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Author Topic: Project LPG - LEMON :(  (Read 2790 times)

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JamesV6CDX

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Project LPG - LEMON :(
« on: 31 January 2007, 13:23:49 »

As per the title, I went to pick it up last night. It was located near Birmingham.

I took a phone call from the guy about 16:00, saying that they've just started it up, but it was running a bit lumpy, so could I wait another day. I said no, because I couldn't make any other days. He said it was only the plugs, and he would clean them before I got there. I didn't see it as being serious.

Arrived in B'ham at 18:36. Were in the right area, but couldn't find his place, so stopped by a pub and travel lodge and called him. He said really bluntly "Thought you were coming at 7:30 - you'll have to wait an hour." Didn't do much for my patience, but we went and had a drink in the pub.

Called him at 19:30 - phone off. About 8pm he finally called, saying he was looking for me and would meet me at the travel lodge. Very shifty looking short guy of foreign origin, seemed very impatient and rude.

Followed him back to his lockup, and there sat the Omega. It's clearly had a small impact on the drivers side - the trim around the light is a different colour (well spotted Tunnie!) - the headlight is broken, and the bumper looks a bit pushed in, as does the drivers wing. I wasn't happy that the bonnet sat square either, although it's not a mile out. Broken light on the back.

Directly behind the thing, was a whole pile of what I instantly recognised as 2.0 Ecotec engine parts. Exhaust/inlet manifold, all sorts.


Alarm bells...

Looked under the bonnet. Spark plug cover was off, LPG feed hose was off. Looked in coolant bottle - no antifreeze, just clear water. Looked on dipstick. Oil was BRAND NEW, it had just been changed. More alarm bells. A Trace of sludge on the top of the dipstick. None under filler cap.

Once I'd looked around the car, and re-fitted the breather and fuel hose, I wanted to start it up. The Guy then informs me that I cannot do this (even though he said he'd had it running earlier and I could drive it home). The reason he gave was that the key was broken.

I had a look, and the key itself had come away from the transponder. no problem I thought - hold the transponder near the barrel, and turn the key end with pliers. I should be so lucky. Wouldn't turn.

At this point, it was clear that the ignition barrel was shagged. With the steering lock on.

Asked the guy how he intended I got this car home - he was pretty rude and impatient, and practically told us to "do it somehow." He told me I'd already committed to purchasing a spares or repair car, so I must take it away.  BUT HE SAID IT DROVE!! *sigh*

Ok, clear head. Out with the tools. Can't get to all the screws, because I can't turn the wheel. So - undo the ones we can, and then bust off the steering column covers. He looked horrified. I didn't give a t*ss.

Off with wiper stalk and indicator stalk.

Out with the chisel, and hammer. Friend cuts a groove in one of the shear bolts holding on the ignition barrel assembly, and proceeds to tap it round. Lengthy job, but he got it. While he was doing this, I proceeded to attack the other shear bolt in a much more crude way, with a kilowatt Hammer drill! Once we'd got those, a few sharp thwacks with sammy the hammer, and off comes the assembly.

Right, steering free - so we can tow if necessary. But where's the fun in that we said - lets hotwire it! So, I taped the transponder to the reciever, while my friend Markie rebuilt the ignition "switch". He turned it with a pair of pliers, and we got ignition lights. We couldn't turn the engine AND keep the ignition lights on, but at least we had ignition lights.

At this point, the guy almost threw us out  ;D - so we attached the tow rope, and proceeded to tow it away behind the V6.

Got it down the road, with ignition lights on, and with a few attempts manage to bump start it. (It's a manual).

It ran, but wasn't just lumpy. It was a complete crock of sh1te, and was running on at most 3 cyls. (more to follow on that in General help soon).

Tow it to a garage just down the road, look at it in light. Can't get it to run any better with another DIS (Yes I took a spare!)

There was loads of oil/coolant etc burning off the manifold - it had clearly just had some form of major engine work done, and hadn't even been started since is my guess. Fuel seeping from feed pipe union.

Reckon there's something seriously wrong.

By this point, it's late, can't be arsed - time to just tow it home. Just as we had attached the chain, and pulled away, the D clamp broke, leaving us shafted. Getting upset now.

Went in the garage, thank lord they sold tow ropes.

(Police forum members look away now ;) )

Attaching the rope, police pull up. Buggery. We have a totally illegal car, with the ignition smashed up and the thing hotwired. Hmmmmmmm. Tow rope attached, and questionable whether or not we are licenced to pull it. No ON-TOW sign. Thought for a min the game was up, but thankfully they just got fuel and breaked off!

Right, get it home quick. Meega pulling Meega. Straight down the M5, 65mph all the way. With a £4.99 rope ;D .  Took a chance, but thankfully got off at our exit 60 miles later without incident.

Towed it back to my mates farm, where it's now sat, waiting for my TLC. Had a cuppa tea, and laughed long and hard about the nights events.

You may ask, why so cheerful after all that?

Well.......

About the only good thing that came out of last night...

