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[Doctor Gollum]

I also think a big part of it is keeping the list price 'down'. When you have fairly middling 3 series going over £40k and a hot one can go North of £60k without even getting an M badge, they've probably realised there's a limit to what people will pay and they're pushing up at it. By splitting off the options, you can split the bill in two and make the total larger.

It's like a few years ago when various companies tried bundling the usual phone, TV and broadband package together with mobile phone service on one bill. Back then it didn't prove as popular as they thought it would because no one wanted to see a single bill for well over £100pcm.

Also, as said it allows them to make the same money over and over again. A £1000 option on a new car isn't worth £1000 on the second hand market (particularly if it's not popular), but £10pcm will always be just that (and no doubt index linked too so it keeps going up over time). I also wouldn't be surprised if there are limitations on downgrading options down the line to keep the money flowing.

In summary, cheaper for the manufacturer, more costly for the consumer 

Smoke and mirrors.

And it is all about separating you from your money. Whilst screwing you over in the process.

Before you know it, you can double your car payment and keep renting the options long after the car is paid for.

Before you know it we will be back to renting kettles and toasters

[Marks DTM Calib]

Its more based around getting income for the life of the car and with each differing user.

[Nick W]

Its more based around getting income for the life of the car and with each differing user.

Isn't that still separating you from your money?

[Marks DTM Calib]

Its more based around getting income for the life of the car and with each differing user.

Isn't that still separating you from your money?

Oh yes, totally, the approach I have seen is very simialr to today so you can buy the option outright for the vehicle life at day one, or add/lease it later to give flexibility through the whole vehicle life

Another driver is automated driving, where the on cost is many many thousands extra, Tesla already do this.....not that I will have that issue as I quite enjoy being the seat wheel interface

[johnnydog]

In the past, having bought a lot of ex lease cars, I found that many had 'sensible' and 'useable' options fitted above standard spec. The fleet / business sales staff at dealerships no doubt were able to offer certain options to fleet / business buyers in an attempt to gain their business and sell a number of vehicles. Volume sales in many respects were possibly equally as important as the amount of profit, especially considering dealership bonuses from manufacturers for monthly / quarterly targets etc.

[Doctor Gollum]

Its more based around getting income for the life of the car and with each differing user.

Isn't that still separating you from your money?

Oh yes, totally, the approach I have seen is very simialr to today so you can buy the option outright for the vehicle life at day one, or add/lease it later to give flexibility throguh the whole vehicle life

Definitely marketing wank presented to sound like it's doing the consumer a favour...

[Nick W]

Its more based around getting income for the life of the car and with each differing user.

Isn't that still separating you from your money?

Oh yes, totally, the approach I have seen is very simialr to today so you can buy the option outright for the vehicle life at day one, or add/lease it later to give flexibility throguh the whole vehicle life

Definitely marketing wank presented to sound like it's doing the consumer a favour...

Which has been BMW's strategy for decades. They've managed to maintain their status in the automotive industry by successfully adopting the latest marketing wank as soon as an appropriate cellulose based wiping matrix has become available to clean up after themselves.

[VXL V6]

In fairness to BMW (and no doubt others will do the same in time), it's definitely an idea that's got legs, so many second / third etc owners spend money on used cars then immediately start upgrading with parts on from higher spec models.

I'm guessing the key to this is the use of connected drive, so the car needs a data connection and a subscription before any manufacturer 'over the air' coding can take place.

[Doctor Gollum]

In fairness to BMW (and no doubt others will do the same in time), it's definitely an idea that's got legs, so many second / third etc owners spend money on used cars then immediately start upgrading with parts on from higher spec models.

I'm guessing the key to this is the use of connected drive, so the car needs a data connection and a subscription before any manufacturer 'over the air' coding can take place.

Yeah, but a nicer interior or better seats etc is a one off modest purchase and some time not a monthly subscription. And who gets to pay for the repair when a heated seat stop working. Right to repair is going to become much more of an issue to, because it will all become dealer only for everything.

