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[Jim]

Speed cameras must be visable for 60 meters for 40mph or less and 100 meters for anything above 40mph.

This is the Department of Transport rules for speed cameras
http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/speedmanagement/pdfdftcirc0107.pdf

[steve_daly]

Speed cameras must be visable for 60 meters for 40mph or less and 100 meters for anything above 40mph.

This is the Department of Transport rules for speed cameras
http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/speedmanagement/pdfdftcirc0107.pdf

That is the same pdf that was linked earlier in the thread, and indeed where I got this from:

This camera signing, visibility and conspicuity guidance has no bearing on the enforcement of offences. Non-compliance with this guidance does not provide any mitigation of, or defence for, an alleged offence committed under current UK law.

Which obviously states, that you have no grounds for defence or mitigating circumstances if the guidelines are not met.

That is my point, these are guidelines or best practice methods, not hard and fast rules/laws regarding how or where cameras are placed or how they should be signed. Indeed some signing/camera placement is at the discretion of the local authority, although I think if they don't comply they don't get some/all of the revenue raised

The statement from Psychoca "I'd be inclined to check the whether suitable warning signs are in the vicinty of the camera, as required...  You may be able to get away with them under a technicality...." was what I was answering, not about camera placement.

Of course this is just my opinion and perception of what is stated in that government pdf, but I still think you would have a hard time getting off with a speeding offence because there was no little white sign within 1km of the camera.

You are still breaking the law regardless of whether a sign is warning you that you may be caught for it, therefore the only signs to be aware of, are the speed limit ones.

Tigers best chance of avoiding the tickets is whether or not the stretch of dual carriageway is sign posted at a 30 limit and/or has street lamps.

[omegadan67]

Speed cameras must be visable for 60 meters for 40mph or less and 100 meters for anything above 40mph.

This is the Department of Transport rules for speed cameras
http://www.dft.gov.uk/pgr/roadsafety/speedmanagement/pdfdftcirc0107.pdf

That is the same pdf that was linked earlier in the thread, and indeed where I got this from:

This camera signing, visibility and conspicuity guidance has no bearing on the enforcement of offences. Non-compliance with this guidance does not provide any mitigation of, or defence for, an alleged offence committed under current UK law.

Which obviously states, that you have no grounds for defence or mitigating circumstances if the guidelines are not met.

That is my point, these are guidelines or best practice methods, not hard and fast rules/laws regarding how or where cameras are placed or how they should be signed. Indeed some signing/camera placement is at the discretion of the local authority, although I think if they don't comply they don't get some/all of the revenue raised

The statement from Psychoca "I'd be inclined to check the whether suitable warning signs are in the vicinty of the camera, as required...  You may be able to get away with them under a technicality...." was what I was answering, not about camera placement.

Of course this is just my opinion and perception of what is stated in that government pdf, but I still think you would have a hard time getting off with a speeding offence because there was no little white sign within 1km of the camera.

You are still breaking the law regardless of whether a sign is warning you that you may be caught for it, therefore the only signs to be aware of, are the speed limit ones.

Tigers best chance of avoiding the tickets is whether or not the stretch of dual carriageway is sign posted at a 30 limit and/or has street lamps.

I was caught speeding on moulton park industrail estate in northampton 1 year ago by a police bike with a mobile camera, 46 in a 40 zone bang to rights or so you might think.

But due to the only speed camera sign being the 1 at the back of his bike i went to court and defended my case that the sign was not of the correct size and type and the case was dropped maybe i was lucky maybe i wasnt the facts remain that if you can find the article in law that relates to your case the courts will drop the case cos the wont have a high enough chance of a successful conviction

[steve_daly]

Get a nice judge you get off, get a stickler for the rules and you don't. Much the same as most other things that go before the courts I guess. Perhaps though had it been a fixed camera that got you the outcome may have been different, who knows.

Seems to me that the pdf is worded to cover all failings in the signing or positioning of cameras.

[biggriffin]

look here
http://www.ukspeedtraps.co.uk/index.htm         

[Cliffo B]

I Know how you feel,last year I came back from nearly 3 weeks holiday in North Wales to a ticket for 37 in a 30 zone on the 1st day. Then I really suffered still dont know how I missed more tickets, my son borrowed my Tom Tom to help in a new job I have it set to moo like a cow when approaching a speed limit and subscribe to their safety camera tariff I have a 50year clean licence so I really was sick and worried wait for it!!!!!!!I got a letter from North Wales police giving me the choice of:-A Speed Awareness course or points and £60 .00 fine.The speed awareness course had a fee of £60.00 don't care if it was £600 I'd still have had the course option.My point is I wonder if you wrote a massive sorry humble pie letter pleading your need for a speed awareness course in view of your good driving record any how thought I'd tell you of my good luck and genuinely hope you get the same.If you take the course your offence is totally wiped clean so insurance companies and any other interested parties can't use it against you 

[Sir Tigger KC]

No more tickets so far!!

Don't think I've any grounds for appeal, as there are plenty of signs for the 30mph speed limit and the little camera signs.   

Its one of those places where the speed limit seems ridiculously low ie: a dual carriagway, thats not in a residential area and not even particularly built up!! and chatting to some locals, apparently they've recently converted the camera so it catches speeders as well as red light jumpers.  Its caused alot of local outrage as loads of people are now getting tickets and it smacks of a cash machine rather than a safety device!! 

[Steve 1564]

[size=22]THERMITE![/size] easy to make - so satisfying to use...

Its a shame no one has invented a "Driving like a t*at camera" - Birmingham would be a gold mine

Have a look on "peppipoo" they seem to know all the defences - the other half actually had a plea of guilty overturned because the NIP was sent to our old house & didnt arrive within the 14 days.... (mind you we saw the magistrate arrive in a DB9 with a road angel on the dash ! -  also i have had red light cameras flash at me (once) on green ! (cribbs causeway exit to M5 south) - no letter though

[webby23]

39 and 43 in a 30mph limit..........Sorry mate but you got what you deserved, and I dont mean that with disrespect.

Live by the sword...........die by the sword.....

[Mr Skrunts]

Someone was caught by this camera in .

[webby23]

Someone was caught by this camera in .

lol

Most of the cameras in Lincolnshire have now been torched like that too......!

 

[Martin_1962]

I would take it to court - simply because there are two and you received th efirst after you had been caught again.

As they are supposed to be a disincentive - what has it acheived?

Take it to court and i reckon you could get one of them quashed.

[Martin_1962]

I would take it to court - simply because there are two and you received th efirst after you had been caught again.

As they are supposed to be a disincentive - what has it acheived?

Take it to court and i reckon you could get one of them quashed.

Along the lines if you were stopped by a policeman you would have modified your behaviour immediately.

[webby23]

I would take it to court - simply because there are two and you received th efirst after you had been caught again.

As they are supposed to be a disincentive - what has it acheived?

Take it to court and i reckon you could get one of them quashed.

Sort of like a Buy One Get One Free......

Dont think that will work to be honest, but if the guys licence is on the line its gotta be worth a try at least.....

2 offences means 2 tickets.......normally thats non negotiable

[Martin_1962]

I would take it to court - simply because there are two and you received th efirst after you had been caught again.

As they are supposed to be a disincentive - what has it acheived?

Take it to court and i reckon you could get one of them quashed.

Sort of like a Buy One Get One Free......

Dont think that will work to be honest, but if the guys licence is on the line its gotta be worth a try at least.....

2 offences means 2 tickets.......normally thats non negotiable

But then I have heard that ones like this often they dump the second offence.