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[terry paget]

Son Jonny reports that in a traffic halt in Bristol some guy ran into the back of his car. It struck him in the tow ball so I bet the other guy came off worse. Other guy admitted it was his fault. Jonny was stationary at the time of the collision. Pic follows.

How should I proceed? Is all I get is the write ooff value of the car?

[Lazydocker]

Firstly, sorry to hear of the accident but glad all is ok with Jonny.

Deal directly with the other insurers.
Under no circumstances do you let the collect or take the car away from your sight! This is very important.
Remember that you are entitled to a Like for Like replacement until 7 days after the final deal is done.
You do not have a contract with his insurers so they cannot write off your car without your agreement.
Let them come up with a decent offer... IME they are getting more realistic now. If it isn't enough, tell them to replace it with a similar vehicle.

[05omegav6]

Firstly, sorry to hear of the accident but glad all is ok with Jonny.

Deal directly with the other insurers.
Under no circumstances do you let the collect or take the car away from your sight! This is very important.
Remember that you are entitled to a Like for Like replacement until 7 days after the final deal is done.
You do not have a contract with his insurers so they cannot write off your car without your agreement.
Let them come up with a decent offer... IME they are getting more realistic now. If it isn't enough, tell them to replace it with a similar vehicle.

Firstly, sorry to hear of the accident but glad all is ok with Jonny.

Deal directly with the other insurers.
Under no circumstances do you let the collect or take the car away from your sight! This is very important.
Remember that you are entitled to a Like for Like replacement until 7 days after the final deal is done.
You do not have a contract with his insurers so they cannot write off your car without your agreement.
Let them come up with a decent offer... IME they are getting more realistic now. If it isn't enough, tell them to replace it with a similar vehicle.

All sound advice, and therefore worth repeating

Car might be repairable,  but unlikely at insurers expense.

Oh, never let the car out of your sight. Any assessment gets done on your drive way.

[terry paget]

Thanks for advice.Do I need to advise my insurer?

[Lazydocker]

Thanks for advice.Do I need to advise my insurer?

Yes, "For information only"

[terry paget]

Thanks. I suppose I must make contact with the other driver. Jonny got his name, address and phone number, also that he is insured with Hastings Direct and a number, presumably the policy number.

[05omegav6]

Insurers name and reg should suffice

Re your insurers, as said advise only... Be clear though that it was a non fault incident and that you are dealing with the Tips insurers directly 

[tunnie]

Insurance will write that off, wonder how much they will give 

[ronnyd]

Mine was less damage than that one and ins co wrote it off, but, it was 2001 (51).

[05omegav6]

Insurance will write that off, wonder how much they will give 

Not true.

Third party insurers can only choose not to repair.

[Lazydocker]

Insurance will write that off, wonder how much they will give 

They can't without the owner's agreement as he doesn't have a contract with them

As HKT says, they can refuse to repair it though

[frostbite]

You won't get a lot,  when my 2.5cdx got wrote off they gave me 500 quid so I when the down the accident claim route and got an extra 3g's

[citroenguy]

I would recommend for him to go to the doctor´s to get examined and to get the accident documented. For insurance reasons, if problems would start to show in the future. Whiplash injuries are common with this type of accident.

[terry paget]

This afternoon Jonny brought his car home and left in X168, a 2.5 estate. Damage does not look too bad, not much worse than Ben's 2.2 after he had backed it into a skip smashing all 4 rear lights. Thanks to RobG and some hammering that car is now back in service.

 In Jonny's crash the tow ball took most of the impact, pushing the car forward with modest damage to Jonny's car, but wrecking the other car. Amazingly, though Jonny and Elaine are keen photographers and carry huge cameras everywhere, they took no photos of the other car, did not note its reg. no., model or make, but could tell me it was grey, most helpful. Jon told me it had 2 occupants. This morning I rang its driver and learned there was a third, a one year old baby, who was taken to A&E for a checkup - he was fine.

[Lazydocker]

Check the floor carefully 

Glad to hear that all concerned are safe... I hope he isn't too stiff after things have settled.

