did about 600km all up. I found it very refined and comfortable for the type of car, it also swallowed 5 adults plus skiing/snowboarding gear with ease once the middle middle seat of the middle row was folded (I do miss the factory at the foot of a ski slope!).

Cost must certainly be a factor, however I would give an s-max serious thought!

Good to hear, I've heard good things about them. Middle seat in back row is also full size, unlike in the Zaf.

[Marks DTM Calib]

S-Max is a size up from the Zafira and hence the feature, engine range and price difference.

As for longevity of any small turbo engines, its nothing to worry about in reality, the turbo is no more strained than on any other vehicle and the internals are more than robust enough to handle 140bhp. The fact they have VVT and variable vane means they are pretty good at managing heat etc

I find the 1.4 Turbo in the wife's car quite an easy drive and it has an astonishing amount of torque low down for a petrol but, her car is a few hundred kgs lighter!

Not sure I would be concerned about a centre seat Isofix to much.....unless your planning to 'get on it' significantly in the next few months, last thing you really want is a child within plain sight of the windscreen if you can help it 

[Doctor Gollum]

No experience of the Zaf, however I once drove an S-max from Munich down to Bruneck in Italy and back again for work. I had it 3 weeks in all, did about 600km all up. I found it very refined and comfortable for the type of car, it also swallowed 5 adults plus skiing/snowboarding gear with ease once the middle middle seat of the middle row was folded (I do miss the factory at the foot of a ski slope!).

Cost must certainly be a factor, however I would give an s-max serious thought!

Interestingly, Ford regard the SMax as the "same" vehicle as the Mk4 Mondeo. Ok, different panels etc, but the floor pan and all mechanicals/electrics are Mondeo Mk4 estate based.

If interested, then use Google to Find Ford & Etis, this will bring up a page where you can enter a Ford reg number & it will give the vehicle spec as built - rather useful if looking to buy as many adverts are misleading. HTH

The SMax is a Galaxy with a small boot... if you want an estate car, buy one. If you want a people carrier buy a Galaxy/Sharon. If you want a people carrier with genuine luggage capacity then buy a long wheelbase low roof Transit/Vivaro/Vito.

Incidentally, what does Mrs T want?

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

1.4 Turbo with a slush box in a Zafira?

Well, if the objective is to make the Passat seem less dull.

I like these...

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201702182454470?price-from=10000&radius=1500&postcode=tw89de&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&model=S-MAX&fuel-type=Petrol&sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&make=FORD&page=1

But they aint cheap, same price gets me a much newer and low miles Zaf.

[/highlight]

£11650 for a 7 year old Ford just ripe for expensive repairs. Has the world gone mad?....

[tunnie]

S-Max is a size up from the Zafira and hence the feature, engine range and price difference.

As for longevity of any small turbo engines, its nothing to worry about in reality, the turbo is no more strained than on any other vehicle and the internals are more than robust enough to handle 140bhp. The fact they have VVT and variable vane means they are pretty good at managing heat etc

I find the 1.4 Turbo in the wife's car quite an easy drive and it has an astonishing amount of torque low down for a petrol but, her car is a few hundred kgs lighter!

Not sure I would be concerned about a centre seat Isofix to much.....unless your planning to 'get on it' significantly in the next few months, last thing you really want is a child within plain sight of the windscreen if you can help it 

Thanks Mark  - I would not mind a Zaf, as it fit's nicely in my budget plans.

Reasoning for centre ISO, is MrsT's sisters have young children, I can see it being useful having 3 ISO's in the middle, they would be used.

Also going on the fact sister-in-law has taken our daughter out for the afternoon with her 2, while the other one was at school. So she used the spare seat, that said, I guess we could soon get away with a booster in the middle, but having said that backless boosters appear to be soon illegal:

http://www.which.co.uk/news/2016/04/new-booster-seats-ban-439787/

The Zaf's setup of seatbelt only in the middle would be a pain, it's the SIL's main gripe with their big Zaf Tourer and are now looking at Fords (S-Max & Galaxy)

I also would want the rear two seats only for luggage/occasional use, something about them being that close to the rear screen makes me shudder.

[tunnie]

1.4 Turbo with a slush box in a Zafira?

Well, if the objective is to make the Passat seem less dull.

I like these...

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201702182454470?price-from=10000&radius=1500&postcode=tw89de&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&model=S-MAX&fuel-type=Petrol&sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&make=FORD&page=1

But they aint cheap, same price gets me a much newer and low miles Zaf.

[/highlight]

£11650 for a 7 year old Ford just ripe for expensive repairs. Has the world gone mad?....

It has, some people pay 50quid a month to tax a Vectra 

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

1.4 Turbo with a slush box in a Zafira?

Well, if the objective is to make the Passat seem less dull.

I like these...

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201702182454470?price-from=10000&radius=1500&postcode=tw89de&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&model=S-MAX&fuel-type=Petrol&sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&make=FORD&page=1

But they aint cheap, same price gets me a much newer and low miles Zaf.

[/highlight]

£11650 for a 7 year old Ford just ripe for expensive repairs. Has the world gone mad?....

It has, some people pay 50quid a month to tax a Vectra 

Ah.....but the Signum is a very superior Vectra. .......and it costs a paltry £45 each month to tax.

[STEMO]

1.4 Turbo with a slush box in a Zafira?

Well, if the objective is to make the Passat seem less dull.

I like these...

http://www.autotrader.co.uk/classified/advert/201702182454470?price-from=10000&radius=1500&postcode=tw89de&onesearchad=Used&onesearchad=Nearly%20New&onesearchad=New&model=S-MAX&fuel-type=Petrol&sort=price-asc&advertising-location=at_cars&make=FORD&page=1

But they aint cheap, same price gets me a much newer and low miles Zaf.

[/highlight]

£11650 for a 7 year old Ford just ripe for expensive repairs. Has the world gone mad?....

It has, some people pay 50quid a month to tax a Vectra 

Oooooo....that will hurt