Topic: Could it be the water pump ????? (Read 1956 times)

25td-jazman · « **on:** 10 August 2007, 17:58:21 »

Ok Read this and tell me I'm wrong !!! The engine is the "bullet proof" 2-5td BMW unit that has performed perfectly even though most of the miles I have covered thus far have been side ways or over the legal limit I think, but wouldn't recommend to law following citizens, so in short the dog does hunt !!
After a recent qwik trip to Sunny Aberdeen the COOLENT LEVEL warning was displayed on the way home, (nothing new there eh ?) around 10 mins later the temp shot up and I nursed the car to the garage refilled the header bottle which took very little water ? and made my way home.
Checking the car over the next day I found that the oil and water were in the places they should be but still after running for an hour or so the car began to over heat again !
I cut the centre out of the thermostat which made no difference even though it wasn't opening fully when it was tested !
The fan is viscous and turns as it should !
Suggestions so far have included air locks, a cracked head that is letting exhaust gases into the water system and a knackered engine.
Admittedly when you pull the overflow pipe from the header tank and hold the revs steady - water will fire out the bottle ? It does suggest that the pump is doing something but I fear not enough ?
Any suggestions and how to fix are welcome along with possible suppliers of said parts !

old cruiser · « **Reply #1 on:** 10 August 2007, 19:29:20 »

Check seal on the coolant tank cap, may not be sealing properly and causing water to boil as it were.
Cheers Pete

Richard A · « **Reply #2 on:** 10 August 2007, 19:53:05 »

Pleaase check 'heater by-pass value', yes even the BWM diesel has them.

regards

TheBoy · « **Reply #3 on:** 10 August 2007, 21:23:18 »

Quote

The engine is the "bullet proof" 2-5td BMW unit

LOL. "Bullet Proof" and "BMW" are not 2 phrases I would use in same sentence....

Right, trying to be more constructive, here are some things to try (yes, I have one of these crap engines as well):

Check waterpump - they have a habit of shedding plastic impellor fins.
Replace stat rather than drill it - helps to stabilise temp on these.
Check for coolant hose delamination.
Check for hot/cold spots on rad - these engines (and many other BMW plants) seem to sludge up rads after a while, causing poor efficiency.
Check electric cooling fans working.
Do a thorough coolant flush, use Forte cooling system flush.
Check if excess pessure build up in coolant, if it is, check for coolant leaks, but be aware these engines are prone to cracking heads (my current problem).

Hope that helps

TheBoy · « **Reply #4 on:** 10 August 2007, 21:24:04 »

Quote

Pleaase check 'heater by-pass value', yes even the BWM diesel has them.
regards

Generally reliable from what I can tell...

TheBoy · « **Reply #5 on:** 10 August 2007, 21:24:56 »

Also, check the expansion bottle, sometimes they fail where the threaded bit is 'welded' into main bottle.

25td-jazman · « **Reply #6 on:** 11 August 2007, 11:22:17 »

Thankx for the pointers gents !!
As a trip to the local halfords for a workshop manual has proved fruitless I will need a little more help identifing the heater bypass valve and where it can be found lurking.
Is the valve easy to remove and test

Now that I think about it ! The heater in the car never was the warmest ! Could this have been an indication of something that I missed !!

Got ma mind on my miggy and my miggy on my mind !! :-/

Grumpy · « **Reply #7 on:** 11 August 2007, 12:21:23 »

As a trip to the local halfords for a workshop manual has proved fruitless

Amazon have them at £13-29 new and £9-99 used.

Richard A · « **Reply #8 on:** 11 August 2007, 17:45:59 »

HBV is back of engine bay just below wiper motor, remove wipers and scuttle, they can weep then just go, bit of a pig but if you are leaking water but you can't spot from where its the HBV, about £40 from GM.
very very common problem have a look.
regards

Darth Loo-knee · « **Reply #9 on:** 11 August 2007, 18:20:41 »

Have a look at this link, there is a picture of an engine with arrows on it.. C is the HBV

http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1152598350

TheBoy · « **Reply #10 on:** 11 August 2007, 19:06:01 »

hold on, he has td, not v6.

