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[Rods2]

"Rods 2", I always have difficulty with steaks because I'm an awkward Bugger - I like mine well done - NO pink - but still moist and succulent, not dried out and like tough cardboard.
There are very few chefs that can comply with my wants; do you know of any, as you seem to be a connoisseur?

Ron.

My first wife had the same problem and getting a steak well done was easy here compared with France! IME most chefs will make a steak well done, if requested, but the fact there are different ideas of well done and it is much more difficult to judge makes it much more hit and miss process where the chef will tend to err on the underdone side, so the steak may have to go back more than once. Medium rare is what a steak chef will recommend as the most tender cooking level for a steak and is also the easiest to judge by how much 'bounce' the meat has. Fortunately, this is how I prefer mine but I can understand your difficulties and others who don't like pink meat, where cooked all the way through but not overdone may take more than one attempt. I used to find politeness and firmness by sending it back until it cooked to your preference does work here but 'bien cuit' was more challenging in France!

[Rods2]

Panda's are carnivores really but eat only bamboo so that's why they are dying out lets hope all the vegans go the same way 

Why would you want all vegans to die out to? Do you know any? Do you have any awareness or understanding of veganism?

This thread promotes meat eating, and attacks vegetarians and vegans for their alleged holier than though, preaching, and judgemental attitudes and behaviour towards meat eaters, yet it seems that same attitude is the norm here, against vegetarians and vegans. That's quite contradictory and very hypocritical I'd say. It appears that many on OOF are threatened by diversity, which is an observation made on threads and posts over a long period of time, not just this one.

It seems stereotypes and clichès are used to create an archetypal image of vegetarians and vegans, and people take their limited experience of them and extrapolate it and label all vegetarians and vegans the same. This is the height of ignorance, stupidity and prejudiced behaviour; when other groups of people are summarised in this way, it's known as racism, sexism etc.

There are many reasons why people might choose to follow a vegetarian or vegan lifestyle, sustainability, health reasons, ethical reasons, cost, religious reasons, care for the world and environment are just a few.

None of the vegetarians or vegans I know preach their ideas, and certainly don't display the level of intolerance shown on this thread. Perhaps people here are threatened by diversity?

For the record, I became vegetarian about 6 years ago, and vegan about 3 years ago. But my world view makes no difference to my points, which are objective, not opinion.

Contrary to the general theme here, I as a vegan, am preached to and judged the most by non vegetarians and non vegans. One idea I have about that is that many people as we know, engage in 'group think' (look it up if you don't know the finer points), where people with undeveloped personalities follow the consensus and are threatened by different ideas, and then attack them (probably due to their insecurity). This and the fact that many people, again, with undeveloped personalities, are driven by self interest and instinct, as oppose to higher purposes, the bigger picture, and the greater good.

Some might see this post as threatening, retaliatory, insulting etc. which would reflect more on them than me. It is not intended as such. The intelligent will realise this.

Ranting replies containing insults and unreasoned ideas not welcome, I'd rather have a reasoned informed debate than a slanging match.

I personally don't have a problem with vegetarians or vegans but I do have a problem with bigoted ministers trying to impose their views on perfectly legal activities and that would also apply if they wanted to force everybody to eat meat. If we all tried to stop what we don't like it would not take long before everything was illegal and so all foods and beverages were banned! Not a sensible way for adults to behave especially when they get into positions of power and conveniently forget the views of the majority that elected them there.

When you meet a supreme bigot with very fixed views it is alarming what they would ban. Somebody I know would ban all heavy rock music as it is just a jarring noise to him, all immigrants and deport them, all religions apart from CofE, all two wheeled transport as they are difficult to see and dangerous, all lorries as they clog up roads, all smoking (as an ex-smoker) etc, etc. He makes Alf Garnet look like a libertarian and Victor Mildew is Mr Happy. His idea of tolerance is that everybody must agree and comply with his views

[Nick W]

"Rods 2", I always have difficulty with steaks because I'm an awkward Bugger - I like mine well done - NO pink - but still moist and succulent, not dried out and like tough cardboard.
There are very few chefs that can comply with my wants; do you know of any, as you seem to be a connoisseur?