A call centre in India telling you that they've reactivated your navigation unit when it clearly doesn't work isn't going to cut it. And you don't have to look too far for Tesla owners unsuccessfully trying to get refunds for subscriptions to things when the car spends three months at a dealer awaiting a warranty repair. On this point the practice actually seems to be sit on the car until the warranty runs out, then return the car saying that it is no longer under warranty...

[VXL V6]

In fairness to BMW (and no doubt others will do the same in time), it's definitely an idea that's got legs, so many second / third etc owners spend money on used cars then immediately start upgrading with parts on from higher spec models.

I'm guessing the key to this is the use of connected drive, so the car needs a data connection and a subscription before any manufacturer 'over the air' coding can take place.

Yeah, but a nicer interior or better seats etc is a one off modest purchase and some time not a monthly subscription. And who gets to pay for the repair when a heated seat stop working. Right to repair is going to become much more of an issue to, because it will all become dealer only for everything.

A call centre in India telling you that they've reactivated your navigation unit when it clearly doesn't work isn't going to cut it. And you don't have to look too far for Tesla owners unsuccessfully trying to get refunds for subscriptions to things when the car spends three months at a dealer awaiting a warranty repair. On this point the practice actually seems to be sit on the car until the warranty runs out, then return the car saying that it is no longer under warranty...

Yeh, monthly subscription is a daft idea (but then isn't that how a good proportion of the current generation live - monthly wage into the bank and every penny going out on DD's to support their lifestyle choices??!!), but a one off payment to enable an option could be a goer. I suspect that third parties will find work arounds to using the official BMW route to code in options.... just as long as you never take the car to a BMW dealer you'll be fine LOL.

I guess the call centre you get could depend on the level of subscription you pay for... I know back in the day Orange contract phone subscribers got through to UK call centres whereas PAYG subscribers went to the nearest 'follow the sun' call centre, these days companies often choose the cheapest possible option for parts and support as it's the only way they can match their competitors and show profits on the balance sheet.... which is all the bean counters care about at the end of the day.

[Marks DTM Calib]

Bit more fundamental than that, the cars have what is called a digital twin, so the config is onboard and offboard. This can get aligned over the air at anytime so just avoiding a dealer won't work, you also need to ditch the connectivity

[Doctor Gollum]

Bit more fundamental than that, the cars have what is called a digital twin, so the config is onboard and offboard. This can get aligned over the air at anytime so just avoiding a dealer won't work, you also need to ditch the connectivity

Which presumably bricks the car.

[VXL V6]

Bit more fundamental than that, the cars have what is called a digital twin, so the config is onboard and offboard. This can get aligned over the air at anytime so just avoiding a dealer won't work, you also need to ditch the connectivity

Which presumably bricks the car.

Well I would imagine it will be done through BMW connected which no-one apart from the first owner for the first year ever bothers with. When you pair a handset with the car you have to enable data services for connected to make the data connection for it's online services, on most vehicles that's a tick box menu option (certainly on the NBT iDrive version in my car which has the latest software on it - required to run 2021-1 and above maps). I don't think 'bricking' the car would be allowed in this country for a multitude of safety reasons especially when, as previously stated, disabling a car is not allowed.

[Doctor Gollum]

Bit more fundamental than that, the cars have what is called a digital twin, so the config is onboard and offboard. This can get aligned over the air at anytime so just avoiding a dealer won't work, you also need to ditch the connectivity

Which presumably bricks the car.

Well I would imagine it will be done through BMW connected which no-one apart from the first owner for the first year ever bothers with. When you pair a handset with the car you have to enable data services for connected to make the data connection for it's online services, on most vehicles that's a tick box menu option (certainly on the NBT iDrive version in my car which has the latest software on it - required to run 2021-1 and above maps). I don't think 'bricking' the car would be allowed in this country for a multitude of safety reasons especially when, as previously stated, disabling a car is not allowed.

Because nobody in a call centre has ever clicked the wrong box...

[Marks DTM Calib]

Bit more fundamental than that, the cars have what is called a digital twin, so the config is onboard and offboard. This can get aligned over the air at anytime so just avoiding a dealer won't work, you also need to ditch the connectivity

Which presumably bricks the car.

No it returns it to the original Car Confog File and feature set