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Author Topic: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold  (Read 1134 times)

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gazsomega

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Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« on: 03 April 2019, 08:29:27 »

Hi there got me a new Opel 2.5td lovely car owned many now this one wont start first thing when cold just cranks for a minute then will go like lack of fuel but then will start fine all day long on and off and will start again if I turn it straight off it's as the plugs are not working but I'm thinking fuel is leaking during night no leaks though any help guys much appreciated
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Omegatoy

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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #1 on: 03 April 2019, 17:30:04 »

air leak, my first port of call would be,usually where the fuel filter screws on,the piece(heater)  above it comes loose simple to fix 

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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #2 on: 03 April 2019, 18:09:16 »

LOL, I was gonna go for glow plugs.  But both worth checking.


I'm afraid Omegatoy and I are probably a little bit too familiar with the td lump, following all our sagas a decade or so ago
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gazsomega

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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #3 on: 04 April 2019, 09:00:37 »

Any guides on here about fuel filter glow plugs I dont want to sell car but cold start no chance
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #4 on: 04 April 2019, 17:41:21 »

Update getting 12v at each glow plug now wont start at all am I missing something
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Migv6

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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #5 on: 04 April 2019, 18:50:52 »

That just confirms your getting power to the plugs, but not the condition of them. You need to find out the resistance in ohms the plugs should have, then remove them and check the resistance.
If the plugs aren't that old I would be checking for unmetered air being sucked into the air intake or air being sucked into the fuel system.
I don't know the layout of the engine so cant advise on specifics.
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zirk

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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #6 on: 04 April 2019, 18:59:47 »

I would also go with Glow Plugs or GP Relay, you can easierly measure them, think there about 2 ohms each from memory, also the GP Relay pits up and arcs across the 2 contacts over time meaning that although you get 12v on the Plugs there is limited current being delivered.

Pull the Black Plug off the top of the Relay and measure current in series through each plug or you can just measure the impedance to each plug to Negative, one by one from the top of the plug via the 6 wires.

On a cold day you only need 2 or more plugs not to be working for it to be a right pig to start.
« Last Edit: 04 April 2019, 19:01:48 by zirk »
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #7 on: 04 April 2019, 23:00:03 »

Hi there got me a new Opel 2.5td lovely car owned many now this one wont start first thing when cold just cranks for a minute then will go like lack of fuel but then will start fine all day long on and off and will start again if I turn it straight off it's as the plugs are not working but I'm thinking fuel is leaking during night no leaks though any help guys much appreciated
the td i had for 10years had the glow plugs changed only once. if ever it never started straight away it was always the leak off pipes needed replacing. if i squeezed them where they went on to the nipple & my fingers had diesel on them i changed them. also i would check the blank on No 6. some are rubbish & swell . regards the leak-off pipes i always made mine a tad longer than necessary so i could just cut a couple of mill off the ends.
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #8 on: 05 April 2019, 00:01:11 »

Good point. I had an issue with my 190D where it wouldn't start no matter what I tried. Eventually I found a couple of cracked leak off pipes, replaced the lot for less than a fiver and the car ran perfectly once that was done.  :y
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #9 on: 05 April 2019, 17:36:15 »

Update getting 12v at each glow plug now wont start at all am I missing something
If you give it 3 or 4 lots of glowplugs before you even attempt to crank, each of at least 5s, does it start easier?  If so, change the glowplugs.
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #10 on: 05 April 2019, 18:25:49 »

glowplugs are reasonably easy to change,inlet off makes it easier, very surprised if it them at fault though,
does it have less than a quarter tank of diesel in it? very common cause of non start its pump in the tank failed or blocked
if it wont start at all now,grab a can of wd40,pull air filter pipe off and while someone is cranking it fire the wd into the pipe if it starts or fires its defo a fuel problem

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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #11 on: 06 April 2019, 16:57:29 »

 If you need a fuel filter, I have some genuine ones
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #12 on: 07 April 2019, 09:58:25 »

