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[TheBoy]

Should have closed the lot, then I wouldn't be suckered into using such a crap service, and being £70 lighter for the privilege. I make that 50p per mile, give or take, not taking into account t the taxpayer subsidies

[TheBoy]

Obviously, that's standing room only

[Bigron]

I rarely use the trains, TB, so I'm with you on that, but I do use the roads. I've often thought that railways would be best concreteded over and used as roads - nice and straight, gentle gradients and right into city centres.
The stations themselves would make good (free) car parks, too!
Governt policy is to encourage more people to use railways and other public transport, but what if they got wwhat they claim to want? The already overcrowded trains and buses simply could not cope.

Just another item to add to my Manifesto as prospective Minister for Transport! 

Ron.

[biggriffin]

A good policy, I will 2nd, when TB is our glorious leader,  there's an awful lot of railway employees that would need to be included in the cull.

[Sir Tigger KC]

When Comrades Corbyn and McDonnell get in and nationalise the railways, the service will become so abysmal that no one will use them, the whole lot will become bankrupt (along with the rest of us) and will be shut down. 

British Rail sandwich anyone? 

[Kevin Wood]

When Comrades Corbyn and McDonnell get in and nationalise the railways, the service will become so abysmal that no one will use them, the whole lot will become bankrupt (along with the rest of us) and will be shut down. 

British Rail sandwich anyone? 

Shut down? Oh, I don't think the unions will let them get away with that!

[Mister Rog]

Ooooops  I disagree. I often travel to London from West Wales, very rarely any problem, and with a senior discount card it's cheap. About £54 return. I can't drive for that, even taking into consideration tube fares.

If I stay in London, I stay a bit out of town as the hotels are cheaper, and take the train. Again rarely any problem.

It's you. They've just got it in for you. CCTV picks you up, facial recognition, train delay protocol is automatically initiated. 

[Sir Tigger KC]

When Comrades Corbyn and McDonnell get in and nationalise the railways, the service will become so abysmal that no one will use them, the whole lot will become bankrupt (along with the rest of us) and will be shut down. 

British Rail sandwich anyone? 

Shut down? Oh, I don't think the unions will let them get away with that!

Ah yes I forgot about them.    OK well if you don't mind getting on a filthy train that is 10 minutes late and delivers you to your destination 30 minutes later than advertised it'll be fine because there will be plenty of seats! 

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

Public transport only works if it is state owned and run, and heavily subsidised.

Any train travel within a 100 mile radius should cost £3 or less. Any train travel nationwide should cost £10 or less.

You will still travel in 'cattle class' conditions much the same as now, but the price will reflect this so people will be more chilled out.

.......and don't get me started on why we, the taxpayer, are subsidising privately run train companies which were supposed to be mean and lean and therefore not be a drain on the taxpayer.

[Kevin Wood]

When Comrades Corbyn and McDonnell get in and nationalise the railways, the service will become so abysmal that no one will use them, the whole lot will become bankrupt (along with the rest of us) and will be shut down. 

British Rail sandwich anyone? 

Shut down? Oh, I don't think the unions will let them get away with that!

Ah yes I forgot about them.    OK well if you don't mind getting on a filthy train that is 10 minutes late and delivers you to your destination 30 minutes later than advertised it'll be fine because there will be plenty of seats! 

You could avoid all those embarrassing empty seats by paying the drivers to stay at home. Problem solved.

[Doctor Gollum]

Public transport only works if it is state owned and run, and heavily subsidised.

Any train travel within a 100 mile radius should cost £3 or less. Any train travel nationwide should cost £10 or less.

You will still travel in 'cattle class' conditions much the same as now, but the price will reflect this so people will be more chilled out.

.......and don't get me started on why we, the taxpayer, are subsidising privately run train companies which were supposed to be mean and lean and therefore not be a drain on the taxpayer.

Actually the opposite will happen... the less people pay, the more they demand.

[Mister Rog]

Public transport only works if it is state owned and run, and heavily subsidised.

Any train travel within a 100 mile radius should cost £3 or less. Any train travel nationwide should cost £10 or less.

You will still travel in 'cattle class' conditions much the same as now, but the price will reflect this so people will be more chilled out.

.......and don't get me started on why we, the taxpayer, are subsidising privately run train companies which were supposed to be mean and lean and therefore not be a drain on the taxpayer.

Actually the opposite will happen... the less people pay, the more they demand.

A bit like flying

"Wot do you mean I have to pay extra for my bags ? I paid £5 for this flight !!"

[Lizzie Zoom]

The railways, once rebuilt and extended with HS2, 3, 4, etc are the future for the continual mass movement of people and goods.

This is a car Forum, so I expect TB and almost everyone to disagree with me.  But what have your experiences been driving long distance in this country now, especially travelling to the North West or North East from the London direction, or crossing the Pennines or travelling from Liverpool and going around Manchester to the East?

