Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[STEMO]

With all the technology and databases available to the police, I find it incredible that they can't trace this driver:


M62 'road rage' driver attacks lorry with shovel
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-manchester-38148811

[Ever Ready]

Reminds me of the incident on the M25 when a young man died over a road rage incident

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

Killed by Ken Noye iirc ?

[Bigron]

STEMO, how naive of you: they only bother to use technology chase motorists for revenue collection - anything else involves too much work (sorry Jason)!

Ron.

[Crazycarzowner]

STEMO, how naive of you: they only bother to use technology chase motorists for revenue collection - anything else involves too much work (sorry Jason)!

Ron.

Complete and utter 'dangle berries'!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And that's all I'm saying on this 

[2boxerdogs]

I don't think it will be very long before this driver will be identified & charged over this incident.

[YZ250]

STEMO, how naive of you: they only bother to use technology chase motorists for revenue collection - anything else involves too much work (sorry Jason)!

Ron.

Complete and utter 'dangle berries'!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And that's all I'm saying on this 

It pains me to say but I'm with Ron on this one, and I speak from first hand experience. Left hand drive truck rips the side off the stationery car at a junction and does not stop. Immediately phone the police as the vehicle is trashed and all they were interested in was our documents.    When the Police (in our case Kidlington Police) inform you that they have 'exhausted all avenues of enquiry', of finding the truck owner but you manage to track down said vehicle yourself with minimal detective work, it does not inspire confidence. I still have the letter that I sent and their pathetic reply and I have posted on here many times regarding their lack of interest, even though we had the registration number of the offending vehicle and dash cam footage.
The reason we believe the police weren't interested........... it was a foreign truck.     As I said to the police at the time, I can only assume that they would have had the same negative response if this truck had killed someone.   
We did eventually get it sorted, thanks to Admiral getting loss chasers involved.    My blood pressure has just shot up a notch just thinking about it. 

[Sir Tigger KC]

I don't think it will be very long before this driver will be identified & charged over this incident.

Not now the media have got hold of the story, but the incident was 3 weeks ago......

[Kevin Wood]

STEMO, how naive of you: they only bother to use technology chase motorists for revenue collection - anything else involves too much work (sorry Jason)!

Ron.

Complete and utter 'dangle berries'!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

And that's all I'm saying on this 

It pains me to say but I'm with Ron on this one, and I speak from first hand experience. Left hand drive truck rips the side off the stationery car at a junction and does not stop. Immediately phone the police as the vehicle is trashed and all they were interested in was our documents.    When the Police (in our case Kidlington Police) inform you that they have 'exhausted all avenues of enquiry', of finding the truck owner but you manage to track down said vehicle yourself with minimal detective work, it does not inspire confidence. I still have the letter that I sent and their pathetic reply and I have posted on here many times regarding their lack of interest, even though we had the registration number of the offending vehicle and dash cam footage.
The reason we believe the police weren't interested........... it was a foreign truck.     As I said to the police at the time, I can only assume that they would have had the same negative response if this truck had killed someone.   
We did eventually get it sorted, thanks to Admiral getting loss chasers involved.    My blood pressure has just shot up a notch just thinking about it. 

Yep, Mrs. KW had her car damaged by a pikey in a Transit pickup. Submitted registration number, business card left by the driver at a local business and a security video of said incident occurring. Result? Mrs. KW got a producer and Police "Unable to trace" the third party. The Police seriously have to start making an effort on the hearts and minds front even if their hands are tied legally in some of these cases. Why immediately waste time processing the innocent party as a criminal, for a start?

[tunnie]

Sorry to say Jason, it's a similar experience here. Since we had a car slide into and crash into our garden fence, we've been aware the car park behind us is often used for donuts and drifting type stuff. About once every 2 weeks or so, some idiot in a BMW arrives and does a donut of two then speeds off.

I've caught them on camera doing this, then driving off, clearly capturing the number plate. Police are not interested, they say they can do nothing 

Unless they can stop him there and then, prove who was the driver. Even with the reg supplied, they refused to even visit the driver. 

However they are quite happy to sit on the London Road 40MPH area, just south of Heathrow with a speed gun. On a road than can easily be 60 and nab people doing 50!!!

