Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: korum on 22 July 2016, 16:31:18
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Just seen this on my facebook feed and wondered who is at fault for this.
https://www.facebook.com/tom.t.casey/videos/1012296805550933/
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Neither of them was driving very sensibly, were they? The car appeared to be tailgating and the bike was too close to the car. Technically, I guess the car driver was at fault for pulling out but, if you're gonna ride a bike in that manner, it's only a matter of time before you're doing 60 on your arse.
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The video didn't oprn.....
Ron.
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Simple: both of them.
Neither needed to overtake, and both did it badly. They were too close to each other and the vehicle they were passing, the bike was poorly positioned from the start of the maneuver for the car driver to see, if he even bothered to look.
None of that excuses the car driver leaving the scene.
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Fault of the car driver.
The bike rider was well into the overtake before the car pulled out.
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Fault of the car driver.
The bike rider was well into the overtake before the car pulled out.
Yep! :y
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Simple: both of them.
Neither needed to overtake, and both did it badly. They were too close to each other and the vehicle they were passing, the bike was poorly positioned from the start of the maneuver for the car driver to see, if he even bothered to look.
None of that excuses the car driver leaving the scene.
Have to agree with most of that... But it is possible that the car driver wasn't aware that he hit anything... especially if he had music on/was focused on the road ahead/pissed off at having a bike right up his arse...
The way some people ride around here it's a miracle more don't die. Being able to do 0-60+ in a nano second seems to give bikers a sense of entitlement, so much so that they go launching themselves in to all sorts of stupid situations of which this is a classic example.
Glad the bloke isn't dead, so he can hopefully learn from it.
Only issue with the car driver is leaving the scene, but they have a window to report it.
Talking of which, reporting original link as the comments aren't fit for general consumption ;)
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As a car driver, knowing I've got a couple of bikes following me, I'd be expecting them to use the next overtaking opportunity and I'd be VERY careful before doing so myself. Assuming he'd noticed the bikes following him, of course. ::)
As said, though, both were following too close, which led to a rushed manoeuvre on both counts, probably without the required mirror checks and signalling first.
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The bike wasn't right up his arse. ;) Biker did nothing wrong. Car driver needs shooting. Didn't bother checking behind before pulling out, and nearly killed someone.
As for leaving the scene. He needs shooting again for doing that. Your supposed to stop if anyone is injured. The biker must have had some sort of injuries, however minor, and for all the driver knew he might have been dead.
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As a car driver, knowing I've got a couple of bikes following me, I'd be expecting them to use the next overtaking opportunity and I'd be VERY careful before doing so myself. Assuming he'd noticed the bikes following him, of course. ::)
As said, though, both were following too close, which led to a rushed manoeuvre on both counts, probably without the required mirror checks and signalling first.
I agree with you there Kevin, I used to ride bikes so I always watch out for them, if I have one sat on my shoulder then I pull over slightly to let them past, I always like them to overtake first before I go as they have far better acceleration.
I`ll gamble that the car driver didn`t use his/her rear view or wing mirror at any point in that manouvre.
I had someone do the same thing to me years ago, I was in my car at the time overtaking another car and the daft t*@t just pulled out and started overtaking the car in front while I was along side >:(
Fortunately nothing was coming the other way and the road was wide enough for me to pull further over.
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Didn't see indicators used by either party. Car driver was completely oblivious to the bike.
But I've got to question if there has been anything else earlier in the ride that we haven't seen :-\
Oh... And both car and biker look like they were exceeding the speed limit :-X
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Didn't see indicators used by either party. Car driver was completely oblivious to the bike.
But I've got to question if there has been anything else earlier in the ride that we haven't seen :-\
Oh... And both car and biker look like they were exceeding the speed limit :-X
I wondered about that one too :y
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I remember years ago a boss telling me that there is no such thing as "Accidents", there is always a cause. If there is a cause then it is not an "accident".
This looks to me like competitive driving, by both. Or stupid driving, by both.
The bike should not be so close or so fast, unless it was some unlikely life or death situation
The car was either being bloody minded or unobservant, but in either event the bike should be considering that possibility.
There is too much emphasis on "who's fault" these days. Every road user has a responsibility to be safe and to engage in defensive driving. By defensive I mean always thinking "what if". This is an incredibly boring driving style, but you stay alive.
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At last I have managed to view that clip!
Since the road is clearly marked "SLOW", which indicates a need for caution due to a hazard ahead, should either of them bave contemplated overtaking there?
Ron.
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At last I have managed to view that clip!
