Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[Kevin Wood]

Yep, the later TC actually brakes the rear wheel that's slipping most, transferring torque to the other wheel through the open diff.

I'm guessing in parts of mainland europe that had more extreme weather the LSD was an option but they are very rare in the UK and unheard of on the 4 pot Omegas. Ditto EBD and stability control.

[anV6]

It was at the time where TC systems were looking like they may replace LSDs, I suppose. The earlier TC literally cuts power to both rear wheels, the later does a little more, splitting the power between both rear wheels (if one wheel's on ice, the other on dry, warm tarmac etc) very late top spec Omegas got EBD, too, I believe.


I was going to comment how good your English was actually! 

 

But my German, not so much.

But I'm moving along.

It does look like the later the model the better. All this just adds to my dilemma of wanting a B1 for the looks but a B2 for the rest. And even a B2 I would need an earlier one if I want a V6 manual. Just don't feel like doing gearboxes and engines swaps. But it looks like if I want everything in the Omega, a Frankenstein is the only way. Which means lots of work

[anV6]

Yep, the later TC actually brakes the rear wheel that's slipping most, transferring torque to the other wheel through the open diff.

I'm guessing in parts of mainland europe that had more extreme weather the LSD was an option but they are very rare in the UK and unheard of on the 4 pot Omegas. Ditto EBD and stability control.

So the later TC was effectively a LSD then.

It makes sense that people in the Alps would want a car with LSD and so they might have been available. Good tip! I will investigate further. 

[Kevin Wood]

So the later TC was effectively a LSD then.

I wouldn't quite say that. From a driving perspective, it's far from an LSD.

In terms of stopping a powerful car from being a death trap with an inexperienced driver on a wet / icy road, it probably does the same job. In fact, an LSD would tend to make the back end a bit more liable to break away, so it's probably better.

From a point of view of getting some traction in ice / snow / mud in the scenario where one rear wheel just spins, it's a help.

From a point of view of maximising traction out of a bend where the inner rear wheel can start to slip as you get on the power, it's a hindrance because, in addition to braking the slipping wheel, it quickly reverts to cutting the power as well, meaning the car just bogs down (often when you're "nipping" out of a T junction into a gap in the traffic) .

[anV6]

So the later TC was effectively a LSD then.

I wouldn't quite say that. From a driving perspective, it's far from an LSD.

In terms of stopping a powerful car from being a death trap with an inexperienced driver on a wet / icy road, it probably does the same job. In fact, an LSD would tend to make the back end a bit more liable to break away, so it's probably better.

From a point of view of getting some traction in ice / snow / mud in the scenario where one rear wheel just spins, it's a help.

From a point of view of maximising traction out of a bend where the inner rear wheel can start to slip as you get on the power, it's a hindrance because, in addition to braking the slipping wheel, it quickly reverts to cutting the power as well, meaning the car just bogs down (often when you're "nipping" out of a T junction into a gap in the traffic) .

 

Can the TC be turned off?

[Diamond Black Geezer]

TC is switchable, yes.

For the LSD queries check out ye olde thread (and specifically the link I post) here....

http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=132846.msg1702119#msg1702119


 

[zirk]

None, in the UK, Police only, dont believe its was an optional extra on stock.

So the Omega never had a LSD? Pity. But I seem to have read Omegas with them. Probably aftermarket? Is it a difficult or expensive DIY job?

Didn't actually say that, Quote: Not in the UK, I believe some Northern Euro Countries, Finland, Norway, etc, some had them, no idea whether it was Standard Fitment or Optional Extra though.

[zirk]

Yes, paying attention to the seats sounds like a great tip. 

So the Recaros came out in leather as well? In the Omega Sport it seems they were only cloth.

By the way, it is just the name plates that were mixed up, right? Opel didn't actually make different cars for both markets. They were just called different names. (?)

Ok, quoting, In the UK again, Factory V6 MV6's had Sports Seats clothe or leather options, believe the 4 pot Sports only came in Clothe.

They didn't just mix the badges up, as said before VX models and specs, trims etc didn't necessarily follow Opel models, and again Im guessing Opel models probably varied or may have been country specific.

Example on the Seats, heres a pic of one of the Opel Type Sports Recaros that we never got in the UK.

[Diamond Black Geezer]

They are heavenly-looking seats.

As above, just get a decent car with the engine you want, they're the two biggest hurdles, the rest really is not hard, and you always were going to do a project vehicle. If you want it all done for you, then buy a Monaro, VXR8, or any number of other things with other badges, be it M, RS, VRS, AMG etc...

