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[tunnie]

Not mine, but next doors.

They asked me what i thought, so I had a nose under the bonnet. Its a 1.8 (i think) 70k miles, so ripe for HG failed i thought....

Checked the dipstick, no water on it. Oil seams fine.

Oil filler cap good, no mayo.... all dry.

Header tank was horrid, full of brown goo, mud like stuff. All over the drive too where they cleaned it out  

To me, it looked like a classic Omega V6 oil cooler problem, but on the 1.8 Rover not sure.... the above symptoms to me don't say HG. A sniff of the header tank and no petrol fumes, also no clouds of white smoke from the engine when started.

They say its fine for about 15 when driving, then starts to overheat.

Any ideas? - My thoughts are oil cooler, but no idea on these Rover engines!  :-/

[Andy B]

How old is it? I'd be surprised if an oil cooler was fitted. If the coolant system is as silted up as you suggest then it's no surprise it's getting hot. It sounds as though it requires a bloody good flushing out with the garden hose. Is/was there any anti-freeze in it? No corrosion inhibitor in the water won't help.

[Kevin Wood]

I've had a sludgey header tank before on a K series and sure enough the head gasket went. There were no signs of contamination of the oil and it ran fine.

Worth a flush and a new thermostat just in case though.

Kevin

[tunnie]

How old is it? I'd be surprised if an oil cooler was fitted. If the coolant system is as silted up as you suggest then it's no surprise it's getting hot. It sounds as though it requires a bloody good flushing out with the garden hose. Is/was there any anti-freeze in it? No corrosion inhibitor in the water won't help.

Sorry should have been more specific, its a 2001 Freelander. The guy who i was talking with also agreed they are rubbish cars but his friend bought it!

Its really odd, no steam, no water in oil, just a brown goo in the header tank. Looks like there is just water in it at the moment, it looked like a classic V6 oil cooler problem... so I did not want to say what was wrong.

Could lack of antifreeze cause that build up? surely not!

I take it to clear it out, you can put some bleach in the coolant for a few mins when running to break the oil up then drain it out?

[Martin_1962]

Change the title to Freelander as I think everyone here was thinking V8 or 4 cylinder Diesel

[tunnie]

Change the title to Freelander as I think everyone here was thinking V8 or 4 cylinder Diesel

good point just changed  

[Martin_1962]

You need to ask your cuddle friend - he is an expert at K Series

[theolodian]

You need to ask your cuddle friend - he is an expert at K Series

Doggie style?  

Sorry, but it had to be said.

[DaveL]

Sounds like a HG to me, have recently seen same with a '52' plate with 44K recorded. Stripped engine down twice, skimmed head, but still problems after 2k more miles. Head now past safe skimming level so new head required. Lots of expense but under Dealer warrenty still

Owner now looking for a poper 4x4.
 8-)
DaveL

[Auto Addict]

Sorry tunnie, going to move this to General Chat, as it's not an Omega.

[Kevin Wood]

Owner now looking for a poper 4x4.

 

These things have to be ragged so mercilessly to even keep up with the traffic with a 1.8K I think HGF is a very common issue.

You couldn't find a more inappropriate engine to put into a 4x4 IMO.

Kevin

[tunnie]

oops sorry yes AA should have put it in Gen chat... i forgot  

[Markie]

No oil cooler in these,

Its the Head gasket, its a standard 1,8 k series engine.

Easy job to do but like omega oil cooler its getting rid of the mayo that takes time  

[Admin]

Only Rover would put a 1.8 engine in something that size!  

Certainly sounds like the HG.... hang on, it's a Rover engine, of course it's the HG!  

[tunnie]

No oil cooler in these,

Its the Head gasket, its a standard 1,8 k series engine.

Easy job to do but like omega oil cooler its getting rid of the mayo that takes time  

But that's where i get confused (easily done  ) ... there is not a single trace of Mayo under the oil filler cap! And no trace of exhaust gasses in the coolant header tank  :-/

[Kevin Wood]

But that's where i get confused (easily done  Grin) ... there is not a single trace of Mayo under the oil filler cap! And no trace of exhaust gasses in the coolant header tank  undecided

The K is a wet liner engine, so the only failure mode for the head gasket if leaking from around the bores (where they all fail due to liner movement) is into the coolant jacket. There is no deck on the top of the block to allow the bores to blow into the oil return holes and it's very unlikely that the oil gallery feed into the head, or the oil return holes into the sump, would fail on their own.