Since the road is clearly marked "SLOW", which indicates a need for caution due to a hazard ahead, should either of them bave contemplated overtaking there?
Ron.
Exactly the point Ron. I suspect that there was something else going on earlier in the journey.
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I remember years ago a boss telling me that there is no such thing as "Accidents", there is always a cause. If there is a cause then it is not an "accident".
This looks to me like competitive driving, by both. Or stupid driving, by both.
The bike should not be so close or so fast, unless it was some unlikely life or death situation
The car was either being bloody minded or unobservant, but in either event the bike should be considering that possibility.
There is too much emphasis on "who's fault" these days. Every road user has a responsibility to be safe and to engage in defensive driving. By defensive I mean always thinking "what if". This is an incredibly boring driving style, but you stay alive.
The bike isn't particularily close and is obviously doing the same speed as the two cars in front of it. ;)
Inevitably, some are judging the actions of the bike rider as they would judge a car being driven, but bikes are very different in a few respects - physical size for one thing - and what would be tantamount to suicide in a car, could be an easy straightforward manoeuvre on a bike.
What did or didn't happen earlier is irrelevant imo, to call the car driver moronic would be an insult to morons everywhere.
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I remember years ago a boss telling me that there is no such thing as "Accidents", there is always a cause. If there is a cause then it is not an "accident".
This looks to me like competitive driving, by both. Or stupid driving, by both.
The bike should not be so close or so fast, unless it was some unlikely life or death situation
The car was either being bloody minded or unobservant, but in either event the bike should be considering that possibility.
There is too much emphasis on "who's fault" these days. Every road user has a responsibility to be safe and to engage in defensive driving. By defensive I mean always thinking "what if". This is an incredibly boring driving style, but you stay alive.
The bike isn't particularily close and is obviously doing the same speed as the two cars in front of it. ;)
Inevitably, some are judging the actions of the bike rider as they would judge a car being driven, but bikes are very different in a few respects - physical size for one thing - and what would be tantamount to suicide in a car, could be an easy straightforward manoeuvre on a bike.
What did or didn't happen earlier is irrelevant imo, to call the car driver moronic would be an insult to morons everywhere.
Yes. :y
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I would hate to ride a motorbike these days. You can see them eyeing you up at junctions and roundabouts because they're not sure you've seen them. Not a very pleasant way to get about, unless you're on the open road.
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Whatever happened earlier in the trip is totally irrelevant as the car driver was completely at fault. It was at best a stupid mistake with possible tragic consequences and at worst a nasty vindictive attack on the biker! >:(
I hope they track down the car and it's driver, and whoever it is faces the full force of the law. :y
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I would hate to ride a motorbike these days. You can see them eyeing you up at junctions and roundabouts because they're not sure you've seen them. Not a very pleasant way to get about, unless you're on the open road.
In your day the choice was between a Velocette or a Francis Barnett.
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Ive given up riding bikes now because the roads are too crowded, too many road users are idiots, too many speed cameras etc. and I'm too old to be getting hurt.
Having said that, since the sun came out I have felt the pull towards a Ducati 916. So far though, Ive resisted. ::)
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PLEASE stop talking about returning to motorbikes; this current hot weather is making me think about my Sunbeam S8 in myriad pieces in my garage! :'(
Ron.
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Screw all those myriad pieces back together Ron and you have around £6000 worth of bike.
Then sell it and buy something decent - like a Ducati 916. :y ;D
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Oi!
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Ive given up riding bikes now because the roads are too crowded, too many road users are idiots, too many speed cameras etc. and I'm too old to be getting hurt.
Having said that, since the sun came out I have felt the pull towards a Ducati 916. So far though, Ive resisted. ::)
Yup me too, Sunday mornings used to be great but not now, far too many idiots on the road and like you I`m getting too old to get hurt :y
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Car driver at fault without a doubt. Up until approximately -0.20 seconds into the clip the bike rider is 'riding the mirror' so as to be seen, he's also not THAT close to the car in front. At around -0.16 seconds into the clip he makes a sweeping manoeuvre, looks through the gap and goes for it. Any other time this would have been standard practice to hook the bike out for the big one, but either the car driver wasn't aware of how quick a bike can get up and go (doubtful) or they'd had some beef earlier.
Incidentally, this was how my riding days were ended. I was following a vehicle that had shown no interest in overtaking the car in front, I too was riding the mirror so that he could see me. I cogged down, even though I didn't need to, so he'd hear the pipes and then hooked it out for the big one. I got twa**ed in the side and knocked off the road. Would have come out of it with minor injuries, except for the abrupt stop as my bike, and my leg, slammed in to a concrete post. I must take a big chunk of the blame though due to my excessive speed.