Haven't picture as I've striped mine down awaiting new engine.

hbv - about halfway along engine, near top, drivers side, as a round plastic unit with 2 miedium size coolant pipes, one goes to baukhead, other goes through 180 degrees then around back of engine? the hbv is plastic bit, with a vac connection on top. Easy to see if leaking, doubt it.

Haynes dont do manuals for omega td.

Do a search and have a look at posts for 'TB2' or 'project tractor'

TheBoy · « **Reply #11 on:** 11 August 2007, 19:08:46 »

if water 'flies out' of bottle with cap off, that will likely be due to exhaust gases. Remove waterpump though to be sure that still has impellors attached. It if hit 100C on gauge (110C in reality), I suspect head cracked....

Darth Loo-knee · « **Reply #12 on:** 12 August 2007, 15:28:17 »

Quote

hold on, he has td, not v6.

Haven't picture as I've striped mine down awaiting new engine.

hbv - about halfway along engine, near top, drivers side, as a round plastic unit with 2 miedium size coolant pipes, one goes to baukhead, other goes through 180 degrees then around back of engine? the hbv is plastic bit, with a vac connection on top. Easy to see if leaking, doubt it.

Haynes dont do manuals for omega td.

Do a search and have a look at posts for 'TB2' or 'project tractor'

The idea of me putting the picture on was to show the guy what a HBV looked like!
Or are they not the same?

Quote

As a trip to the local halfords for a workshop manual has proved fruitless I will need a little more help identifing the heater bypass valve and where it can be found lurking

TheBoy · « **Reply #13 on:** 12 August 2007, 17:32:09 »

Quote

Quote
hold on, he has td, not v6.

Haven't picture as I've striped mine down awaiting new engine.

hbv - about halfway along engine, near top, drivers side, as a round plastic unit with 2 miedium size coolant pipes, one goes to baukhead, other goes through 180 degrees then around back of engine? the hbv is plastic bit, with a vac connection on top. Easy to see if leaking, doubt it.

Haynes dont do manuals for omega td.

Do a search and have a look at posts for 'TB2' or 'project tractor'

The idea of me putting the picture on was to show the guy what a HBV looked like!
Or are they not the same?
Quote
As a trip to the local halfords for a workshop manual has proved fruitless I will need a little more help identifing the heater bypass valve and where it can be found lurking

Only 2 port on tractor, not 3 port like v6. Otherwise similar looking...

TheBoy · « **Reply #14 on:** 12 August 2007, 22:22:19 »

Off car piccy of TD HBV...

Tafty · « **Reply #15 on:** 12 August 2007, 22:58:10 »

Quote

Off car piccy of TD HBV...

Blinkin eck - you stripped your engine to get the picture of the HBV!!!!! - now there's dedication for you

TheBoy · « **Reply #16 on:** 13 August 2007, 11:37:41 »

Quote

Quote
Off car piccy of TD HBV...

Blinkin eck - you stripped your engine to get the picture of the HBV!!!!! - now there's dedication for you

I feel I have to return some of the help I have had from others from this forum

25td-jazman · « **Reply #17 on:** 14 August 2007, 22:56:53 »

Once again I have to take my hat off to all who have tried to help me resolve this overheating issue ! Fanx !!

I have taken a good look around the engine and didn't find what I was looking for ! -- the old peepers aint what they useed to be !! 8-)

After having a good looky looky around where the water pipes go through the bulkhead - I even tried to follow the pipework back to locate said valve - having no luck I did manage to locate what appears to be some selonid operated valve

Will get one of the kids to show me how to upload a photo of this asap so hopefully somebody can tell me i'm trippin and to looky looky behind the head or whatever

Will keep looking for this valve thou and --- no you can get a manual for this engine, Haynes dont cover it on a BMW diesel either !

