Omega Owners Forum

Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
Advanced search  

News:

Please check the Forum Guidelines at the top of the Newbie section

Pages: 1 2 3 [All]   Go Down

Author Topic: Mobile Phone Cons  (Read 2987 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Mr Skrunts

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Skruntie Land.
  • Posts: 25471
  • 3.O Elite Saloon with all the toys,
    • 2003 CD 2.2 Auto
    • View Profile
Mobile Phone Cons
« on: 28 March 2021, 08:18:12 »

Thought the car accident calls might have stopped by now, but No, I still get them.

We all know there is a scam , but are they actually aster or are they just harvesting data in some way.

My usual responce when asked about my car accident.

Is it the the Bentley of Lambo you are ringing about?


or

Which one, which day, I had 5 accidents this week.


or

You tell me you have the details in front of you.

or

. . . . . . . . . Speak then
Logged
Ask yourself :  " WHY do I believe in what I believe?"

Remember that my opinions expressed here are not representative of the opinions of other members on the OOF Forum.

Rangie

  • Omega Lord
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Lincolnshire
  • Posts: 5398
    • RRS TDV8 Subaru Forester
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #1 on: 28 March 2021, 08:42:03 »

I usually add the 7 people that I killed & I know it was stupid to drink & drive but it was an accident I didn't mean to do it , funny thing though they always hang up on me..😀
« Last Edit: 28 March 2021, 08:44:36 by Rangie »
Logged
Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level & beat you with their experience.

Mr Skrunts

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Skruntie Land.
  • Posts: 25471
  • 3.O Elite Saloon with all the toys,
    • 2003 CD 2.2 Auto
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #2 on: 28 March 2021, 09:44:26 »

Also random phone calls where probably a PC dialed I pick up and no one at the other end as they are waiting for someone to pick up. or they just hang up . . .  why ring in the 1st place, or are they just making a list of confirmed active numbers.
Logged
Ask yourself :  " WHY do I believe in what I believe?"

Remember that my opinions expressed here are not representative of the opinions of other members on the OOF Forum.

Mr Skrunts

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Skruntie Land.
  • Posts: 25471
  • 3.O Elite Saloon with all the toys,
    • 2003 CD 2.2 Auto
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #3 on: 28 March 2021, 09:46:46 »

Micky take on the phone calls is I have a spare phone that only 2 people know the number for (poor reception on the other 2 depending on area (thats annother thread))  but yet there are 2 calls a day at least from numbers all over the country.
Logged
Ask yourself :  " WHY do I believe in what I believe?"

Remember that my opinions expressed here are not representative of the opinions of other members on the OOF Forum.

TheBoy

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Brackley, Northants
  • Posts: 105915
  • I Like Lockdown
    • Whatever Starts
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #4 on: 28 March 2021, 18:11:37 »

Firstly, dont be stupid enough to give your phone number to anybody you dont want to have it, including TPS.

Secondly, playing along will get you on the suckers list...   ...although to get the call usually means you are already on it.
Logged
Grumpy old man

Mr Skrunts

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Skruntie Land.
  • Posts: 25471
  • 3.O Elite Saloon with all the toys,
    • 2003 CD 2.2 Auto
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #5 on: 28 March 2021, 19:41:17 »

Firstly, dont be stupid enough to give your phone number to anybody you dont want to have it, including TPS.

Secondly, playing along will get you on the suckers list...   ...although to get the call usually means you are already on it.

I dont even pick the phone up to see who is ringing.  All my friends get different ring tones. (Both of them)
Logged
Ask yourself :  " WHY do I believe in what I believe?"

Remember that my opinions expressed here are not representative of the opinions of other members on the OOF Forum.

Broomies Mate

  • Omega Baron
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Bristol, UK
  • Posts: 3840
    • Stuff!
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #6 on: 28 March 2021, 19:49:22 »

I dont even pick the phone up to see who is ringing.  All my friends get different ring tones. (Both of them)


This says you do!


Thought the car accident calls might have stopped by now, but No, I still get them.

We all know there is a scam , but are they actually aster or are they just harvesting data in some way.

My usual responce when asked about my car accident.