Nothing physical or mental stops me riding, it's just that Mrs YZ said she doesn't want me riding again until I'm at least sixty, so that I have a full pension. ;D
Been on plenty of bikes since, I just never bought another one. Safer on the MotoX. ::)
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Car driver at fault without a doubt. Up until approximately -0.20 seconds into the clip the bike rider is 'riding the mirror' so as to be seen, he's also not THAT close to the car in front. At around -0.16 seconds into the clip he makes a sweeping manoeuvre, looks through the gap and goes for it. Any other time this would have been standard practice to hook the bike out for the big one, but either the car driver wasn't aware of how quick a bike can get up and go (doubtful) or they'd had some beef earlier.
Incidentally, this was how my riding days were ended. I was following a vehicle that had shown no interest in overtaking the car in front, I too was riding the mirror so that he could see me. I cogged down, even though I didn't need to, so he'd hear the pipes and then hooked it out for the big one. I got twa**ed in the side and knocked off the road. Would have come out of it with minor injuries, except for the abrupt stop as my bike, and my leg, slammed in to a concrete post. I must take a big chunk of the blame though due to my excessive speed.
Nothing physical or mental stops me riding, it's just that Mrs YZ said she doesn't want me riding again until I'm at least sixty, so that I have a full pension. ;D
Been on plenty of bikes since, I just never bought another one. Safer on the MotoX. ::)
Encountered similar when I owned my old FJ1200.
I came up behind a queue of seven or eight cars following a pensioner in a Rover 45, driving at about 35 MPH.
I briefly waited but nobody seemed interesting in overtaking. Hmmm.
Second gear and a big handful should take me past all of the cars.....and indeed it did(well almost)
Just as I was about to overtake the second car in the queue the driver decided it was finally time to overtake the coffin dodger in the Rover 45. My speed at this point was highly illegal.
Fearing I was going to smash straight into the rear of the car and with no time to even touch the brakes, I closed my eyes aimed for the small gap between car and curb.
My mistake for coming from so far back. Car drivers generally only check one car behind before pulling out.
It was scary.... :o
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I didn't say it wasn't the car driver at fault. But I still think there was some form of "incident" between car and bike earlier in the journey :-\
And the fact the bike can manoeuvre quickly isn't an excuse for speeding, which it still looks like both were doing ;)
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You don't speed ? :o :-X ;) :D
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I didn't say it wasn't the car driver at fault. But I still think there was some form of "incident" between car and bike earlier in the journey :-\
And the fact the bike can manoeuvre quickly isn't an excuse for speeding, which it still looks like both were doing ;)
If there was some sort of incident earlier and the car drivers actions were deliberate then he should be hunted down and charged with attempted murder! >:(
I don't think they were speeding either. It's probably a 60 limit, there's plenty of traffic and the following biker with the camera stopped pretty quickly. 50 -60? ;)
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I didn't say it wasn't the car driver at fault. But I still think there was some form of "incident" between car and bike earlier in the journey :-\
And the fact the bike can manoeuvre quickly isn't an excuse for speeding, which it still looks like both were doing ;)
If there was some sort of incident earlier and the car drivers actions were deliberate then he should be hunted down and charged with attempted murder! >:(
I don't think they were speeding either. It's probably a 60 limit, there's plenty of traffic and the following biker with the camera stopped pretty quickly. 50 -60? ;)
He didn't stop that quickly for a bike. And if they were doing 50-60 then the overtake would put them over the limit ;)
Agreed that any earlier footage should be reviewed and if the car driver's actions were clearly deliberate he should just be shot ::)
You don't speed ? :o :-X ;) :D
We aren't talking about me though... I haven't rammed a biker off the road ;)
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I didn't say it wasn't the car driver at fault. But I still think there was some form of "incident" between car and bike earlier in the journey :-\
And the fact the bike can manoeuvre quickly isn't an excuse for speeding, which it still looks like both were doing ;)
We,re talking about this comment. :P ;D
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I didn't say it wasn't the car driver at fault. But I still think there was some form of "incident" between car and bike earlier in the journey :-\
And the fact the bike can manoeuvre quickly isn't an excuse for speeding, which it still looks like both were doing ;)
We,re talking about this comment. :P ;D
What about it? :-\ ???
My comment still stands... We aren't talking about me though ;)