Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: Andy B on 26 January 2020, 21:12:56
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https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-51236375
It doesn't take a genius to realise they're a stupid idea
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The minister who first signed them off reckons he was kidded. Totally against them now.
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I often question whether the highways ministers/road layout approvers actually drive a car themselves.
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Whoever thought of the idea should be forced to continually run across the M6 during rush hour. Its obvious to anyone with two brain cells to rub together that its madness.
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..... and I'd also like to give special thanks to those that coned off lanes 1 & 2 of the M61 ... Highways Agency??? this morning across jct 6 (by the Reebok - as was) with no warning at all. At 0615hrs this morning I was driving through Chorley & Leyland trying to get to Wigan before 0650hrs. At one point as I joined the M6 my sat nav told me I'd be on the motorway for 7 miles .... I'd been driving for bl**dy miles since I'd not been able to leave the M61 and I was within 7 miles then
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Listening to the audio of the bloke calling in his breakdown is chilling :o
Any govt minister or adviser planning how they make the smart roads safer, obviously now need to spend some time in a live lane @ night with the motor turned off :)
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Bandwagon anyone? ::)
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Bandwagon anyone? ::)
Not at all. Cars are inherently more reliable these days but there are still breakdowns and you need some where safe to stop.
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Bandwagon anyone? ::)
Not at all. Cars are inherently more reliable these days but there are still breakdowns and you need some where safe to stop.
That wasn't where I was going... Smart motorways have always been a bad idea, anyone except the non driving graduates who designed them have always said as much.
It was aimed at the previous post... Always pops up with a video or outrage whenever some everyday thing pops up in front of him and could probably do with learning to read the road ahead a bit better, much like the lorry driver in the clip... :-X
Two things surprise me about the article... Firstly that ONLY 35 people were killed and secondly that there were 1472 ish near misses... I would have expected both to be much, much higher, and can only suggest that the near misses are reported ones and probably only reflect about 1% of the true number. If anything, the saddest thing is that this point wasn't reported as it might educate a few more people (or at least encourage them to read the highway code).
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Bandwagon anyone? ::)
Not at all. Cars are inherently more reliable these days but there are still breakdowns and you need some where safe to stop.
That wasn't where I was going... ....
Sorry! ;)
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The bigger question has to be, is it the motorways that are dumb or the users.............
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Both in many cases.
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Indeed, you could have four fenced in tracks with a twenty foot pole connecting each vehicle and someone WILL screw it all up ;D
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The bigger question has to be, is it the motorways that are dumb or the users.............
Agreed ..... but better to just have dumb users rather than both user & motorway! :y
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When they were first announced, I had a discussion about the idea, which I immediately thought was "foolish", with a senior police traffic officer at Kent Police HQ.
He explained he had "very real concerns" about this, and envisaged all types of "challenges" for all the emergency services when (trying) attending any major, or even minor, incident. My concerns were that without the safe refuge of a hard shoulder there would be trouble. He totally agreed, but said, as he could only do as a serving officer, "We shall see".
How right we have both proved to be, but anyone with the considerable driving experience we both have could only come to that conclusion.
No, it is, once again, all about the money to be saved and the reduction in the "hassle" of going through planning procedures / public enquiries to extend our motorways to cope with the extra volume of traffic. Your, and my life, does not count in that equation!! >:( >:(
Hopefully this dangerous nonsense will be kicked into touch.
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Smart motorways are for the idiots who think that heavy traffic on motorways is a problem, and not a solution to other, worse problems.
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Maybe they could have better enforced the original rules of the motorway ie keep left. The number of times you see ****heads that sit for mile after mile in the middle lane or even lane 3 of 4. But there are no plod on the roads to police them
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Indeed, you could have four fenced in tracks with a twenty foot pole connecting each vehicle and someone WILL screw it all up ;D
I think we call those railways? :D
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It will be fine when we all use autonomous vehicles that utilise block movement. ::)
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Maybe they could have better enforced the original rules of the motorway ie keep left. The number of times you see ****heads that sit for mile after mile in the middle lane or even lane 3 of 4. But there are no plod on the roads to police them
keep left dates back to two-lane motorways and inadequately performing vehicles, so is decades out of date.
