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[Marks DTM Calib]

I think the conductors probably see this as a first step to their demise.
And I didn't realise that conductors were being kept on. Bad reporting somewhere along the line.

Unions in this modern era tend to exist by pedalling fear to assist in extraction of the monthly subs....hence the full facts are rarely shouted about.

[zirk]

God help us when we get driver-less cars then, I wonder whether Google staff will go strike. 

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

What pisses me off is that the railways are  private companies........and yet we, the taxpayer, still contribute billions towards their running costs. Why?

Private companies should stand on their own two feet. We were told that the railways would no longer be a drain on the public purse.

I can understand this sentiment, but I think that the UK taxpayer contribution needs to be considered in light of what the rail companies have to do. They have to provide a certain number of trains across the entire network, much of which is deperately un-profitable. The 14.25 from Little Dribbling to Upper Drakes Bottom, probably only caries 13 people every week, but the company is required to keep it running under the terms of its agreement. Similarly,  rail companies are required to limit price rises on key lines by a certain percentage each year. Clearly certain commuter lines could be made much more profitable for the rail companies were this restriction not in place.

I'm sure that, given total freedom over what trains to run, how often and what to charge for them, the rail companies could operate very happily with no taxpayer contribution. However its very unlikely we'd be as happy with the service as we are now (happy being a relative term ).

As an aside,  I found this article quite interesting and it debunks a number of preconceptions about how we are billed for railway usage: http://www.citymetric.com/transport/everything-you-know-about-british-train-fares-wrong-704.

Back on topic; I am not a huge fan of Unions, but my view is probably coloured by my years working in London and the rather tube drivers who strike any time the wind changes, but in this case I think they have a point. TBH, of the two people on the train, its the driver we should be focusing on getting rid of. All of the recent large rail disasters that spring to mind (German one last year and the Croydon tram crash) have had an element of human error or recklessness which a properly implemented computer system would have prevented from happening. The human in the back is the one we need to be keeping! This is the approach the DLR uses, where it is actually the driver that has been removed, and a "conductor" is often present during peak periods.

I very much doubt this, Jimmy.

Despite the taxpayer forever paying out the service is generally poor and expensive. In my view the private rail companies should either piss or get off the pot.

Clearly privatisation does not work when it comes to the railways..........unless of course you are the CEO or shareholder.

[STEMO]

I would close all the branch lines. You know, the ones that don't go to major towns and cities.

[Mister Rog]

I would close all the branch lines. You know, the ones that don't go to major towns and cities.

I think a certain Dr Beeching beat you to that one, quite some time ago.

[STEMO]

I would close all the branch lines. You know, the ones that don't go to major towns and cities.

I think a certain Dr Beeching beat you to that one, quite some time ago.

Wales. Who goes to Wales? No need for trains going there.

[Kevin Wood]

I very much doubt this, Jimmy.

Despite the taxpayer forever paying out the service is generally poor and expensive. In my view the private rail companies should either piss or get off the pot.

Clearly privatisation does not work when it comes to the railways..........unless of course you are the CEO or shareholder.

Why does a private company exist if not to please its' shareholders and CEO?

Okay, most won't continue to exist without also pleasing at least some customers, unless they are gifted a monopoly by the government. Oh, wait! 

[Mister Rog]

I would close all the branch lines. You know, the ones that don't go to major towns and cities.

I think a certain Dr Beeching beat you to that one, quite some time ago.

Wales. Who goes to Wales? No need for trains going there.

Absolutely right. Stay away, all of you 

However, on that note . . . .

Arriva has the rail franchise for most of Wales and some other parts of the UK. Arriva is owned by Deutsche Bahn, which is owned by the German Government.

It's just interesting that the UK de-nationalised, and a foreign government is able to come along provide the service profitably. I use the trains down here quite a lot, with no complaints. In fact if I go off to Swansea or Cardiff I prefer to take the train, means I can have a beer 

[STEMO]

Well, of course the Krauts run it profitably, they get millions from our government.

[Doctor Gollum]

I think the conductors probably see this as a first step to their demise.
And I didn't realise that conductors were being kept on. Bad reporting somewhere along the line.

BBC per chance

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

I have sympathy with the argument that the drivers shouldn't be responsible for closing the doors. Because it happens on the DLR doesn't make it right for everywhere else.
However - if this is the real issue, its non of the unions business. Its not the health and safety their members which is the issue. Its the health & safety of the passengers. That isn't the unions responsibility, its the responsibility of management.
The only action the unions need to take is to issue statements to the media stating that they strongly disagree with managements policy,which their members are compelled to work to, and will not be held responsible for it in the event of accidents etc.
Imo, as soon as they go an strike over this, the employer should sack every one of them.

[STEMO]

I have sympathy with the argument that the drivers shouldn't be responsible for closing the doors. Because it happens on the DLR doesn't make it right for everywhere else.
However - if this is the real issue, its non of the unions business. Its not the health and safety their members which is the issue. Its the health & safety of the passengers. That isn't the unions responsibility, its the responsibility of management.
The only action the unions need to take is to issue statements to the media stating that they strongly disagree with managements policy,which their members are compelled to work to, and will not be held responsible for it in the event of accidents etc.
Imo, as soon as they go an strike over this, the employer should sack every one of them.

That's more like it 

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

I thankyou. 

[Rods2]

At around 30p a mile if you are a sole traveller then I think it competes very well with being the only person in a car. Where it can't compete is when you have a car full. Although if you are travelling off-peak as a group you can save up to 50% of the fare by asking for a group reduction.

The current disputes have nothing what-so-ever to do with safety or working conditions and everything to do with Marxist union leaders trying to bring down the Tories politics. Personally in return I think the government should make strikes on such essential services illegal with disputes being forced to binding arbitration. Southern region was picked for this due to more direct government involvement in running this service than with other franchises.

[Marks DTM Calib]

At around 30p a mile if you are a sole traveller then I think it competes very well with being the only person in a car. Where it can't compete is when you have a car full. Although if you are travelling off-peak as a group you can save up to 50% of the fare by asking for a group reduction.

The current disputes have nothing what-so-ever to do with safety or working conditions and everything to do with Marxist union leaders trying to bring down the Tories politics. Personally in return I think the government should make strikes on such essential services illegal with disputes being forced to binding arbitration. Southern region was picked for this due to more direct government involvement in running this service than with other franchises.

Reality is that this between the train operating company (TOC) and the unions....

That said, the rail industry is a closed chop and over the years has happily shot themselves in the foot many times and may well do here.

There are many services on the main network where the doors are driver operated, as said the BedPan, a few Chiltern, some of the Southern, its not just the DLR Tonka specials.