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Author Topic: Worn Front Tires inner Side  (Read 1576 times)

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polilara

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #15 on: 05 November 2019, 17:07:12 »

Sure, I go 8:00 tomorrow to local GM dealer and hear what happened, I guess that those two bolts in bottom part of McPherson struts were not tightened well last Dec when wheels were aligned last time after having renewed everything, what is the tightening torque needed here? New painted shocks against to the smooth metal surface of steering knuckle, then hard driving over the speed bumps, perhaps camber goes to negative direction??
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Eboy.com

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #16 on: 05 November 2019, 18:32:33 »

You will need to get the 4 wheel alignment done. Your tracking is out.
It needs more than 4 wheel alignment, as the camber is out. It needs a proper geometry check.
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polilara

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #17 on: 06 November 2019, 03:18:02 »

I'll report today...
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polilara

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #18 on: 06 November 2019, 16:18:44 »

So, unfortunately nothing to report yet, the support bar of my "new" trailer hitch (going below tank) was so big that it prevented one beam from wheel to wheel in rear. So they asked me to take the bar away or visit another garage close to them having different kind of device. I'll visit them soon.
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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #19 on: 07 November 2019, 17:38:02 »

So, unfortunately nothing to report yet, the support bar of my "new" trailer hitch (going below tank) was so big that it prevented one beam from wheel to wheel in rear. So they asked me to take the bar away or visit another garage close to them having different kind of device. I'll visit them soon.
Sounds like they can only do 4 wheel aligment. You need a full geometry check.
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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #20 on: 07 November 2019, 17:40:13 »

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polilara

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #21 on: 08 November 2019, 16:04:18 »

Nice device, yes full geometry will be checked in my next place. Remember back camber not adjustable wihout tricks. Do anybody know the tightening torque of those bottom McPherson bolts keeping camber in its position.
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Enceladus

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #22 on: 09 November 2019, 00:09:52 »

Nice device, yes full geometry will be checked in my next place. Remember back camber not adjustable wihout tricks. Do anybody know the tightening torque of those bottom McPherson bolts keeping camber in its position.

I think it's a 3 stage process.
Torque to 90Nm
Then angle tighten through 45.
Then angle tighten through a further 15.
Supposedly for new bolts and nuts.

I think the Sachs / Boge dampers (shocks) come with new bolts and nuts. As I recall the bolts and nuts are the flanged type. Else I imagine you need suitable heavy washers.

Normally they give you a before and after schematic printout of the resting camber, caster and toe-in for the front. Camber and toe-in and net thrust angle for the rear. Did you get one when you originally got the car aligned. Might help if you can compare with now to see what exactly went out of alignment.
« Last Edit: 09 November 2019, 00:26:55 by Enceladus »
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polilara

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #23 on: 10 November 2019, 11:10:36 »

Nice device, yes full geometry will be checked in my next place. Remember back camber not adjustable wihout tricks. Do anybody know the tightening torque of those bottom McPherson bolts keeping camber in its position.

I think it's a 3 stage process.
Torque to 90Nm
Then angle tighten through 45.
Then angle tighten through a further 15.

Supposedly for new bolts and nuts.

Normally they give you a before and after schematic printout of the resting camber, caster and toe-in for the front. Camber and toe-in and net thrust angle for the rear. Did you get one when you originally got the car aligned. Might help if you can compare with now to see what exactly went out of alignment.

I think the Sachs / Boge dampers (shocks) come with new bolts and nuts. As I recall the bolts and nuts are the flanged type. Else I imagine you need suitable heavy washers.

OK, pretty tight, I remember the guy just used two spanners when tightened, might bee too loose now. Not very clever construction I think. Bolts&nuts are new and original flanged ones. I got the paper but lost it. Values "after" I reported here, have to find them.
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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #24 on: 12 November 2019, 10:29:48 »

Camber -110'
Toe in 1mm/side total 2mm.

That was done last Dec,  I was standing there, let's see what we found, next week Thursday 21 at 8:00.
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polilara

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #25 on: 21 November 2019, 17:39:19 »

So measured front Camber left side -110' right -140', didn't change it, toe out something 4-5 mm (forgot the paper to the Garage but get it back soon) now toe in +1mm/side. Stopped four wheel alignment for today as the right rear track rod too badly corroded in thread, it did not move even heated red. Have to take it away and try to repair or change. Is it difficult to take away. Wheel end I know as I removed it several times when changed rear springs but how is the other end? When nut removed is it easy to remove the bolt? I mean does the rubber bushing have inner steel core corroded to bolt during last 20 years or is it just plastic?

Any recommendation for back toe in/out and Camber? And any legal tricks to change rear Camber? If I remember right it was about -2 in both sides (have to check the report when got it).
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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #26 on: 21 November 2019, 18:33:04 »

For the rear, the toe is far more important than the camber. So compromise on rear camber, but absolutely, utterly get the thrust angle to 0'00 +/- 0'00

Front camber, 1'40 is too far out IMHO, and will cause accelerated shoulder wear.
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Doctor Gollum

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #27 on: 21 November 2019, 18:37:33 »

Even with that front toe, it will still be pretty horrible to drive, and will kill the inner edge in no time.

Always best to use a true specialist and give then defined numbers... In the green simply isn't good enough. You aren't asking for 'ish' but rather spot on.

A Porsche specialist or similar would be a better bet than a GM dealer or tyre specialist, but depends on what you have available locally.
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Enceladus

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #28 on: 22 November 2019, 13:47:14 »

I'm struggling to understand what has happened.
A year ago you reported that the front camber had been set at -110' each side.
Now the right side has shifted to -140'.
A year ago you reported that the front toe-in had been set to -1mm each side. (Which member aaronjb calculated to be -08' or -016' total toe-in.)
Now both sides have shifted to massive toe-out, +4<>5mm which is +035'<>042' on 16" wheels.

So too much play somewhere or it's not being measured correctly.

Are the wheels actually supporting all the weight of the car when it's being measured?
Are the front seats loaded and the tank full?

Are the horizontal bushes in the lower suspension arms (wishbones) good?
Are the big bolts in the wishbones fully tightened?
And was that done with the weight of the car on the wheels?

Do you have standard or poly bushes. AIUI the poly ones allow you to run close to zero toe-in. The standard bushes will toe out at speed so can't be run near zero toe.
Is the ride height of the car OK? IE. no sag in the springs, or lowering springs fitted?
Perhaps one or more of the ball joints are too worn.
« Last Edit: 22 November 2019, 13:51:07 by Enceladus »
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Doctor Gollum

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Re: Worn Front Tires inner Side
« Reply #29 on: 22 November 2019, 15:25:39 »

Wrong re poly bush toe...

That is only the case with a modified front wishbone rear/vertical bush... The fitting of which has proven to induce catastrophic failure of the wishbone.

Front poly bushes have zero impact on geometry settings.
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