I'd get a garage to look for evidence of exhaust fumes in the expansion tank if you're still sceptical.

These are exactly the same symptoms I had on my Rover 214 years ago. Didn't have a clue about cars then and, I'm ashamed to say, I assumed it just needed a flush, did so and then sold it to a mate of mine who had HGF a couple of weeks later! Luckily he wrote it off soon after that so he couldn't blame me for anything else.  

Kevin

[TheBoy]

Tunnie, HG.

Easy enough repair though.

[Markie]

Tunnie, HG.

Easy enough repair though.

£150 sees it done diy  

[tunnie]

Cheers guys!  

I'd love to get stuck into it, was so tempted to. Can't at the moment, due to project requirements.

However i will let next door know, and maybe in Easter get stuck in  

[TheBoy]

Cheers guys!  

I'd love to get stuck into it, was so tempted to. Can't at the moment, due to project requirements.

However i will let next door know, and maybe in Easter get stuck in  

If they have driven it much like that, they may have done more damage.

Also, leaving oil in the coolant pipes will cause them to fail.  I think they may be best off getting quote from garage

[Olympia5776]

O ring seals between the water heated manifold and the block. They are the achilles heel of the K series engine. They fail and because the cooling system has a very small amount of coolent the engine overheats and THEN blows the HG.
Get them done now before the engine self destructs.

Hope this is not too late .......

Don

[Taxi_Driver]

Only Rover would put a 1.8 engine in something that size!  

I agree....only Rover.....want an auto?.....sorry but you carnt have one....1.8...freelander...auto...is not a possible option!

[Kevin Wood]

Only Rover would put a 1.8 engine in something that size!

Obviously the first engine they found lying around when they penned the design

Kevin

[JamesV6CDX]

Cheers guys!  

I'd love to get stuck into it, was so tempted to. Can't at the moment, due to project requirements.

However i will let next door know, and maybe in Easter get stuck in  

Definately HG

These can be done in a day, can't they Jaime

[Marks DTM Calib]

On these engines, headgasket failure does not follow the usual signs.....and this is a classis K series failure......

Why the hell they pu a K series in a 4x4 with its incredibly poor low down torque is beyond me.....I guess they realy didn't have any other options.

[TheBoy]

On these engines, headgasket failure does not follow the usual signs.....and this is a classis K series failure......

Why the hell they pu a K series in a 4x4 with its incredibly poor low down torque is beyond me.....I guess they realy didn't have any other options.

Remember, Freelander's design was compromised by BMW's management...   ...and remember, BMW where desperate to differentiate the (then upcoming) more expensive X3...

[Kevin Wood]

BMW where desperate to differentiate the (then upcoming) more expensive X3.

They certainly managed that. Had my first drive in an X3 recently and was impressed (goes to wash mouth out with fairy liquid). It was a bit skittish about the straight ahead position but I soon realised that you didn't have to grit your teeth when approaching corners to quite the same degree as with other chelsea tractors. It was almost like driving a real car.  

Kevin

[ClarCE]

The reason I've got the 2.5 V6 freelander is because of this.

check this out: http://forums.preloved.co.uk/fuseaction-forums.showdiscussion/maxrows-20/startrow-1/thread_id-10411/93e028c3.html - pretty much everyone a 1.8 k-series hg failure.

This car is THE worst thing I've ever seen, land rover should be shot, burnt, then shot again for building it, and BMW should be strung up along with them for screwing so many people over.

I had overheating problems on the 2.5, of course I instantly thought HG, but it wasn't - thermostat knackered itself, warped the inlet manifold which you can only buy from LR for £450!! Idiots.

[TheBoy]

The reason I've got the 2.5 V6 freelander is because of this.

check this out: http://forums.preloved.co.uk/fuseaction-forums.showdiscussion/maxrows-20/startrow-1/thread_id-10411/93e028c3.html - pretty much everyone a 1.8 k-series hg failure.