Is it the the Bentley of Lambo you are ringing about?


or

Which one, which day, I had 5 accidents this week.


or

You tell me you have the details in front of you.

or

. . . . . . . . . Speak then
Logged
2004 Saab 9-5 Aero Merlot Red Stg1 noobtune
2009 Saab 9-5 Turbo Edition Titan Grey Stg3 noobtune
2017 Vauxhall Vivaro L1H1 125PS Star Silver

Mr Skrunts

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Skruntie Land.
  • Posts: 25471
  • 3.O Elite Saloon with all the toys,
    • 2003 CD 2.2 Auto
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #7 on: 29 March 2021, 07:06:29 »

I dont even pick the phone up to see who is ringing.  All my friends get different ring tones. (Both of them)


This says you do!


Thought the car accident calls might have stopped by now, but No, I still get them.

We all know there is a scam , but are they actually aster or are they just harvesting data in some way.

My usual responce when asked about my car accident.

Is it the the Bentley of Lambo you are ringing about?


or

Which one, which day, I had 5 accidents this week.


or

You tell me you have the details in front of you.

or

. . . . . . . . . Speak then

HAHA fair point

I did this on my main phone (Three) got fed up now its a waste of my time

My Plusnet phone I get 2/3 calls a day from numbers all over the country.  I just ignore them.

Logged
Ask yourself :  " WHY do I believe in what I believe?"

Remember that my opinions expressed here are not representative of the opinions of other members on the OOF Forum.

YZ250

  • Omega Baron
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Oxford/Bucks border
  • Posts: 4172
    • Black 3.2 Elite Estate
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #8 on: 29 March 2021, 09:38:55 »

I get hardly any unknown calls to my mobile but within the last week I've received two scam text messages. One from Royal Mail to say that there was a £1.49 charge due for an undelivered parcel and to click on the link, and one from the Halifax to warn of a possible unauthorised login to online banking and to click on the link.
As both messages could be partially seen on screen without opening them, and the fact that I'm not expecting a parcel and I don't bank with the Halifax, they both got deleted without the need to open them. Still hacks you off though that someone is up to no good.
Logged
My fun car is a 2020 Bmw F32 430d M Sport with indicators.
My cruiser is an Audi A6 Avant S Line Black Edition with indicators.

deviator

  • Omega Knight
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Chesterfield
  • Posts: 1398
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #9 on: 29 March 2021, 11:40:14 »

Note down the number they call you from and next time you get a call, tell me them your battery is going flat, can they call you back on this number. Give them the number of the previous Indian call centre.

Let them argue between themselves. I had 'Carphone Warehouse' (It wasn't) ringing Carphone Warehouse in London ;)
Logged
FCR and cam lock off kit available. Deposit maybe required. Contact me.

Mr Skrunts

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Skruntie Land.
  • Posts: 25471
  • 3.O Elite Saloon with all the toys,
    • 2003 CD 2.2 Auto
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #10 on: 29 March 2021, 11:47:17 »

I have recently had a text saying my account had been suspended due to abnormal behavior (even though its still getting used)

I got the overdue parcel charge one as well.

Had a few from the scamers regards building society accounts as well.

I have known for years the banking groups, the Tax man etc (Had a few txts for that as well) never send text messasges or detailed emails, they may send a message telling you there is a message when you log in.

The confusing one for me after the advice above was when I go into online banking I often get a link for a safer login method, I wont even try even if it is from the banks, simply because if they recomended it I would have the option once logged in to use it next time round.
Logged
Ask yourself :  " WHY do I believe in what I believe?"

Remember that my opinions expressed here are not representative of the opinions of other members on the OOF Forum.

Mr Skrunts

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Skruntie Land.
  • Posts: 25471
  • 3.O Elite Saloon with all the toys,
    • 2003 CD 2.2 Auto
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #11 on: 29 March 2021, 11:52:54 »

A lot of calls in the past have come through on a local STD code and for the sake of wondering who it was they got answered, when they have an accent I allways get inquisitive and ask where they are from, and ask then , where are you calling from.  Was gobsmaked when one lad said he was calling from Mumbai and using my local STD code. :-\
Logged
Ask yourself :  " WHY do I believe in what I believe?"

Remember that my opinions expressed here are not representative of the opinions of other members on the OOF Forum.

