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[johnnydog]

The 'movement' in the trim is down to body flex, so any consequential wear will occur largely unnoticed...

The movement of this trim that causes the minor abrasion marks / contact marks is actually down to the slight upwards movement of the trim when the top seal on the door frame contacts it on shutting the door and therefore compressing the thin strip seal behind the trim against the door aperture, which in turn forms a tight seal for the water to run on the outer side to the A pillar. Checked my other Omegas and slight movement of this trim can be seen on shutting the front doors...
The 'newly formed' seal on mine seems to work a treat - the slight upwards movement compresses the new seal sufficiently to prevent water escaping before the end of the trim.
After the battering of heavy rain last night, I am glad to say, the drivers floor pan is bone dry  No trace of any water on the door seal rubber . I had put a rolled up piece of kitchen roll taped just below the top edge of the sill, rather than on the floor by the sill - this would have shown if rain water had come in over the sill edge from the door side or down the bulkhead, but success, it would seem - none had come in. The rain drives on the drivers side as well....
Incidentally, the lower windscreen moulding slotted into the newly attached retainer perfectly, assisted by the merest wipe of brake rubber grease to the tongue, and it sits snugly all the way along the windscreen and scuttle. Plus, the scuttle foam was nice and dry too after all the heavy rain last night.
Going to leave it until after the weekend just to be certain as more rain is forecast tonight and tomorrow, before putting the carpets / insulation back down on Monday.
But I'm quietly confident its cured....
Oh, how I hate water leaks....

[iansoutham]

Well done, had a look at the same on my one today. Washed the car yesterday and then run some water down the pillar area with some dye in it and did exactly as said.

Removed the trim today and the seal was collapsed and completely blocked up as well which inevitably causes the issue.

All cleaned and replaced using a thin double-sided closed foam tape so definitely sealed, but still removable should I need to.

[johnnydog]

Good to hear that you have also hopefully sourced the leak from the same fault with the upper door aperture trim / gutter trim 
I have not seen any mention of this source of a leak before on the forum before so hopefully it may help others in the future. Equally, this could also affect the passenger side as well, although wet carpets there are usually attributed (maybe incorrectly in some cases) to the scuttle drain......

[johnnydog]

Maybe I spoke too soon......after the weeks of dry weather, and finding one source of rainwater running from under the gutter trim moulding onto and round the edge of the inner edge of the door seal, onto the sill and under the carpet, and soaking the insulation, after the short spells of recent rain, all seemed well, until now.
I had raised the insulation about 4" off the floor in the drivers footwell with blocks so that any further rain ingress wouldn't soak the insulation all over again when it next rained heavily if not cured.
Being raised, the insulation had formed the shape of a small bowl; the lowest point being around the bonnet release. After the last heavy rain - full of water The insulation behind the pedals was bone dry so it was not coming from the bulkhead area or base of the windscreen.
I changed the door seal for a known good used one as a test having removed the A pillar cover and front part of the roof lining trim. There was a water stain on the lowest point of the A pillar cover. I stuck rolled up pieces of kitchen roll round the front edges of the door seal, in the A pillar holes touching the drain tubes, and around the edge of the windscreen. It then rained gently a couple of days ago, and it was all bone dry, including the kitchen roll.
After the heavy rain tonight....water was found on top of the air con trunking which would be under the drivers seat, and outer seat mounting rail.
Neighbours must think I'm cracked - I've been sitting in the back seat of my car at midnight, with a torch, in a rain storm..?
Good news - with the trim now removed, the leak was obvious. In heavy / prolonged rain, it was dripping off the lowest points of the headlining, above where the A pillar cover would sit. Hence the water stain on the cover, the collection of water in the lifted insulation under the bonnet release as the cover had been acting as a channel, and why the water was running down the inside of the lower section of the door seal 
I'm presuming now that it is from the sunroof, but would a blocked drain cause this? Would this cause water to get on the top side of the headlining to leak out near the A pillar? I can't see water leaking from the upper edge of the windscreen bonding would run in effect backwards to the headlining? It would run down surely? All the headlining round the sunroof appears dry to the touch with no outward water stains.  The tissue I stuffed in the holes in the A pillar around the drain tubes is dry,  indicating that the tubes are still attached and not leaking.
Is it worth dropping the head lining to see if the fault is obvious?
To check the drain holes, can I manually wind the sunroof back sufficiently, as I have separated the loom by the drivers kick panel, and removed the drivers seat, so connecting the battery to open the sunroof is a big no no.....
Sorry for the long winded post, but just to put all my findings out there for your thoughts about the source of the leak....please.....

