Print

Please login or register.
1 Hour 1 Day 1 Week 1 Month Forever
Login with username, password and session length

[unlucky alf]

I happened to check my tyres yesterday & found they have been totally slaughtered on the very inside edge , So went to get my tracking checked before getting the tyres replaced, They said my tracking was pretty much spot on so must be my camber angle is out, My question is what has caused my camber angle to become so far out?, Also has anyone used one of these?, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/301272192717?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
I have checked all ball joints & have found only slight play in a track rod end which i have ordered,
Also is there a "how to" to adjust the camber?.,,,Cheers.

[Marks DTM Calib]

I use a spirit level, basic trig and some bolts screwed into said spirit level.

Very accurate and when checked on a Hunter setup was only a few minutes out (which is well below the tolerance of the machine).

Of course you then need to setup the tracking.

Camber goes out as the suspension ages and sags a bit.

[The Sheriff]

I happened to check my tyres yesterday & found they have been totally slaughtered on the very inside edge , So went to get my tracking checked before getting the tyres replaced, They said my tracking was pretty much spot on so must be my camber angle is out, My question is what has caused my camber angle to become so far out?, Also has anyone used one of these?, http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/301272192717?_trksid=p2059210.m2749.l2649&ssPageName=STRK%3AMEBIDX%3AIT
I have checked all ball joints & have found only slight play in a track rod end which i have ordered,
Also is there a "how to" to adjust the camber?.,,,Cheers.

Unlucky, Alf.

[unlucky alf]

Cheers Mark but not sure how you use your system & "Trig" to me was a character in Only fools & horses , I have ordered one of those things I mentioned & just hoping that comes with instructions such as does the car have to be on the ground when adjusting, The Haynes manual isn't much of a help but then that is no surprise.

[Nick W]

Alf, I've looked at those gauges before, and they don't have the resolution you need.

Google 'Wixey digital angle gauge' for what I used. It's magnetic, so you cabletie a length of angle-iron across the wheel, and stick the gauge to that. You zero it first on a straight edge placed between the front wheels. No trig is needed(not that it's difficult) as the gauge reads directly.
This is done with the wheels on the ground, which makes adjusting the camber a bit tricky. But possible

When I finally got my car setup properly, the machine readings were the same as mine.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Like this:



You must always setup the camber on flat ground and with the wheels loaded.

I seem to remember the difference top to bottom being about 11mm

[unlucky alf]

Cheers Nick, The tool on the Bay has a magnet on it which admittedly is a fat lot of good when the wheels are alloy so i can see why you used a bit of angle iron, I don't know if i have any angle iron or steel bar about but I know my neighbour has got some old steel wheels with tyres off a zafira so I guess i could put them on for the purpose of measuring if it comes to it, Anyhow I wont be doing it just yet until i have changed the track rod then I can make a day of it.

[unlucky alf]

Oh bugger I have just seen your post Mark which would of saved ordering that tool, Although luckily my mate is paying for it as I have got to do his Zafira front springs.

[Doctor Gollum]

Like this:



You must always setup the camber on flat ground and with the wheels loaded.

I seem to remember the difference top to bottom being about 11mm

.....Depending on wheel size.

....then master gets it checked properses. They sees it, they sees it proper. Master can't do it proper without checking, no he can't.

[Doctor Gollum]

But Smeagol asks master. We asks him. Wtf does we bother with the guideses? 

[tidla]

Tyres still wearing even after 2.5 years.

[05omegav6]

 

[dbug]

Cheers Nick, The tool on the Bay has a magnet on it which admittedly is a fat lot of good when the wheels are alloy so i can see why you used a bit of angle iron, I don't know if i have any angle iron or steel bar about but I know my neighbour has got some old steel wheels with tyres off a zafira so I guess i could put them on for the purpose of measuring if it comes to it, Anyhow I wont be doing it just yet until i have changed the track rod then I can make a day of it.

