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[Kate]

Hi all.

I need to replace my rear brake pipes for the MOT. Is this a job I could do myself? I'm trying to learn more about car repair so I'd like to have a go.

Are there any special tools I need?

I'd really appreciate any advice.

Many thanks.

[Tick Tock]

There's a current thread running on here which may be of help 

http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=135196.0

[raywilb]

Hi all.

I need to replace my rear brake pipes for the MOT. Is this a job I could do myself? I'm trying to learn more about car repair so I'd like to have a go.

Are there any special tools I need?

I'd really appreciate any advice.   there are plenty of tutorial how-to short videos on the net. 

Many thanks.

[ted_one]

I'm going to get all three cars brake pipes done as a couple are a bit 'marginal' and they need to be done before going up to Rustbusters, not going to mess about with oily bits.....just going to whip them up to Serek's place....life's to short

[Nick W]

Kate, if you already have the tools for safely working under a car and can manage all the grovelling about that this job entails then a £15 flaring tool and £20 of consumables will do the job.

But it is a fiddly time consuming job that is probably best left to someone who has done it before.

[05omegav6]

Might need to clarify which rear pipes... The ones on the trailing arms would be good for learning on

[Bigron]

I've done it before, on a 1938 Mossis 12, when things were simpler and had copper brake lines. NO, I didn't buy the car from new! 

Ron.

[Kate]

I've done it before, on a 1938 Mossis 12, when things were simpler and had copper brake lines. NO, I didn't buy the car from new! 

Ron.

Was it nearly new then Ron?

[Bigron]

Have you been spanked lately, Kate?

Ron.

[ted_one]

Brakes....safety critical item,need to know what you're about,it's not an item I would want to do....but then I don't want to do anything as I can't be arsed

[05omegav6]

Brakes....safety critical item,need to know what you're about,it's not an item I would want to do....but then I don't want to do anything as I can't be arsed

That semi retirement malarkey is kicking in nicely then lol...

[ted_one]

Now fully sidelined,did'nt bother renewing my PCV licence,it's my new state of mind...just can't be arsed,plus there's a load of fettling to be done on the cars and with summer coming regrettably I'm going to have to do some of the work

[Bigron]

You will soon wonder how you managed to find time to go to work, with all the things you will find to do - or 'er indoors will find for you!   

Ron.

[ted_one]

Nail on head....especially the last part of the post...sort of involves paint brushes and paint and being confined to barracks for an indefinite period 

[Bigron]

Get a shed!   

Ron.

[Kate]

Kate, if you already have the tools for safely working under a car and can manage all the grovelling about that this job entails then a £15 flaring tool and £20 of consumables will do the job.

But it is a fiddly time consuming job that is probably best left to someone who has done it before.

Thanks for the advice Nick.

[BazaJT]

If you do decide to go ahead and d.i.y. make sure any bends you need to put into pipe are smooth with no kinks,and that once done brakes are thoroughly bled and all air expelled.

[Kate]

If you do decide to go ahead and d.i.y. make sure any bends you need to put into pipe are smooth with no kinks,and that once done brakes are thoroughly bled and all air expelled.

Will do. I'm going to do the job next week.

[BazaJT]

Good for you girl I admire your spirit not being afraid to get stuck in

[tidla]

Managed for ages with the cheap brake flaring tools which as long as your doing joint to joint with copper or its mixes is fine.

flaring original steel lines with such tools is near impossible.

the upgrade , which works fantastically but probably not needed is this:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sykes-FLAREMASTER-2-Brake-Flaring-Tool-3-16-and-4-75mm-/310202109435?hash=item48397c8dfb

[Kate]

Managed for ages with the cheap brake flaring tools which as long as your doing joint to joint with copper or its mixes is fine.

flaring original steel lines with such tools is near impossible.

the upgrade , which works fantastically but probably not needed is this:

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Sykes-FLAREMASTER-2-Brake-Flaring-Tool-3-16-and-4-75mm-/310202109435?hash=item48397c8dfb

That looks excellent but it's a bit expensive.

[tidla]

Cheap kit is fine as said, as long as your working with Cupronickel and copper.

[baggers]

If you do decide to go ahead and d.i.y. make sure any bends you need to put into pipe are smooth with no kinks,and that once done brakes are thoroughly bled and all air expelled.