STEMO

  • Omega Lord
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 8350
    • Astra 1.6 diesel
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #12 on: 29 March 2021, 13:05:19 »

A lot of calls in the past have come through on a local STD code and for the sake of wondering who it was they got answered, when they have an accent I allways get inquisitive and ask where they are from, and ask then , where are you calling from.  Was gobsmaked when one lad said he was calling from Mumbai and using my local STD code. :-\
Number spoofing has been used for quite a while now. Despite what these so called 'street wise' people who have been conned say, I reckon you'd have to be a bit retarded to fall for any of these scams.
Logged
Diesel till I die

Andy B

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Bury Lancs
  • Posts: 39466
    • ML350 TDM SmartRoadster
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #13 on: 29 March 2021, 13:51:28 »

....
 and one from the Halifax to warn of a possible unauthorised login to online banking and to click on the link.
 ....

My wife got that too, she does bank with the Halifax and started to get into a panic and was going to click the link. Fortunately I just said it'll be a scam & to log into her account her usual way ..... It was a scam
Logged

Field Marshal Dr. Opti

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Utopia
  • Posts: 31613
  • Speaking sense, not Woke PC crap
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #14 on: 29 March 2021, 14:06:06 »

I rarely get the 'you were in an accident call'

When I do I tell them the crash proved fatal and resulted in my demise.

.......this doesn't seem to deter them though... ;D

Logged

Rangie

  • Omega Lord
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Lincolnshire
  • Posts: 5398
    • RRS TDV8 Subaru Forester
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #15 on: 29 March 2021, 14:13:19 »

When I get one of these calls there is always a delay before they speak + you can hear other scammers in the background it's a dead giveaway , had one last week who rang on the house phone & asked " who am I speaking to" , who do you want it to be pal was my reply you rang me ? He hung up without saying another word.
Logged
Never argue with stupid people, they will drag you down to their level & beat you with their experience.

Mr Skrunts

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Skruntie Land.
  • Posts: 25471
  • 3.O Elite Saloon with all the toys,
    • 2003 CD 2.2 Auto
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #16 on: 29 March 2021, 14:32:14 »

As I said when I 1st posted, what are they hopeing to gain.

We know these calls are a scam

They know its a scam.

We all have insurance companies to deal with our car accident scams

Plus on top of all this I thought "Cold Calling" was illegal now?
Logged
Ask yourself :  " WHY do I believe in what I believe?"

Remember that my opinions expressed here are not representative of the opinions of other members on the OOF Forum.

deviator

  • Omega Knight
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Chesterfield
  • Posts: 1398
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #17 on: 29 March 2021, 14:43:28 »

Plus on top of all this I thought "Cold Calling" was illegal now?

It is, but I think the Indian police have bigger fish to fry.

There is no way to stop it really. You can let all your calls go to answering machine and leave a message saying, 'Hi I screen my calls, if you want a call back, leave a message'.

I argued with one last week, claiming he was from Carphone Warehouse. I told him he wasn't, be he was so insistent. I said, well delete my number and stop phoning me. He replied, I can't unless I get a sale. I pointed out that if he was CPW, he would have to comply to my legal request. I also pointed out, I don't believe your name, your company or your phone number. What makes you think I'm going to give you any of my details?
Logged
FCR and cam lock off kit available. Deposit maybe required. Contact me.

Doctor Gollum

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • In a colds and darks puddleses
  • Posts: 28172
  • If you can't eat them, join them...
    • Feetses.
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #18 on: 29 March 2021, 14:54:53 »

I doubt call centre factories in Bangalore give a flying monkey shit about the legality of what they do.

They possibly use them for staff training courses as part of the induction process into genuine corporate call centres, although I doubt it.

As for the why... it depends on the type of scam, but basically to get your money into their pockets either by making you pay for summat you'll never receive or to make use of something that you've already paid for or harvesting your data and selling it to the highest bidders such as global conglomerates or any company that wants your data but can't 'legally' get it without your permission.
Logged
Onanists always think outside the box.

TheBoy

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Brackley, Northants
  • Posts: 105915
  • I Like Lockdown
    • Whatever Starts
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #19 on: 29 March 2021, 20:16:40 »

A lot of calls in the past have come through on a local STD code and for the sake of wondering who it was they got answered, when they have an accent I allways get inquisitive and ask where they are from, and ask then , where are you calling from.  Was gobsmaked when one lad said he was calling from Mumbai and using my local STD code. :-\
Number spoofing has been used for quite a while now. Despite what these so called 'street wise' people who have been conned say, I reckon you'd have to be a bit retarded to fall for any of these scams.
When sending a GSM SMS, you actually include the sender ID as part of the message.  Now most phones dont allow you to adjust this, but any proper SMS application certainly does.