This car is THE worst thing I've ever seen, land rover should be shot, burnt, then shot again for building it, and BMW should be strung up along with them for screwing so many people over.

I had overheating problems on the 2.5, of course I instantly thought HG, but it wasn't - thermostat knackered itself, warped the inlet manifold which you can only buy from LR for £450!! Idiots.

Doesn't the V6 Freelander have the KV6 engine. If so, yet another quality solution from Powertrain Ltd. Not.

The whole K thing (inc KV6, and engine hastily developed as they obviously couldn't keep using Honda once BMW bought Rover) needed further development for reliability, and again, BMW management would not allow this.

[Jim Bob2]

My fathers Freelander 1.8 had the same problems about a year ago. He had a recon engine put in at a cost of about £1500 and thats now done exactly the same, lots of steam ect.... Lucky it was just in warranty. Hes had another recon engine put in and is now going to sell it.
 I told him not to buy it in the 1st place. Absolute junk.

[Martin_1962]

Well you should get the TD5 or the older 2.5 or 2.25 engines, or of course the V8

[ClarCE]

The reason I've got the 2.5 V6 freelander is because of this.

check this out: http://forums.preloved.co.uk/fuseaction-forums.showdiscussion/maxrows-20/startrow-1/thread_id-10411/93e028c3.html - pretty much everyone a 1.8 k-series hg failure.

This car is THE worst thing I've ever seen, land rover should be shot, burnt, then shot again for building it, and BMW should be strung up along with them for screwing so many people over.

I had overheating problems on the 2.5, of course I instantly thought HG, but it wasn't - thermostat knackered itself, warped the inlet manifold which you can only buy from LR for £450!! Idiots.

Doesn't the V6 Freelander have the KV6 engine. If so, yet another quality solution from Powertrain Ltd. Not.

The whole K thing (inc KV6, and engine hastily developed as they obviously couldn't keep using Honda once BMW bought Rover) needed further development for reliability, and again, BMW management would not allow this.

Don't get me wrong TB, the things on ebay at the mo - KV6 doesn't have HG probs (or at least not a significant amount) - I agree totally - shocking peice of engineering as just about everything else goes wrong instead  

[TheBoy]

The reason I've got the 2.5 V6 freelander is because of this.

check this out: http://forums.preloved.co.uk/fuseaction-forums.showdiscussion/maxrows-20/startrow-1/thread_id-10411/93e028c3.html - pretty much everyone a 1.8 k-series hg failure.

This car is THE worst thing I've ever seen, land rover should be shot, burnt, then shot again for building it, and BMW should be strung up along with them for screwing so many people over.

I had overheating problems on the 2.5, of course I instantly thought HG, but it wasn't - thermostat knackered itself, warped the inlet manifold which you can only buy from LR for £450!! Idiots.

Doesn't the V6 Freelander have the KV6 engine. If so, yet another quality solution from Powertrain Ltd. Not.

The whole K thing (inc KV6, and engine hastily developed as they obviously couldn't keep using Honda once BMW bought Rover) needed further development for reliability, and again, BMW management would not allow this.

Don't get me wrong TB, the things on ebay at the mo - KV6 doesn't have HG probs (or at least not a significant amount) - I agree totally - shocking peice of engineering as just about everything else goes wrong instead  

I believe me, the KV6 has HG problems.  It is likely that at least one of the HG on the KV6 will go before 40k...

[Taxi_Driver]

Well you should get the TD5 or the older 2.5 or 2.25 engines, or of course the V8

I assume you mean the disco??

My brother loves em.....dunno why tho.....hes on his fourth now....

1st one V8 auto.....spent more time on a back of a low loader than actually being driven....
2nd one 2.5TD auto......autobox failed....turbo failed
3rd one 2.5TD auto......autobox failed....new engine
4th one 2.5TD auto.....autobox failed....hes still got this one

Spotting a trend here?? ....He buys a year to 18month old ones from a landrover dealer....so they shouldnt be wrecks when he buys them!

One of my neighbours loves landies.....and has had several for years....no probs with them....but his missus wanted a bit more comfort.....so he bought a disco 2.5TD .....had for less than a year.....engine went pop! ....He scrapped it....nows he got a freelander TD......bet that doesnt last long either!!!