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

I agree with all of the above.

It is not beyond the wit of man to catch this guy.

[Andy B]

I agree with all of the above.

It is not beyond the wit of man to catch this guy.

It was on Radio 2  ... Jeremy Vine. Manchester Plod say that although they can trace the owner, they can't prove who the driver was because the owner won't tell them. 
So .... when the speeding ticket/whatever arrives through the door addressed to the owner of a car, he/she can say 'no idea who was driving' and that's that! 

[STEMO]

So..'I'm not telling' is not withholding information then?
Jack Reagan would have got it out of him.

[Andy B]

So..'I'm not telling' is not withholding information then?

Seems not

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

So..'I'm not telling' is not withholding information then?

Seems not

Insane....and frustrating.

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

I agree with all of the above.

It is not beyond the wit of man to catch this guy.

It was on Radio 2  ... Jeremy Vine. Manchester Plod say that although they can trace the owner, they can't prove who the driver was because the owner won't tell them. 
So .... when the speeding ticket/whatever arrives through the door addressed to the owner of a car, he/she can say 'no idea who was driving' and that's that! 

It's hard to believe the rozzers are going to leave it at that.

"Very well sir, as you refuse to tell us the name of the driver we'll be on our way and leave you in peace.".

No surely not.

[pscocoa]

A few years ago my 80 year old  father in law (now sadly deceased) was a victim of road rage from a druggie yob aged 30 who deliberately drove at FILs car and delivered a glancing blow to side of car. Police could not trace him and when interviewing my FIL asked him if he had "provoked' this yob.

My ex force's brother in law traced driver but nothing was done. We wrote to MP, got police complaints involved etc (long story) and ended up with compensation for police mishandling.

[btc]

I thought it was an offence not to disclose the drivers details

[Bigron]

Yes, "btc", but only if caught speeding by the Greed Cameras!

Ron.

[Steve B]

Well done STEMO... Another member leaves and it is all your fault 

[STEMO]

Well done STEMO... Another member leaves and it is all your fault 

Who's left?

[STEMO]

Ah...Jason. I think if you read the thread, you'll find that I was the only one who didn't disrespect our fine ossifier of the law.

[STEMO]

So, this time, I'm not going to post my link to "another one bites the dust".....although it is a fine tune. 

[Shackeng]

I suspect Jason is as infuriated as any decent copper by this, but I am sure that the reason a lot of these incidents are not followed up relates to targets etc. and is driven by pressure from above, infuriating the front line coppers

[LC0112G]

It is indeed and offence for the registered keeper, or anyone else for that matter to not respond to a S172 request for driver information. However, the registered keeper could be a company, and in that case forcing a company to disclose information is difficult. You can't put points on a companies license, all you can do is fine them. If the company decides to 'protect' an individual then that's likely to be the end of any chance to prosecute the driver.

The other issue is that S172 can only be used to obtain driver details for offenses under certain sections of the RTOA/RTA. So what's the charge in this case? Doesn't appear to be an RTOA case - more like threatening behaviour, assault or criminal damage. S172 can't be used for that.

[biggriffin]

They can use perverting the cause for justice, there are other minor ways that individuals/company's can be persuaded to release the driver of a vehicle.

[tigers_gonads]

I suspect Jason is as infuriated as any decent copper by this, but I am sure that the reason a lot of these incidents are not followed up relates to targets etc. and is driven by pressure from above, infuriating the front line coppers

Yup

I know 3 coppers personally and 1 friend of a friend who is a traffic copper with blunderside police.
Ask anyone of them and you will find that everyone to a man will say how friggin oppsed off they get in situations like this when the so called law effectively stops them from doing what they know is right 

On the subject of revenue cameras, said traffic copper also hates the things with a passion and would much rather triple the amount of traffic coppers on the road and let them use some common sense if or when to pull somebody.
Not spoken to him for a good few years but I believe they have tied him to a desk nowdays 

 

[LC0112G]

They can use perverting the cause for justice,

They would have to prove (beyond reasonable doubt) that the person being questioned knew who the driver was. If the person being questioned simply says "don't know" then PCoJ is unlikely to fly.

there are other minor ways that individuals/company's can be persuaded to release the driver of a vehicle.

