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Author Topic: Crash  (Read 3833 times)

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Martin_1962

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Crash
« on: 19 August 2006, 20:27:15 »

20 minutes ago I was on here - right click - open in new window, however IE window 38 was a mistake - my PC locked up and I had to reboot.

AND ALL THE THREADS WERE MARKED AS READ >:( >:( >:( >:(

SO if I have missed anything please tell me!
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Taxi_Driver

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Re: Crash
« Reply #1 on: 19 August 2006, 20:41:20 »

Quote
20 minutes ago I was on here - right click - open in new window, however IE window 38 was a mistake - my PC locked up and I had to reboot.

AND ALL THE THREADS WERE MARKED AS READ >:( >:( >:( >:(

SO if I have missed anything please tell me!

38 IE windows open??? Blimey that must be a record!!

I used to find that all the time over on the other site.....all threads read....even tho i hadnt....never had that prob on this site  :)
« Last Edit: 19 August 2006, 21:03:45 by Taxi_Driver »
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Salty

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Re: Crash
« Reply #2 on: 19 August 2006, 20:53:42 »

Quote
20 minutes ago I was on here - right click - open in new window, however IE window 38 was a mistake - my PC locked up and I had to reboot.

AND ALL THE THREADS WERE MARKED AS READ >:( >:( >:( >:(

SO if I have missed anything please tell me!

You've probably missed loads ;)
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Taxi_Driver

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Re: Crash
« Reply #3 on: 19 August 2006, 21:02:45 »

You'd better read all of them again Martin .....just in case .....only 10,900 summat  ;)
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Martin_1962

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Re: Crash
« Reply #4 on: 19 August 2006, 21:04:58 »

Quote
Quote
20 minutes ago I was on here - right click - open in new window, however IE window 38 was a mistake - my PC locked up and I had to reboot.

AND ALL THE THREADS WERE MARKED AS READ >:( >:( >:( >:(

SO if I have missed anything please tell me!

38 IE windows open??? Blimey that must be a record!!

I used to find that all the time over on the other site.....all threads read....even tho i hadnt....never had that prob on this site  :)

I always do this regularly when surfing I go over 15 pages
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Martin_1962

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Re: Crash
« Reply #5 on: 19 August 2006, 21:10:50 »

Quote
Quote
20 minutes ago I was on here - right click - open in new window, however IE window 38 was a mistake - my PC locked up and I had to reboot.

AND ALL THE THREADS WERE MARKED AS READ >:( >:( >:( >:(

SO if I have missed anything please tell me!

You've probably missed loads ;)

I managed to find them so all is OK :)
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Martin_1962

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Re: Crash
« Reply #6 on: 19 August 2006, 21:14:07 »

Quote
You'd better read all of them again Martin .....just in case .....only 10,900 summat  ;)

I haven't looked at many early August ones due to holiday!
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Re: Crash
« Reply #7 on: 19 August 2006, 23:18:26 »

Quote
20 minutes ago I was on here - right click - open in new window, however IE window 38 was a mistake - my PC locked up and I had to reboot.

AND ALL THE THREADS WERE MARKED AS READ >:( >:( >:( >:(

SO if I have missed anything please tell me!

It would have been interesting to have had a look at Task Manager before the crash.
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Paul M

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Re: Crash
« Reply #8 on: 20 August 2006, 11:59:29 »

http://www.mozilla.com/firefox/

Internot Exploder sucks at the best of times, but with 38 windows open that's just crazy!

Welcome to the 21st century and the joys of tabbed browsing  ;)
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Paul M

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Re: Crash
« Reply #9 on: 20 August 2006, 12:02:21 »

Quote
Quote
20 minutes ago I was on here - right click - open in new window, however IE window 38 was a mistake - my PC locked up and I had to reboot.

AND ALL THE THREADS WERE MARKED AS READ >:( >:( >:( >:(

SO if I have missed anything please tell me!

It would have been interesting to have had a look at Task Manager before the crash.

