Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[oro]

Hi all,
I thought it would be a good idea to copy some of my music from my computer onto cd then play them through the car cd player.
Well most of the tracks wont play, some skip and some discs are not even recognised by the player. Is there something I am doing wrong.
Regular bought cd's play fine music and books.
Any ideas?
Mike
I have a 4 cd cartridge changer on a Phillips 2006 unit in a x reg 2.5 elite.

[Dave DND]

None of the pre-2004 Vauxhall head units are compatable with CDR or RW

Check out previous threads of this forum as has been extensively answered before

[Danny]

None of the pre-2004 Vauxhall head units are compatable with CDR or RW

Check out previous threads of this forum as has been extensively answered before

mine plays my own copied discs

[Dave DND]

Read the previous thread, as it explains the damage you will do by using discs that are not meant to be used.

I don`t really want to repeat a discussion again.

[Dave DND]

CD`rs and CD`rws use a smaller mark on the disc than an audio CD player and the older players and OEM units have difficulty in focussing the laser on the smaller dots. If you do have a player that reads a CDR, you are strining the laser and will shorten the life by approx 80%

please dont flood this thread with

"Mine works ok "

they were never designed to !

[Danny]

only sayin

[Dave DND]

Danny,

I`m not having a dig at you my friend, I`m just making sure that people realise that there is a major constructional and design difference between discs that are used on a computer and those that are used by the manuafacturers to sell audio.

Some may well play, and those that do will almost certainly end up at my workshop for an expensive repair well before their time.

[TheBoy]

My own experience would suggest it makes no difference to reliability using pressed or CDRs.

I have been using CDRs in all my cars since I got my first CD Writer about 12yrs ago.  Oldest changers still in use are a 16yr old 10 disc Kenwood and a 10yr old Philips in the little Rover 25 (it came out of our earlier Rover 400).  I have not knackered a player yet.  Same goes for my home players, though for past 3 years, I've used media center instead.

I tend to find quality CDRs makes a difference, my preference being Verbatim.

The CDRs seem to get more condensation when cold in my experience, so once a month I tend to bring the magazine in for a couple of days, which seems to resolve playing issues.

I know DND will disagree, but that is my long term experience.  I hope my comments help someone.

[cbs2]

I agree with TB.
Had 6 CD'r s in the stack since I bought the mig & theres only been once that its refused to play them. As TB said overnight in the warmth cured the condensation issue

[Dave DND]

And you can also drive a V6 engine with two plug leads removed.

Just because you can, does not mean you should !

[Danny]

i best stop using my left foot to steer my automatic then

[waspy]

We all know the reasons why we use CDR's CDRW's etc, it's because we can get them cheap from someone at work or we burn them ourselves from the net.
The cost of a new CD in the shops are stupidly high & so whatever the costs are involved in getting the unit repaired will probabley be cheaper than buying full price CD's

[Dave DND]

whatever the costs are involved in getting the unit repaired will probabley be cheaper than buying full price CD's

You`ve obviously never had a bill from me for a new laser then  

[TheBoy]

We all know the reasons why we use CDR's CDRW's etc, it's because we can get them cheap from someone at work or we burn them ourselves from the net.
The cost of a new CD in the shops are stupidly high & so whatever the costs are involved in getting the unit repaired will probabley be cheaper than buying full price CD's

no, mine is because my cd collection sits indoors and stays there.  With 3 cars to fill, all only having '6 disc' changers, i like to make my own compilations.  I would say 99% of my music is bought.  Don't buy so much now, as its all crap, but thats coz I've turned in to Radio2 man (Mainly coz I cant stand Moyles and the scottish bimbo after him).

[Humpy]

I've made copies of my legaly bougth CD's for yonks and played them in various changers with no trouble yet. I must admit I've never heard of a problem with CDR's in car audio CD players. I've got some in the Meega now so we'll see how we go.

Humpy

PS Mind you, who's going to get there changer repaired if they can get a SH one of fleabay :-/

[tomoco]

Anyway, getting back to "ORO's" original problem of his car cd player struggling to play his CDR's. Try to record (BURN) them slower. Most cd burning software will let you adjust the burning speed before you start burning to disc. Even though most blank cd's you buy these days have a lable saying 52X, you should never burn audio discs at anyway near that speed. Try much slower (i'm talking 4X or even 2X) its takes a bit longer but you get better quality (because the lazer can find the tracks a lot easier) and you get less errors (coasters). I burn all my car cd's at 4X with no problems what so ever.

Mark

P.S. try a cd lens cleaner before you through all your existing cdr's away.

P.P.S. Dont use  CDRW's the format (the way the data is set down on the disc) is different so most of the older pre 2004 in car units will struggle with this type of disc.

hope this helps

[Marks DTM Calib]

CDR's reflect less light to the detector than pressed CD's (upto about 1/4 of the light) and so not all CD player receivers can tolerate the lower light output.