Will do. I'm going to do the job next week.

 

These can come in handy too....... http://www.lasertools.co.uk/product/3483
They can be purchased for less money than this though.

[Lazydocker]

You can buy a cheap kit on eGay that has pipe, flarer kit, fittings and benders. Well, you used to be able to. I would seriously recommend having several practice attempts at using the flaring tool before starting on the real pipes

[terry paget]

I have found MOT testers happily fails cars for surface rust on brake pipes. If I then remove the rust with emery cloth and show the tester pipe is sound he will pass it. I have also seen a tester slapping grease on the brake pipes of a mate, then passing it. I now submit cars for test with all metal brake pipes greased. Does anyone know what the tester's manual says about this?

[Nick W]

If you do decide to go ahead and d.i.y. make sure any bends you need to put into pipe are smooth with no kinks,and that once done brakes are thoroughly bled and all air expelled.

Will do. I'm going to do the job next week.

 

These can come in handy too....... http://www.lasertools.co.uk/product/3483
They can be purchased for less money than this though.

I had one of those, and found that it only does large radius bends in the middle of a pipe. And you can do those just as easily by bending the pipe around a former that you already own, like a socket, bottle, pipe, post etc.


What you really need for doing neat, safe brake pipe installations is the ability to put really tight bends next to each other, or right at the end of an already formed pipe. That's where this comes into its own:  http://www.automec.co.uk/collections/tools/products/small-pipe-bending-tool-by-oakes A small twist type pipe cutter is also a good idea, as it instantly gives a straight cut square to the pipe, which is necessary for a good flare, and utterly essential if using one of the cheap clamp type flaring tools.

[raywilb]

If you do decide to go ahead and d.i.y. make sure any bends you need to put into pipe are smooth with no kinks,and that once done brakes are thoroughly bled and all air expelled.

Will do. I'm going to do the job next week.

  I bought a flaring tool kit a while ago via amazon I think. it came with a pipe bender & pipe cutter for £15 + free delivery. also there are loads of how-to info & video clips online to assist. 

[GastronomicKleptomaniac]

If you do decide to go ahead and d.i.y. make sure any bends you need to put into pipe are smooth with no kinks,and that once done brakes are thoroughly bled and all air expelled.

Will do. I'm going to do the job next week.

 

These can come in handy too....... http://www.lasertools.co.uk/product/3483
They can be purchased for less money than this though.

I had one of those, and found that it only does large radius bends in the middle of a pipe. And you can do those just as easily by bending the pipe around a former that you already own, like a socket, bottle, pipe, post etc.


What you really need for doing neat, safe brake pipe installations is the ability to put really tight bends next to each other, or right at the end of an already formed pipe. That's where this comes into its own:  http://www.automec.co.uk/collections/tools/products/small-pipe-bending-tool-by-oakes A small twist type pipe cutter is also a good idea, as it instantly gives a straight cut square to the pipe, which is necessary for a good flare, and utterly essential if using one of the cheap clamp type flaring tools.

Twisting pipe cutter essential as said - and not many pennies at all.

Did you have to show me that small bending tool Nick? I already have a shopping list of shiny things I can't afford!

[Nick W]

I had one of those, and found that it only does large radius bends in the middle of a pipe. And you can do those just as easily by bending the pipe around a former that you already own, like a socket, bottle, pipe, post etc.


What you really need for doing neat, safe brake pipe installations is the ability to put really tight bends next to each other, or right at the end of an already formed pipe. That's where this comes into its own:  http://www.automec.co.uk/collections/tools/products/small-pipe-bending-tool-by-oakes A small twist type pipe cutter is also a good idea, as it instantly gives a straight cut square to the pipe, which is necessary for a good flare, and utterly essential if using one of the cheap clamp type flaring tools.

Twisting pipe cutter essential as said - and not many pennies at all.

Did you have to show me that small bending tool Nick? I already have a shopping list of shiny things I can't afford!

It's about £15? Mine was bundled with their flaring tool at a show some years ago. I didn't expect it to be up to much, but changed my tune as soon as I used it. As has anyone I've lent it to as it makes perfect bends every time with no effort whatsoever. You can even put a 90 degree bend on an already flared pipe with just enough float for the fitting to move.