It should have been a single process, but no guarantees.
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TheBoy

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Re: Crash
« Reply #10 on: 20 August 2006, 15:32:58 »

Unless you need to use firefox, I'd stick with some variant of ie6. It pains me to say it, but there are less security flaws in ie6 than in firefox (taking statistics of security related patches released in last 18 months).  Firefox also is less likely to render pages correctly (like it or not, all web pages are tested and designed for ie.

However, if you use Linux, you're stuck with FF, as everything else is rubbish...
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Markjay

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Re: Crash
« Reply #11 on: 20 August 2006, 16:11:37 »

Quote
SO if I have missed anything please tell me!

Sure. Ronnie was accused of doing a botch job of replacing the rear indicator bulb on project no. MCVVVXI, i.e. using a cheap non-branded bulb in order to get it through the MOT and then flog it on eBay to an unsuspecting buyer who would expect the bulb to last 1 Trillion miles, but instead it will peel-off after a mere 1 Billion, Ronnie said that the guy should have his head examined (well something to this affect anyway), then AA found the original manufacture’s MTBF which proved that the bulb WILL eventually peel off, though it won’t matter much because it will happen just after the next Ice Age, but TheBoy stepped-in and banned everyone forever. On appeal, the ban was overruled by Laidback and all the relevant posts were removed without trace. So there, that’s what happened. Really.


« Last Edit: 20 August 2006, 16:12:11 by markjay »
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Martin_1962

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Re: Crash
« Reply #12 on: 20 August 2006, 16:24:33 »

Quote
Quote
SO if I have missed anything please tell me!

Sure. Ronnie was accused of doing a botch job of replacing the rear indicator bulb on project no. MCVVVXI, i.e. using a cheap non-branded bulb in order to get it through the MOT and then flog it on eBay to an unsuspecting buyer who would expect the bulb to last 1 Trillion miles, but instead it will peel-off after a mere 1 Billion, Ronnie said that the guy should have his head examined (well something to this affect anyway), then AA found the original manufacture’s MTBF which proved that the bulb WILL eventually peel off, though it won’t matter much because it will happen just after the next Ice Age, but TheBoy stepped-in and banned everyone forever. On appeal, the ban was overruled by Laidback and all the relevant posts were removed without trace. So there, that’s what happened. Really.




 ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Martin_1962

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Re: Crash
« Reply #13 on: 20 August 2006, 16:25:21 »

Quote
Quote
Quote
20 minutes ago I was on here - right click - open in new window, however IE window 38 was a mistake - my PC locked up and I had to reboot.

AND ALL THE THREADS WERE MARKED AS READ >:( >:( >:( >:(

SO if I have missed anything please tell me!

It would have been interesting to have had a look at Task Manager before the crash.

It should have been a single process, but no guarantees.


SIngle process yes
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Marks DTM Calib

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Re: Crash
« Reply #14 on: 20 August 2006, 16:26:40 »

I saw a title of 'Crash' and your name Martin and thought....not again ;)
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Martin_1962

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Re: Crash
« Reply #15 on: 20 August 2006, 16:45:23 »

You SOD >:( >:( :'(
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Paul M

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Re: Crash
« Reply #16 on: 20 August 2006, 17:11:56 »

Quote
Unless you need to use firefox, I'd stick with some variant of ie6. It pains me to say it, but there are less security flaws in ie6 than in firefox (taking statistics of security related patches released in last 18 months).  Firefox also is less likely to render pages correctly (like it or not, all web pages are tested and designed for ie.

However, if you use Linux, you're stuck with FF, as everything else is rubbish...


I think that's very misleading. The number of patches isn't really relevant, any application will have flaws, what matters is their severity and how quickly they are patched. Mozilla has a much better record than Microsoft here, most flaws are patched within a few days of discovery, whereas MS tend to work on a monthly schedule unless it's a critical flaw. In addition, IE flaws are far more likely to be exploited in the wild due to it being deployed on the vast majority of PCs.

