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Terbs

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Parasitic drain
« on: 25 August 2016, 10:18:04 »

Hi all....

I definitely have a parasitic drain on my 2.5 estate. New battery, and still flat after leaving for a while. Other cars start perfect.
So...following a link I searched on here to a video of how to test and cure, I seem to have a drain of 3.0.
The next step is fuse pulling. However, the chap doing the vid says disconnect the meter before you open any doors. Then clamp the door open mechanism switch in the closed position.
Sorry if this is a 'duh' question, but how to you clamp the door switch in on the Omega. In the vid, his was on the door post...easy.
TIA :y
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #1 on: 25 August 2016, 10:46:38 »

What about just pulling the wires/bulbs from the door courtesy lights/interior light? Failing that actually take out the switches (one screw) and unplug them.  :)
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #2 on: 25 August 2016, 10:53:48 »

Ah...thanks DBG....
I did not think there would be a plug behind....thought it would just be a wire. I will undo that screw and pull the wire and see what happens.
But...and excuse my ignorance...the circuit is 'live' when the plug is in the open position. Just disconnecting, would that not leave the circuit open, and working, or does it have to be connected to work :(
Meaning...the contacts in the switch spring to a closed position when the door is open completing the circuit !!
« Last Edit: 25 August 2016, 10:55:22 by terbert »
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #3 on: 25 August 2016, 11:03:34 »


Sorry if this is a 'duh' question, but how to you clamp the door switch in on the Omega. In the vid, his was on the door post...easy.
TIA :y

Duct tape a short strip of wood across it.
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #4 on: 25 August 2016, 11:07:54 »

Thanks Nick, I'll try that first, before I start playing with things I don't know about ;D
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #5 on: 25 August 2016, 11:10:53 »

I have a pre-GCSE and pre-19th Century understanding of electrics, but if there's no connecting wires, that's that, there's no electrical drain, there's no circuit. (unless, one supposes, there's a frayed wire arcing on a bit of bare steel on that particular wire, of course)

if unsure, as Nick says , tape the thing down. I've also wedged a lump of wood/plastic between the door and the switch before to hold it in the down position before. Just remember it's there before you slam the door and rip the hinges out! I eventually twigged it's far easier to just take the switch out, or the offending light bulbs.  :)
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #6 on: 25 August 2016, 11:23:01 »

The usual system with door courtesy light switch wiring is to feed the switch via the bulb (i.e. the 12 volt feed goes to the bulb first) and the circuit to earth is made via the switch, as it is physically in contact with the door metalwork.
If you remove the retaining screw for the switch and allow it and its wire to dangle in the fresh air, the earth return path cannot be made, so no light and no drain.....

Ron.
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #7 on: 25 August 2016, 11:28:50 »

Thanks chaps....I have taken the switch out (DBG) and once I gave a tug I had excess wire, so disconnected the plug. Me worrying over nothing, as usual. :-[
Going to reconnect the meter, and then the laborious job of fuse pulling :y
I think the only thing fitted and hidden away was a phone system, which Nick W 'uninstalled' a while back, but I still get drain, unless there is a bit we missed lurking somewhere ???
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #8 on: 25 August 2016, 11:31:30 »

Tried unplugging the Alarm Powersounder under the scuttle  ???

A real favorite for battery drain  :y
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #9 on: 25 August 2016, 11:32:17 »

Bear in mind that there's a 10-15 minute delay before everything really turns off after closing all the doors due to the consumer delay relay. In a standard Omega it should drop to below 80ma or so.
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #10 on: 25 August 2016, 11:44:52 »

Tried unplugging the Alarm Powersounder under the scuttle  ???

A real favorite for battery drain  :y


Good thought. Most on here have long unplugged theirs, but if you haven't then that's a good thing to try  :)
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #11 on: 25 August 2016, 11:57:36 »

Power sounder went 6 years ago, mate...
To be quite honest, this is not my territory. I don't think my meter is good enough. Its only a Draper one, and I am not totally sure I am using the right settings. On the front it says DCV and I have it set on 200m. The other readings in that section are...500...200...20...2000m.
Yesterday it read 3.0, today I have got a reading of 004  or  00.4 (because the 'point' does not seem to be lit).
All I have done is unplug that door switch, so do you think its in that circuit ?