Ron.

My aunt Viv took her father out to dinner the first time he visited her in Paris. This was after he should have retired, and was the first time he'd been abroad. He was both fussy and unadventurous with food, so he had steak. It was ordered well done, which was how it was served. His reaction? It's not cooked! The third time it went back, Viv's French husband told the waiter to burn the bloody thing, which finally meet with Grandad's approval.

[korum]

Vegans WTF look like they could do with a big fat juicey half pounder. The only thing that survives on seed is Budgies.

Hmmmm, that's exactly the kind of idiotic, ignorant and inane response I was talking about. I wouldn't really expect much more though. Omegas are old cars now, with little value, and as such are now in the reach of the lower socio-economic groups in society, which is obvious from some of the drivel posted on this forum!

Well this is just the sort of sanctimonious rubbish vegans get known for, in your first post you comment about stereotypes and cliches then in this post you suggest that steve is poor and therefore be an ignorant inane idiot which goes against the last sentence of your last post.

so while I don't care if your a vegan or not (its up to you) i don't believe people in positions of influence should be spouting rubbish as this woman did.

[Bigron]

Rods, I had a similar experience in Spain a few years back; after I had sent my steak back FOUR times, the chef must have got the ache with me because he absolutely cremated it and it was solid charcoal and of course inedible!
I did not get a bill.....

Ron.

[Sir Tigger KC]

Rods, I had a similar experience in Spain a few years back; after I had sent my steak back FOUR times, the chef must have got the ache with me because he absolutely cremated it and it was solid charcoal and of course inedible!
I did not get a bill.....

Ron.

Probably just as well Ron as he may have added some 'Gentlemans Relish' as well!   

[Bigron]

Smegging hell!

[Broomies Mate]

Hmmmm, that's exactly the kind of idiotic, ignorant and inane response I was talking about. I wouldn't really expect much more though. Omegas are old cars now, with little value, and as such are now in the reach of the lower socio-economic groups in society, which is obvious from some of the drivel posted on this forum!

Irony overload.

I know it is childish, but if I were in sight of you now, I'd be making a hand gensture.... You really are a self-righteous, sanctimoniousness, moron.

Go and eat a steak - You never know, you might like it.... It might also dislodge some of that shit you are so full of 

[Broomies Mate]

D to the P.

As the 'Modify' button has left the planet, I'd like to blame auto-correct for the incorrect grammar. 

[TheBoy]

Children, children, if you can't play nicely, I'll ask the headmaster to close the playground.

Warning 1 fired

[Terbs]

Hey folks, this was not posted as an 'attack veggies'.....but as an advice on what a certain MP was voicing.
If she (or anyone) wishes to be a veggie, or vegan, that is there choice.
My point was, as Rods2 and others confirmed, do as you wish, but do not make obnoxious statements against others who do not wish to follow your path.
People in her position should keep their mouths shut !!!!!!!!!!!!!!

PS Admins....sorry if this post caused 'problems' ......the original intention was far from that.

[geoffr70]

Oh dear....I must've hit the nail right on the head to evoke some of these responses! Hmmm, people don't like the truth, clearly. As for sanctimonious, I think not. I live by certain rules that I have set myself, which clearly upsets and/or threatens others, who perhaps don't have the strength of character or willpower to do the same, and put immediate satisfaction, which generally comes in the form of physical pleasure, above a virtuous lifestyle. Instinct over enlightenment and awareness.

Becoming abusive and insulting tells me you've lost the debate and you know it, as you have no further (valid) points to make so therefore resort to abuse.