[Doctor Gollum]

Headlining out and check the roof drains thoroughly 

[johnnydog]

Headlining out and check the roof drains thoroughly 

Can you clarify a little more please?
What would I be looking for in the sunroof drains that would be assisted by dropping the head lining? A leak around the drain outlet to rubber pipe possibly or poor pipe connection?
Is there any other seal or way that water can get to the top side of the headlining other than via the drains holes? ie if the drain holes are blocked, then where would the rain water go to considering there are no visible leaks inside by the sunroof itself or would it just basically overflow onto the headlining? The main drip is by the front grab handle mounting, and lesser drip by the top of the A pillar. But maybe the water is just running over the inside fabric and not showing itself....
As I asked previously, can the sunroof be wound back sufficiently manually to check all drain holes (as there is no power to it).
I appreciate the response of just 'drop the headlining and check roof drains thoroughly', but maybe a bit more clarification with your reasoning..??
TIA

[Doctor Gollum]

Forcing rods down the brittle plastic drain pipes can cause cracking and you can't check they're correctly fitted without seeing them.

Also, what you are trying to do without getting a clear look is akin to identifying the source of a roof leak from the room below the loft.

Also, removing the headlining will give you a chance to also dry that out.

That's three good reasons to remove it...

[Doctor Gollum]

Forcing rods down the brittle plastic drain pipes can cause cracking and you can't check they're correctly fitted without seeing them.

Also, what you are trying to do without getting a clear look is akin to identifying the source of a roof leak from the room below the loft.

Also, removing the headlining will give you a chance to also dry that out.

That's three good reasons to remove it...

To further answer your other questions,

Yes the roof can be operated manually, instructions in the owners manual. (No excuses as there's a free download to the entire thing here).

If the drains are blocked then yes the water would overflow into the headlining.

If the drains were previously blocked, then unsympathetic clearance can do alot of damage, all unseen.

You'll be surprised by how much moisture lives above the headlining with no sign.

That you can see water dripping into the cabin suggests more than condensation so warrants the couple of hours work to remove the headlining in order to investigate it properly.

Easier on an estate, but it should come out through the boot with some careful jiggling, and the guide is pretty comprehensive if i do say so myself and applies to all models. 

[johnnydog]

Thanks for the additional info. I don't know whether the drains have been cleared previously prior to me getting the car and damage caused, but this leak has been going on for some time by the look of it, and gone unnoticied apart from the serious condensation issues I used to get which may be I should have looked into previously
I have read the handbook instructions 're operating the sunroof manually - I was just presuming all the same movements of the panel can be carried out manually as electrically.
I have also read the headlining removal 'how to' which is very clear and specific ( ). I might just be tempted to replace the aerial base too whilst l'm in there.....

[Doctor Gollum]

 

Also affords the opportunity to relocate/fix the parking sensor speaker. Which is nice

[johnnydog]

Finally found the main culprit for the water leak into the drivers footwell. Dropped the complete headlining (removed from the car quite easily as the drivers seat was out) and there was a massive water stain on the top side with the culprit lying rusting away in two pieces....
The metal spring clip that retains the flange connector fom the sunroof outlet drain was broken and the connector was loose. It is kept water tight with an O ring under tension from the clip. The drain pipe is a push fit onto the flange connector. It looks like this has been loose for some considerable time and water was working its way down from the top of the headlining via the A pillar trim giving false indications of leaks elsewhere. The gutter trim did need resealing so it wasn't all in vain.
These clips (and the flange connector) now NLS, so a trip to the local scrappers today got a couple of clips and flanges (worth having a spare).
Check both drains were free using a flexible inner speedo cable from an old Triumph which is ideal as it just follows any curve in the pipe.
All back connected - just going to wait for a downpour to check the handywork before putting the headlining back.
A friggin' tiny clip causing all that....

[Doctor Gollum]

Job mostly jobbed

What about the rear drains?

[johnnydog]

They appear intact / secure, with no problems with the clips.  There was no evidence of any leak at the rear. Later today, I intend to remove the rear flange connectors, clean the outlets, O rings and flange, check the drains are clear and reassemble.
If all is good, happy days! 

[Doctor Gollum]

 

Alcantara headlining upgrade whilst you're at it? 

[johnnydog]

Probably pass on that one...!