Such as? S172 is such a draconian power that it only just managed to squeak through the ECtHR as being proportional. Compelling people to give self-incriminatory evidence in more serious cases is highly unlikely to get past the ECtHR. Or are we talking waterboarding? 

[Bigron]

I'm not sure that I understood much of that, LCO112G!
Regarding your reference to "proper" policing, TG, I certainly would have welcomed that approach a few years back when stopped by an UNMARKED traffic car half-way down the M3 at about 3 AM on a clear, dry and virtually empty Motorway for exceeding the speed limit.
He got me on Vascar and would not listed to reason, probably visualising the cash benefit to their Christmas fund?
My point is that it was a first offence with NO safety issues, so a warning/reprimand would have sufficed: instead of which, I got a Court appearance, fined £150 and they looked after my licence for me for 6 months.
Speaking of safety issues, isn't the Police's Prime Directive prevention before prosecution?
Clearly marked police vehicles and gerrd traps/cameras would go a long way to helping achieve this aim.

Ron.

[Viral_Jim]

I'd love to say that my experience of the plod was different. But...

Couple of years ago my car was in London car park, I deliberately parked bang in front of a security camera. Came back after 2hrs to find someone had hit the front of my car, moved the bumper and smashed the headlight.

Called the plod, the guy came out, told me there was nothing they could do  . Then, 2 days later a letter drops from the same plod force telling me that I had to repair my headlight in the next 7days or I'd be committing an offence and be fined for the vehicle being not roadworthy  . 

Also, despite the apparent cutbacks, South Wales police don't seem to be short of unmarked bikes, scoobies and audi Q7's to knock about the counties' A & B roads in issuing fines.

Her majesty's revenue collection services at their finest. 

[LC0112G]

I'm not sure that I understood much of that, LCO112G!

I'm just trying to explain why finding and prosecuting may not be as trivial as some appear to think it is.

Regarding your reference to "proper" policing, TG, I certainly would have welcomed that approach a few years back when stopped by an UNMARKED traffic car half-way down the M3 at about 3 AM on a clear, dry and virtually empty Motorway for exceeding the speed limit.
He got me on Vascar and would not listed to reason, probably visualising the cash benefit to their Christmas fund?
My point is that it was a first offence with NO safety issues, so a warning/reprimand would have sufficed: instead of which, I got a Court appearance, fined £150 and they looked after my licence for me for 6 months.

Huh? You got a 6 month ban for a first offence? I can only assume that the speed was well into 3 figures. Unlikely any copper is going to let you off with that, I've heard of many cases where the copper has said something like "we clocked you at 105, but I'm only going to report you for 98" - that is usually enough to avoid a ban and 'only' get 6 pints as a warning. Vascar means he timed you between 2 point on the road that are a known distance apart. If used properly it's plenty accurate - so he probably had you banged to rights. Neither the police nor DVLA can ban you from driving - only a court can do that. So if the offence is serious enough to possibly warrant a ban, then you end up in court.

Speaking of safety issues, isn't the Police's Prime Directive prevention before prosecution?
Clearly marked police vehicles and gerrd traps/cameras would go a long way to helping achieve this aim.

It's not something I'm minded to believe. They are there to protect the public safety by enforcing the laws of the land and gathering evidence to place before a court when these laws are broken. The education/prevention argument is used to try and persuade the public that they aren't after YOU.

[Marks DTM Calib]

I find this whole incident very disappointing, the fact that the driver did this, the van owner is known and there is bound to be paper work and other details (the goods must have been collected and dropped off somewhere plus the insurance claim!) and yet, nothing can be done shows a very sad state of affairs!

[geoffr70]

STEMO, how naive of you: they only bother to use technology chase motorists for revenue collection - anything else involves too much work (sorry Jason)!

Ron.

I'm in agreement with you on this Ron. Years ago I had the misfortune of being a police type person. I've worked as and with many different types of police in 3 continents, and the longer I did the worse I thought of it. Any interest in fairness and justice seemed to easily give way to the selfish and lazy whims of the officer, many of whom were also terribly incompetent, so even if they had the integrity to attempt to do the job properly, it didn't matter because they made a pig's ear of it anyway.

