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Author Topic: Interesting documentary  (Read 7708 times)

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Lizzie Zoom

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #30 on: 01 February 2018, 10:45:22 »

Pray for a great leader presently unknown to facilitate peace? Good luck with that.

Think we will have a long wait. Man is too intransigent to live in peace with one another. How many physical wars are going on right now across the planet.? 10 ? 20.? Then you have the intelectual wars, cyber wars, manipulation ofelection outcomes

Winston Churchill came out of the wilderness as a great (war) leader when many did not rate him at all.  So, who knows, one great man or women may exist to take over the struggle soon! ;)

Yes, that is the problem Varche.  I have studied Thomas Hobbes (1588-1679) for some years now and out of all the philosophers he is the one who hits it on the head in his summing up of man and his natural state that is always inclined towards "Warre".  Plato (427-327 BCE) identified it with one particular famous quote amongst many "Only the dead have seen the end of war".

Niccolò Machiavelli (1469-1527) covered excellently how man always seeks power by cunning and often dishonest means, with always the risk of war justifying the means by the end result, as indeed the Nazis did, whilst perverting the prevailing beliefs of Friedrich Nietzsche (1844-1900), with one of his quotes always striking a chord with me and again sums up the Nazis and now the West in it's long struggle to influence the East:
"Whoever fights monsters should see to it that in the process he does not become a monster. And if you gaze long enough into an abyss, the abyss will gaze back into you"  The warning in that is very clear.

All the above cover what you say Varche and what I fear.  These are dangerous times. :(
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Lizzie Zoom

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #31 on: 01 February 2018, 10:49:05 »

Quote
en-pass
'impasse' perhaps?

 ;D ;D ;D  Oh, yes, thanks Shankeng, that is me typing away fast again and slipping into a bit of bad French!! :o :o ::) ::) :-[ :-[ ;)
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Shackeng

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #32 on: 01 February 2018, 14:10:32 »

Quote
en-pass
'impasse' perhaps?

 ;D ;D ;D  Oh, yes, thanks Shankeng, that is me typing away fast again and slipping into a bit of bad French!! :o :o ::) ::) :-[ :-[ ;)

Hmmm, not sure I like that. ;D ;D ;D
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Varche

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #33 on: 01 February 2018, 14:49:41 »

Shankeng - foreign cousin perhaps? ;D
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Lizzie Zoom

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #34 on: 01 February 2018, 18:00:20 »

Sorry Shackeng, there I go again!! :-[ :-[ :D

I should know better as I know you love the good old Shackleton; a lovely aeroplane and I can still hear those four Griffin engines when I think back to Malta in 1963 and watch them flying over our house using an aldis lamp to communicate with the Grand Harbour control centre.  Ahhhhhhhhhh, what a comforting sound, not much different to four Merlins! :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* 8) 8) ;)
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ronnyd

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #35 on: 01 February 2018, 20:38:41 »

Sorry Shackeng, there I go again!! :-[ :-[ :D

I should know better as I know you love the good old Shackleton; a lovely aeroplane and I can still hear those four Griffin engines when I think back to Malta in 1963 and watch them flying over our house using an aldis lamp to communicate with the Grand Harbour control centre.  Ahhhhhhhhhh, what a comforting sound, not much different to four Merlins! :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* 8) 8) ;)
Magical. ;)
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Shackeng

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #36 on: 02 February 2018, 15:26:06 »

Sorry Shackeng, there I go again!! :-[ :-[ :D

I should know better as I know you love the good old Shackleton; a lovely aeroplane and I can still hear those four Griffin engines when I think back to Malta in 1963 and watch them flying over our house using an aldis lamp to communicate with the Grand Harbour control centre.  Ahhhhhhhhhh, what a comforting sound, not much different to four Merlins! :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* 8) 8) ;)

They must have been in trouble if they had to use the Aldis lamp for that. I never knew it used when airborne. But the facility was there to communicate with ships or survivors in dinghies or lifeboats. The a/c would have had to have lost all radio comms, i.e. UHF, VHF & HF, to use it as described above. However my friend was on 37 Sqn at Malta on Shacks, so I will mention it to him. :y
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Lizzie Zoom

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #37 on: 02 February 2018, 18:17:08 »

Sorry Shackeng, there I go again!! :-[ :-[ :D

I should know better as I know you love the good old Shackleton; a lovely aeroplane and I can still hear those four Griffin engines when I think back to Malta in 1963 and watch them flying over our house using an aldis lamp to communicate with the Grand Harbour control centre.  Ahhhhhhhhhh, what a comforting sound, not much different to four Merlins! :-* :-* :-* :-* :-* 8) 8) ;)

They must have been in trouble if they had to use the Aldis lamp for that. I never knew it used when airborne. But the facility was there to communicate with ships or survivors in dinghies or lifeboats. The a/c would have had to have lost all radio comms, i.e. UHF, VHF & HF, to use it as described above. However my friend was on 37 Sqn at Malta on Shacks, so I will mention it to him. :y

Yes, my father once said they were on training flights and as a then RN Petty Officer of signals he was able to read what was being communicated, but he never said what, due to him never imparting any official (Secrets Act) information to us his family.  The use of the Aldis lamp was not a one off as I saw that on a number of occasions.