IS THAT THE CAR HAS ACTUALLY GOT A MULTIPOINT SEQUENTIAL LPG KIT!!!!!

So, for £273, it's worth it for that, to transfer to a better Meega. So all is not lost.

Once (IF) I get the engine running on all 4, I'll make sure it runs on Gas, and take it from there. It wouldn't run on LPG when I tried, but not surprising, and no green lights, so probs tank empty.

Lesson of the day, always view a car before comitting to buy it!!!

Martin, I'll be in touch soon to discuss the LPG side of things :)
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tunnie

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #1 on: 31 January 2007, 13:35:47 »

Wow interesting night there m8!

Its just luck really, been lucky with my first to projects and very lucky with the overall condition of the Senator.

Glad you got it back and had all those tools!!

Fantastic its got the proper LPG install  :D - If i was not running the Senator i might have had that off you  ;)

Lets hope its a crap plug or something nice and simple  :y
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JamesV6CDX

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #2 on: 31 January 2007, 13:38:36 »

Quote
Lets hope its a crap plug or something nice and simple  :y

Pigs may fly...

I'm hinging more on something like incorrect valve timing following a rebuild... the engine was pinking like mad...

More to follow on that in help tonight :)
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tunnie

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #3 on: 31 January 2007, 13:42:28 »

Quote
Quote
Lets hope its a crap plug or something nice and simple  :y

Pigs may fly...

I'm hinging more on something like incorrect valve timing following a rebuild... the engine was pinking like mad...

More to follow on that in help tonight :)

Good luck on that, at least the LPG system is a decent one. You still needing those seats collected?
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JamesV6CDX

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #4 on: 31 January 2007, 13:50:21 »

Yes please Tunnie, Sunday should be great, and they're all paid for!!
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tunnie

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #5 on: 31 January 2007, 13:54:22 »

Quote
Yes please Tunnie, Sunday should be great, and they're all paid for!!

 :y
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Markie

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #6 on: 31 January 2007, 14:12:49 »

that was a good read on my break  :y seems to a bit of a rouge does the seller  :-/
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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #7 on: 31 January 2007, 14:32:45 »

No doubt a bit late now, but I would have ensured that I had a quick snapshot of their faces on a camera phone.....  Just in case....

I would also suggest you make sure that you keep all receipts and/or any bill of sale safe.

Did you pass details of your home location to the seller?  Seems he was less than happy to let you see where he lived...  Personally, if I were in your shoes, I would be quite wary of what I have just purchased -  an LPG system and a load of spares, probably scrapping/breaking the rest??  

Just my tuppence..   :-/
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JamesV6CDX

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #8 on: 31 January 2007, 16:00:34 »

He gave me a full reciept for it. I also paid by debit card (I have the reciept) so he has a registered business that takes cards.

I saw his warehouse - basically full of crashed cars.

I'm going to have a good look at the car on my day off in daylight, but as you say, may be only worth the LPG kit (all I really wanted, they are a lot of ££ new for SGI kits..)

I have also got the new keepers suppliment from the V5, and the MOT cert which has literally just expired. I should have asked him why it's been sat for 6 months, if it's only just expired. Didn't think about that.

Check out www.cybersalvagecars.com - that's them. They sell cars for a few £k, so I doubt they had much time for this one...



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JamesV6CDX

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #9 on: 31 January 2007, 16:02:25 »

I didn't give him any address, BUT he would have been given it by ebay when I won the auction.

Be interested in when I get the logbook...

Now I've got the MOT number etc, I could also do a HPI check if it's worth it?
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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #10 on: 31 January 2007, 16:08:00 »

Well I would also look underneath at the chasis mate before trying to get the engine running.

Oh and while you're at it, check the engine & chasis no.

I'm just a suspicious old so and so...

Still, you won't lose on it.
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Martin_1962

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #11 on: 31 January 2007, 18:48:49 »

Oh dear - so the seller was a total tosser - need to leave interesting feedback about 5 minutes before it times out!!!!

I suppose if you can get it to run it will be worth playing with - what LPG system is installed?
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JamesV6CDX

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #12 on: 31 January 2007, 18:51:09 »

Quote
Oh dear - so the seller was a total tosser - need to leave interesting feedback about 5 minutes before it times out!!!!

I suppose if you can get it to run it will be worth playing with - what LPG system is installed?

Not yet sure on the make, but there are stickers everywhere "installed by Avon Autogas".

It's definately a sequential, multi injection one.

Martin - if this car turns out to be a pile of crap, what's the feasability of transferring the LPG kit onto a better 2.0? Guessing it would be easy because I could just take the existing inlet manifold across, saving on drilling more holes?
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Taxi_Driver

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #13 on: 31 January 2007, 18:59:48 »

Quote
Quote
Oh dear - so the seller was a total tosser - need to leave interesting feedback about 5 minutes before it times out!!!!

I suppose if you can get it to run it will be worth playing with - what LPG system is installed?

Not yet sure on the make, but there are stickers everywhere "installed by Avon Autogas".

