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Author Topic: Iranian tensions  (Read 1730 times)

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Lizzie Zoom

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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #15 on: 11 July 2019, 15:12:14 »

Have found this online:

https://www.rivieramm.com/news-content-hub/news-content-hub/what-we-know-about-detained-iranian-tanker-grace-1-55529

Written in an "academic" online organisations publication, Riviera Open.

If it is true, there is a few interesting pointers to what led up to today's events over just the last few days. ;)
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Doctor Gollum

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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #16 on: 11 July 2019, 15:17:27 »

What little old insignificant Britain being asked to stop the tanker near Gib and look after this tanker in the Straits of Hormuz. Who would have thunk that especially after all the talk Britain down rhetoric from the Remainers that the UK is like a banana republic just above Haiti in the ranks.

AIUI the tanker is the BP owned "British Heritage", which is registered in the Isle Of Man so entitled to protection from the Royal Navy. That's one of the primary reasons the RN was formed - to protect the British merchant fleet. If the Yanks got intelligence that some Iranian up to no good was about to happen, and there was a RN presence in the area, then I'd bloody well hope they pass that info on to HMG and appropriate action is taken. The yanks don't have to tell us where the info came from, spy satellites, drones, ELINT etc, but we should be thankful they shared it with us.

If there had been no RN presence then it's up to the rules of engagement of whatever assets were in the area, and their chain of command, as to what happens next. Often that is nothing, as was the case with the two tankers a few weeks ago. The US obviously had 'eyes-on' but on that occasion chose not to respond with lethal force. If the tankers had been US flagged things would have been different.

If the merchant ship is sailing under a different flag, then it's up to that country to sort their mess out. If the ship had been Panamanian for instance, I doubt HMS Montrose would have intervened so swiftly - and it's anyones guess if the USN would have reacted.

Yes, and according to the BBC, it was an American reconnaissance aircraft who spotted the problem developing and communicated with the Royal Navy ship :y

This must now be one of the most watched areas of the World! :D ;)
After Love Island  ;D
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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #17 on: 11 July 2019, 15:18:07 »

What little old insignificant Britain being asked to stop the tanker near Gib and look after this tanker in the Straits of Hormuz. Who would have thunk that especially after all the talk Britain down rhetoric from the Remainers that the UK is like a banana republic just above Haiti in the ranks.

AIUI the tanker is the BP owned "British Heritage", which is registered in the Isle Of Man so entitled to protection from the Royal Navy. That's one of the primary reasons the RN was formed - to protect the British merchant fleet. If the Yanks got intelligence that some Iranian up to no good was about to happen, and there was a RN presence in the area, then I'd bloody well hope they pass that info on to HMG and appropriate action is taken. The yanks don't have to tell us where the info came from, spy satellites, drones, ELINT etc, but we should be thankful they shared it with us.

If there had been no RN presence then it's up to the rules of engagement of whatever assets were in the area, and their chain of command, as to what happens next. Often that is nothing, as was the case with the two tankers a few weeks ago. The US obviously had 'eyes-on' but on that occasion chose not to respond with lethal force. If the tankers had been US flagged things would have been different.

If the merchant ship is sailing under a different flag, then it's up to that country to sort their mess out. If the ship had been Panamanian for instance, I doubt HMS Montrose would have intervened so swiftly - and it's anyones guess if the USN would have reacted.

Yes, and according to the BBC, it was an American reconnaissance aircraft who spotted the problem developing and communicated with the Royal Navy ship :y

This must now be one of the most watched areas of the World! :D ;)
After Love Island  ;D
;D ;D
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Sir Tigger QC

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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #18 on: 17 July 2019, 09:24:37 »

Regarding the Iranian tanker that was seized by 'Royal Marines' off Gibraltar recently.  ???

If it was carrying oil from Iran to Syria as alleged, what was it doing going through the Straights of Gibraltar, as surely it should have passed through the Suez Canal?  :-\

Unless it was trying slip under the radar by taking the long way round the Cape?  :-\  ???

Anyone?  ???  It's niggling me!  ::)  ;D
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LC0112G

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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #19 on: 17 July 2019, 09:50:12 »

Regarding the Iranian tanker that was seized by 'Royal Marines' off Gibraltar recently.  ???

If it was carrying oil from Iran to Syria as alleged, what was it doing going through the Straights of Gibraltar, as surely it should have passed through the Suez Canal?  :-\

Unless it was trying slip under the radar by taking the long way round the Cape?  :-\  ???

Anyone?  ???  It's niggling me!  ::)  ;D

Various rumors, but the most likely to me seems to be this one :

https://en.radiofarda.com/a/why-iran-supertanker-took-a-much-longer-route-to-reach-syria-/30038586.html

Basically, the oil carried in the tanker is heavier than normal, which makes the tanker float too "deep" to pass through the Suez Canal. No doubt Barnacle Bill the ex-Sailors amongst us will be able to explain the correct technical words for "float" and too "deep" soon. Bit like pointy end and blunt end of a boat doesn't go down very well in the navy :-)
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Doctor Gollum

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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #20 on: 17 July 2019, 10:11:19 »

Regarding the Iranian tanker that was seized by 'Royal Marines' off Gibraltar recently.  ???

If it was carrying oil from Iran to Syria as alleged, what was it doing going through the Straights of Gibraltar, as surely it should have passed through the Suez Canal?  :-\

Unless it was trying slip under the radar by taking the long way round the Cape?  :-\  ???