[frostbite]

+1 check for creases in boot floor

[jonathanh]

almost exactly the same happened to me in a very old Vectra.... although my towbar got bent up as well

in my case, the other party's insurer stopped talking to me, assuming I'd go away as the car was really only worth scrap.  Unfortunately for them I issued court papers against them and they paid up straight away.  The claim was roughly built up as

£10 for each day the car was out of action
scrap value of the car ( got 4 similar prices from auto trader and averaged them)
cost of tow hitch.

the boot floor was crumpled but 90% of it pulled out with a 5 tonne winch and something heavy to pull it from ( land rover defender cam in handy for that..)

replaced the bumper and tailgate and it's good as new.

so my suggestion is to get as much cash from them as you can and fix it yourself - keep copies of all correspondence and notes of phone calls ( its a real bore doing that but it helps if it goes to court)

[Diamond Black Geezer]

If you get a penny more than sweeet FA, then you're doing very well. I came a cropper in an accident that wasnt my fault late last year, and after 6 months wrangling have arrived at a 'FU in your old car'-style settlement.

My very best of luck to you, any advice, this is the forum to be 

[terry paget]

I have a spare bumper off a facelift, and a boot lid off a 1999 earlier shape saloon. Would the boot lid fit? It looks similar, though the lights are not the same.

[Doctor Gollum]

Bumper, crash bar and lights off...

Get busy on the rear panel with blocks of wood, bottle jack and sledge as required...

Refit fresh crash bar etc... Job jobbed.

Would suggest not unbolting towbar.

Bootlid might fit the hinges but the rest won't fill the hole, even if the latches line up

[terry paget]

Thanks to all for advice.
I rang Hastings Direct Monday. They were helpful, brisk and accepted my claim, said their client was at fault. A woman rang Tuesday, lots of questions, told me an assessor would call Wednesday.

He called this morning, examined the car, took measurements of tread depth, etc. He pointed out that the tow bar was bent sideways, that the rear door aperture was distorted, declared it a write-off.

He asked me what I thought it was worth. I muttered that they appear on e-bay at £2000, that I had to replace the car, that any e-bay car needs collecting, and needs sorting - cam belts, clutches, etc. He smiled. His smart phone had come up with a value of £700, what did I think of that. I hesitated. He asked me what I had paid for it, I replied £400 3 years ago..

I pushed for £800, which he accepted, and said if I wished to keep the wreck they would knock off 10%. It would be a category C wreck, meaning I could not put it back on the road.

Thanks again for your help. I am relieved I have managed it, all in 3 days.

[Kevin Wood]

I pushed for £800, which he accepted, and said if I wished to keep the wreck they would knock off 10%. It would be a category C wreck, meaning I could not put it back on the road.

No reason why you can't put a cat C back on the road. Cat A or B you can't but C or D you can (although it's recorded, so you'd need to tell your insurer).

[tunnie]

As I suspected, declared write off straight away. Worth checking insurance implications of a CAT C? Wonder how it would affect a premium. 

[Doctor Gollum]

Cat C can be put back on the road. Pm me if you need any help re repairs...

I know you favour Dropbox , but could you post pictures of the rear quarters where the meet the doors on both sides, doors closed. Should be an even 4-5mm shut line.

Would suggest leaving the towbar in situe, but remove the tow ball to remove any temptation to tow with it.

Cat C can be put on the road all day long, no VIC anymore either although your insurers might insist on dropping cover down to TP until it is re Mot'd.

As for the value side of things, 10% is fair salvage, and if the car is otherwise sound, I would fix it and run it until it dies

[Entwood]

As I suspected, declared write off straight away. Worth checking insurance implications of a CAT C? Wonder how it would affect a premium. 

Has little effect on premium as the "risk" level is unchanged ... however there are a lot of insurers who simply won't touch a cat C or D, and the online comparison sites become useless as well, as you cannot enter the fact that it is a cat C or D, which you must declare.

