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[05omegav6]

Possibly if the co pilot had collapsed/had a panic attack or forgotten to/mis set the autopilot before trying to free the door from the inside.

With the throttles and flying controls left alone, the aircraft will naturally descend due to gravitational pull...

[Kevin Wood]

With the throttles and flying controls left alone, the aircraft will naturally descend due to gravitational pull...

Most likely the aircraft would have been on autopilot anyway and would have continued the flight plan programmed into the FMC giving ample time to gain access to the cockpit by whatever means necessary. Uncontrolled dive due to a malfunction PLUS one pilot overcome WHILE the other pilot is out of the cockpit is just too many freak incidents at once, IMHO.

Suicidal pilot waits for his mate to go for a riddle before locking the door and flying into a mountain, on the other hand...

Word on PPRUNE yesterday was that the aircraft exceeded Vmo during the dive and, under all operating regimes other than being hand flown without automation, the automatic protection mechanisms would have kicked in and decelerated the aircraft.. yet the aircraft continued on the same heading it had been following in the cruise, so someone/thing was in (at least directional) control. Had a human of sound mind been at the controls, wouldn't he have just headed out to sea, or anywhere other than into a mountain range?

Not ruling out the airbus systems doing something daft, of course, they have a track record, but doing so at the exact instant that one pilot is out of the cockpit and the other keels over?

[Kevin Wood]

.. and, as I understand it, the way a cockpit door works is that, to deny entrance to the flight deck by one of the flight crew, someone has to consciously block their attempts to enter from inside. IIRC, there was an incident a while back when both pilots somehow managed to lock themselves out of the flight deck, prompting this measure.

[LC0112G]

On commercial aircraft, every flight safety critical component is at least dual redundant, and some are triple or even quad redundant. If any one channel of these redundant systems fails, then the other(s) can take over the safe operation of the aircraft. However, a failure of one flight safety critical system (almost) always results in an emergency being declared, and a swift landing at the nearest suitable airport.

IMO, pilots should be considered a flight safety critical component in the same way. There are two of them so that if one "fails", the other can take over the safe operation of the aircraft. However, currently one can leave the cockpit (for a waz or dump or whatever) at which point the dual redundancy has been compromised. There is no other system on the aircraft where you are allowed to compromise the dual redundant nature of a safety critical system in this way. 

The mechanicals of modern airliners are now so safe that such pilot "failures" are becoming statically important. Last years Ethiopian Airlines hijacking into Geneva was a pilot lockout event. MH447 might be too. Now this one possibly. There are others too if you look back - Silkair, EgyptAir etc.

The pilots in charge of hundreds of lives in the fragile aluminium tube behind them need to accept that they are a dual redundant component and behave accordingly. On short haul (sub 4hr) flights there should be no need to leave the cockpit. Go before you leave or you use a pee bag like fighter pilots have to. Longer than 4 hours and you need 3 type rated pilots in the cockpit.

[tunnie]

Sent chill down my spine hearing this on the radio this morning, so it looks like either:

1) Pilot suicide. Set to land and just sit back, waiting for the end.
2) Co-Pilot had some kind of medical issue. (but then as Kev mentions, surely entry could be gained?)

Need to find the second black box, to find out if controls/actions where being taken when the other pilot was locked out. Which would indicate Co-Pilot knew what he was doing.

[LC0112G]

Sent chill down my spine hearing this on the radio this morning, so it looks like either:

1) Pilot suicide. Set to land and just sit back, waiting for the end.
2) Co-Pilot had some kind of medical issue. (but then as Kev mentions, surely entry could be gained?)

Need to find the second black box, to find out if controls/actions where being taken when the other pilot was locked out. Which would indicate Co-Pilot knew what he was doing.

Except it's the Co-pilot that's reported to have been locked out.

[tunnie]

Ah, article I read/heard suggested Co-Pilot.

So still same then, just roles reversed.

Can access be gained to the cockpit, if the Pilot was unconscious? (i guess not, as this would be a method for would-be hijackers too)

[tunnie]

Latest update from SkyNews....

The co-pilot of a plane which crashed in the Alps activated the descent button and refused to open the cockpit door to the pilot.

http://news.sky.com/story/1453092/alps-co-pilot-crashed-deliberately-prosecutor

[LC0112G]

Can access be gained to the cockpit, if the Pilot was unconscious? (i guess not, as this would be a method for would-be hijackers too)

Yes and no.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixEHV7c3VXs

[tunnie]

Can access be gained to the cockpit, if the Pilot was unconscious? (i guess not, as this would be a method for would-be hijackers too)

Yes and no.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ixEHV7c3VXs

So after entering the code, the Co-Pilot could over-ride the request and keep it locked?

That system does not look to account for Pilots wanting to crash 

[Kevin Wood]

...

IMO, pilots should be considered a flight safety critical component in the same way. There are two of them so that if one "fails", the other can take over the safe operation of the aircraft. However, currently one can leave the cockpit (for a waz or dump or whatever) at which point the dual redundancy has been compromised. There is no other system on the aircraft where you are allowed to compromise the dual redundant nature of a safety critical system in this way. 

Yep, and for a system as "complex" as a pilot, dual redundancy is not really enough, given the subtle ways in which it could "fail". If it were an electronic system it would be triple redundant with voting... And if you are going to have voting, who gets to carry the big "voting stick"?

The pilots in charge of hundreds of lives in the fragile aluminium tube behind them need to accept that they are a dual redundant component and behave accordingly. On short haul (sub 4hr) flights there should be no need to leave the cockpit. Go before you leave or you use a pee bag like fighter pilots have to. Longer than 4 hours and you need 3 type rated pilots in the cockpit.

Yep, there are various arrangements for us glider pilots who often fly 5 hours + with no real prospect of leaving the flight deck! I think I'd be investing in some of this technology now if I were a CPL!

http://www.bgashop.co.uk/index.php?_a=viewCat&catId=5

Only dilemma is small, medium, large or "John Holmes".

[Varche]

The planes I have flown on (like Ryanair) have what looks like a keypad to gain entry. The steward "stands guard" while the pilot has a loo break. Is there a manual bolt on the cockpit side?

If it is a suicide , then it is wicked to kill 149 other innocents. Awful for the pilots family too.

[chrisgixer]

Press conference today

Pilot had been locked out of the flight deck. Co pilot then deliberately crashed the plane.

....going by voice recordings from the black box flight recorder.

[LC0112G]

So after entering the code, the Co-Pilot could over-ride the request and keep it locked?

That system does not look to account for Pilots wanting to crash 

Pilot wanting to crash is, unfortunately, not something that can be 100% protected against regardless of how many pilots are in the cockpit. If the pilot in control (PIC) shortly after take off, or shortly before landing violently pushes the stick forward 100 feet above the ground, then the other pilot is unlikely to be able to take effective action before the plane impacts the ground.

[Rods2]

Getting rid of the dual redundancy with pilot and co-pilot with either crew on a short haul flight being able to leave to go to the toilet, does rather compromise safety. I'm not sure how you fix: "I'm determined to commit suicide and for my 5 minutes of fame I'm taking all the crew and passengers with me". Which is truly frightening.

Long haul flights used to have 3 crew with pilot, co-pilot and flight engineer. However with the 'reduced workload'* with modern avionic systems the flight engineer is no more.

*In normal circumstances. when things go wrong then work load for the pilot and co-pilot, using these days tablet computers to look up in the flight manual on what to do, considerably raises both crew's workload while trying to fly a malfunctioning aircraft. Most crashes are a single problem compounded by mistakes by the pilot / co-pilot where stress / workload exceeds instant mental capacity.