During much of the day the motorways involved become giant car parks.  You sit there in the never ending queue thinking why am I doing this?  I also have thought repeatedly the age of long distance motoring is over.  I have watched, since the 1970's, whilst motoring long distances in the UK, a constant build up of traffic no matter how many new motorways have been built, or how they have "improved" them, to bring a repetition of  traffic queues, with the only change that they are getting longer and longer, with travelling times extending beyond acceptability.  Our population is rapidly increasing, with of course a corresponding escalation in the number of new drivers taking their vehicles onto the road.  This cannot continue, and the one way we as humans can transport ourselves en mass, apart from teleporting,  is to use trains.  Thousands of people can be transported very quickly, and that is why so much investment is going into the railways now, at last thank God.

As for freight, why are we putting up with our roads being clogged by long distance lorries?  The loads being carried by them should be moved to the railways.  It makes perfect sense, but of course there is a anti-railways lobby that is getting in the way of all this.

Beeching did what he thought was right for his political masters at the time, but as usual the politicians were only thinking ahead by 5 or 10 years.  If they had had real insight the railways would have been rebuilt in the 1970's, but they were so convinced the railways were old hat and obsolete and the car was the future.  How wrong they were, and how wrong they were in closing down railway routes like the Great Central main line, or the Somerset and Dorset, or the Waverley Route, and then there is more local lines that now would have been vital links in our transport system, but no were closed.  Some of those, like the Polegate Line in Sussex, are now the subject of reviews to rebuild and re-open.  Thank God the heritage lines have been saved and now survive with the ability to give locals an alternative transport system, with many rebuilding their main line connections.

The new age of the railways is with us and that is why the demands on them are doubling, not decreasing, and in fact are proving so successful that sometimes they just cannot cope with the numbers.  That is why billions are being pumped into them to rebuild, extend, and greatly improve the Customer experience.  HS1 has already made a big difference here in the South East; HS2 onwards will only spread that improvement across the Country, with far greater capacity and faster journeys.

Long live the railways!

[Bigron]

Oh Lizzie, you were right to predict disagreement!
The problem with railways, especially for freight, is that their end points are rarely where the goods need to be. I'm afraid I am old enough to remember the depots with their delightful Scammel vehicles, designed to be able to turn as tightly as the horse-drawn carts they replaced. Guess what they did once loaded with the freight from the trains?
Motorways and other major (and minor, really) roads have always been built long after they were desperately needed. If our planners had actually planned, we would have a network better than the Germans and your long distance journeys would be relaxing and pleasurable.

When I implement my policy of concreting them over, I would leave the overhead power supply in place, so that there would always be plentiful charging facilities for the electric vehicles, although the 25kV supply might need to be calmed down a bit!

Lizzie, I don't mind trains - especially steam - but as curiosities for the tourism and leisure industries, not to go anywhere in comfort, conveniently. 

Ron.

[Lizzie Zoom]

Oh Lizzie, you were right to predict disagreement!
The problem with railways, especially for freight, is that their end points are rarely where the goods need to be. I'm afraid I am old enough to remember the depots with their delightful Scammel vehicles, designed to be able to turn as tightly as the horse-drawn carts they replaced. Guess what they did once loaded with the freight from the trains?
Motorways and other major (and minor, really) roads have always been built long after they were desperately needed. If our planners had actually planned, we would have a network better than the Germans and your long distance journeys would be relaxing and pleasurable.

When I implement my policy of concreting them over, I would leave the overhead power supply in place, so that there would always be plentiful charging facilities for the electric vehicles, although the 25kV supply might need to be calmed down a bit!

Lizzie, I don't mind trains - especially steam - but as curiosities for the tourism and leisure industries, not to go anywhere in comfort, conveniently. 

Ron.

Yes, I remember those days, but they were handling loose coal and freight in small quantities. We need to return to the idea of major rail freight head distribution centres that handle bulk freight, nowadays mostly in containers, with major companies being encouraged through normal commercial considerations to build those centres, helped by governmental "incentives". 

Currently, 44 tonne lorries drive up and down our motorways to distribution centres where they are unloaded.  The goods head out again on local delivery lorries to the customer.  Instead the initial 44 tonne lorry haul should be phased out, with rail delivered long distance freight instead, then onto the local delivery fleet.  That alone would rid the M20, M25, M4, M1, M5, M6, etc, etc, of lines of 56 mph lorries clogging the system.  Pollution would be dramatically cut , and costs reduced, and with Continental Channel traffic reduced, the chance for illegal immigrants boarding lorries would also be cut.

A win, win situation all round, with even car drivers being given a reprieve by the newly opened up space on the motorways being available, with their pollution and costs cut.