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Average is 17 minutes from stopping on a smart motorway, to getting hit :o..
Worse stretch I use is the Luton --Milton Keynes, regularly see people's carrying on along the hard shoulder, then realise, whoops, and pull straight back onto the carriageway..
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Maybe they could have better enforced the original rules of the motorway ie keep left. The number of times you see ****heads that sit for mile after mile in the middle lane or even lane 3 of 4. But there are no plod on the roads to police them
keep left dates back to two-lane motorways and inadequately performing vehicles, so is decades out of date.
keep left still applies ..... overtake & move back left ie don't sit in the middle lane or outside lane for miles if you're able to move left
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http://www.trucknetuk.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=163737
Pops up on a regular basis
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Maybe they could have better enforced the original rules of the motorway ie keep left. The number of times you see ****heads that sit for mile after mile in the middle lane or even lane 3 of 4. But there are no plod on the roads to police them
keep left dates back to two-lane motorways and inadequately performing vehicles, so is decades out of date.
keep left still applies ..... overtake & move back left ie don't sit in the middle lane or outside lane for miles if you're able to move left
I know it still applies. My point is that it's no longer necessary, or even worthwhile. The 70mph speed limit is another; now that we're all used to variable limits(the only good part of smart motorways), raising the maximum to a conditional 90mph maximum is overdue.
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Wasn't the minister who approved the smart motorways the same one that said, 'If you breakdown, just drive to the next junction'?
Without a single sign of a smirk on his face.
To me, these smart motorways are a cash cow. I use the same junctions 5 days a week, during rush hour, the speed limit is always 60. This doesn't matter what else is happening, like school holidays, where I can travel at 70mph in lane 2. They are always on. The only reason is to make money from the cameras. What it does mean, is that people now ignore the variable speed limit, do what speed they like and then anchor up for the camera , causing tailbacks and accidents before speeding back up.
Apparently, this is the future and a lot safer :-X
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Maybe they could have better enforced the original rules of the motorway ie keep left. The number of times you see ****heads that sit for mile after mile in the middle lane or even lane 3 of 4. But there are no plod on the roads to police them
keep left dates back to two-lane motorways and inadequately performing vehicles, so is decades out of date.
keep left still applies ..... overtake & move back left ie don't sit in the middle lane or outside lane for miles if you're able to move left
I know it still applies. My point is that it's no longer necessary, or even worthwhile. The 70mph speed limit is another; now that we're all used to variable limits(the only good part of smart motorways), raising the maximum to a conditional 90mph maximum is overdue.
I kind of agree that its no longer necessary, as in we should allow undertaking as they do in the U.S. where it works fine. The problem is that a lot of drivers in this country aren't safe with the current system and could easily be lethal if it was changed.
As things stand the keep left rule does still apply, and those who wilfully ignore it should be shot in front of their families imo.
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The problem is that a lot of drivers in this country aren't safe with the current system and could easily be lethal if it was changed.
People don't look when on a normal road. Just last night as I approached traffic lights, 2 lanes, I'm in the left lane and the taxi driver on my right decided at the last minute he also wanted the left lane .... both lanes are for going forward .... a blast on the horn & he reconsidered ::)
As things stand the keep left rule does still apply, and those who wilfully ignore it should be shot in front of their families imo.
:y :y
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Maybe they could have better enforced the original rules of the motorway ie keep left. The number of times you see ****heads that sit for mile after mile in the middle lane or even lane 3 of 4. But there are no plod on the roads to police them
keep left dates back to two-lane motorways and inadequately performing vehicles, so is decades out of date.
keep left still applies ..... overtake & move back left ie don't sit in the middle lane or outside lane for miles if you're able to move left
I know it still applies. My point is that it's no longer necessary, or even worthwhile. The 70mph speed limit is another; now that we're all used to variable limits(the only good part of smart motorways), raising the maximum to a conditional 90mph maximum is overdue.