***Edit....not that, reconnected and same reading. :(
Will now pull fuses to see if reading changes...bah humbug !!!

« Last Edit: 25 August 2016, 12:04:23 by terbert »
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #12 on: 25 August 2016, 13:37:02 »

As above, my understanding is abysmal of using a multimeter, but I'm learning. I think it's just got to be logical, take it steady, and isolate/deduct one thing at a time.


I had a fuse blow on the Central Locking circuit day before our holidays, perfect timing. We'd recently replaced most of the doors, so anything could have happened. Rany my mechanic mate and save faffing with multimeters and so on, his nice, simple approach was 'get a handful of fuses, disconnect/reconnect the doors one by one, soon as the fuse stops blowing, you've found the door.' each day out we did just that, by the 3rd day found the faulty door. CL solenoid at fault.

If you're having inconclusive results from the multimeter, try a similar approach? Not entirely sure what systems you can safely remove a fuse from (well, theoretically all of them, otherwise what happens when a fuse blows?) yes, the car might not start/windows stop working etc but at least you've found/discounted your fault each time.  :)
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #13 on: 25 August 2016, 14:11:06 »

terbert, your description of how you use the meter is confusing. Just to clarify, (not knowing your exact model of meter) your test leads should be in the current socket (perhaps 10A, or loer if you have more choices) and the other lead in the common socket. The test leads are then used in the negative return from the battery; disconnect the battery terminal and connect theblack lead to the battery lug itself and the red lead to the terminal on the loose lug that was connected to the battery.

Ron.
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #14 on: 25 August 2016, 16:28:28 »

I had a drain on my old estate.after days of searching it turned out to be curtasy light in passenger sun visor. Pulled bulb and all ok
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #15 on: 25 August 2016, 17:39:46 »

Don't know if this helps....although the red wire looks to be on the left, its because its twisted behind the meter. Red is connected to the battery live, and the black is connected to the battery earth lead, (which is disconnected from the battery) :y
While I was posting this, the reading has increased to 0.10

« Last Edit: 25 August 2016, 17:41:38 by terbert »
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Bigron

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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #16 on: 25 August 2016, 18:28:37 »

Terbert, if I read you correctly you are not measuring anything of significance! Your meter is somewhat unusual in that it doesn't appear to have a separate current-measuring terminal; presumably you select that option from the rotary switch? In your photo, you appear to have selected the 200milliVOLT position, which you do not want. Select the DCA (amps) position, initially the highest one and connect the leads in the way I outlined in my previos reply to you. IN NO CIRCUMSTANCES attempt to connect your meter across the battery when it is in current-measuring mode or you will cremate it! It has to be is series with the battery lead, preferably the negative battery lead, as I said earlier.

Ron.
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #17 on: 25 August 2016, 19:37:58 »

Thanks for the input Ron (and others).
I am giving up now as I don't think my meter is up to it. Going to get a proper meter and try again.
There has to be a drain, as switching batteries does not cure the problem. Donor car always starts after leaving, but 2.5 gives me the one finger salute every time its left for a few days. Starts perfectly if in constant use.>:(

Does this one look any good......

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Multimeter-Aidbucks-Resistance-Voltmeter-Backlight/dp/B01DUH9VT0/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1472038395&sr=8-1&keywords=ammeter

« Last Edit: 25 August 2016, 19:41:44 by terbert »
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #18 on: 25 August 2016, 22:02:52 »

I am reluctant to comment on or recommend anything that I don't have personal experience of, but the price isn't too bad if the quality is good. There are cheaper ones (from China!) on eBay and you can pay lots more, too.
I would commend this site to you, though:-

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZBbgiBU96mM

My Service Provider is playing up and I haven't watched much of it, but the menu on the right-hand side lists fllow-up tutorials too, so I hope you are not offended by my suggesting that you watch them?

Ron.
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #19 on: 25 August 2016, 23:14:33 »

Thanks Ron....not offended in the least. I am always open to suggestions and willing to learn :y
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #20 on: 26 August 2016, 00:05:09 »

I have a what they call a clamp meter, literally open the jaw type and it will measure the amps flowing thru a wire (usually a main battery wire) without any disconnection required.