In theory, better discs and slower burn speeds help increase the light levels but they are never going to be as good as originals.

You might get lucky and have a player with a more sensitive PIN diode/transimpedance amp setup but, most older players are not designed to this criteria.

Cant get my head around any mechanism that would shorten the life of the player though as the laser 1's level and bias is constant.....

[Dave DND]

Cant get my head around any mechanism that would shorten the life of the player though as the laser 1's level and bias is constant.....

Its the laser focus coils that burn out as they struggle to see the smaller dots. Laser power is indeed constant. If you fancy a technical challenge to see what I mean, hook up a scope to the focus / tracking test points and observe the difference in activity between the two formats.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Cant get my head around any mechanism that would shorten the life of the player though as the laser 1's level and bias is constant.....

Its the laser focus coils that burn out as they struggle to see the smaller dots. Laser power is indeed constant. If you fancy a technical challenge to see what I mean, hook up a scope to the focus / tracking test points and observe the difference in activity between the two formats.

Thanks Dave, will have a nose at that.....

Been trying to recall my CD principles knowledge......do they still apply a control tone to the laser rather than operate CW?

[Dave DND]

Most of the In Car stuff does not need an external control tone, (but yes to your question) as pretty much all of them nowadays have an inbuilt test mode allowing you to view the S curve without the need of a signal generator. One less bit of kit to hook up.

[Kevin Wood]

It's quite interesting watching the control systems in a CD player working. They're an impressive bit of control system design, and it's remarkable that they work as well as they do, really.

Kevin

[Marks DTM Calib]

It's quite interesting watching the control systems in a CD player working. They're an impressive bit of control system design, and it's remarkable that they work as well as they do, really.

Kevin

Pretty slow and simple stuff realy though.......by modern standards.

I suspect the lasers would be considerably more reliable if they had proper control systems to....but that would add cost.

[TheBoy]

It's quite interesting watching the control systems in a CD player working. They're an impressive bit of control system design, and it's remarkable that they work as well as they do, really.

Kevin

Pretty slow and simple stuff realy though.......by modern standards.

I suspect the lasers would be considerably more reliable if they had proper control systems to....but that would add cost.

I'm guessing cost is most important factor, but also weight if it has to be on laser itself to allow for fast adjustments with less inertia?

[Kevin Wood]

I'm guessing cost is most important factor, but also weight if it has to be on laser itself to allow for fast adjustments with less inertia?

The fast stuff just moves the lens on the players I've destroyed serviced. The laser itself is on a fairly slow-moving sled. However, more weight means it will be more sensitive to shock.

Kevin

[TheBoy]

I'm guessing cost is most important factor, but also weight if it has to be on laser itself to allow for fast adjustments with less inertia?

The fast stuff just moves the lens on the players I've destroyed serviced. The laser itself is on a fairly slow-moving sled. However, more weight means it will be more sensitive to shock.

Kevin

I was thinking for finding the spiral, and constant adjustment to stay on it?

[Kevin Wood]

I'm guessing cost is most important factor, but also weight if it has to be on laser itself to allow for fast adjustments with less inertia?

The fast stuff just moves the lens on the players I've destroyed serviced. The laser itself is on a fairly slow-moving sled. However, more weight means it will be more sensitive to shock.

Kevin

I was thinking for finding the spiral, and constant adjustment to stay on it?

The lens does that, in conjunction with the sled, normally. There are usually 2 sets of "voice coils" connected to the lens that move it up and down (to focus the laser (or, more accurately, the reflection on to the sensor) and side to side to keep the laser aligned with the track. These follow any warp or eccentricity of the disc too.

The sled is then used for coarse positioning of the laser, to keep the "left/right" control system within its operating range.

I think Mark was referring to controlling the current through the laser to get an adequate signal, rather than just running it flat out all the time?

Kevin

[TheBoy]

I'm guessing cost is most important factor, but also weight if it has to be on laser itself to allow for fast adjustments with less inertia?

The fast stuff just moves the lens on the players I've destroyed serviced. The laser itself is on a fairly slow-moving sled. However, more weight means it will be more sensitive to shock.

Kevin

I was thinking for finding the spiral, and constant adjustment to stay on it?

The lens does that, in conjunction with the sled, normally. There are usually 2 sets of "voice coils" connected to the lens that move it up and down (to focus the laser (or, more accurately, the reflection on to the sensor) and side to side to keep the laser aligned with the track. These follow any warp or eccentricity of the disc too.

The sled is then used for coarse positioning of the laser, to keep the "left/right" control system within its operating range.

I think Mark was referring to controlling the current through the laser to get an adequate signal, rather than just running it flat out all the time?