There have been many incidents, both minor and serious and everywhere in between in many different contexts over a long period of time, and still on going, where me, my family or friends have made complaints to police, who haven't lifted a finger to take any action. One even tried to lie to us to avoid doing an investigation. It becomes apparent when you call 999 that they are not interested; the control room operators seem to try to divert and distract you, that's even if they answer at all (yes that has happened - in the early hours so presumably they were asleep). A few years ago I apprehended a burglar and restrained him on the ground (I was faster than fat plod), when the person was calm and compliant and face down on hard tarmac, the chasing policeman ran and did a two footed stamp on his head - judging by the noise it made it was lucky there wasn't brains all over the road.

Anyway, of course years ago I came to my senses and left. It's at the point now where I doubt I'd even ring the police for assistance as it would be worse than doing nothing.

[Entwood]

Given that this thread has rapidly turned into a "have a go at the police" thread, it is hardly surprising jason has had enough and left.

There are a several thousand police members out there, doing their best, every single day. When they get shot protecting us there is a huge outswell of support and calls for them to be armed etc etc.

When they catch someone else breaking the law they have "done their job" well, when they attend collisions and save lives, or put their own lives at risk, they are the "good guys"

When they do the job they are paid for, enforcing the laws that WE have broken .. they are slammed and ridiculed as "cash collectors"  ...  somewhat hypocritical methinks ??

The Police collect no cash .. the courts do.

If you don't break the law... you don't get caught/ fined ... dead simple really, even an OOF member should be able to understand that simple fact.

I, for one, am sorry jason left, although I see why, as his was an interesting and knowledgeable insight in to many of the facets of policing we seldom think about. He will be missed.

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

1. I agree with quite a lot of your post Nige.
2. To use the phrase "even an OOF member should be able to understand..." is incredibly condescending, snobbish in fact.
3. You speak as someone who has never exceeded 70mph on UK roads, or knowingly broken any traffic regulations. Is that the case ?
4. I too will miss Jason, for the reasons you mentioned. I'm also a little surprised that his skin is apparently pretty thin.

[btc]

There is an old saying commit the crime get caught do the time or pay the fine

[Bigron]

I didn't realise until today (these posts) that Jason had left.
Whereas I am broadly in agreement with you, Nige, my main grievance is the official hypocracy where speed/safety is concerned and it's a bit disingenuous to say that if you don't speed you will never get fined, etc.
To meet that criterion, you would need to have your nose glued to the speedo permanently - now THAT would be a safety issue!
In my M3 example, If I may refer back to it, I was on a clear road in good visibility and the only other vehicle in sight was this unmarked plod hammering along the motorway behind me and must have been doing a much higher speed before he even saw me. I moved over to let him pass and it was only when he was right behind me that he put the blues on and pulled me over.
Where is the safety issue there? With plod, I would day, as he was just storming along in the hope of catching someone.

I'm afraid LCO112G, you didn't quite take my point regarding the policy of "prevention before prosecution. If "safety" is really the driving force and not revenue generation, then show a presence and people will slow down - the desired result, surely? Sneaky stealth methods can only be for revenue collection.
What other human activity attracts so much police attention and monitoring? To be equivalent in everyday life all citizens would need to wear registration plates and followed wherever they go - don't laugh, the next socialist government could well make it happen!

Jason, if you are still reading these posts, then if anything that I have written has offended you and/or contributed in any way to your leaving, I apologise unreservedly: it was not personal - we all need to let off steam occasionally in this high-pressured world.

Please reconsider your decision to leave,,,,,

Ron.

[Entwood]

1. I agree with quite a lot of your post Nige.
2. To use the phrase "even an OOF member should be able to understand..." is incredibly condescending, snobbish in fact.
3. You speak as someone who has never exceeded 70mph on UK roads, or knowingly broken any traffic regulations. Is that the case ?
4. I too will miss Jason, for the reasons you mentioned. I'm also a little surprised that his skin is apparently pretty thin.