Your spare should be on a steel rim

[Nick W]

Tyres still wearing even after 2.5 years.

That's a bit more sophisticated than my cable ties and angle-iron, and I might have to copy it. If sophisticated is the right word for something made out of bent studding!
It is a pity the traditional Dunlop tracking gauges aren't much use on an Omega.

[elvin315]

These bolts provide +/- 2 degrees of camber adjustment. I've had these on my Catera for about 5 years and the wear inside tread wear has been somewhat reduced. Granted, my car is lowered 25.4 mm (1 inch) and the bolts compensate for the added negative camber added. On a nonlowered car the they would allow you to dial out more neg camber than on my car. I'm out of my element here so feel free to correct me (like you need my permission).

http://www.ingallseng.com/81260-14mm-fastcam-bolts_pair.html

[unlucky alf]

UPDATE,,,,I made up the Mark special tool today & found that although my N/S is pretty much spot on the O/S is a mile out, , Before i go wading in with the spanners is there anything i should check first that might have caused this?, & secondly if only one side is out would it still cause both front tyres to get chewed on the inside edge?.

[Nick W]

As the Omega has about 5 degrees of adjustment, from positive through to far too much negative, why would you bother with eccentric bolts?

[Doctor Gollum]

As the Omega has about 5 degrees of adjustment, from positive through to far too much negative, why would you bother with eccentric bolts?

There have been one or two mentions of some set up company or other, in the land of dodgy water , that allegedly couldn't achieve the correct camber setting due to lack of adjustment in the shock to knuckle mounting points. In other words the holes in the shock whereby "ovalised" enough. In that instance, if even remotely true and not a poor excuse by the operator, camber bolts could have a use.

But otherwise, none whatsoever. ...I wonder if Monaro shocks (on Elvins car iiirc) don't have the camber adjustment the omega has. Perhaps?

[Doctor Gollum]

UPDATE,,,,I made up the Mark special tool today & found that although my N/S is pretty much spot on the O/S is a mile out, , Before i go wading in with the spanners is there anything i should check first that might have caused this?, & secondly if only one side is out would it still cause both front tyres to get chewed on the inside edge?.

Alf Darling. Listen very carefully. CHECK THE GUIDES SECTION! It's aaaaslll there.

[05omegav6]

Monaro adjustment machined into the steering knuckle

[Doctor Gollum]

Monaro adjustment machined into the steering knuckle

Aha! That's why we needs camber bolts.

Genuine omega shocks don't need them though. Unless you use a set up company in Northamptonshire, going by posts here. (most odd)

[Doctor Gollum]

After thought..,,


Or is omega the same....? (As Monaro with oval knuckle holes....?) I really can't remember.



Anyway. You get the theory with camber bolts presumably?

[05omegav6]

After thought..,,


Or is omega the same....? (As Monaro with oval knuckle holes....?) I really can't remember.



Anyway. You get the theory with camber bolts presumably?

Thems sameses

[Doctor Gollum]

After thought..,,


Or is omega the same....? (As Monaro with oval knuckle holes....?) I really can't remember.



Anyway. You get the theory with camber bolts presumably?

Thems sameses

Ok. So do they act as an eccentric allowing diy adjustment of camber by turning the bolt maybe?

[05omegav6]

Lower bolt is fixed pivot, upper bolt hole is about 1.5 times bolt diameter and can be extended a fraction with a round file as required

As Nick suggests, there should be adequate scope for,adjusting all but the most banana shaped cars

[elvin315]

...I wonder if Monaro shocks (on Elvins car iiirc) don't have the camber adjustment the omega has. Perhaps?

For the record my Catera has Koni Sport inserts in the original strut bodies so the upper and lower knuckle holes are exactly how they would be on a stock Omega. She also has Powerflex front/horizontal bushes and new tie-rod ends. I didn't install the eccentric bolts myself so I can only attest to the results I've experienced. I don't have exact mileage numbers but the tires have lasted longer and worn more evenly after the bolts than before them. The wear is still based to the inner part of the tread but that's just the nature of our suspension.