Also Internet Explorer is fundamentally flawed from a security perspective IMO - it's far too tightly integrated into the OS which gives it far too much potential to wreak havok when a vulnerability is exploited. I believe that Internet apps should be sandboxed from the rest of the system as far as possible without being a PITA, which is the exact opposite approach from the MS philosophy of tight integration.

Read the facts and make up your own mind:
http://secunia.com/product/11/
http://secunia.com/product/4227/
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Paul M

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Re: Crash
« Reply #17 on: 20 August 2006, 17:16:17 »

Should also mention Opera which is another very good alternative (free, but not open-source).

http://secunia.com/product/4932/

http://www.opera.com
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TheBoy

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Re: Crash
« Reply #18 on: 20 August 2006, 17:55:59 »

I agree that apps should be seperate from OS. IE is not a tightly integrated as MS or others would have you believe.  Windows' problem is that most users run as admin - thats asking for trouble. Unix has same fundamental flaws if running as root.

IE is going to be a bigger target for script kiddies, purely due to its popularity.

However, I do not think my post was misleading. FF has had more critical security patches applied that ie6 in the last 18 months.

The belief that FF (and the same goes for Linux) is secure is its biggest insecurity. People do not update their systems, as they think they are secure. How many Linux users do not run AV software because they think their OS is secure.

Anyone who thinks Unix/FF/Mac etc are more secure than Windows - something put about by vocal Linux enthusiasts, and picked up by popularist computer mags - are mistaken; some of the most secure systems out there run on Windows.
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TheBoy

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Re: Crash
« Reply #19 on: 20 August 2006, 17:56:58 »

Quote
Should also mention Opera which is another very good alternative (free, but not open-source).

http://secunia.com/product/4932/

http://www.opera.com
The free version of Opera is ad sponsored.  It also fails to render many pages.
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Paul M

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Re: Crash
« Reply #20 on: 20 August 2006, 18:38:03 »

Quote
I agree that apps should be seperate from OS. IE is not a tightly integrated as MS or others would have you believe.  Windows' problem is that most users run as admin - thats asking for trouble. Unix has same fundamental flaws if running as root.

Still too tightly integrated for my liking, there should be no integration at all! The problem with Windows users running as admin is twofold - first, Windows creates users as admin by default, so non-savvy users don't know any different. Second is that many apps have migrated from Win9x which is single-user. Meaning they're not properly written for multi-user systems based on NT, so can't be installed or often even just run without admin priviledges. Even now there are apps with this problem that have no real reason to need admin. So even those who do realise the consequences may choose to run as admin as it's less hassle. Secondary login helps but it's still hassle for something that's usually down to poor design on behalf of third-party software vendors.

Quote
IE is going to be a bigger target for script kiddies, purely due to its popularity.

However, I do not think my post was misleading. FF has had more critical security patches applied that ie6 in the last 18 months.

The belief that FF (and the same goes for Linux) is secure is its biggest insecurity. People do not update their systems, as they think they are secure. How many Linux users do not run AV software because they think their OS is secure.

Anyone who thinks Unix/FF/Mac etc are more secure than Windows - something put about by vocal Linux enthusiasts, and picked up by popularist computer mags - are mistaken; some of the most secure systems out there run on Windows.

Secunia appears to disagree re. extremely critical vulnerabilities:





As I said before, I believe flaws are inevitable, what's important is how quickly they're patched. Firefox's update system is pretty seamless these days too.

*nix certainly isn't immune to risks, and needs to be administered properly to prevent remote exploits. But I strongly believe Windows has more than its fair share of holes, added to the fact it's a much jucier target due to popularity. I also find it to be more difficult to lock down, shutting off all the crap that increases risks and shouldn't be running.

Windows is getting better, especially since SP2, but a lot of MS's policies were at best bizarre, and at worst just plain silly. Perfect example - they used to have loads of services running by default sitting listening on various ports. Great idea, so when a vulnerability was discovered suddenly loads of PCs were being remotely infected without the user ever doing anything - just being connected to the internet was enough.