To explain ..

point 2 ... deliberately said given some of the hypocritical comments ...

point 3 .... No .. I do break the limit, and have been caught/done/paid for it. Difference is I KNOW when I'm breaking the limit, and if I get done I accept it, I don't whinge about "cash collectors" .. as they are doing the job of enforcing the law I have just broken.

EDIT

Ron, not wishing to pick an argument, but I'm amazed at the stated requirement to "keep an eye glued on the speedo" to avoid speeding.

My ears/eyes/arse tell me my speed to within a few mph, and if I wish to check it is a millisecond to glance down, same time as it takes to check the rearview mirror, or check that lights are off, or that indicator has cancelled, all require a "glance" at the binnacle. We don't describe THAT as dangerous ..... in fact we seem to require folks to do it more often.

Of course, check a text/answering the phone, changing a CD/radio station, having a drink/eating a sandwich/lighting a fag are all acceptable, but looking at your speedo is deemed "unsafe"

Don't see it myself, but everyone is entitled to an opinion.

[Bigron]

But Nige, in the days of "proper" policing, there was an element of discretion on the part of the officer and prevailing conditions were taken into account; these days the automated detection and persecution are blunt weapons with no selectivity.
Yes, of course I broke the law, but I am of reasonable intelligence and have had many years of safe driving experience so I would NEVER knowingly put myself or others at risk.
Speed limits were set ages ago to take into account the worst possible scenarios and not always applicable.
I have often thought what it would be like to remove speed limits altogether and just prosecute the dangerous/careless/silly behaviour that REALLY compromises road safety, but that would mean real officers doing the job and more patrols, but it ain't ever going to happen - think of all the paperwork instead of just automated NIPs!

Ron.

[Entwood]

But Nige, in the days of "proper" policing, there was an element of discretion on the part of the officer and prevailing conditions were taken into account; these days the automated detection and persecution are blunt weapons with no selectivity.
Yes, of course I broke the law, but I am of reasonable intelligence and have had many years of safe driving experience so I would NEVER knowingly put myself or others at risk.
Speed limits were set ages ago to take into account the worst possible scenarios and not always applicable.
I have often thought what it would be like to remove speed limits altogether and just prosecute the dangerous/careless/silly behaviour that REALLY compromises road safety, but that would mean real officers doing the job and more patrols, but it ain't ever going to happen - think of all the paperwork instead of just automated NIPs!

Ron.

So, would you be happy for an extra 10p on a litre of petrol, or 1% on your income tax, or 5% on your rates, or ..... I could go on but won't ...

It takes money to pay for the extra manpower, money that comes from taxation, you can't have more of one without more of the other... there is no such thing as a free lunch or something for nothing.......

[YZ250]

Given that this thread has rapidly turned into a "have a go at the police" thread, it is hardly surprising jason has had enough and left.
.............................

I agree that it's a shame that Jason felt the need to leave, even though I was one of the posters criticising the police. I won't retract that criticism as I feel they have failed in their duty on several occasions, when we had required their support. It's no secret that I have very little time for them, not because I had broken the law but because I've needed their help when somebody else has. My lack of time for them has nothing to do with motoring either.
1. Attempted burglary on my house, cristal clear CCTV image of the men on my doorstep, phone the police who eventually attend, drink my coffee and eat my biscuits and the end result is zilch, jack, nothing.
2. Girl in street being attacked by recently dumped ex-boyfriend, my son intervenes and pushes the man away, gets hit with an iron bar and the guy runs off. My lad ends up in hospital with stitches and a scar but the police won't visit the guys house that night as 'his mum is a nice lady' (their words not mine) so they won't disturb her until the next morning.    The bar is found in her sons room, with my sons skin and hair still on it, and put in an evidence bag. It is left in a police van on a sweltering hot day, sweats in the polythene bag and goes rusty. It is deemed inadmissable to be used in court so the case is less clear cut.
Add this to the car scenario in this post, so yes, it's fair to say that I have no time for them.

I, for one, am sorry jason left, although I see why, as his was an interesting and knowledgeable insight in to many of the facets of policing we seldom think about. He will be missed.