[GastronomicKleptomaniac]

Should have said "don't currently need and can't njustify"  but my point stands

Every spare penny is being split between the two Omegas and the wedding fund at the moment... hence my tight northern ways are coming to the fore 

[terry paget]

Should have said "don't currently need and can't njustify"  but my point stands

Every spare penny is being split between the two Omegas and the wedding fund at the moment... hence my tight northern ways are coming to the fore 

Congratulations on your impending nuptials. I hope you are not spending vast sums on it. I went to a wedding of a great niece last weekend and it took for ever. Long church service with 5 hymns, 15 mile drive to wedding breakfast venue, drinks. photos, hanging around, then formal meal with preselected food and named place settings. At this point my wife and I sloped off, but my children hung around for a concert (?) performed by the bride's friends and a disco, getting home at 1a.m.
My wedding consisted of church service with 2 hymns, drinks and buffet in church hall, and guests able to drive home in daylight. That's all the guests wanted. It cost me about £500. I have a friend marrying off a daughter reckoning it will cost him £20,000 - madness.

Apologies for wandering off thread, it's on my mind at the moment.

[relluf]

I have found MOT testers happily fails cars for surface rust on brake pipes. If I then remove the rust with emery cloth and show the tester pipe is sound he will pass it. I have also seen a tester slapping grease on the brake pipes of a mate, then passing it. I now submit cars for test with all metal brake pipes greased. Does anyone know what the tester's manual says about this?

I am with terry on this school of thought, I don't consider them to be seriously corroded, a clean up with some emery paper may well suffice.
Handbrake cable was replaced last year along with adjustment of shoes etc ,I had a look at them all then and seemed to be ok.

As a small piece of advice Kate go to a small local (if you have one) MOT place, don't go back to Halfruads ,which is where I think you went(but may be wrong)
All the best

[Lazydocker]

I have found MOT testers happily fails cars for surface rust on brake pipes. If I then remove the rust with emery cloth and show the tester pipe is sound he will pass it. I have also seen a tester slapping grease on the brake pipes of a mate, then passing it. I now submit cars for test with all metal brake pipes greased. Does anyone know what the tester's manual says about this?

Yes... Seems to be the latest trend. IIRC, the manual says that "the corrosion should reduce the pipe sidewall thickness by more than 50%" but I could be wrong. Realistically they should only fail on them if the tester can be certain of the reduction in pipe wall thickness - the only way to do that would be to cut it

Fortunately I don't have any of that with my tester... Completely understands and knows that I do all the work

[Kate]

I have found MOT testers happily fails cars for surface rust on brake pipes. If I then remove the rust with emery cloth and show the tester pipe is sound he will pass it. I have also seen a tester slapping grease on the brake pipes of a mate, then passing it. I now submit cars for test with all metal brake pipes greased. Does anyone know what the tester's manual says about this?

I am with terry on this school of thought, I don't consider them to be seriously corroded, a clean up with some emery paper may well suffice.
Handbrake cable was replaced last year along with adjustment of shoes etc ,I had a look at them all then and seemed to be ok.

As a small piece of advice Kate go to a small local (if you have one) MOT place, don't go back to Halfruads ,which is where I think you went(but may be wrong)
All the best

I'd never go back to Hellfrauds. Thay are a bunch of con merchants.

I'm going to try and clean the pipes up first. You are right, there's probably nothing wrong with them.

As for the Mot, there's a place near me in Kelly Bray so I think I'll go there.

All the best to you too Andy.

[STEMO]

Stop whining, woman. Get someone who knows what they're doing, say....a man, to fix it for you, then you can wash his dirty clothes and make him a nice cup of tea.

[Kate]

Stop whining, woman. Get someone who knows what they're doing, say....a man, to fix it for you, then you can wash his dirty clothes and make him a nice cup of tea.

I'll fix it myself.

I do need a man though as I want to practice my boxing skills. STEMO I'll use your face as a punchbag.

[STEMO]

Stop whining, woman. Get someone who knows what they're doing, say....a man, to fix it for you, then you can wash his dirty clothes and make him a nice cup of tea.

I'll fix it myself.

I do need a man though as I want to practice my boxing skills. STEMO I'll use your face as a punchbag.

Mmmmmmmm......I like it rough....