Kevin

I did lightly look into it all many years ago.  Trouble at my age is that to fit new knowledge in to my mush pit in my head means some old knowledge has to drop out.  I hope knowledge of vital body functions doesn't drop out....

[M16]

Hey. I had same problem. If I copied one of my cd's on my laptop the car cd would not play it at all. All i did was buy an external CD/DVD copier from maplin and problem solved. Car now plays copies. It all depends on what sort of CD Writer you have. I now use a Argosy External (Cost £35). Bit better than a new car cd player lol

[file28]

you're not one of terrys togs are you ? anyway i prefer to listen to radio 2 also where else can you listen to the full version of stairway to heaven without going digital

We all know the reasons why we use CDR's CDRW's etc, it's because we can get them cheap from someone at work or we burn them ourselves from the net.
The cost of a new CD in the shops are stupidly high & so whatever the costs are involved in getting the unit repaired will probabley be cheaper than buying full price CD's

no, mine is because my cd collection sits indoors and stays there.  With 3 cars to fill, all only having '6 disc' changers, i like to make my own compilations.  I would say 99% of my music is bought.  Don't buy so much now, as its all crap, but thats coz I've turned in to Radio2 man (Mainly coz I cant stand Moyles and the scottish bimbo after him).

[Marks DTM Calib]

Yes, there was a method used on high end CD players where the laser was modulated with a tone so the diode had to be biased at the knee point (all laser diodes operate as an LED until they reach a threshold where the current climbs fast and they lase) and then the modulation applied.

The theory was that it is easier to recover the digtal signal because you could just look for the signal strength of a known tone (filter it!), it also made focusing easier because you adjusted to maintain the maximum control tone at the 1's level......

Having worked with comms laser based transmision systems for some 10 years now (we work up to 10G directly modulated and 40G via modulators!) the CD player setups are very old hat and simple!

[file28]

thanks mark that really simplifies it

[mkaminski100]

So, it’s not recommended to play any CDR’s or CDRW’s. Trouble is that most of my CD’s are copied so that original is untouched.
DaveDND – as I understand, this is a laser unit problem, not the player. I know that these lasers (FL models) are quite expensive (how much BTW) but is there any way to fit different laser that will not have any problems with reading CDR’s?
I know that the best way is to change the unit but as it’s 2DIN unit in FLs, it’s expensive to buy the player, 1DIN cover, cables (steering wheel controls)

[Dave DND]

The technology of the basic stereo is simply not there to run a different type of laser, and with the unit being so old, it just isn`t economic to redesign a circuit to allow a 10 year old stereo to run what is essentially illegally copied discs.

I understand your thinking - but it aint happenin !

[mkaminski100]

My radio is not even 8 years old!
So the only way to avoid constant laser damage is to buy a decent MP3 unit?
I might be wrong but I can make one copy of any CD or DVD as a “backup”.
Anyway, as an expert, can you please advice any good unit which can be plugged to Omega (with steering wheel buttons operation)? I don’t fancy radio on MID display so it’s not a desirable feature.

[Kevin Wood]

Why mess about writing CDs anyway?

Surely MP3 is the ideal format for car use. I would be happy with a head unit containing a tuner and a hard drive on a caddy. Just fill it up with MP3s at your preferred level of compression and you've got your whole music collection.

Is there something on the market like the old Dension units that used to do this?

Kevin

[Dave DND]

The best way for storing mass MP3`s these days is almost without question the iPod.

I would also be very surprised if there was not an interface available to allow connection to the standard head unit - somebody else here will have the answer to that one.

As far as other formats - Dension is still around, but the high cost and FM modulator lose out to the iPod again. Dedicated HDD head units are still too close to four figures to be considered, and if going for a genuine aftermarket head unit, most have steering control and iPod connectivity solutions - just make sure you go for a good quality brand.

[mkaminski100]

I will have to start looking for a new stereo, but it's not urgent. If you have any suggestions about something that works with GM car, let us know.
Is there any way to make an "AUX-IN" in 2DIN units? I know that TraffcMaster playes messages throught the radio so there is a way to connect it (maybe it's just a FM transmitter so the quality is poor).

[Dave DND]

We use these transmitters - they are excellent and inlike the others, you do not need to mess around with the aerial leads - which is generally where the interference problems start !!

http://ice.dndservices.co.uk/shop_show_item.php/ST/savv/IID/2947/PAGE/shop_search_index.php

[Kevin Wood]

The best way for storing mass MP3`s these days is almost without question the iPod.

It just seems an expensive way of buying a hard drive and also something that's liable to get nicked out of the car if you don't disconnect it and take it with you every time you leave the car... There seems to be very little else, though. :-/

What with mobile phones, sat nav, etc. I'm sick of gadgets that I have to take with me.

Regarding feeding audio into the factory head units the trafficmaster / phone input is mono. However, I have been meaning to pull my CCR2006 out and figure out a way to connect a stereo input.

