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[STEMO]

Great, as long as it do them 80 miles at a time:

Tesla battery supplier Catl says new design has one million-mile lifespan https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-52966178

[Viral_Jim]

To be fair, I don't know why there would be much appetite for this extra longevity, given that its adding 10%+ to the cost of the most costly component in an EV.

There is some analysis of existing EV battery technology here: https://thenextavenue.com/2020/05/11/new-data-on-tesla-battery-degradation/. This suggests that as it stands, Teslas (there seems to be more high mileage data available than for other EVs) lose, on average about 9% capacity after 170,000 miles. Also, most of that degradation seems to occur in the first 50,000 miles, so the study estimates it will be over 500,000 miles before capacity hits 80%. Presumably other components in the car will have become unusable long before the battery deteriorates below a usable capacity, so I doubt current batteries are a limiting factor, except possibly when it comes to people's perception of EVs.

FWIW I think the next battery breakthrough will come in terms of the materials that go into them. As it stands they rely on materials like cobalt that are politically difficult to obtain and environmentally damaging to mine/extract - although they can be recycled once they have been obtained.

John Goodenough's announcement on solid state batteries in 2017 seems to be edging closer to being a commercial reality, although not imminently: https://electrek.co/2020/04/23/work-on-goodenoughs-breakthrough-solid-state-ev-battery-moves-forward/.   

[STEMO]

To be fair, I don't know why there would be much appetite for this extra longevity, given that its adding 10%+ to the cost of the most costly component in an EV.

There is some analysis of existing EV battery technology here: https://thenextavenue.com/2020/05/11/new-data-on-tesla-battery-degradation/. This suggests that as it stands, Teslas (there seems to be more high mileage data available than for other EVs) lose, on average about 9% capacity after 170,000 miles. Also, most of that degradation seems to occur in the first 50,000 miles, so the study estimates it will be over 500,000 miles before capacity hits 80%. Presumably other components in the car will have become unusable long before the battery deteriorates below a usable capacity, so I doubt current batteries are a limiting factor, except possibly when it comes to people's perception of EVs.

FWIW I think the next battery breakthrough will come in terms of the materials that go into them. As it stands they rely on materials like cobalt that are politically difficult to obtain and environmentally damaging to mine/extract - although they can be recycled once they have been obtained.

John Goodenough's announcement on solid state batteries in 2017 seems to be edging closer to being a commercial reality, although not imminently: https://electrek.co/2020/04/23/work-on-goodenoughs-breakthrough-solid-state-ev-battery-moves-forward/.   

Don't tell Opti, his main argument against EV's is that the batteries are short lived.

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

An electric car is no more than a household appliance.

[Doctor Gollum]

An electric car is no more than a household appliance.

Proportionally, given the cost, that's akin to having an 100" plasma tv in a doublewide

[TheBoy]

All the "analysis" proving what is chemically impossible to somehow be true tends to be written by, or sponsored by, those that are themselves commercially or politically biased.

So they need to be read with care.

Tesla, for all their other faults, which are endless, do have class leading battery management.  But not orders of magnitude better than anyone else.  And there is the undeniable, proven, degradation in Lithium technologies that no matter how kind you are to them, causes a degradation in capacity and discharge capability.

And, its currently being discovered in the EV market what the chemists have been saying all along for a decade o rmore, leaving the car unused but fully charged is having an impact on the battery health (ie, in its capacity, and its discharge capability).


Electric traction is the future, providing all the right power in all the right places.  But not battery powered with current or next generation batteries.  So at absolute best, it will be at least 20 years before a non hybrid EV is remotely viable for most, no matter how much tax payer cash is thrown at those that can afford to buy them new.

[Viral_Jim]

An electric car is no more than a household appliance.

As time goes on I find it increasingly hard to buy the argument that EVs are soulless compared to ICE cars.

Living as we now do in an era where ICE cars have fake exhaust tips, fake useless vents, splitters, air dams etc and a soundtrack of another engine pumped through the car's speakers, it all feels a bit like manufacturers are trying too hard.

It's a bit like going to Ye Olde Rose and Crown(e) in a US city, they're playing on nostalgia or people's ideas of what cars should look like.

I may as well go and buy a CD of Golf GTI noises for my milkfloat.   

[Nick W]

An electric car is no more than a household appliance.

that's what most car owners think of any car. It's the 'enthusiasts' who are wrong.

[STEMO]

An electric car is no more than a household appliance.

that's what most car owners think of any car. It's the 'enthusiasts' who are wrong.

Correctamundo, Nick. Cars are tools for doing jobs for most people. Most enthusiasts cars spend their time parked in the garage/on the drive.

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

An electric car is no more than a household appliance.

that's what most car owners think of any car. It's the 'enthusiasts' who are wrong.

Correctamundo, Nick. Cars are tools for doing jobs for most people. Most enthusiasts cars spend their time parked in the garage/on the drive.

This is true of dreary derv.

12 cylinders, 6 carbs, and 8000 rpm powered by petrol has a soul.

[Viral_Jim]

12 cylinders, 6 carbs, and 8000 rpm powered by petrol has a soul.

Now that's a proper engine, but I fear you're showing your age m'lud? I can't think of anything produced in this century that would fit that description (kit cars or specials aside).

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

12 cylinders, 6 carbs, and 8000 rpm powered by petrol has a soul.

Now that's a proper engine, but I fear you're showing your age m'lud? I can't think of anything produced in this century that would fit that description (kit cars or specials aside).

I was thinking Lamborghini Miura and Ferrari Daytona.

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

A mate has a Testarossa.5 litres and 12 cylinders. It does sound lovely.

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

A mate has a Testarossa.5 litres and 12 cylinders. It does sound lovely.

I think this is a flat 12. a very W I D E car.

[STEMO]

An electric car is no more than a household appliance.

that's what most car owners think of any car. It's the 'enthusiasts' who are wrong.

Correctamundo, Nick. Cars are tools for doing jobs for most people. Most enthusiasts cars spend their time parked in the garage/on the drive.

This is true of dreary derv.

12 cylinders, 6 carbs, and 8000 rpm powered by petrol has a soul.

Something that had a soul wouldn't destroy the atmosphere.