[tunnie]

Slapped grease all over the brake pipes if both mine several years ago, road crap and mud stick to it, but don't show any rust. So far been ok with them 

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

I had to replace the rear brake pipes on my first Omega, it was a real pita of a job. Not technical though, just very annoying, time consuming, and required a lot of patience.

[terry paget]

Apart from saving all the effort and expense of replacing steel pipes with copper, the original steel pipes are much stronger than copper. I have never had any trouble removing the rear calipers to service the handbrake with steel pipes, but I had a copper pipe break a few days after a handbrake service. Before I submit a car for MOT I take all the wheels off and grease all the steel brake pipes. It's a bit of a fag, but it's easier that submitting car for retest.

[raywilb]

Apart from saving all the effort and expense of replacing steel pipes with copper, the original steel pipes are much stronger than copper. I have never had any trouble removing the rear calipers to service the handbrake with steel pipes, but I had a copper pipe break a few days after a handbrake service. Before I submit a car for MOT I take all the wheels off and grease all the steel brake pipes. It's a bit of a fag, but it's easier that submitting car for retest.

  when I first bought this mig that I'm driving and looked at its mot it had an advisory which related to rear brake pipes that were greased up. it seems they didn't like it.

[pernix]

if its just the rear brake pipes ie the ones running along the rear arms then it is an easy job and I would encourage you to do it
I have to replace my front to rear pipes and that is a job to far for me (its the getting the back high enough to run the left to right across the rear behind the subframe)
to be honest I am thinking along the lines of for me is it worth it total mot spend would be @ £3-400 and I know the geo needs setting so a spend of £500 looms

[terry paget]

Apart from saving all the effort and expense of replacing steel pipes with copper, the original steel pipes are much stronger than copper. I have never had any trouble removing the rear calipers to service the handbrake with steel pipes, but I had a copper pipe break a few days after a handbrake service. Before I submit a car for MOT I take all the wheels off and grease all the steel brake pipes. It's a bit of a fag, but it's easier that submitting car for retest.

  when I first bought this mig that I'm driving and looked at its mot it had an advisory which related to rear brake pipes that were greased up. it seems they didn't like it.

Not necessarily, just covering themselves. My previous tester would always advise 'cill covers fitted'. All Omegas have fitted cill covers, nothing unusual there. He was just saying he could not comment on their condition. Same applies to greasy brake pipes.

[Kate]

I had a look at the brake pipes and they don't look that bad:

https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=CFCF2657E747879F!4221&authkey=!ADlkTXL2lv44g18&v=3&ithint=photo%2cjpg

[terry paget]

I had a look at the brake pipes and they don't look that bad:

https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=CFCF2657E747879F!4221&authkey=!ADlkTXL2lv44g18&v=3&ithint=photo%2cjpg

Hard to judge from that picture, but you have little to lose by rubbing down that pipe with coarse glass paper and see how it comes up. If it comes up shiny and unpitted, take it back to the tester and he should pass it.

[Kate]

I had a look at the brake pipes and they don't look that bad:

https://onedrive.live.com/redir?resid=CFCF2657E747879F!4221&authkey=!ADlkTXL2lv44g18&v=3&ithint=photo%2cjpg

Hard to judge from that picture, but you have little to lose by rubbing down that pipe with coarse glass paper and see how it comes up. If it comes up shiny and unpitted, take it back to the tester and he should pass it.

I'm taking it to another test station as soon as I get all the little jobs done. I've still got to swap the back wheels round and there's one headlight left to fix. Then there's the anti roll bar link and the rear suspension arm. I've bought the anti roll bar link but I'm not sure how to fit it. I haven't bought the suspension arm yet.

I might take her for the mot again before the last to jobs are done and hope the tester isn't too strict.

I think Hellfrauds did the mot forensically and used a microscope the scamming bast**ds.

[terry paget]

Were all those items fail items or just advisories. If just advisories, don't bother with them now.

[Kate]

Were all those items fail items or just advisories. If just advisories, don't bother with them now.

They were all fail items.

[terry paget]

Were all those items fail items or just advisories. If just advisories, don't bother with them now.

They were all fail items.

Bad luck. I've never had a fail on a rear track rod, just advisories. A determined tester may find slight play in one of the end ball joints, but they don't knock like drop links.