Anyone?  ???  It's niggling me!  ::)  ;D
They share a perfectly good land border with Turkey ::)

That said, an Iranian oil tanker in the Med is always going to be on the suspicious side of curious ;D
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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #21 on: 17 July 2019, 10:15:02 »

Sounds plausible thanks.  :y

Interesting that the article notes that other European countries have been silent on the UK acting in accordance with EU sanctions. ::)


They share a perfectly good land border with Turkey ::)

That said, an Iranian oil tanker in the Med is always going to be on the suspicious side of curious ;D

I doubt that Turkey for all Erdogan's bluster would want to upset both the US and EU by assisting Iran to break sanctions.  ::)
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Doctor Gollum

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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #22 on: 17 July 2019, 10:25:17 »

I wonder if Cem has finished painting his car yet :-\

Be interested to hear his view on that...
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Varche

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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #23 on: 17 July 2019, 12:10:22 »

Yes, paging cem to the forum. His contributions are missed.
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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #24 on: 17 July 2019, 12:15:27 »

Couple of developments.

First is we are sending a third warship to the area. Part of a planned exercise but Iran wont see it as that.

More disturbing is the lack of news over the small tanker that went missing last night. Radio silence today. It was on Sky news around 11.30 . Might be summat or nowt.
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Doctor Gollum

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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #25 on: 17 July 2019, 13:02:19 »

Couple of developments.

First is we are sending a third warship to the area. Part of a planned exercise but Iran wont see it as that.

More disturbing is the lack of news over the small tanker that went missing last night. Radio silence today. It was on Sky news around 11.30 . Might be summat or nowt.
Try Aliaga ;)
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Lizzie Zoom

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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #26 on: 17 July 2019, 16:29:41 »

Regarding the Iranian tanker that was seized by 'Royal Marines' off Gibraltar recently.  ???

If it was carrying oil from Iran to Syria as alleged, what was it doing going through the Straights of Gibraltar, as surely it should have passed through the Suez Canal?  :-\

Unless it was trying slip under the radar by taking the long way round the Cape?  :-\  ???

Anyone?  ???  It's niggling me!  ::)  ;D

Various rumors, but the most likely to me seems to be this one :

https://en.radiofarda.com/a/why-iran-supertanker-took-a-much-longer-route-to-reach-syria-/30038586.html

Basically, the oil carried in the tanker is heavier than normal, which makes the tanker float too "deep" to pass through the Suez Canal. No doubt Barnacle Bill the ex-Sailors amongst us will be able to explain the correct technical words for "float" and too "deep" soon. Bit like pointy end and blunt end of a boat doesn't go down very well in the navy :-)

Yes, I looked into this just after all this became news, and have been watching it since,

In short the vessels that can transit though the Canal are classed as being Suezmax vessels which are withing the various restrictions on size, that is mainly in terms of beam (width) and draft (depth), which in the case of tankers is the crucial elements given their usually large proportions, along with the normal max load of 1 million barrels, which brings them under the draft limit.

Now in short, and is a complicated situation, the limit of Draft is 20.1 metres, or 66 feet.  The Grace 1 tanker that is subject to this situation would not normally be able to transit the Canal with a full load as she is not classed as a Suezmax vessel, as it is outside the normal restrictions, with 2.1 million barrels of light crude oil (equivalent to 2 million barrels of fuel oil) on board, giving her a draft of 22.5 metres.  Normally, apparently, this size of vessel unloads her cargo of oils, crude oil, light crude, or fuel oil, out at sea as she, a vessel of over 20 years old, is prohibited from many ports, so unloads to Suezmax tankers carrying 1 million barrels apiece to go through the canal. This Grace 1 has a long history of doing these STS, Ship To Ship transfers, and did off Iraq (2018) and UAE this year.  Grace 1 is very much a supertanker and was built for not going through the World's canals but going with their huge cargos the long way around the Cape of Good Hope, so are classed as Capsize vessels.

The whole situation is very suspicious, and the Captain has apparently been arrested along with the First Mate for reasons not given, but many "irregularities" in the loading of the fuel at various points, and then her travel up to the Straights of Gibraltar, have been noted.

Hope this clarifies ;)
« Last Edit: 17 July 2019, 16:31:20 by Lizzie Zoom »
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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #27 on: 17 July 2019, 17:46:10 »

Interesting info Lizzie.  :y

Has anyone ever wondered why the USA didnt ask Spain to intervene with this oil tanker?  My theory is that the EU /Spain would not have reacted quickly enough. Plus they are more on Irans side than the USA much to Israels disgust.
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STEMO

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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #28 on: 17 July 2019, 17:47:30 »

Interesting info Lizzie.  :y

Has anyone ever wondered why the USA didnt ask Spain to intervene with this oil tanker?  My theory is that the EU /Spain would not have reacted quickly enough. Plus they are more on Irans side than the USA much to Israels disgust.
You asked me what Israel had to do with anything. We may find out soon.
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Re: Iranian tensions
« Reply #29 on: 17 July 2019, 17:49:18 »

Interesting info Lizzie.  :y

Has anyone ever wondered why the USA didnt ask Spain to intervene with this oil tanker?  My theory is that the EU /Spain would not have reacted quickly enough. Plus they are more on Irans side than the USA much to Israels disgust.
You asked me what Israel had to do with anything. We may find out soon.
Correction: You asked me where Israel fitted in to all this. Same answer.
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