THE BOY ! Do hope your wrong ! But from what I've seen on the site so far - u could be right again !

TheBoy · « **Reply #18 on:** 14 August 2007, 23:03:51 »

Quote

THE BOY ! Do hope your wrong !

I honestly do hope I'm wrong, wouldn't want you to go through hassles I'm going through with my tractor...

25td-jazman · « **Reply #19 on:** 15 August 2007, 21:37:59 »

Tonight I was able to have a good look for this heater bypass valve and didnt find one, either it has been removed - or this model which is a 97 wasn't fitted with one - more likely I'm losing the plot altogether

The mysterious selonid valve thingy turned out to be a water circ pump of sorts which was under the header bottle - doeasn't appear to be working with either the heater running on full blast ( which didnt really get warmer than a breath ) or the AC on.

The car was running for a good 30 mins and during which the revs were held at 3K and the header bottle topped off and watched for escaping exhaust gases. The car was held at 3K for a good 10mins after which the temp began to rise above 90 on the gauage. Didn't notice any difference in the level or any bubbles !

As the temp rose the water started to seep over the edge of the header bottle, it then slowly began to bubble and get warmer as the steam began to rise - the kettle was ready

Hopefully this indicates that the water is being boiled off in the block and the head is ok

Would love to know what this pump is and where the best place to shop for it and a water pump

- Ebay

Unable to post pic of pump !

Would also appreciate any advise or pointers from somebody who has done a water pump on a td , other than get somebody else to do it

TheBoy · « **Reply #20 on:** 15 August 2007, 21:43:54 »

As said earlier, HBV is plastic valve attached halfway along the drivers side of rocker cover. Waterpump is the bit the viscous is attached to.

TheBoy · « **Reply #21 on:** 15 August 2007, 21:45:08 »

Whip out waterpump and check impellors still there. Do not use car, if the head is OK now, it won't be if you keep letting it overheat.

25td-jazman · « **Reply #22 on:** 15 August 2007, 22:21:43 »

LOL ! " Whip it out ! "

With a little bit of luck when it does come oot the fins will be awol !

The water pipe the runs along the drivers side rocker cover is a metal pipe that t's off to the bottom of the header bottle via a rubber hose ?? Cannie find this HBV !

What of the missing fins from the water pump ?? Are they easily retrived from the block or is a fishing expedition ? Time will tell eh ?? :-/

Will try and post the pics I have of the circ pump !

TheBoy · « **Reply #23 on:** 15 August 2007, 22:26:18 »

Quote

The water pipe the runs along the drivers side rocker cover is a metal pipe that t's off to the bottom of the header bottle via a rubber hose ?? Cannie find this HBV !

Does you car have a/c?

if so the metal pipe goes to baukhead? then othe pipe from baukhead goes to hbv.

Post piccie of engine

25td-jazman · « **Reply #24 on:** 18 August 2007, 22:49:06 »

Thankx to everyone who posted !!!

My miggy is back up and motoring

Missed ma miggy so much

Dragging my tools out the garage and my heels too I was delighted to find that the complete plastic impeller had broken off the water pump shaft !
Water pump from the local autoparts cost £38
Smile on my face when we went out and played in the rain tonight - pricless

Could it be the water pump

??

-- Could be !!

Thankx again !! Will post pics of damaged pump etc when able !

Tafty · « **Reply #25 on:** 18 August 2007, 23:02:20 »

Quote

Thankx to everyone who posted !!!

My miggy is back up and motoring Missed ma miggy so much

Dragging my tools out the garage and my heels too I was delighted to find that the complete plastic impeller had broken off the water pump shaft !
Water pump from the local autoparts cost £38
Smile on my face when we went out and played in the rain tonight - pricless

Could it be the water pump ??

-- Could be !!

Thankx again !! Will post pics of damaged pump etc when able !

Good that you're back on the road

News:

Author Topic: Could it be the water pump ????? (Read 1956 times)