I kind of agree that its no longer necessary, as in we should allow undertaking as they do in the U.S. where it works fine. The problem is that a lot of drivers in this country aren't safe with the current system and could easily be lethal if it was changed.
As things stand the keep left rule does still apply, and those who wilfully ignore it should be shot in front of their families imo.
Undertaking is not allowed? :o :-X
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Undertaking is not allowed? :o :-X
There is no specific offence for undertaking. However, there is speeding and there is dangerous driving/driving without due care if you are weaving in and out.
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Undertaking is not allowed? :o :-X
There is no specific offence for undertaking. However, there is speeding and there is dangerous driving/driving without due care if you are weaving in and out.
Not to mention causing an obstruction by failing to keep left when permitted ;)
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We really do need to ban lorries overtaking at certain hours of the day, on my daily M1 trip, every 4 section part has three lanes of lorries
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Yep, this drives me nuts. A truck doing 55.7mph taking several miles to overtake another one doing 55.6mph, with a long queue of angry motorists behind. Cameron said he was going to ban it, but the useless tosser didn't bother.
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We really do need to ban lorries overtaking at certain hours of the day, on my daily M1 trip, every 4 section part has three lanes of lorries
This. To me they need to stop lorries from going into lane 3 and all commercial vehicles from going into lane 4. No one wants to see a 'who has the fastest lorry' at rush hour when we are talking a difference of less than 2mph, this pushes all the other vehicles into lane 4, of which most seem to stay there for the entirety of their journey. Banning commercial vehicles in lane 4 is because a lot of commercial vehicles also have a speed limiter which makes it a dangerous place to be for them. It would also help penalise those who have gone for a van/pickup truck as the company car tax rules cost them less when it's classed as a 'commercial vehicle'.
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Panorama, 8:30, tonight.
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We really do need to ban lorries overtaking at certain hours of the day, on my daily M1 trip, every 4 section part has three lanes of lorries
biggriffin to General Car Chat please. :)
I don't mind being stuck behind lorries, they have a job to do and they improve my mpg no end. I even encourage it by flashing them out for the overtake. ;D I'm always in good time, never late, so I see them as a speed limiter for me to keep my speed down, and my fines. ::) The little left, right, left, right on the indicators shows their appreciation and I've done my good deed for the day. I find it rewarding knowing that I've helped them on their way. :) And when clear to do so, I can whizz back up to the 69.99mph that I had been doing before that bloody great big truck got in my way. ;)
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If people actually drove at the limit, rather than what they think is the limit (sat nav vs speedo), exercised some form of lane discipline and accepted that other people actually used the road (at the same time, God forbid ;D) then travelling might actually become a less stressful.
This applies to everyone no matter how important they think they are... You, me, Mark in his fancy company hack or even BG in his company hack.
Then perhaps we can have a sensible conversation about changing the limits for cars and lorries.
Banning goods vehicles will only serve to make goods deliveries more expensive, and will lead to congestion at other times of day.
Besides on Monday the whole country will cease to be important, so there should be a lot less traffic ::)
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The world is going to fall off its axis at 11pm Friday, so nothing at all will matter after that.
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We really do need to ban lorries overtaking at certain hours of the day, on my daily M1 trip, every 4 section part has three lanes of lorries
Likewise the M62 up hill towards the other side of the Pennines! ;)
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Breaking news...
The single motorway between Liverpool and Leeds happens to be busy because lots of people use it... ::)
https://images.app.goo.gl/VehbeFpfL5E4bt6L8
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Besides on Monday the whole country will cease to be important, so there should be a lot less traffic ::)
Monday? ???
You think there'll be another Monday? :o
Who knew?! ::) ;D
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Breaking news...
The single motorway between Liverpool and Leeds happens to be busy because lots of people use it... ::)
https://images.app.goo.gl/VehbeFpfL5E4bt6L8
The point being made was that 3 of the 4 lanes had HGVs doing somewhere between 55.9mph & 56.1mph all the way up and nobody has the b4lls to stand up to the hauliers and restrict them to just 2 lanes or even have parts of the motorway where they're not allowed to over take.