There is no longer any need for a VIC check on a repaired Cat C or D, although some insurers will insist on a new MOT

Chris's clit is cat C after the idiot T-boned it and damaged the door/front wing, insurance estimate of repair £1600, value of car £1200, I actually paid £900 to have it fixed and pocketed the £300

Adrian Flux will insure Cat C & D, they are not the best insurer but they are not completely useless, you just have to tell them the same thing 4 times before they listen to you ! Premiums are competitive however, both the clit and the Omega are now with them.

Too slow .... far too slow ....   

[Nick W]

As I suspected, declared write off straight away. Worth checking insurance implications of a CAT C? Wonder how it would affect a premium. 

Of course it is a write-off, it isn't worth anything to anyone except Terry. And that's only because he already owns it, knows its history and knows that a replacement is going to have issues.


As for repairing it, I would borrow another bootlid to see how well it could be made to fit using basic pulling techniques. Somebody with experience could probably straighten it well enough to put it back into service for a few quid's worth of secondhand spares.


As for it being Cat C, it wasn't worth anything before, it just means that nobody will buy it.

[Doctor Gollum]

Thanks to all for advice.
I rang Hastings Direct Monday. They were helpful, brisk and accepted my claim, said their client was at fault. A woman rang Tuesday, lots of questions, told me an assessor would call Wednesday.

He called this morning, examined the car, took measurements of tread depth, etc. He pointed out that the tow bar was bent sideways, that the rear door aperture was distorted, declared it a write-off.

He asked me what I thought it was worth. I muttered that they appear on e-bay at £2000, that I had to replace the car, that any e-bay car needs collecting, and needs sorting - cam belts, clutches, etc. He smiled. His smart phone had come up with a value of £700, what did I think of that. I hesitated. He asked me what I had paid for it, I replied £400 3 years ago..

I pushed for £800, which he accepted, and said if I wished to keep the wreck they would knock off 10%. It would be a category C wreck, meaning I could not put it back on the road.

Thanks again for your help. I am relieved I have managed it, all in 3 days.

To be clear, TPs insurer/assessor have suggested that it's a Cat C? Not sure they can do that... but sounds like you have agreed to effectively sell them your car for £800, and then buy it back for £80... Net result being £720 plus a dented car that you already own.

Might be worth asking if they'll just give you £720 for your trouble and keep the car off the register Not that I would trust them to do that, but there we are.

Had a car registered as a Cat C before my insurers made their first offer... if you don't claim, it cannot be a loss but once recorded, always recorded...

Although as Nick W suggests, the car that was only ever worth anything to you, is still only worth anything to you, so no change in the scheme of things

[terry paget]

Thanks for advice. I had given the car up for dead, and was scouring e-bay for a replacement. I changed the hed gasket on this car last summer, and the rear wheel arches show no rust, so it might be worth saving. Pics follow of the rear door gaps; the doors open and close normally. I have 2 other FL saloons in the fleet, Be's boot was damaged when he backed it into a skip, but the wife's 2003 police special is in tact.

[Nick W]

There's a very good chance that pulling the impact area will considerably improve the door gaps and also allow you to fit a straight bootlid: mine clearly had a smack up the arse when it was worth repairing, but neither 1/4panel to door fit is much better than that  


This would mean you only need to find a bootlid and the lamps which can't be hard/expensive.


I haven't had much practice at the straightening, and if using makeshift methods would probably lose the towbar to reduce the force required.

[Doctor Gollum]

Ok, looks to be a fairly square impact, which is good. Effect on/of the towbar depends on three things... previous impacts, type of towbar and how it's fitted.

Wings are likely pushed forward from rear edge rather than floor, though you might find there's a crease either end of the bar

How does the tank seem to be sitting in it's straps compared to a n other Omega saloon?

Only suggest keeping the bar bolted up as once undone it will need removing completely, so best left until last in the strip down process

[terry paget]

I have removed the bumper and boot lid. Damage seems mainly in the bumber beam, the boot floor, lower boot panel and boot lid.