As said, it's a shame when anybody feels the need to leave. The posts on this thread were from people giving their first hand impressions of what had happened to them. It was not intended as a personal dig at Jason, James or any other serving officer or ex officer.
An article in the paper today says that 84% of police officers are unhappy with the lack of respect they receive from the public. Maybe someone should tell them that this works both ways. Sadly all of the good things that the police do are eradicated by the thoughts of camera vans/police hiding in bushes with speed guns etc. Even though I've been done for speeding, this is not why I have gripes with them, I was guilty as charged and I'll get over it. It's just a shame that this is mostly what the public think of them so they are on a hiding to nothing.

I've said my piece but just to make it clear, this was not a snipe at an individual.

[Bigron]

Nige, as you know I think the world of you - such a lovely man - but please don't get me started on the abuse of our taxation system.
In brief ('cos I might get carried away!), we as motorists pay over £50 thousand million in motoring taxes and receive back only around £4 thousand million in motoring services. The balance is vired off into other things, like the NHS, Education and the like. All worthy causes, of course, but hardly fair or honest.

Ron.

[YZ250]

I've said my piece .....................

 
Oops, I meant peace. Hope Andy doesn't see that. 

[Mr Gav]

My ears/eyes/arse tell me my speed to within a few mph, and if I wish to check it is a millisecond to glance down, same time as it takes to check the rearview mirror, or check that lights are off, or that indicator has cancelled, all require a "glance" at the binnacle. We don't describe THAT as dangerous ..... in fact we seem to require folks to do it more often.

Totally agree with you there Entwood, I can judge my speed within a few mph while driving with the odd cursory glance just to make sure.

[Andy B]

I've said my piece .....................

 
Oops, I meant peace. Hope Andy doesn't see that. 

 

[TheBoy]

The Police have good and bad, like any organisation.

However, I don't think all these reality police car chase programmes help, as invariable the police individuals come across as arrogant tosspots, playing to the camera, and the voiceover narration adds to this.

I've been pulled far more times than I care to remember, some deserved, some not, but apart from the odd sarcastic attempt at humour, which often backfired (esp if it was an undeserved tug), I have mostly been treated with dignity and respect, and generally have no issues whatsoever with frontline officers...  ...quite the opposite, I wouldn't fancy their job.


But during the last armed robbery at bro's shop, a little old lady, the wrong side of 60, had to stand up to armed robbers, because the police refused to attend until the danger had passed - literally "call back when they have left".  And my mum's last burglary, caught on CCTV, the police admitted they knew who it was, but not further investigation. Then the fact that the (seemingly) entire Towcester police station use liveried company cars to drive 4 miles down to the Super Sausage on a Friday morning really doesn't help with public perception - nobody begrudges then a break, but to do some so publically, and misusing company property that we all pay for, doesn't help with images.  I've even seen them use B&Ts to get there.


Jasonm - sorry to see you leave 

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

I find it extremely difficult to keep within the speed limits.

For example .......I can be following an old lady doing 35 MPH in a 40 MPH limit. I need to get past.

A one inch stab of throttle can mean I'm doing 70+ by the time I have finished the overtake.

If I encounter the same situation with two of more elderly drivers  then the final speed will be significantly higher. If I crawl past at 36 MPH I'm likely to be hit by oncoming traffic.

I suppose I could just sit there forever and die of extreme old age.

[Bigron]

Doctor Opti, you have underlined my points nicely: your rapid overtake is the safest for everyone concerned, yet the official view is that it's unsafe and should be punished.
The most dangerous overtaking action is a slow one, exposing all parties to danger for too long a time.
Example? One oversized lorry overtaking another on a dual carriageway with a 1 or 2 mph speed differential and taking a mile or two to complete the action and about 10 minutes too - even a BMW driver would be safer!

Ron.

[Kevin Wood]

I find it extremely difficult to keep within the speed limits.

For example .......I can be following an old lady doing 35 MPH in a 40 MPH limit. I need to get past.

A one inch stab of throttle can mean I'm doing 70+ by the time I have finished the overtake.

If I encounter the same situation with two of more elderly drivers  then the final speed will be significantly higher. If I crawl past at 36 MPH I'm likely to be hit by oncoming traffic.