Cue hauliers cries of everything in shops being carried by HGVs etc etc ...... ::)
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Breaking news...
The single motorway between Liverpool and Leeds happens to be busy because lots of people use it... ::)
https://images.app.goo.gl/VehbeFpfL5E4bt6L8
The point being made was that 3 of the 4 lanes had HGVs doing somewhere between 55.9mph & 56.1mph all the way up and nobody has the b4lls to stand up to the hauliers and restrict them to just 2 lanes or even have parts of the motorway where they're not allowed to over take.
Cue hauliers cries of everything in shops being carried by HGVs etc etc ...... ::)
This is common in Germany and works well. :y
Although I once got stuck behind an elderly bull nosed Merc truck, doing about 30 mph, that was belching out thick black smoke and was wearing what appeared to be Iranian plates.
When I finally got past there were 6 or 7 blokes of Middle Eastern appearance squeezed in the cab all staring out at me! I was probably the first RHD truck they had seen. ;D
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The French motorway from Bordeaux to the Spanish border had no overtaking for commercial vehicles . Worked quite well compared to the old days of lorries taking twenty miles to get by another one.
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For part of its length the M18 is two lane and trucks are forever taking up both lanes as one inches past the other for mile after mile.
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We really do need to ban lorries overtaking at certain hours of the day, on my daily M1 trip, every 4 section part has three lanes of lorries
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Ban oppsing Audi,BMW, and other tests from last minute for com lane changes, dumb opps girlys doing facecloth while driving, Stoopid engineers doing conference calls whilst supping a Costa packet, Shall I stop ranting >:(
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For part of its length the M18 is two lane and trucks are forever taking up both lanes as one inches past the other for mile after mile.
I remember when most of the M5 was like that .... :y
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Bandwagon anyone? ::)
Not at all. Cars are inherently more reliable these days but there are still breakdowns and you need some where safe to stop.
That wasn't where I was going... Smart motorways have always been a bad idea, anyone except the non driving graduates who designed them have always said as much.
It was aimed at the previous post... Always pops up with a video or outrage whenever some everyday thing pops up in front of him and could probably do with learning to read the road ahead a bit better, much like the lorry driver in the clip... :-X
Two things surprise me about the article... Firstly that ONLY 35 people were killed and secondly that there were 1472 ish near misses... I would have expected both to be much, much higher, and can only suggest that the near misses are reported ones and probably only reflect about 1% of the true number. If anything, the saddest thing is that this point wasn't reported as it might educate a few more people (or at least encourage them to read the highway code).
Oh dear ,it looks as if I`m being stalked by Doctor Gollum. ;D ;D ;D
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Bandwagon anyone? ::)
Not at all. Cars are inherently more reliable these days but there are still breakdowns and you need some where safe to stop.
That wasn't where I was going... Smart motorways have always been a bad idea, anyone except the non driving graduates who designed them have always said as much.
It was aimed at the previous post... Always pops up with a video or outrage whenever some everyday thing pops up in front of him and could probably do with learning to read the road ahead a bit better, much like the lorry driver in the clip... :-X
Two things surprise me about the article... Firstly that ONLY 35 people were killed and secondly that there were 1472 ish near misses... I would have expected both to be much, much higher, and can only suggest that the near misses are reported ones and probably only reflect about 1% of the true number. If anything, the saddest thing is that this point wasn't reported as it might educate a few more people (or at least encourage them to read the highway code).
Oh dear ,it looks as if I`m being stalked by Doctor Gollum. ;D ;D ;D
Come out, come out wherever you are............. he`s gotta be around here somewhere the stench is gettin stronger ;D ;D ;D
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For part of its length the M18 is two lane and trucks are forever taking up both lanes as one inches past the other for mile after mile.
I remember when most of the M5 was like that .... :y
What is even more stupid is when you sit and do the maths for how much time they would actually save, its like a few minutes over a a whole shift (and that assumes they could travel at the limit for the full shift, which they cant).