It's definately a sequential, multi injection one.

Martin - if this car turns out to be a pile of crap, what's the feasability of transferring the LPG kit onto a better 2.0? Guessing it would be easy because I could just take the existing inlet manifold across, saving on drilling more holes?

Yes it should be possible to do that....just hope the gas tank is empty and the reason it wont run on lpg!
Id be tempted if you can it running on petrol ok to shove a fiver of gas in it to see it will run on gas....tho dont be suprised if it wont straight away....you might have to keep flicking the switch a bit to start with....as i have come across this...a lpg system that been dry for a while seems to get air in....so you have to get rid of that first  :y

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Martin_1962

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #14 on: 31 January 2007, 19:08:16 »

Quote
Quote
Oh dear - so the seller was a total tosser - need to leave interesting feedback about 5 minutes before it times out!!!!

I suppose if you can get it to run it will be worth playing with - what LPG system is installed?

Not yet sure on the make, but there are stickers everywhere "installed by Avon Autogas".

It's definately a sequential, multi injection one.

Martin - if this car turns out to be a pile of crap, what's the feasability of transferring the LPG kit onto a better 2.0? Guessing it would be easy because I could just take the existing inlet manifold across, saving on drilling more holes?

Very feasable, gas will slowly leak away if nearly empty 6 months would lose the rest.

But you will need lots of pipework.

Can you photo the ECU, Evaporator and injectors and I'll see if it matches anything or I can ask a local expert
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JamesV6CDX

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #15 on: 31 January 2007, 19:10:07 »

Quote
Quote
Quote
Oh dear - so the seller was a total tosser - need to leave interesting feedback about 5 minutes before it times out!!!!

I suppose if you can get it to run it will be worth playing with - what LPG system is installed?

Not yet sure on the make, but there are stickers everywhere "installed by Avon Autogas".

It's definately a sequential, multi injection one.

Martin - if this car turns out to be a pile of crap, what's the feasability of transferring the LPG kit onto a better 2.0? Guessing it would be easy because I could just take the existing inlet manifold across, saving on drilling more holes?

Very feasable, gas will slowly leak away if nearly empty 6 months would lose the rest.

But you will need lots of pipework.

Can you photo the ECU, Evaporator and injectors and I'll see if it matches anything or I can ask a local expert

Of course I can photo it all - but what are you thinking? :)
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Martin_1962

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #16 on: 31 January 2007, 20:11:46 »

Quote
Quote
Quote
Quote
Oh dear - so the seller was a total tosser - need to leave interesting feedback about 5 minutes before it times out!!!!

I suppose if you can get it to run it will be worth playing with - what LPG system is installed?

Not yet sure on the make, but there are stickers everywhere "installed by Avon Autogas".

It's definately a sequential, multi injection one.

Martin - if this car turns out to be a pile of crap, what's the feasability of transferring the LPG kit onto a better 2.0? Guessing it would be easy because I could just take the existing inlet manifold across, saving on drilling more holes?

Very feasable, gas will slowly leak away if nearly empty 6 months would lose the rest.

But you will need lots of pipework.

Can you photo the ECU, Evaporator and injectors and I'll see if it matches anything or I can ask a local expert

Of course I can photo it all - but what are you thinking? :)


Need to know what make it is for spares ect. - I have emailed Avon Autogas to see if they know.
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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #17 on: 31 January 2007, 21:04:50 »

What a tale.  Can't say anymore  [smiley=tekst-toppie.gif]
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JamesV6CDX

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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #18 on: 05 February 2007, 03:47:01 »

Well, I had a look at this car in daylight yesterday, and to be honest, if I get the ignition barrel sorted, and get the engine running, it's not that bad. That bit of trim that's a different colour is making it look very bad, and I could soon replace/respray that.

The bonnet closing issue I now believe is actually to do with the catch, because looking at the bonnet in natural light it's actually OK.

The interior is a little bit grubby, but it's worth bearing in mind that, I have a set of mint leather.

The plan is this:

Try and get the engine going OK, if it won't be costly.

IF I get the engine going, next step is to give it a quick test drive (on a private road of course!) and test it on GAS.

IF it drives ok and runs on GAS, Take it for MOT

IF it passes MOT without much needed, then rip out all the interior, rip out and renew / clean the carpet, and fit the leather.

IF any of the above doesn't happen, then it's back to plan B, which is to remove the LPG kit and find a better Meega to fit it to.

Either way, I have now got a couple of days off, and I finish at 3pm every other day this week, so I'll have a couple of hours each night to tinker - hence hopefully we'll have some more conclusive results by the end of the week at latest!!

« Last Edit: 05 February 2007, 04:24:38 by JamesV6CDX »
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Re: Project LPG - LEMON :(
« Reply #19 on: 05 February 2007, 10:41:28 »

Good luck with this one - sorry to hear of your troubles in collecting the car.

Hopefully, you will be able to get it running and a new MOT on it. [smiley=thumbup.gif]
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