[Doctor Gollum]

...I wonder if Monaro shocks (on Elvins car iiirc) don't have the camber adjustment the omega has. Perhaps?

For the record my Catera has Koni Sport inserts in the original strut bodies so the upper and lower knuckle holes are exactly how they would be on a stock Omega. She also has Powerflex front/horizontal bushes and new tie-rod ends. I didn't install the eccentric bolts myself so I can only attest to the results I've experienced. I don't have exact mileage numbers but the tires have lasted longer and worn more evenly after the bolts than before them. The wear is still based to the inner part of the tread but that's just the nature of our suspension.

Yes the state of the wear is due to the suspensions camber setting. The wear should be focused towards the inner edge by the time the tyre is spent ( we have a 3mm tread wear limit on the centre two thirds iirc ) but driving style affects the wear so more aggressive drivers need more camber to achieve this. Apologies if I'm quoting the rule book at you though I'm sure you know all this.
Point is the tyre wear is not to do with the bolts. The original components do not need them, or at least not to enable a setting that is otherwise out of reach, anyway.

I've not used them, as not needed, so can't dismiss them completely but, for instance, Smeagols car runs 30mm drop front suspension, stock boots, yet there is still excess camber available.

When the car came to me it was running an inch higher than stock too. Same bolts achieved the required setting.

What might be handy is the ability to turn the camber bolt with the eccentric section within moving the top of the hub in and out as required, in order to adjust the actual camber setting during set up. Although I guess the bolt length would need to be more cranked than excentric.  But other than that....

...No need.

Apologies re the Monaro shocks guess. Must of been another thread I saw.

[05omegav6]

I believe Elvin has Pedders GTO springs, so presumably same as Monaro

[EMD]

UPDATE,,,,I made up the Mark special tool today & found that although my N/S is pretty much spot on the O/S is a mile out, , Before i go wading in with the spanners is there anything i should check first that might have caused this?, & secondly if only one side is out would it still cause both front tyres to get chewed on the inside edge?.

Alf Darling. Listen very carefully. CHECK THE GUIDES SECTION! It's aaaaslll there.

Is that mr.gixer 

[elvin315]

I believe Elvin has Pedders GTO springs, so presumably same as Monaro

Not Pedders, stock GTO/Monaro springs. They lower our cars an inch (25.4mm).

[05omegav6]

I believe Elvin has Pedders GTO springs, so presumably same as Monaro

Not Pedders, stock GTO/Monaro springs. They lower our cars an inch (25.4mm).

Ah ok

[EMD]

UPDATE,,,,I made up the Mark special tool today & found that although my N/S is pretty much spot on the O/S is a mile out, , Before i go wading in with the spanners is there anything i should check first that might have caused this?, & secondly if only one side is out would it still cause both front tyres to get chewed on the inside edge?.

Alf Darling. Listen very carefully. CHECK THE GUIDES SECTION! It's aaaaslll there.

Is that mr.gixer

Yes 

[biggriffin]

UPDATE,,,,I made up the Mark special tool today & found that although my N/S is pretty much spot on the O/S is a mile out, , Before i go wading in with the spanners is there anything i should check first that might have caused this?, & secondly if only one side is out would it still cause both front tyres to get chewed on the inside edge?.

Alf Darling. Listen very carefully. CHECK THE GUIDES SECTION! It's aaaaslll there.

Is that mr.gixer

Yes 

AR, a welcome back Mr gixer.

[chrisgixer]

Who's this Gixer feller anyway?

[05omegav6]

Ducked if I know...

[Doctor Gollum]

Ducked if I know...

Me neitherses

[Doctor Smeagol]

Ducked if I know...

Me neitherses

We DOESN'T knowses

[EMD]

Who's this Gixer feller anyway?

Doctor Gollumgixer