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[Andy B]

Judging by this quote, the Union didn't like the deal:

"The revised offer still falls a long way short of the cost of living crisis claim submitted by our members and their expectations. Unite senior reps are in discussions to decide next steps,"

4% uplift and a £2k bonus doesn't meet this year's cost of living uplift?! Unite must think we all came down with the last shower.

but the union itself doesn't have the final say, the members do.

I'll let you know if our 4.5% plus £1500 cash bunce (in two instalments) is accepted  ..... the union can suggest we accept it, but that doesn't mean to say it'll be accepted by the members. It should do, but there are always those that will reject any offer made by the 'management' because they think there's a chance of a little bit more.

[Doctor Gollum]

Which is fundamentally why my first company folded. They were pushing for 10%. Unfortunately, rather than focusing on building business they lost a couple of decent contracts and XL Airways folded. At that point with one contract, they were done.

Unless there's a guaranteed pot to meet the demand anything being demanded is wishful thinking, not an entitlement.

Unfortunately the unions seem unable to protect themselves by failing to grasp the fundamental point that the company needs to remain viable in order to promote growth and job security.

[Lizzie Zoom]

Which is fundamentally why my first company folded. They were pushing for 10%. Unfortunately, rather than focusing on building business they lost a couple of decent contracts and XL Airways folded. At that point with one contract, they were done.

Unless there's a guaranteed pot to meet the demand anything being demanded is wishful thinking, not an entitlement.

Unfortunately the unions seem unable to protect themselves by failing to grasp the fundamental point that the company needs to remain viable in order to promote growth and job security.

The Union bosses have not got the brain cells to understand that crucial commercial fact, that without profit a business is doomed and so are the jobs that go with it

[Viral_Jim]

Unfortunately the unions seem unable to protect themselves by failing to grasp the fundamental point that the company needs to remain viable in order to promote growth and job security.

Or, they just don't care, because at the end of the day the union pays it's higher-ups jolly well, so their jobs are safe regardless of what happens to the businesses they fu£k about with.

You only have to look at good ol' Len McLusky to see where the unions' priorities lie.

[STEMO]

The union leaders also seem unable to accept that companies are allowed to turn a profit. Indeed, they need to turn a profit for future investment.

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

In the case of the railway union the leaders are committed to stopping that sort of thing so we can march forward to the communist utopia.
Morons. 

[Sir Tigger KC]

Why do they call them Union Barons? 

Is it because they are the aristocracy of workers and are more equal than the others?   

[Andy B]

What have the unions ever done for us?

Apart from ....

For a start, unions stopped child labour. Unionised workplaces are safer, with 50% fewer accidents. Every year unions train 10,000 safety reps. Union members earn, on average, 12.5 per cent more than non-members. They have better job security, and stay in their jobs for an average of five years longer than non-members. Unionised workplaces have higher productivity and fewer industrial tribunals.

Apart from that, though, trade unions have only gained us paid holidays, maternity and paternity leave, paid sick leave, equal pay legislation, pensions, and workplace anti-discrimination laws. Oh, and the weekend. It was unions that fought for a five day working week.

And, of course, furlough was a result of unions negotiating with the government. We’ve all benefited by keeping the economy afloat.

[Sir Tigger KC]

How much of the £140m were the union going to see? Obviously the members wouldn't. 

It was investment in the factory at Kitt Green, bringing sauce back amongst other things, but at the expense of Ts & Cs ..... SFA to do with the union.

So did Heinz end up investing the £140m or not?   

[TheBoy]

The last train I was on was a steam train on the East Lancs Railway ..... and it will be the next time I'm on a train.

Train travel is expensive & isn't door to door like a car is.

The last time I got on a train was last November for a day trip to London from Axminster, Devon and the ticket was about £86 for a trip that's about 2 hrs 45 mins each way. 

Plus £6.50ish for car parking at the station and whatever the Travelcard was when I got to Londinium. About £12.50 I think? 

Shame as I like getting on the choo choo!                                                     

Sounds cheap, Tig.

A return to London from Bicester (travelcard, so includes the tube) is £80, plus £9.50 parking. Plus a 30 mile round trip to get to Bicester.

[Andy B]

How much of the £140m were the union going to see? Obviously the members wouldn't. 

