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Author Topic: Plastic gasket ring and small bag got sucked into oil pump!! I feel stupid!  (Read 664 times)

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TestOmega

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The oil filter rubber gasket and the small bag it came in I left in the filter and it got sucked into the system. I feel so stupid. Usually these filters come with the gasket outside and I thought the filter was missing the gasket and did not look inside the filter hole as these were stuffed in there as I was just trying to redo the oil change thinking the last oil change had issues and noticed in the new filter that I just opened. Now rattling and chattering! What to do!

Would it have been shredded and now blocking the pickup tube or it got buried inside the engine. The oil pressure appears to be extraordinarily high but not outside of the gauge range.

See the associated post about chattering.

Should I drop the oil pan and see if the pickup tube has the remnants and the blockage? Is there salvation and what is the best possible outcome and the worst and any next steps?

Thanks.
« Last Edit: 29 December 2017, 19:17:51 by TestOmega »
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Doctor Gollum

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Any remnants inside the oil filter?
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TestOmega

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Nothing!
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Migv6

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I think I would drop the oil pan and hope to find the remains in the sump.
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Doctor Gollum

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I think I would drop the oil pan and hope to find the remains in the oil pump.
I would probably be looking for a replacement lump...

Pontiac Transport of 98-03 vintage uses the same basic lump :y
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TestOmega

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Should I just try to drain oil as there is definitely a blockage and would changing oil cause the blockage to dislodge. Should I try to pump air into the filter hole and would that be of any benefit? Obviously I am just lost.

I thank you and if nothing in the pan then I suppose I am screwed!
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TestOmega

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I think I would drop the oil pan and hope to find the remains in the oil pump.
I would probably be looking for a replacement lump...

Pontiac Transport of 98-03 vintage uses the same basic lump :y
Doctor would trying to suck through the filter hole with a shop vac be of any benefit!

I cannot put another engine this car as it is already 16 years old and not many people know much about these cars around here. But had before this, it has  been exceptionally well running. So any or all out of the box ideas you may have!

Thank you!
« Last Edit: 29 December 2017, 19:37:26 by TestOmega »
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Sir Tigger QC

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I think I would drop the oil pan and hope to find the remains in the sump.

Yes it may have found it's way to the sump and is blocking the oil pump feed.  :-\

If you have an airline, you could try blowing air into the oilways from various points to see if the bag pops out?  ???  Worth a try anyway.  ;)
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Andy H

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If a foreign body started in the oil filter and then got pushed into the oilways in the block it will just get stuck in the block. It has no chance of passing through the shell bearings of the crankshaft or the camshafts.

If you are lucky it may have got stuck at the first change in direction in the oilways - if you take the oil filter off and fish around in the hole in the centre you may be able to pull it back out again.

The problem is that once an engine has run without oil for long enough to become audible then it is usually scrap. It really needs to be stripped down and inspected for bearing damage.
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Kevin Wood

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What he said ^, unfortunately. :(
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TestOmega

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Friends I much appreciate the great suggestions and wisdom on this board.

So I was in a Kamikaze or Hail Mary situation. So I have done the following and the results;

1. I got the filter and oil out. I tried to suck through the filter hole and some oil came out and otherwise no objects.

2. I was thinking to get a more cold weather liquid oil to see if things will get shifted around and hopefully dislodge if in smaller pieces. I know for this step you will all throw bricks and jests at me. I got 5L of 0W20 Synthetic oil and added about one litre of Motormedic Motor Flush (made by GUNK people) and idled for approximately 5 minutes. I removed the resulting oil and the filter.

3. I installed a fresh filter (correctly  ::)) and 5L of 0W20. I went for a spin and it is still cold out here (-9 celsius, not too bad) both on the roads and the highway. She was acting little funny as to be racing but I am trying to fix her EBTCM module too with "VSS Speed Sensor A" issues as I have no speedometer or odometer. I used the GPS for speed so did 100 Km/h plus and other speeds.  In steady speed cruising she was as though nothing happened. The noise is much gone and not there at all on idle. When starting from a stop light I did seem to feel that the engine tries to race/whine a bit. But I have only done about 30 Km or so. When I came home and listened to the car idling, it was as like before and nicely purring along.

However, the proof is in the pudding but the pudding is not fully cooked yet. Time will tell sooner or later but after I fix the EBTCM (i.e. if the car is still alive over the next two weeks) it may resolve some shifting and such issues. I will know then if damage became chronic or if I had been lucky to get lesser damage. In spite of everything, she is already 253,000 plus Km in age and has served me very well.

I will for sure update in case it may help someone.

