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[feeutfo]

Thanks to Dbug btw.

No problem - couldn't have you recommending tyres without understanding tyre markings, speed ratings or loadings

?...well, this is it, tram lining is caused by too firm a tyre. Too firm a side wall. Not absorbing road imperfections and transmitting them to the rim/steering/driver. (Plus the other reasons most of which we've covered) according to the trade and "general" rules accepted re tram lining. As I understand it anyway...?

But are we seeing the vast majority of tram lining issues occurring on load ratings at 95 and below....? Some 95's are fine, some 94s and 93s are fine. But perhaps we start delving into lower softer construction ratings that might give issues. Under rated tyres effectively.

Do we, in fact, need to be looking on average at a firmer side wall/load rating, for the weight of this car?

The danger there might be that we might get into the real harsh side wall that makes a tyre bump over when fully loaded with lateral grip, doesn't absorb small bumps but bounces off them etc.

SMD's issues aside for a minute.

[dbug]

Thanks to Dbug btw.

No problem - couldn't have you recommending tyres without understanding tyre markings, speed ratings or loadings

?...well, this is it, tram lining is caused by too firm a tyre. Too firm a side wall. Not absorbing road imperfections and transmitting them to the rim/steering/driver. (Plus the other reasons most of which we've covered) according to the trade and "general" rules accepted re tram lining. As I understand it anyway...?

But are we seeing the vast majority of tram lining issues occurring on load ratings at 95 and below....? Some 95's are fine, some 94s and 93s are fine. But perhaps we start delving into lower softer construction ratings that might give issues. Under rated tyres effectively.

Do we, in fact, need to be looking on average at a firmer side wall/load rating, for the weight of this car?

The danger there might be that we might get into the real harsh side wall that makes a tyre bump over when fully loaded with lateral grip, doesn't absorb small bumps but bounces off them etc.

SMD's issues aside for a minute.

You're just starting to get there, but thats only part of the story 

[feeutfo]

Dbug, do you know the answers to this, after all the agro we've had on here with tram lining, yet said nothing?

I fully appreciate that there's a number of factors involved btw.

[dbug]

Dbug, do you know the answers to this, after all the agro we've had on here with tram lining, yet said nothing?

I fully appreciate that there's a number of factors involved btw.

Believe so but you thought you knew better, so I wasn't prepared to post as you become aggressive and rude when people disagree with you.  As has been mentioned I used to be involved in projects re tyre rubber compositions, as well as practically testing tyres for Dunlop and a well known race and sports car manufacturer.  But you know better.  However I have pm'd my opinions, in confidence, to another OOF member a while back.

[feeutfo]

Dbug, do you know the answers to this, after all the agro we've had on here with tram lining, yet said nothing?

I fully appreciate that there's a number of factors involved btw.

Believe so but you thought you knew better, so I wasn't prepared to post as you become aggressive and rude when people disagree with you.  As has been mentioned I used to be involved in projects re tyre rubber compositions, as well as practically testing tyres for Dunlop and a well known race and sports car manufacturer.  But you know better.  However I have pm'd my opinions, in confidence, to another OOF member a while back.

Doesn't suprise me at all Dbug. I actually get hacked off with obnoxious unpleasant attitudes. Something you've displayed as long as I've been a member here. Trouble is, IMO, I tend to respond in kind when I encounter them. That much I will accept. Quite happily. Although clearly, you won't.


Anyway. Your info won't be relevant unless it was tested on an omega. So no worries there.

[dbug]

Dbug, do you know the answers to this, after all the agro we've had on here with tram lining, yet said nothing?

I fully appreciate that there's a number of factors involved btw.

Believe so but you thought you knew better, so I wasn't prepared to post as you become aggressive and rude when people disagree with you.  As has been mentioned I used to be involved in projects re tyre rubber compositions, as well as practically testing tyres for Dunlop and a well known race and sports car manufacturer.  But you know better.  However I have pm'd my opinions, in confidence, to another OOF member a while back.

Doesn't suprise me at all Dbug. I actually get hacked off with obnoxious unpleasant attitudes. Something you've displayed as long as I've been a member here. Trouble is, IMO, I tend to respond in kind when I encounter them. That much I will accept. Quite happily. Although clearly, you won't.


Anyway. Your info won't be relevant unless it was tested on an omega. So no worries there.

No problem mate - as my info is not relevant, you continue on your way as your knowledge and experience on tyres, and their performance and testing, is obviously far greater than mine.  Glad to have helped you understand tyre markings, speed ratings and loadings.

I think the above highlights apply to you more than me

[feeutfo]

Dbug, do you know the answers to this, after all the agro we've had on here with tram lining, yet said nothing?

I fully appreciate that there's a number of factors involved btw.