So beyond trivial to spoof text messages
Logged
Grumpy old man

TheBoy

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Brackley, Northants
  • Posts: 105915
  • I Like Lockdown
    • Whatever Starts
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #20 on: 29 March 2021, 20:20:28 »

As I said when I 1st posted, what are they hopeing to gain.
British public are stupid.

They only need a handful to believe them to make it worthwhile.

And the British public are stupid.


It clearly is working for them, else these would slowly dry up.


Oh, and the British public are pretty gullible. And stupid.
Logged
Grumpy old man

STEMO

  • Omega Lord
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 8350
    • Astra 1.6 diesel
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #21 on: 29 March 2021, 20:21:46 »

A lot of calls in the past have come through on a local STD code and for the sake of wondering who it was they got answered, when they have an accent I allways get inquisitive and ask where they are from, and ask then , where are you calling from.  Was gobsmaked when one lad said he was calling from Mumbai and using my local STD code. :-\
Number spoofing has been used for quite a while now. Despite what these so called 'street wise' people who have been conned say, I reckon you'd have to be a bit retarded to fall for any of these scams.
When sending a GSM SMS, you actually include the sender ID as part of the message.  Now most phones dont allow you to adjust this, but any proper SMS application certainly does.

So beyond trivial to spoof text messages
Maybe, but Skruntie said calls, and any scam call centre worth it's salt can easily do that.
Logged
Diesel till I die

STEMO

  • Omega Lord
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 8350
    • Astra 1.6 diesel
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #22 on: 29 March 2021, 20:24:11 »

Jim Browning is an interesting watch.
Logged
Diesel till I die

TheBoy

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Brackley, Northants
  • Posts: 105915
  • I Like Lockdown
    • Whatever Starts
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #23 on: 29 March 2021, 20:26:57 »

A lot of calls in the past have come through on a local STD code and for the sake of wondering who it was they got answered, when they have an accent I allways get inquisitive and ask where they are from, and ask then , where are you calling from.  Was gobsmaked when one lad said he was calling from Mumbai and using my local STD code. :-\
Number spoofing has been used for quite a while now. Despite what these so called 'street wise' people who have been conned say, I reckon you'd have to be a bit retarded to fall for any of these scams.
When sending a GSM SMS, you actually include the sender ID as part of the message.  Now most phones dont allow you to adjust this, but any proper SMS application certainly does.

So beyond trivial to spoof text messages
Maybe, but Skruntie said calls, and any scam call centre worth it's salt can easily do that.
Indeed. But I was getting across even little jonny can do it from his bedroom whilst mummy thinks he's doing his homework :)
Logged
Grumpy old man

STEMO

  • Omega Lord
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Posts: 8350
    • Astra 1.6 diesel
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #24 on: 29 March 2021, 20:29:07 »

A lot of calls in the past have come through on a local STD code and for the sake of wondering who it was they got answered, when they have an accent I allways get inquisitive and ask where they are from, and ask then , where are you calling from.  Was gobsmaked when one lad said he was calling from Mumbai and using my local STD code. :-\
Number spoofing has been used for quite a while now. Despite what these so called 'street wise' people who have been conned say, I reckon you'd have to be a bit retarded to fall for any of these scams.
When sending a GSM SMS, you actually include the sender ID as part of the message.  Now most phones dont allow you to adjust this, but any proper SMS application certainly does.

So beyond trivial to spoof text messages
Maybe, but Skruntie said calls, and any scam call centre worth it's salt can easily do that.
Indeed. But I was getting across even little jonny can do it from his bedroom whilst mummy thinks he's doing his homework :)
There are lots of things little Jonny can do in his bedroom, unbeknown to his mummy  ;D
Logged
Diesel till I die

Doctor Gollum

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • In a colds and darks puddleses
  • Posts: 28172
  • If you can't eat them, join them...
    • Feetses.
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #25 on: 29 March 2021, 20:39:04 »

Come again :o
Logged
Onanists always think outside the box.