It was investment in the factory at Kitt Green, bringing sauce back amongst other things, but at the expense of Ts & Cs ..... SFA to do with the union.

So did Heinz end up investing the £140m or not?   

No .... they didn't.
https://www.wigantoday.net/news/national/heinz-factorys-ps140m-sauce-deal-scrapped-3597898

https://www.business-humanrights.org/en/latest-news/uk-kraft-heinz-accused-of-betraying-workers-after-pulling-140-million-of-investment-from-wigan-factory-blaming-workers-who-rejected-package-of-conditions-measures/


Not so far anyway, though they'd done already done some preparatory electrical spade work.

Though it did NOT apply to me/other engineering workers, there was an implication of a pay reduction for the shop floor workers, something to do with a lower pay scale that was never used but would have been if the new Ts & Cs were implemented.
Sauce would have operated as a completely separate entity elsewhere on the site.

[TheBoy]

What have the unions ever done for us?

Apart from ....

For a start, unions stopped child labour. Unionised workplaces are safer, with 50% fewer accidents. Every year unions train 10,000 safety reps. Union members earn, on average, 12.5 per cent more than non-members. They have better job security, and stay in their jobs for an average of five years longer than non-members. Unionised workplaces have higher productivity and fewer industrial tribunals.

Apart from that, though, trade unions have only gained us paid holidays, maternity and paternity leave, paid sick leave, equal pay legislation, pensions, and workplace anti-discrimination laws. Oh, and the weekend. It was unions that fought for a five day working week.

And, of course, furlough was a result of unions negotiating with the government. We’ve all benefited by keeping the economy afloat.

I think its fair to say that the union that covers my role is spineless and pointless.  They think an average of around 2.5% pay rise is a good outcome.  They thought that all that offshoring was a grand plan.  All those redundancies were epic.  And the current new office locations requiring many to quadruple their daily commute is a superb idea.

Somehow, I don't think I'm seeing any value to my quite expensive subs, but they do enjoy a lot of jollys at my expense, so thats all OK.

[Sir Tigger KC]

The last train I was on was a steam train on the East Lancs Railway ..... and it will be the next time I'm on a train.

Train travel is expensive & isn't door to door like a car is.

The last time I got on a train was last November for a day trip to London from Axminster, Devon and the ticket was about £86 for a trip that's about 2 hrs 45 mins each way. 

Plus £6.50ish for car parking at the station and whatever the Travelcard was when I got to Londinium. About £12.50 I think? 

Shame as I like getting on the choo choo!                                                     

Sounds cheap, Tig.

A return to London from Bicester (travelcard, so includes the tube) is £80, plus £9.50 parking. Plus a 30 mile round trip to get to Bicester.

Maybe. I still live in the 1990's when it cost about £25! 

[Field Marshal Dr. Opti]

What have the unions ever done for us?

Apart from ....

For a start, unions stopped child labour. Unionised workplaces are safer, with 50% fewer accidents. Every year unions train 10,000 safety reps. Union members earn, on average, 12.5 per cent more than non-members. They have better job security, and stay in their jobs for an average of five years longer than non-members. Unionised workplaces have higher productivity and fewer industrial tribunals.

Apart from that, though, trade unions have only gained us paid holidays, maternity and paternity leave, paid sick leave, equal pay legislation, pensions, and workplace anti-discrimination laws. Oh, and the weekend. It was unions that fought for a five day working week.

And, of course, furlough was a result of unions negotiating with the government. We’ve all benefited by keeping the economy afloat.

I agree with this.....and there was certainly a need for the Labour party and the unions many years ago because the working man was regularly shit upon from a great height.

However, time has moved on and the unions of today are politically motivated.....the priority to bring down the democratically elected government of the day (usually Tory)

I would say that the Labour party of today has very little interest in the white working class. They are seen as an embarrassment. Minority groups are all the Labour party is interested in. They will certainly get 100% of the gay/trans/lesbian/ black vote.....but will it be enough for Starmer to get the keys to No10?

Not a fan of Boris and his Tory government either. With an overall majority of 80 he should have done far better.

[Migv6 le Frog Fan]

I agree with most of that. 
Considering his majority Boris should be half way through a new version of the Thatcher revolution by now.
It is said that he cant handle confrontation, and answers a lot of questions for me.