I suppose I could just sit there forever and die of extreme old age.

I've always felt that using the full performance of your vehicle to get past and out of danger is more important than dogged observance of the speed limit.. 

[STEMO]

When I decide to overtake on the road I mentioned earlier, even I'm doing 65-70 in no time, and that's in a puny astra. I would imagine 70 would come up in a nanosecond in Opti's car.

[2boxerdogs]

Doctor Opti, you have underlined my points nicely: your rapid overtake is the safest for everyone concerned, yet the official view is that it's unsafe and should be punished.
The most dangerous overtaking action is a slow one, exposing all parties to danger for too long a time.
Example? One oversized lorry overtaking another on a dual carriageway with a 1 or 2 mph speed differential and taking a mile or two to complete the action and about 10 minutes too - even a BMW driver would be safer!

Ron.

     


This is quite true I used to always overtake lorries on the A16 when safe to do so the Merc is plenty quick enough to do so easily, but now the average speed cameras are operative the traffic flows around 50-55 mph safer yes but oh so boring. Also very sad to see Jason M go.

[Bigron]

Jason, please read this: with so much good feeling towards you on here, can you really be so hurt as to stay away forever?
You have made valuable and worthwhile contributions to the Forum and we hope that you feel able to continue doing so - it was NEVER personal, as is evidenced by all the sadness expressed at your leaving.

Ron.

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

When I decide to overtake on the road I mentioned earlier, even I'm doing 65-70 in no time, and that's in a puny astra. I would imagine 70 would come up in a nanosecond in Opti's car.

In isolation it feels extremely rapid.

I suppose the latest 600 BHP projectiles from Ze Fatherland,  the Audi RS6, the Mercedes E63, and BMW M5, may make it seem like 'the fat boy with asthma'..........but it's all relative.

[STEMO]

When I decide to overtake on the road I mentioned earlier, even I'm doing 65-70 in no time, and that's in a puny astra. I would imagine 70 would come up in a nanosecond in Opti's car.

In isolation it feels extremely rapid.

I suppose the latest 600 BHP projectiles from Ze Fatherland,  the Audi RS6, the Mercedes E63, and BMW M5, may make it seem like 'the fat boy with asthma'..........but it's all relative.

Well....not to harp on, you understand, but this why I'm happy with my astra. It is more than capable of doing a safe overtake quickly enough on a clear(ish) road. Driving around in a town on a day-to-day basis with room for the dog, shopping and a wardrobe if need be, is exactly the job I bought it for.
A lot of people get speed mixed up with acceleration, my car does not accelerate very quickly, but will travel at well over the NSL if required.
So, where does that leave me? When coming off a roundabout I am often tailgated by a golf or beemer, because they accelerate much quicker than me. But within, say, five seconds, I am at the limit and, if they want to come past me, they're very welcome.
Another reason not to take bends fast or accelerate quickly is that I would make chips out of my dog in it's cage. 

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

When I decide to overtake on the road I mentioned earlier, even I'm doing 65-70 in no time, and that's in a puny astra. I would imagine 70 would come up in a nanosecond in Opti's car.

In isolation it feels extremely rapid.

I suppose the latest 600 BHP projectiles from Ze Fatherland,  the Audi RS6, the Mercedes E63, and BMW M5, may make it seem like 'the fat boy with asthma'..........but it's all relative.

Well....not to harp on, you understand, but this why I'm happy with my astra. It is more than capable of doing a safe overtake quickly enough on a clear(ish) road. Driving around in a town on a day-to-day basis with room for the dog, shopping and a wardrobe if need be, is exactly the job I bought it for.
A lot of people get speed mixed up with acceleration, my car does not accelerate very quickly, but will travel at well over the NSL if required.
So, where does that leave me? When coming off a roundabout I am often tailgated by a golf or beemer, because they accelerate much quicker than me. But within, say, five seconds, I am at the limit and, if they want to come past me, they're very welcome.
Another reason not to take bends fast or accelerate quickly is that I would make chips out of my dog in it's cage. 

I can almost visualise this in cartoon form.