Fuel tank looks fine.
How should I proceed?

[Nick W]

Pay someone who has done this work before to pull it straight enough to fit a good bootlid and bumper. You could try it yourself with winches, straps, other vehicles, well fixed posts, big hammers, blocks of wood etc but without experience you are much more likely to set the damage in place. One application of force did the damage, careful and considered force in the right direction will reverse most(if not all) of it. It's the sort of repair that a small backstreet bodyshop do everyday.

[neil74]

As nick says get someone to get it somewhere near straight again and put it back together yourself. as my sisters 07 astra is having similar work done to it despite the insurers wanting it to be scrapped even though theres no damage to the boot floor or chassis legs.

[terry paget]

Thanks for the advice gentlemen. I suppose I should remove the tow bar, it will obstruct straightening work and I have no use for it. Also I should remove and straighten the bumper bar and its brackets. Should I seek another boot lid? That would enable the professional body repair man to resahpe the boot surround to fit it, although it does not look too mishapen now.
The bumper is flexible and I imagine it will serve again. I had a similar experience in Berlin in a Senator. I continued my travels and drove the car home. Then I took off the bumper, bumper bar and brackets, bashed them straight and reassembled it all, and it did not look too bad. In this current case I am not lloking for an 'as new' job; as long a it is respectable , that is good enough. 

[Doctor Gollum]

Bumper alignment relies on bracket and bar... Better to replace with good second hand than to straighten.

Question regarding the tank was more to see if the straps were distorted by way of where they mount on the chassis rails

[terry paget]

Tow bar now removed. Here it is parked beside its big sister, wife's 3.2. Doesn't look too bad, does it?

[Nick W]

Tow bar now removed. Here it is parked beside its big sister, wife's 3.2. Doesn't look too bad, does it?

No it doesn't, which is why the application of some real expertise is the way to go.

[Doctor Gollum]

Rear panel, and therefore boot floor, pushed in an inch or so... Boot floor will be both ends due to way tow bar mounts...

[terry paget]

Rear panel, and therefore boot floor, pushed in an inch or so... Boot floor will be both ends due to way tow bar mounts...

The forward towbar mounting is a single bolt to support that end of the bar, it would not carry much fore and aft force. The rear mount is much more substantial, and supports the bar and bears pulling and pushing loads. The floor is bulging upwards between the mountings, suggesting that the front mounting has not moved.

[Doctor Gollum]

A couple of hundred spent getting it pulled out would be well spent... You can replace the rest with good second hand bits for peanuts afterwards

[terry paget]

Today I received a 'without prejudice' letter from Hastings Direct, dated June 14th telling me they would be sending an engineer to evaluate my vehicle. That's good to know.

[terry paget]

Thanks for advice.
Found a spare bumber beam in my spares heap. The drop supports for the bumper are not in the same slots, and look different lengths, but the bar is OK.

V8S, member of this forum, is selling a boot lid in Nautilus blue.
On advice, today I visited VW Autobodies, in Temple Cloud, and he agreed to push my boot back into shape for £100.

[Doctor Gollum]

Top bar is estate and therefore useless for your needs.

New used to be around £35-40 but good, ie straight second hand fine.

What condition is the foam in?

[Doctor Gollum]

Terry, save your time... Give either Steve at Omegaspareparts, or Nigel in Nottingham a call... Save getting decked around on costs etc

[LC0112G]

If it helps -

Best scrappies round here (Yeovil, South Somerset, North Dorset) are Angel Autos, Clay Pidgeon half way between Yeovil and Dorchester on the A37, and Langford Car spares on the A350 5 miles north of Shaftsbury.

Both normally have a couple of Omegas in. There are a couple of smaller scrappies, but it's a bit hit and miss with those.

[terry paget]

The two beams look identical in holes, slots and cutouts. Obviously one is deformed, and the drop fingers are different and in different slots; perhaps that is how saloon and estate differ. The foam looks reusable.

[Sir Tigger KC]

Shoes could do with a polish Tel!