Kevin

[Dave DND]

Expensive?

you must  be joking !

I picked up a 40GB ipod for £35 on ebay, I have stored on it enough music to last nearly a month with duplicating the same track, and I leave it permanently attatched to the stereo so that it charges and runs as soon as the stereo is turned on - and this is velcro`d to the inside of my glovebox so that I never need to look at it, let alone take it out !

[Martin_1962]

And decent MP3 players can work as well.

[Kevin Wood]

Expensive?

you must  be joking !

I picked up a 40GB ipod for £35 on ebay, I have stored on it enough music to last nearly a month with duplicating the same track, and I leave it permanently attatched to the stereo so that it charges and runs as soon as the stereo is turned on - and this is velcro`d to the inside of my glovebox so that I never need to look at it, let alone take it out !

Fair enough   Hadn't thought about a 2nd hand one TBH. Don't know why. Most of my stuff comes from Ebay. Will keep an eye out for one.

I assume you've got a head unit that can talk to it - or is it possible for it to power up and start playing automatically with just audio and power connections.

Kevin

[Dave DND]

There are a number of ways to connect an iPod - really depends on budget and requirements.

Some of (but not all) options are - a head unit that can control the iPod directly via a dedicated socket or interface, an fm modulator, or via a basic aux in lead where you still control the iPod frrom its own switches and simply pipe the music through the head unit.

options are almost infinate !!

[TheBoy]

They do appear to be a lot of leads for ipod that just enable you to connect up the ipod (electrically) in place of CD Changer, allowing head unit controls (and steering wheel controls) to control the ipod.  The ones I've seen, you create 6 (or 10) playlists on the ipod, and these become the 'CDs' as far as the headunit is concerned.

[mkaminski100]

Do you know how to do it, or somebody who knows?

[cbs2]

Just bought a Harmon Kardon Drive & play. Only bought it as it was the only one I could see that let the ipod be hidden away during use.

To be honest, the sound without it being plugged into the ariel ain't great, but connected to the ariel connector its alot better.

I have two (very picky) gripes with it though. I've changed the dash to blue leds. the HK button lights up blue, but the screen is white
And the size of the control button.

My handy tip of the day. If you fit one of these, remove the trafficmaster button & fit the controller over the hole. Drill two holes either side of the existing hole to mount the controller. if you take it back out, the traffic master button should hide the screw holes

[Kevin Wood]

Does the Drive & Play output the audio signals or are you restricted to using the FM output?

Kevin

[Kevin Wood]

Scratch that. Just Please read the manual and it does

Kevin

[Albatross]

They do appear to be a lot of leads for ipod that just enable you to connect up the ipod (electrically) in place of CD Changer, allowing head unit controls (and steering wheel controls) to control the ipod.  The ones I've seen, you create 6 (or 10) playlists on the ipod, and these become the 'CDs' as far as the headunit is concerned.

So just to check here; If I'm running a facelift Elite which has the standard head unit & 4 disc changer and have a CID in the dash (soon  ) then would this mean that there is a solution which allows, with an iPod, the track names to be accessed through the steering wheel and head unit controls and show up on the CID as they were playing?

[TheBoy]

They do appear to be a lot of leads for ipod that just enable you to connect up the ipod (electrically) in place of CD Changer, allowing head unit controls (and steering wheel controls) to control the ipod.  The ones I've seen, you create 6 (or 10) playlists on the ipod, and these become the 'CDs' as far as the headunit is concerned.

So just to check here; If I'm running a facelift Elite which has the standard head unit & 4 disc changer and have a CID in the dash (soon  ) then would this mean that there is a solution which allows, with an iPod, the track names to be accessed through the steering wheel and head unit controls and show up on the CID as they were playing?

You would need to check if there was an ipod interface adapter available for ncdc201x stereo, and the functionality it offers.

The adapters I've seend dont show track names, just the 'track number' and 'cd number' (playlist) - remember, its emulating a cd changer.

[jemis]

Anybody having problems playing cdr discs in your player try buying audio specific cdr's instead of data disc's.
We had this problem in my wifes Merc C220cdi and done some research into it as I thought the player was U/S. It turns out it was designed not to play cdr's but copies on audio discs seem to play ok.
They are a little more expensive as they are brand names like sony or tdk etc instead of tesco's.

[Road Hog Mad]

Suppose the only was around this is to have a USB drive on your CD player

[Dave DND]

Anybody having problems playing cdr discs in your player try buying audio specific cdr's instead of data disc's.
We had this problem in my wifes Merc C220cdi and done some research into it as I thought the player was U/S. It turns out it was designed not to play cdr's but copies on audio discs seem to play ok.
They are a little more expensive as they are brand names like sony or tdk etc instead of tesco's.

No.

Have a read of this

http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1300229193