Don't let yoursef get too bogged down in the specifics. Some models have this, some don't etc...

other than pub bragging right about an LSD, I don't see the point really, I think even the most hardened car nut would have to admit that you're really not going to see the effect of a LSD on the road very much/often. And if you do feel the benefit, that person's perhaps driving a bit too close to the car's limits given that there are other people using said roads/pavements nearby. 

Get something with a 6 cyl engine, ideally a manual if you don't want to faff of swapping that over. Make it what you want it to be, over a period of years, where funds allow.

Your question is 'which Omega to buy?' Thing is, if it's PFL/MFL it won't have rain sensing wipers, [probably] no HID, temp-adjustable heated seats, internal boot release. If it's a FL it won't look as nice (subjective), many models lose the sunroof, later V6 engines are strangled for emissions, lose the cable throttles, for UK buyers they pay higher tax on post 2001(I think) cars. But aguments over 'which model Omega is the best' have raged for many a year and are always ultimately flawed, because everyone's Omega is the best, because the answer is always "mine." And rightly so. You make your Omega the best for you.

If your criteria is 'highest spec, most kit and toys' then get a 2004 reg 3.2 Elite. But then a bloke with a rusty 1994 Elite will go "Awww, you don't have an air-conditioned glovebox and rear side window demist vents? Bless" it's the way things go. 


But I appreciate you're just trying to get a feel for the model(s) and what's going to suit. Might sound daft, but how about buying yourself a few old brochures from ebay, they're often a couple of quid, plus postage, and it will give you a comprehensive idea of what's out there, get two or three from different years and you'll have a broad view of the range.

 

[anV6]

None, in the UK, Police only, dont believe its was an optional extra on stock.

So the Omega never had a LSD? Pity. But I seem to have read Omegas with them. Probably aftermarket? Is it a difficult or expensive DIY job?

Didn't actually say that, Quote: Not in the UK, I believe some Northern Euro Countries, Finland, Norway, etc, some had them, no idea whether it was Standard Fitment or Optional Extra though.

Yes, paying attention to the seats sounds like a great tip. 

So the Recaros came out in leather as well? In the Omega Sport it seems they were only cloth.

By the way, it is just the name plates that were mixed up, right? Opel didn't actually make different cars for both markets. They were just called different names. (?)

Ok, quoting, In the UK again, Factory V6 MV6's had Sports Seats clothe or leather options, believe the 4 pot Sports only came in Clothe.

They didn't just mix the badges up, as said before VX models and specs, trims etc didn't necessarily follow Opel models, and again Im guessing Opel models probably varied or may have been country specific.

Example on the Seats, heres a pic of one of the Opel Type Sports Recaros that we never got in the UK.

Yes, sorry. All the UK and not UK versions get confusing. I didn't mean you implied all Omegas didn't have the LSD.

I have indeed seen cars with those exact seats for sale here. 

All the different versions between the UK and Germany make it difficult to get information in English which is also accurate to the German models. And as most of my research needs to be in English because of my language barrier, that throws a big wrench into things.

[anV6]

They are heavenly-looking seats.

As above, just get a decent car with the engine you want, they're the two biggest hurdles, the rest really is not hard, and you always were going to do a project vehicle. If you want it all done for you, then buy a Monaro, VXR8, or any number of other things with other badges, be it M, RS, VRS, AMG etc...

Don't let yoursef get too bogged down in the specifics. Some models have this, some don't etc...

other than pub bragging right about an LSD, I don't see the point really, I think even the most hardened car nut would have to admit that you're really not going to see the effect of a LSD on the road very much/often. And if you do feel the benefit, that person's perhaps driving a bit too close to the car's limits given that there are other people using said roads/pavements nearby. 

Get something with a 6 cyl engine, ideally a manual if you don't want to faff of swapping that over. Make it what you want it to be, over a period of years, where funds allow.

Your question is 'which Omega to buy?' Thing is, if it's PFL/MFL it won't have rain sensing wipers, [probably] no HID, temp-adjustable heated seats, internal boot release. If it's a FL it won't look as nice (subjective), many models lose the sunroof, later V6 engines are strangled for emissions, lose the cable throttles, for UK buyers they pay higher tax on post 2001(I think) cars. But aguments over 'which model Omega is the best' have raged for many a year and are always ultimately flawed, because everyone's Omega is the best, because the answer is always "mine." And rightly so. You make your Omega the best for you.

If your criteria is 'highest spec, most kit and toys' then get a 2004 reg 3.2 Elite. But then a bloke with a rusty 1994 Elite will go "Awww, you don't have an air-conditioned glovebox and rear side window demist vents? Bless" it's the way things go. 