Personally if I were running a system for security it'd probably be one of the BSD based systems. Far fewer bells 'n' whistles than Linux but this simplicity allows them to spot holes much more easily. Windows is too bloated IMO, and that's half the problem that it must be a nightmare to audit for the classic buffer overflows etc.

WinXP Pro - http://secunia.com/product/22/

FreeBSD - http://secunia.com/product/6778/

BTW I use Windows on a daily basis so I'm anything but a Linux/Unix/Mac zealot!



It's
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TheBoy

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Re: Crash
« Reply #21 on: 20 August 2006, 18:46:54 »

Hey, Paul, I was in no way infering you were one of the linux fanatics ;)

Those stats go back to far when FF was new, and people weren't looking for exploits. Do same stats over last 18 months ;)

I agree, Windows problems are due to users and apps, not OS.  Its also too easy to write win32 apps, meaning business critical web services are written by people who are not really skilled enough to understand it. This tends to happen less on non Win32 platforms...
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Re: Crash
« Reply #22 on: 20 August 2006, 18:57:21 »

When I try to go into certain sites, Renaultforums.co.uk for instance, IE just shuts down, Thompson Holidays is another that springs to mind, when you try to price a holiday.

On these sites I use FF, on all other sites I use IE.

I believe the problem started a couple of months ago when MS issued a new update.
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Taxi_Driver

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Re: Crash
« Reply #23 on: 20 August 2006, 19:05:39 »

Quote
When I try to go into certain sites, Renaultforums.co.uk for instance, IE just shuts down, Thompson Holidays is another that springs to mind, when you try to price a holiday.

On these sites I use FF, on all other sites I use IE.

I believe the problem started a couple of months ago when MS issued a new update.

Firstly you shouldnt be on Renault forums AA....tsk tsk....you should be here  ;)

So my diagnosis on your problems is...IE is working correctly only letting you to view this site.  ;)

IE is also working correctly re: not letting you view Thompson Holidays correctly.....bet it works ok for you on Saga Holidays  ;D
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Taxi_Driver

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Re: Crash
« Reply #24 on: 20 August 2006, 19:27:06 »

Just my 2 pennyworth

I have 3 pc's, 2 run XP pro....1 runs 2003 server.
I have adsl connection with linksys adsl modem/router....replaced my old setup...linksys blue/black box (with seperate adsl modem) with new linksys silver combined box (old linksys gave up on 54g  :( )

I run all 3 pc's in admin mode.....and with combined effort of the firewall on the router and the MS firewall software....plus running Symantec Antivirus software on the 3 pc's....ive never had probs with virus's or malicious code being executed from IE.

I occasionaly get email with virus....but symantec antivirus kills it

Should add IE6 on all pc's with all latest updates.....and dont get a prob viewing any sites on any of the pc's

The PC running 2003 server is fairly new....but the other two have been running for 3/4 years without probs
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Re: Crash
« Reply #25 on: 20 August 2006, 20:39:14 »

Quote
Quote
When I try to go into certain sites, Renaultforums.co.uk for instance, IE just shuts down, Thompson Holidays is another that springs to mind, when you try to price a holiday.

On these sites I use FF, on all other sites I use IE.

I believe the problem started a couple of months ago when MS issued a new update.

Firstly you shouldnt be on Renault forums AA....tsk tsk....you should be here  ;)

So my diagnosis on your problems is...IE is working correctly only letting you to view this site.  ;)

IE is also working correctly re: not letting you view Thompson Holidays correctly.....bet it works ok for you on Saga Holidays  ;D

As regards the Renault forum, when I posted the link to this site (there's an area on the forum where you can point to other car sites), the membership on here shot up to over 200, so there 8-)
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Re: Crash
« Reply #26 on: 20 August 2006, 20:41:22 »

....and anyway TD, I might listen to Saga FM, but I've yet to go on holiday with them....(too expensive) ;D
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