As for irony!!! These replies have reinforced my statements; inane, idiotic and ignorant, and generally indicative of the lower socio-economic groups as said. Surely an educated, intelligent person would listen to a range of views and offer constructive criticism, challenging some and supporting others, in a positive way? Above all, perhaps they would accept diversity and agree to disagree whilst still respecting the other parties' and their views. That, unsurprisingly, hasn't happened here, which is what I referred to in my first post.

No doubt you might try and turn it around and say I'm being insulting and stereotypical which is what 'korum' alluded to. Analysis and observation of social stratification isn't abusive at all, nor is it shit BM. Everybody needs to know their place. Also BM, thank you, but there is no need to salute me....that is the hand gesture you're talking about right? You wouldn't be in sight of me, as I wouldn't be seen in some of the places you go, I have class after all!

The responses here have supported my assertions that non vegetarians and non vegans are the most intolerant. It's puzzling that non vegans judge me for being a vegan (and become abusive as seen) and generally have a negative attitude towards me because of it, without knowing why I am vegan! That is the height of ignorance!

[Broomies Mate]

Oh dear....I must've hit the nail right on the head to evoke some of these responses! Hmmm, people don't like the truth, clearly. As for sanctimonious, I think not. I live by certain rules that I have set myself, which clearly upsets and/or threatens others, who perhaps don't have the strength of character or willpower to do the same, and put immediate satisfaction, which generally comes in the form of physical pleasure, above a virtuous lifestyle. Instinct over enlightenment and awareness.

Becoming abusive and insulting tells me you've lost the debate and you know it, as you have no further (valid) points to make so therefore resort to abuse.

As for irony!!! These replies have reinforced my statements; inane, idiotic and ignorant, and generally indicative of the lower socio-economic groups as said. Surely an educated, intelligent person would listen to a range of views and offer constructive criticism, challenging some and supporting others, in a positive way? Above all, perhaps they would accept diversity and agree to disagree whilst still respecting the other parties' and their views. That, unsurprisingly, hasn't happened here, which is what I referred to in my first post.

No doubt you might try and turn it around and say I'm being insulting and stereotypical which is what 'korum' alluded to. Analysis and observation of social stratification isn't abusive at all, nor is it shit BM. Everybody needs to know their place. Also BM, thank you, but there is no need to salute me....that is the hand gesture you're talking about right? You wouldn't be in sight of me, as I wouldn't be seen in some of the places you go, I have class after all!

The responses here have supported my assertions that non vegetarians and non vegans are the most intolerant. It's puzzling that non vegans judge me for being a vegan (and become abusive as seen) and generally have a negative attitude towards me because of it, without knowing why I am vegan! That is the height of ignorance!

Why is it you feel that you have to try and undermine everyone who doesn't follow your lifestyle?  Are you really that shallow?

Strength, Willpower? What on earth are you talking about?  Why would I want to exclusively eat seeds, nut and pulses?  It's stupid when we have this massive array of foods on offer.

Lower Socio-economic group?  I can afford meat thank you.  A higher value product than, grass for example.  My food eats the grass.  Ta.



Oh, I can assure you, I'd never salute you!  And I'm sure you wouldn't be in some of the places I go.  I very much boubt you'd be welcome at Grillstock.  Shame, I'd buy you a lovely bit of meat!  As far the 'class' statement, you are from Sunderland.  Shall we not go there, eh?

[Broomies Mate]

Sorry for the DP again, BUT.............

More to the point - You have made 4 posts in 2015 - 2 of which have been in this thread, and the other two were flogging something.

Why do you bother contributing 'dangle berries' to a forum such as this?

You've not offered any input which is beneficial to a car related forum in the slightest.

Get a hobby, you over sensitive bellend.

(Don't care if I get banned if it's for the benefit of the forum)

[omega2018]

..Becoming abusive and insulting tells me you've lost the debate and you know it, as you have no further (valid) points to make so therefore resort to abuse.

don't worry stella the pisshead keyboard warrior has previous.  this thread is the most oustanding example i have seen though.