But I appreciate you're just trying to get a feel for the model(s) and what's going to suit. Might sound daft, but how about buying yourself a few old brochures from ebay, they're often a couple of quid, plus postage, and it will give you a comprehensive idea of what's out there, get two or three from different years and you'll have a broad view of the range.

 

Yes, definitely. At this point I have a very good idea of what type of Omega I'm looking for. I'm just enjoying chatting and learning about the car with people who also like them and know way more than I do about them. 

But I'm going for motor, millage/condition, interior, colour, then the rest.

Although I feel a LSD also helps a lot on ice, snow or rain, even if not driving any close to the limit. But it won't be a deal breaker at all.

But oh no! The FL cars lost the air-conditioned glove box???  This is the feature that stuck on my mind the most as a neighbor had one and always bragged about carrying beer in there when I was a teenager. .

The tip about getting old brochures from ebay is a good one and I'm actually already on it. I was looking for the Haynes book on the Omega FL but only found it for the B1. Also checked brochures and other materials.

I'm keeping my eyes open for a car that fits what I want. I guess the best compromise will be a 2000 car. So I can get a manual transmission with a 3.0 V6, not lose the cable throttle and get around the emissions strangle while getting most of the creature comforts of the FL cars. 2001 loses me the 3.0 manual and won't even get me more comforts as the next change was 2002. I think ESP for example only came in 2002 and later cars. At least TC was there from the beginning.

The front end will be easy enough to change to PFL if I really want it. It will all depend on how much of a problem is to change the rear.

By the way what does MFL mean? Mid-face lift?

[Doctor Gollum]

Euroland also had green and rockinghorseshitrate red leather options...

Basically buy the best 3.0/3.2 Facelift car you see/can afford/like the colour of... Then budget a further €2-3k  making it YOUR car.

Job jobbed

[zirk]

Yes, definitely. At this point I have a very good idea of what type of Omega I'm looking for. I'm just enjoying chatting and learning about the car with people who also like them and know way more than I do about them. 

But I'm going for motor, millage/condition, interior, colour, then the rest.

Any Service History would be nice, or having previous Owners who knew how to look after them, Low Millage would be handy as well as former number of Keepers, Re your other thread on Performance Mods, probably a better idea to try and find one that hasn't lost too many Horses in the first place rather than trying tune up a shagged out engine.


Although I feel a LSD also helps a lot on ice, snow or rain, even if not driving any close to the limit. But it won't be a deal breaker at all.

Probably a bit late in the day to search for LSD, bear in mind your looking at a 14+ year old car now, the chances of finding one is very slim these days.


But oh no! The FL cars lost the air-conditioned glove box???  This is the feature that stuck on my mind the most as a neighbor had one and always bragged about carrying beer in there when I was a teenager. .

The tip about getting old brochures from ebay is a good one and I'm actually already on it. I was looking for the Haynes book on the Omega FL but only found it for the B1. Also checked brochures and other materials.

Haynes never did one for the Facelift.

I'm keeping my eyes open for a car that fits what I want. I guess the best compromise will be a 2000 car. So I can get a manual transmission with a 3.0 V6, not lose the cable throttle and get around the emissions strangle while getting most of the creature comforts of the FL cars. 2001 loses me the 3.0 manual and won't even get me more comforts as the next change was 2002. I think ESP for example only came in 2002 and later cars. At least TC was there from the beginning.

The front end will be easy enough to change to PFL if I really want it. It will all depend on how much of a problem is to change the rear.

By the way what does MFL mean? Mid-face lift?

PFL, MFL, FL = PreFaceLift up to 97/98, MiniFaceLift 97/98 to 2000, Facelift 2000 to 2003

[anV6]

Euroland also had green and rockinghorseshitrate red leather options...

Basically buy the best 3.0/3.2 Facelift car you see/can afford/like the colour of... Then budget a further €2-3k  making it YOUR car.

Job jobbed

Yep. This is the budget I had thought to make it my own. 

But I can't go with a 3.2. The manual transmission transplant would eat a lot of my budget. I also don't want to lose the cable throttle. So it must be a 3.0. I'm not seeing a way around that. Besides I don't really see any advantages with the 3.2 for my applications.

[TheBoy]

FL MV6 is basically CD spec internally.
MFL MV6 is basically CDX spec internally.

If goodies are what you want, start with a Elite 3.0/3.2 as a base (as the 3.0/3.3 not available on CDX).  Suspension is easy to change