If you have a multimeter with an amps setting, this can be used but you have to connect the meter in series ( remove the battery clamp and place the meter wires between the terminal and the clamp)

A word of caution thou as most multi meters have an internal fuse of 10 A which is a nuisance to change if you inadvertantly exceed that current.

As mentioned by others, the vehicle should "sleep" after a certain period and the current draw drop to a respectable .00something level. If it doesent, find the circuit at fault by pulling fuses one at a time till you find the current drawing circuit.

Late night ramble so forgive me if not all clear.
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #21 on: 26 August 2016, 09:42:59 »

Yes Tidla...understand that...as I have communicated with BigRon....my problem is sorting volts from amps, ohms, etc
The vids I am watching, via Ron, are brilliant (imo) :y
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YZ250

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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #22 on: 26 August 2016, 10:56:28 »

Terbert, if I read you correctly you are not measuring anything of significance! Your meter is somewhat unusual in that it doesn't appear to have a separate current-measuring terminal; presumably you select that option from the rotary switch? In your photo, you appear to have selected the 200milliVOLT position, which you do not want. Select the DCA (amps) position, initially the highest one and connect the leads in the way I outlined in my previos reply to you. IN NO CIRCUMSTANCES attempt to connect your meter across the battery when it is in current-measuring mode or you will cremate it! It has to be is series with the battery lead, preferably the negative battery lead, as I said earlier.

Ron.

Agreed.  :y  Your digital multimeter looks like a Draper DMM7, which should be capable of reading what you want in the method that Ron has posted, with it set to DCA mode. You are effectively using your meter to bridge the gap between your removed negative terminal clamp and the post that it came off.  :y  As Ron has said, set it to a higher DCA position first and work your way down the settings until you get a reading. The meter you've already got should be fine for this check.  :y
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #23 on: 26 August 2016, 11:03:35 »

So....what are 20m and 200m and 2000y (or similar symbol) Are they milli amps. I assume they are smaller than amps. That's all I have under DCA. :)

I may pm further replies, as I am getting the feeling I am looking a prize numpty :-[
« Last Edit: 26 August 2016, 11:09:08 by terbert »
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #24 on: 26 August 2016, 11:21:42 »

So....what are 20m and 200m and 2000y (or similar symbol) Are they milli amps. I assume they are smaller than amps. That's all I have under DCA. :)

I may pm further replies, as I am getting the feeling I am looking a prize numpty :-[

If you set it to the higher setting first you will hopefully see zero on the readout, because the drain will be nowhere near in that region. If you then cog it down to 200 you are fine tuning the reading to capture readings that are not quite so high and if it's still not accurate you can then cog it down to 20 to pick up the low readings.  :y  Always go in high first and fine tune by selecting the lower settings one by one until you get the best reading. The point is, your multimeter is capable of doing this.  :y

Just seen your edit.  ;D  No shame in asking questions, it's how we all learn new stuff.  :y
« Last Edit: 26 August 2016, 11:28:17 by YZ250 »
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #25 on: 26 August 2016, 16:20:58 »

So....what are 20m and 200m and 2000y (or similar symbol) Are they milli amps. I assume they are smaller than amps. That's all I have under DCA. :)

I may pm further replies, as I am getting the feeling I am looking a prize numpty :-[

Don't be shy... We all learn somewhere :y
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Re: Parasitic drain
« Reply #26 on: 02 September 2016, 11:55:57 »

Just to add, that helpful forums like this one are here to explain things, and thrive on questions being asked

No matter how silly you feel your question is, the guys here will always try their best to answer it.

If I may my 2 cents also . .

Don`t bother trying to measure battery drain with a conventional multimeter - yes, it can be done, but its such an arseache to connect things properly without blowing the internal fuse that you will give up long before you have solved it. Get yourself a cheap Clampmeter, its much easier to use. There are some china cheapies around the £20 mark, but I would suggest to spend a bit extra - £30 and get one of these, as its sensitive enough to do what you are trying to do

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Digital-Mini-AC-DC-Clamp-Meter-600V-2A-80A-633-/262581737050?hash=item3d2317565a:g:aWkAAOSwdzVXtDz1

Good luck with it, and let us know your findings
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