Field Marshal Dr. Opti

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Utopia
  • Posts: 31613
  • Speaking sense, not Woke PC crap
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #26 on: 30 March 2021, 13:10:00 »

A lot of calls in the past have come through on a local STD code and for the sake of wondering who it was they got answered, when they have an accent I allways get inquisitive and ask where they are from, and ask then , where are you calling from.  Was gobsmaked when one lad said he was calling from Mumbai and using my local STD code. :-\
Number spoofing has been used for quite a while now. Despite what these so called 'street wise' people who have been conned say, I reckon you'd have to be a bit retarded to fall for any of these scams.
When sending a GSM SMS, you actually include the sender ID as part of the message.  Now most phones dont allow you to adjust this, but any proper SMS application certainly does.

So beyond trivial to spoof text messages
Maybe, but Skruntie said calls, and any scam call centre worth it's salt can easily do that.
Indeed. But I was getting across even little jonny can do it from his bedroom whilst mummy thinks he's doing his homework :)
There are lots of things little Jonny can do in his bedroom, unbeknown to his mummy  ;D

Yes. But most of them end up as a 'sticky mess'.... 8)
Logged

YZ250

  • Omega Baron
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Oxford/Bucks border
  • Posts: 4172
    • Black 3.2 Elite Estate
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #27 on: 30 March 2021, 16:52:52 »

As I said when I 1st posted, what are they hopeing to gain.
British public are stupid.

They only need a handful to believe them to make it worthwhile.

And the British public are stupid.


It clearly is working for them, else these would slowly dry up.


Oh, and the British public are pretty gullible. And stupid.

Credit where it's due TB, you had the opportunity to answer bluntly and curtly, but no, you took the extra time to make sure that your reply was both articulate and finessed. Well done.  :y  :)  .................... ;D
Logged
My fun car is a 2020 Bmw F32 430d M Sport with indicators.
My cruiser is an Audi A6 Avant S Line Black Edition with indicators.

Lizzie Zoom

  • Omega Lord
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Female
  • South
  • Posts: 7370
    • Omega 3.2 V6 ELITE 2003
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #28 on: 30 March 2021, 17:23:17 »

As I said when I 1st posted, what are they hopeing to gain.
British public are stupid.

They only need a handful to believe them to make it worthwhile.

And the British public are stupid.


It clearly is working for them, else these would slowly dry up.


Oh, and the British public are pretty gullible. And stupid.

Yes, all regrettably correct TB :y

That is why so many hand over thousands of pounds, often their life savings, they have withdrawn from their bank on the instructions of the "police" to couriers who call on the doorstep ::) ::) :'( :'( :'( :'(
Logged

TheBoy

  • Administrator
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Brackley, Northants
  • Posts: 105915
  • I Like Lockdown
    • Whatever Starts
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #29 on: 30 March 2021, 17:56:16 »

Credit where it's due TB, you had the opportunity to answer bluntly and curtly, but no, you took the extra time to make sure that your reply was both articulate and finessed. Well done.  :y  :)  .................... ;D
Why Thank you Mr Yz.

I really do think the tablets to help me discover a new, softer, me are really helping.
Logged
Grumpy old man

YZ250

  • Omega Baron
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Oxford/Bucks border
  • Posts: 4172
    • Black 3.2 Elite Estate
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #30 on: 30 March 2021, 18:00:30 »

Credit where it's due TB, you had the opportunity to answer bluntly and curtly, but no, you took the extra time to make sure that your reply was both articulate and finessed. Well done.  :y  :)  .................... ;D
Why Thank you Mr Yz.

I really do think the tablets to help me discover a new, softer, me are really helping.

 ;D ;D  :y
Logged
My fun car is a 2020 Bmw F32 430d M Sport with indicators.
My cruiser is an Audi A6 Avant S Line Black Edition with indicators.

Mr Skrunts

  • Get A Life!!
  • *****
  • Offline Offline
  • Gender: Male
  • Skruntie Land.
  • Posts: 25471
  • 3.O Elite Saloon with all the toys,
    • 2003 CD 2.2 Auto
    • View Profile
Re: Mobile Phone Cons
« Reply #31 on: 05 April 2021, 14:17:47 »

Cant believe it's Bank Holiday and the buggers are at it again.

After the 1st ignored mobile call, 10 mins later the land rings.  so as no one other than family and thre NHS know this number I picked it up to be askedabout the damage caused to my house.    Is this the latest cold call scam starting?
Logged
Ask yourself :  " WHY do I believe in what I believe?"

Remember that my opinions expressed here are not representative of the opinions of other members on the OOF Forum.
Pages: 1 2 3 [All]   Go Up
 

Page created in 0.047 seconds with 21 queries.