The no overtaking between certain times works well in France, Germany etc.
We either need to spend stupid money on wider roads (4 lanes of lorries on a 5 line road ;D) or start being more sensible with lane utilisation
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Freight back onto the railways would be a great solution but I cant see it happening.
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It is all dejavu.
Quite depressing that drivers don’t know about Smart motorways.
More safety refuges or an extra carriageway and call it a hard shoulder.
No way would I sit in a car for 34 minutes in lane1. As the vehicle slowed I would be planning as safe an exit to the other side of the Armco for everyone in the vehicle. Rain or not.
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Reality is, a smart motorway cant be a worse place to break down than a dual carriageway way or fast A road?
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No way would I sit in a car for 34 minutes in lane1.
I wouldn't sit in the car for 3 minutes on the hard shoulder, let alone a running lane - it only takes one dozing driver wandering onto the hard shoulder and you're a smear.
They could help by moving the car-catchers (armco) a few feet away from the nearside lane/hard shoulder to provide a grassy, soggy, sinking refuge - at least somewhere you could bump a car on the starter to. Of course, modern cars probably can't be bumped on the starter in gear because the electronics/slushbox will say "no".. I've never tried, anyone know?
Reality is, a smart motorway cant be a worse place to break down than a dual carriageway way or fast A road?
Fast A-road you can sometimes at least get the car onto the verge.. not always - in the flatlands that usually means sinking into a drainage ditch, or arguing with a dry stone wall in the Cotswolds, or a hedge in Darzet.. OK, I'll revise that to "rarely" you might be able to get off the road ;D
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- at least somewhere you could bump a car on the starter to. Of course, modern cars probably can't be bumped on the starter in gear because the electronics/slushbox will say "no".. I've never tried, anyone know? ....
you can't do that on many manuals these days as 'elf & safety' has determined that the clutch &/or brake pedal has to be pressed to start many cars these days ... especially key-less
On a similar note, my daughter was amazed when I started her last car in gear, then drove it changing gear without the clutch ..... cable had gone
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Good point! Hadn't thought about push-button start interlocks.. yep, you can no longer 'self rescue'. Progress!
Clutchless shifts - I never did master that.. I did watch the AA man do exactly that, though, when the cable snapped in my old Renault 19 16v (he disappeared at great speed, presumably to somewhere I couldn't see him doing a 3-point turn sans clutch! ;D )
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Clutchless shifts - I never did master that.. I did watch the AA man do exactly that, though, when the cable snapped in my old Renault 19 16v (he disappeared at great speed, presumably to somewhere I couldn't see him doing a 3-point turn sans clutch! ;D )
You just play with the revs as you slip it in ...... ::) Ooooer!
Not that I've had to do many clutchless gear changes these days but IMHO were easier on a RWD where the gear lever was on the end of the gearbox rather than miles away at the end of a series of linkages or cables on a transverse FWD
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Clutchless shifts - I never did master that.. I did watch the AA man do exactly that, though, when the cable snapped in my old Renault 19 16v (he disappeared at great speed, presumably to somewhere I couldn't see him doing a 3-point turn sans clutch! ;D )
with some practice, you can drive through the rush hour traffic to the motor factors before they close to buy a new clutch cable. Which I fitted in their carpark before they locked the gate. Car was a mk2 Cavalier, so I can't see what difference FWD makes.
Don't try the method of starting a car in gear with the clutch pedal down to free off a stuck clutch if it's hydraulic! Especially if it doesn't have a proper external slave cylinder......
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Car was a mk2 Cavalier, so I can't see what difference FWD makes. ....
I didn't say it was impossible .... my daughter's car was a Seicento .... I just my opinion that it was easier when the gear lever was directly in the end of the 'box
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I watched the programme about this last night and wouldn't fancy breaking down on the elevated section of smart motorway that they showed, I think on the M6? :-\
There is literally nowhere to hide... :(
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I drove my Capri for 3 years only using the clutch to pull away in 1st gear. It was slipping and I couldn't be arsed to change it.