Regards.
« Last Edit: 30 December 2017, 00:37:45 by TestOmega »
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Sir Tigger QC

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Sounds like you've been lucky and the bag has ended up somewhere where the oil can get round.  :-\

Did you have a fish in the oil filter hole with a bit of wire or similar?  If not that might be worth a go next time you have the filter off, to see if you can hook the bag and drag it out.

Otherwise if it's running OK then live with it.  ;) 
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TestOmega

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It died on the highway. Such a wonderful car as long it lasted and it grew on me. So sad.

I wish Dr. Gollum was wrong in the prediction, but he is realistic and was right whereas I was wishful.

Again, thanks everyone for the suggestions and help. 

Many best wishes to all for the New Year.
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Doctor Gollum

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Sad news, plenty of GM North America products use that engine...

Worst case the belt driven four cylinder lump will bolt straight in with minimal wiring work ;)
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Sir Tigger QC

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Shame!  :(
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Fuse 19

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It probably got stuck in the oil cooler or oil cooler pipes, would have been easy to get to in reality (If memory serves me correctly the oil cooler is post the filter)

The filter is post the pump so it wont be in the pump.
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TestOmega

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Since I need a basic drive around and I have been familiar with the Catera/Omega B for the past twelve years; I looked around for a used vehicle like the one that died.

I had a bit of luck in acquiring one today. It is the 2001 Cadillac Catera Sport model. It has only 101,000 Km versus the one I killled with 253,000 Km on it. So basically I am back on with "Catera/Omeg B" setup. Hopefully I will not create more mistakes like the last one. What a way to learn!  But I suppose cars do eventually die due to poor service, nature or servicing mistakes. So not bad for me to  carry a Cadillac Catera from 64,000 (km) at purchase to the eventual 253,000 Km.

I will be scarpping the dead Catera over the next 4-6 weeks and scavenge it for some parts and spares before I let go. My thoughts are to keep some good sensors, relays, ECU, valve covers, coil packs, breather and associated assmebly, timing cover, emission pump and associated steel piping used on cold starts, cooling fans, brand new Battery, door electronic controls, and some other little things. I cannot keep any big parts as the house garage is already pretty cluttered.

Dr. Gollum I thank you for suggesting and searching for possible solutions.  Same for other great members on this forum. However, I am becoming little older and have been really trying to make do with highly unprofessional rinky/dinky quality tools versus what I do believe some of the senior members on this forum have access to.

Going forward any suggestions regarding the following;

- The working car I have now (2001 Cadillac Catera Sports) is using fully synthetic oil per th elast owner. Any good recommendations if I should be using fully synthetic 0W40 or any other grade Synthetic.
- Any specific areas for care and cleaning that I should watch for beyond oil changes and air filters for my working Catera.
- I got only one Key and one FOB opener with the replacement Catera; how can create a second spear Fob and key economically?
- Any ideas on which part(s) I should try to keep for spare from the dead Catera before getting rid of it for scrapping.

Thank you all.
« Last Edit: 05 January 2018, 04:23:56 by TestOmega »
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Kevin Wood

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- The working car I have now (2001 Cadillac Catera Sports) is using fully synthetic oil per th elast owner. Any good recommendations if I should be using fully synthetic 0W40 or any other grade Synthetic.

I would say, given your climate, a decent quality 0W30 or 0W40 synthetic oil would be a good idea. 10W40 semi synth is a common recommendation in the UK but we don't know the meaning of "cold start". ;)
No need to pay a premium for "boutique" oil, though.
Regular changes are a good idea. I'm not sure what change intervals were specified in Canada, but, with synthetic oil, I'd be changing it every 6-8k miles here rather than the comedy 20,000 mile interval specified by GM.
Quote

- Any specific areas for care and cleaning that I should watch for beyond oil changes and air filters for my working Catera.

The crankcase breather system has a tendency to block, so it is important that this is checked with every oil change, especially in cold weather.
Scuttle drain, of course.
Rear wheel arches and the seal by the back doors always seems to attract crud like a magnet. I'm sure you know most of this already!
Quote

- I got only one Key and one FOB opener with the replacement Catera; how can create a second spear Fob and key economically?

If you keep the fobs and immobiliser chips from your old car, you could probably have them programmed to your new one if they are the same type, then just get a new key blank cut. This is where distance is an issue, as there are several of us with Tech2s in the UK who could do this cheaply.
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- Any ideas on which part(s) I should try to keep for spare from the dead Catera before getting rid of it for scrapping.

This is where you need your crystal ball. ;) You can guarantee that anything you throw away will fail on your new car the next week.  :D

Glad to hear that you've remained an OmegaCateraowner and I hope your new steed serves you well.
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