Believe so but you thought you knew better, so I wasn't prepared to post as you become aggressive and rude when people disagree with you.  As has been mentioned I used to be involved in projects re tyre rubber compositions, as well as practically testing tyres for Dunlop and a well known race and sports car manufacturer.  But you know better.  However I have pm'd my opinions, in confidence, to another OOF member a while back.

Doesn't suprise me at all Dbug. I actually get hacked off with obnoxious unpleasant attitudes. Something you've displayed as long as I've been a member here. Trouble is, IMO, I tend to respond in kind when I encounter them. That much I will accept. Quite happily. Although clearly, you won't.


Anyway. Your info won't be relevant unless it was tested on an omega. So no worries there.

No problem mate - as my info is not relevant, you continue on your way as your knowledge and experience on tyres, and their performance and testing, is obviously far greater than mine.  Glad to have helped you understand tyre markings, speed ratings and loadings.

I think the above highlights apply to you more than me

Oh ffs, would you like us to get a room together? Or prefer to take your toys off and play elsewhere. Man up.

[dbug]

Dbug, do you know the answers to this, after all the agro we've had on here with tram lining, yet said nothing?

I fully appreciate that there's a number of factors involved btw.

Believe so but you thought you knew better, so I wasn't prepared to post as you become aggressive and rude when people disagree with you.  As has been mentioned I used to be involved in projects re tyre rubber compositions, as well as practically testing tyres for Dunlop and a well known race and sports car manufacturer.  But you know better.  However I have pm'd my opinions, in confidence, to another OOF member a while back.

Doesn't suprise me at all Dbug. I actually get hacked off with obnoxious unpleasant attitudes. Something you've displayed as long as I've been a member here. Trouble is, IMO, I tend to respond in kind when I encounter them. That much I will accept. Quite happily. Although clearly, you won't.


Anyway. Your info won't be relevant unless it was tested on an omega. So no worries there.

No problem mate - as my info is not relevant, you continue on your way as your knowledge and experience on tyres, and their performance and testing, is obviously far greater than mine.  Glad to have helped you understand tyre markings, speed ratings and loadings.

I think the above highlights apply to you more than me

Oh ffs, would you like us to get a room together? Or prefer to take your toys off and play elsewhere. Man up.

I've given my reasons for not posting technically on these many tyre threads, yet you still make unpleasant and personal posts - so I won't be further goaded by you - as always I'll let you have the last word

[feeutfo]

Any one else with input on load ratings?

[doz]

Only that if we're saying hi load ratings are causing tram lining how come the Falkerns suffer? They are 94/95 unless you buy the 453 will you get a 97 load ratings

[feeutfo]

Only that if we're saying hi load ratings are causing tram lining how come the Falkerns suffer? They are 94/95 unless you buy the 453 will you get a 97 load ratings

Currently working on the theory that higher load ratings "might" TL "less", not checked Falkens listings, but I guess they do a range of a few different loads. I have a FALKEN 912 here with a 92 rating, for example.

Unfortunately I don't have records of the Falkens I owned, other than knowing they where 451, 452 and 912 in stock sizes. I don't know the load ratings of them but memory is telling me 93. But then my memory is not to be trusted.

All those models felt like water balloons on each corner from new to me. It might be in inherent FALKEN thing, or the load ratings where too low, and the structure degraded internally within the tyre. A more sedate driver might not work the tyre to the same level and not encounter the problem at all.

Afaik 93 is the lowest permissible load for omega. ..? Maybe Falkens 93 load isn't the same as the load designated to oem tyres for omega....?

FALKEN are an aftermarket manufacturer, I believe? Not aware of them supplying factory fit?

[feeutfo]

To add, it looks like, on average, a 97 load tyre is less likely to tram line, than a tyre of 95 or lower.

So far anyway.

Hopefully I've understood your post correctly Doz?

[doz]

Aye it was me who got it the wrong way round 

Just for info.
452's are 94 rated
453's are 97
912's are 94
914's are 94

All the above are for 235/45/17.

Not had any dealings with the 453's but maybe they would work ok however at 93 quid a corner it is and expensive experiment. I use 452's on the rear of the LC and don't suffer to bad (bearing in mind they are 265 wide) however they only have a 40 profile so not that much to give I guess.

[doz]

and just to muddle things up further. Load rating may not stay the same if you change the tyre size. ie 265/40/17 453's are 100 rated. What a mess

[feeutfo]

Ok I'm a bit fuddled now.

Just for info.
452's are +           94 *
453's are +            97 *
912's are +.          94 *
914's are +.         94 *

Ok for clarity could you add the exact size and speed after the + sign. And what they are like for tram lining after the * sign. If you get a minute. Ta.