Checked the service history fuel filter was last changed May 2015 at 38,000 now on 40,000(mileage is correct not been used much last 2 years)Not sure if a genuine filter was used or not.Over half a tank full of fuel.Makes no difference how many times i let the glow plugs go off and on before trying to start will still not start.
However got it to start on Friday afternoon just as the battery was dying after cranking for about 20 seconds, although it had been almost firing up after about ten seconds but just seems to struggle to get over that last hurdle to kick in.
Going to try and check glow plug and relay ohms today and check for any fuel leaks.
Any other suggestions appreciated.
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gazsomega

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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #13 on: 07 April 2019, 12:18:06 »

Just a quick update before lunch.Checked all pipes from tank up to engine no obvious leaks.Checked in engine bay no leaks all pipes seem secure  and all nuts tight.Started again after about 20 seconds plenty of white smoke out the back.Drove 200 yards downtime road, stopped switched off waited about 10 mins and started with almost no turn of the key ! and no glow plug light showing before start.Will check the ohms this afternoon.
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #14 on: 08 April 2019, 10:39:21 »

 Sounds like fuel is running back to the tank after some time/overnight-fuel vacuum leak
Had this on my sprinter. Found to be a pin prick hole in the fuel filter
Start up almost immediately after a turn off the fuel does not get to run back to tank
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Kevin Wood

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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #15 on: 08 April 2019, 11:53:54 »

The plumes of white smoke might indicate a glow plug issue, though?

I.e. presence of fuel but at least a couple of pots not firing due to lack of preheating.
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gazsomega

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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #16 on: 08 April 2019, 14:46:09 »

Have parked it on a downhill slope to see if that had any bearing on fuel leaking back but still wouldn't start easy.Had problems trying to test the ohms reading couldn't get the readings to make any sense.(to me anyhow).
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #17 on: 08 April 2019, 19:47:40 »

OK, if that makes no difference, replace all the leak-off pipes as a matter of course.
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #18 on: 08 April 2019, 20:19:17 »

Have parked it on a downhill slope to see if that had any bearing on fuel leaking back but still wouldn't start easy.Had problems trying to test the ohms reading couldn't get the readings to make any sense.(to me anyhow).
Did you pull the Black Plug off the top like I said, otherwise your be measuring them all in Parallel, need to measure each one individually.
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #19 on: 09 April 2019, 12:09:22 »

 i used to purchase a 2mtr length of leak-off pipe from a firm called Pirtek  & cut to size. also range rover stockists were far cheaper than vauxhall & b.m.w used them for gaskets filter etc
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #20 on: 09 April 2019, 15:04:37 »

By the leak off pipe do you mean the canvas striped pipe running by the injectors along the engine?

I did take the black plug off to expose the six wires on the glow plug relay.Will have another look at that.
« Last Edit: 09 April 2019, 15:12:38 by gazsomega »
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #21 on: 09 April 2019, 15:40:10 »

By the leak off pipe do you mean the canvas striped pipe running by the injectors along the engine?

I did take the black plug off to expose the six wires on the glow plug relay.Will have another look at that.

Quick google search revealed what the leak off pipes are.Will replace them as a possible easy fix.
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #22 on: 09 April 2019, 15:51:59 »

By the leak off pipe do you mean the canvas striped pipe running by the injectors along the engine?

I did take the black plug off to expose the six wires on the glow plug relay.Will have another look at that.