[TheBoy]

Well you should get the TD5 or the older 2.5 or 2.25 engines, or of course the V8

I assume you mean the disco??

My brother loves em.....dunno why tho.....hes on his fourth now....

1st one V8 auto.....spent more time on a back of a low loader than actually being driven....
2nd one 2.5TD auto......autobox failed....turbo failed
3rd one 2.5TD auto......autobox failed....new engine
4th one 2.5TD auto.....autobox failed....hes still got this one

Spotting a trend here?? ....He buys a year to 18month old ones from a landrover dealer....so they shouldnt be wrecks when he buys them!

One of my neighbours loves landies.....and has had several for years....no probs with them....but his missus wanted a bit more comfort.....so he bought a disco 2.5TD .....had for less than a year.....engine went pop! ....He scrapped it....nows he got a freelander TD......bet that doesnt last long either!!!

Discos used to use same 2.5TD as Omegas - the hugely overated BMW unit.  Again, another BMW decision....

[Martin_1962]

Oh dear

Proper Land Rover - is a good car very basic but will last forever

Discovery is a Range Rover with a cheap suit.

Gear box is GM - same range as ours So should be good no sports mode though and even the 4.0 is not overly quick.

The first ones used a DI 5 bearing version of their 2.5 TD - also got fitted to 90 & 110 eventually, petrol options were 3.5 V8 and 2.0 M16, my cousin has the TD.

The facelifted Discovery has 4.0 V8 or the TD5 Storm DI 5 cylinder diesel, I  know of no problems with it.

The Ford Discovery has the Ford/Peugeot 2.7 V6 don't know what the petrol is.

The BMW 2.5TD was only fitted to the Range Rover - replacing the VM tractor engine.

Yes I do fancy a 109 or a 88 or even an early 90 or 110 HCPU (petrol) as a project.

My cousin with the Discovery 1 TD also has a S2 88 under restoration fitted with a Montego 2.0 TD and Salisbury axles, he also has a 2.25 109 as a part donor I am goading him to restore.

Last holiday we gave each other rides, me up the road at high speeds in total comfort, him along an impassible track and the through a field* on a short cut.

* Him and his dad are the employed farmers for this farm my uncle basically runs it.

My cousin and his wife are currently struggling to find somewhere to live as they live in a very high cost holiday/posh/retirement area, and outsiders are getting on the councils and stopping new build for young locals

As to Freelanders - would an X20XEV fit the gearbox?

[Mole]

If you end up doing the head gasket job yourself Tunnie then make sure you get the superceded thermostat housing. My brother has a 1.8 freelander and got a new engine foc from Rover when the head gasket went at 4 years old. The thermostat housing was relocated and it has been fine ever since(about another 4 years). Apparently that stops them overheating. The Lotus Elise which uses the same engine doesn't go through head gaskets like they are going out of fashion because it is properly cooled.

[ClarCE]

The reason I've got the 2.5 V6 freelander is because of this.

check this out: http://forums.preloved.co.uk/fuseaction-forums.showdiscussion/maxrows-20/startrow-1/thread_id-10411/93e028c3.html - pretty much everyone a 1.8 k-series hg failure.

This car is THE worst thing I've ever seen, land rover should be shot, burnt, then shot again for building it, and BMW should be strung up along with them for screwing so many people over.

I had overheating problems on the 2.5, of course I instantly thought HG, but it wasn't - thermostat knackered itself, warped the inlet manifold which you can only buy from LR for £450!! Idiots.

Doesn't the V6 Freelander have the KV6 engine. If so, yet another quality solution from Powertrain Ltd. Not.

The whole K thing (inc KV6, and engine hastily developed as they obviously couldn't keep using Honda once BMW bought Rover) needed further development for reliability, and again, BMW management would not allow this.

Don't get me wrong TB, the things on ebay at the mo - KV6 doesn't have HG probs (or at least not a significant amount) - I agree totally - shocking peice of engineering as just about everything else goes wrong instead  

I believe me, the KV6 has HG problems.  It is likely that at least one of the HG on the KV6 will go before 40k...

I must have just been lucky then - perhaps you don't hear of it so much as nowhere near as many were sold as the 1.8's...