I remember the Shackletons also feathering various props, which once again my father said was being done as a training exercise.  Don't know about that, as I can imagine with four engines each with two counter turning props, that could have been done to save fuel (??)

No matter what the facts were I just loved watching and listening to those planes, along with Vulcans that used to make their presence known every so often, once indeed when my father got us a visit to the Luqa control tower when a Vulcan apparently returned from a bombing exercise with a jammed bomb bay.  All great stuff to watch when you are a 10 year old girl! 8) 8) ;)
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Lizzie Zoom

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #38 on: 02 February 2018, 18:31:13 »

One other fact about the Shackletons using the Aldis lamps over the Grand Harbour, that I always wondered about and it's again come to mind, is that the NATO Headquarters in Malta was just behind our house. My father never mentioned any link but I wonder again if there was. ;)
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Bigron

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #39 on: 02 February 2018, 18:51:33 »

Vulcans, Lizzie? I have a memory of seeing/hearing my one and only Vulcan when I was strolling along Weymouth Pier in Carnival week (air show): suddenly there was this great noise overhead - literally overhead - so close that it nearly parted my hair!
"Oh my goodness" * I thought, as I ran towards Marks' and Spencers' for fresh knickers..... :-[ :-[ :-[

Ron.


* Insert suitable expletive of your choice here!
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BazaJT

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #40 on: 02 February 2018, 19:02:40 »

Finnigley[now Robin Hood airport]air show always used to start-back in the '60s with a "scramble of 4 Vulcans,that didn't half make the ground shake 8) Wasn't it the Shackleton that used to be described as so many thousand rivets flying in loose formation?
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Lizzie Zoom

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #41 on: 02 February 2018, 19:37:37 »

Ah, that brings back memories of me at about aged 5 when we went to see my Auntie Murial at Fleet.  It coincided with the Farborough Air Show with the Black Arrows, Lightenings, Vampires, and an assortment of V bombers flying over.

Her son with her daughter took me to see the show, and it was there I saw a Vulcan in action for the first time. What a lasting impression that gave me! 8)

I also saw once a mass take off with 3 Vulcan's and it left me speechless.  It was so long ago I cannot remember when and where it was, but I seem to recall it was down to my father getting special access through the "mates" system to watch them at some base or another.  That wouldn't happen now, even if any Vulcan's still flew and on active service! ::) ::) :D ;)
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Shackeng

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #42 on: 02 February 2018, 19:46:08 »

Quote
I remember the Shackletons also feathering various props, which once again my father said was being done as a training exercise.  Don't know about that, as I can imagine with four engines each with two counter turning props, that could have been done to save fuel (??)

Your dad was correct, Shackletons never feathered an engine to save fuel, only for pilot or crew training, and only below weights at which a further engine failure would not be embarrassing. The later Mk3s, as in my Avatar, had Viper jets, running on Avgas, fitted in the outboard Griffon nacelles, initially to assist take-offs only, the controls for which were at the FE station. They later modified the jets, modifying the fixed idle/max power only 'throttle' setting to a variable 'throttle' to allow them to be used in the cruise or for emergency Griffon failure. So the FE needed to very slick in lighting them in flight, as a Griffon failure at 1000', our normal cruise height over the ocean, or lower, required a rapid crew response in a heavy Mk3, which would struggle to maintain altitude on 3 Griffons at max power, as I discovered more than once.

 
Quote
Don't know about that, as I can imagine with four engines each with two counter turning props, that could have been done to save fuel
We did use this technique on the Nimrod, and could safely cruise on 2 once below 'critical weight', the weight at which we could maintain altitude on one engine should we lose one of the powered Speys.

Quote
Wasn't it the Shackleton that used to be described as so many thousand rivets flying in loose formation?

Correct, and it sounded like it inside. After a 12 hour trip, my Beetle sounded like a Roller. :y
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Lizzie Zoom

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #43 on: 02 February 2018, 20:06:31 »

Thanks Shackeng :y :y

I always been jealous of you knowing you flew in what was in essence a Lancaster variant. What an experience you must have had, but I suppose after the first 25 12 flights the novelty may have worn off?? :D ;)

To think now woman would be allowed to crew these planes ::) ::)
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Bigron

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Re: Interesting documentary
« Reply #44 on: 02 February 2018, 20:11:28 »

REALLY
 :-X ::)







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