Quick google search revealed what the leak off pipes are.Will replace them as a possible easy fix.
  the very last is a blank , very hard to see its tucked underneath the scuttle if my memory serves me right. another tip is put a rag or something between the starter motor & the engine when doing anything in that region as whatever is dropped usually end up there & lost   :y
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #23 on: 09 April 2019, 15:57:23 »

 Yea, the blank off on number 6 is a right pig to do. Always had at least half a dozen as always lost most replacing it
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #24 on: 14 April 2019, 13:16:55 »

Run some diagnostics on the car and it is showing fault code 49 glow device general error.Does this mean one or more of the glow plugs is not working ?
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #25 on: 14 April 2019, 16:37:05 »

Run some diagnostics on the car and it is showing fault code 49 glow device general error.Does this mean one or more of the glow plugs is not working ?
  i would get the complete set.  :y
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #26 on: 14 April 2019, 17:27:43 »

Would you suggest it's the glow plugs then
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #27 on: 14 April 2019, 19:43:36 »

Would you suggest it's the glow plugs then
  there are more knowledgeable guys than me , but i would think so. i learnt never to let the 2.5 td get low on fuel too. i believe there is a range rover workshop manual that covers the 2.5 straight six lump.
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #28 on: 14 April 2019, 19:53:15 »

Would you suggest it's the glow plugs then
  there are more knowledgeable guys than me , but i would think so. i learnt never to let the 2.5 td get low on fuel too. i believe there is a range rover workshop manual that covers the 2.5 straight six lump.
There are some PDF Manuals floating around on the Web, like you say the RR / Freelander was the same Lump just a bit more power.

I may have the PDF Manual kicking around somewhere on a Bak Up, fairly sure you could download from OOF Site somewhere, but that may have been on the older Site. Or maybe I just dreamt it.
« Last Edit: 14 April 2019, 19:57:03 by zirk »
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #29 on: 14 April 2019, 20:20:03 »

 TB should be able to answer that as he owned one :y
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #30 on: 15 April 2019, 17:31:42 »

Would you suggest it's the glow plugs then
  there are more knowledgeable guys than me , but i would think so. i learnt never to let the 2.5 td get low on fuel too. i believe there is a range rover workshop manual that covers the 2.5 straight six lump.
There are some PDF Manuals floating around on the Web, like you say the RR / Freelander was the same Lump just a bit more power.

I may have the PDF Manual kicking around somewhere on a Bak Up, fairly sure you could download from OOF Site somewhere, but that may have been on the older Site. Or maybe I just dreamt it.
Freelander never got that engine. P38 RR only, early L322 TDs got a variant more similar to the euro spec Y25DT

I do have the JLR PDF that covers it.
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #31 on: 15 April 2019, 19:49:22 »

Sounds like gloplugs to me from my TD experience. Certainly worth replacing them and the leak-off pipes before spending serious money on injectors/fuel pumps etc. :y
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #32 on: 16 April 2019, 20:12:40 »

Will be replacing the glow plugs end of May unable to do anything until then.Will update the post when done.Thanks for the help so far.Just hope those pesky glow plugs come out easy ::)
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #33 on: 17 April 2019, 19:50:57 »

Will be replacing the glow plugs end of May unable to do anything until then.Will update the post when done.Thanks for the help so far.Just hope those pesky glow plugs come out easy ::)

A simple job with the intake removed, not so simple without, although TB can do it in 20 minutes while drinking tea. ::) ::) ::)
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #34 on: 20 April 2019, 10:20:00 »

Will be replacing the glow plugs end of May unable to do anything until then.Will update the post when done.Thanks for the help so far.Just hope those pesky glow plugs come out easy ::)

A simple job with the intake removed, not so simple without, although TB can do it in 20 minutes while drinking tea. ::) ::) ::)
I've only done it once. In my lunch hour. It took 55 mins start to finish, allowing me just time to make some tea and take it back to my desk ;D

From memory, intake off, unscrew the electrical cable tray thing, then the glowplugs are easily accessible.

It would be *VERY* tricky to do without taking the intake off. Verging on the impossible I'd say.
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #35 on: 28 May 2019, 13:57:14 »

Glow plugs changed.
Took about 3 hours taking my time.
Now starts easy so they were the problem.
Thanks for the help and suggestions.
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Re: Opel 2.5 td hard start cold
« Reply #36 on: 28 May 2019, 22:26:58 »

 :y :y :y
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