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[Andiman]

Hello all,

As promised (in the new members section) I am requesting someone's knowledge and ideas on a problem I have. Please please please someone shed a bit of light on this one?

Ok, have been looking for an Omega for some time now, always been into my Vauxhalls, and found a different one the other day.

It is an N reg (1996) Omega 2.0 Select petrol with LPG conversion on it. No tax, but MOT until July next year. At £400 I snapped it up - totally skinted me, but couldn't afford to turn it down.

Have only driven it once, but that was enough for me. I noticed this problem at the time, but figured that it should be curable. However now I think  need a few clues.

Right, the clutch takes right at the top of the peddle, so thinking either new clutch or cable needs adjusting - will be looking into that later. Not a problem.

No water / mayo in the header tank, on the dipstick, or under the filler cap. All fine there. Header tank holds pressure and car gets warm. Not seen if it overheats at all, but when you first turn the blower on, faint smell of old water.antifreeze blows out of the vents for a couple of seconds or so then it settles down. Odd, but not horrendous.

Enough waffling, down to the problem. The stupid thing hates loathes and detests hills. It loses power - to the point where you have to drop it into first and floor it to get up them. This is only in petrol mode - the gas needs a refill so not had chance to test that yet. Never come across this problem before, so was wondering if it could be the cat? No other ideas.

The engine (which has done 182000 miles) purrs and is so quiet in the cabin. The gearbox is still solid - most cars at that sort of mileage have a gearstick that feels like you are stirring porridge, but this is excellent so no wear as such on the brushes. the gas appears to be ok, but as previously stated, not tested that yet. All electrics are working except the sunroof - but I think it needs reprogramming. Found that bit in the book! Got to program up  a remote keyfob that should arrive today (tenner off ebay!)

So may have a dud, or it may be a good one - hopefully a good one as generally don't have much luck on cars.

If anyone could come up with any ideas, I will be indebted to them.

cheers

Andi  

[TheBoy]

Hello all,

As promised (in the new members section) I am requesting someone's knowledge and ideas on a problem I have. Please please please someone shed a bit of light on this one?

Ok, have been looking for an Omega for some time now, always been into my Vauxhalls, and found a different one the other day.

It is an N reg (1996) Omega 2.0 Select petrol with LPG conversion on it. No tax, but MOT until July next year. At £400 I snapped it up - totally skinted me, but couldn't afford to turn it down.

Have only driven it once, but that was enough for me. I noticed this problem at the time, but figured that it should be curable. However now I think  need a few clues.

Right, the clutch takes right at the top of the peddle, so thinking either new clutch or cable needs adjusting - will be looking into that later. Not a problem.

No water / mayo in the header tank, on the dipstick, or under the filler cap. All fine there. Header tank holds pressure and car gets warm. Not seen if it overheats at all, but when you first turn the blower on, faint smell of old water.antifreeze blows out of the vents for a couple of seconds or so then it settles down. Odd, but not horrendous.

Enough waffling, down to the problem. The stupid thing hates loathes and detests hills. It loses power - to the point where you have to drop it into first and floor it to get up them. This is only in petrol mode - the gas needs a refill so not had chance to test that yet. Never come across this problem before, so was wondering if it could be the cat? No other ideas.

The engine (which has done 182000 miles) purrs and is so quiet in the cabin. The gearbox is still solid - most cars at that sort of mileage have a gearstick that feels like you are stirring porridge, but this is excellent so no wear as such on the brushes. the gas appears to be ok, but as previously stated, not tested that yet. All electrics are working except the sunroof - but I think it needs reprogramming. Found that bit in the book! Got to program up  a remote keyfob that should arrive today (tenner off ebay!)

So may have a dud, or it may be a good one - hopefully a good one as generally don't have much luck on cars.

If anyone could come up with any ideas, I will be indebted to them.

cheers

Andi  

Runs fine on the flat then, just hills?

BTW, they keyfob won't work without being programmed to car.  If its the radio type (as opposed to older infra red), this will require a Tech2, and you will also need your immobiliser PIN (which is on your 'carpass')

[TheBoy]

With regarded to the lack of power, I'm thinking along lines of DIS, though I suspect one of the experts will have a better idea.

Whatever, it would be advisable to also clean the breather system on it.

[nixoro]

Ok having read your post as jaime says I would firstly check the breather system and make sure there are no leaks coming from the exhaust.

Just curious but is the engine management light on at any point when the engine is running.

Your lack of power uphill could be caused by the clutch slipping.

Do the revs go up but the speed stay the same or should I say take a while to catch up, what do the brakes feel like, any signs of clutch fluid drop in the brake/clutch filler pot under the bonnet.

[Matchless]

Can you confirm the engine management light (EML) behaviour please.

Should come on when ignition turned on then go off as soon as engine started.


(just want to be sure that a previous owner / mechanic hasnt removed the bulb to hide a problem)

[Andiman]

Hi folks,

firstly, many thanks for coming back so quickly.

I have just spoken to the previous owner who has lost the security code/carpass info - so have spoken to Vauxhall and they will furnish me a copy at the extremely generous' (sic) price of 20 quid. Gee, thanks Vauxhall!

Moving on, there appears to be no clutch slip - the engine doesn't race at all. The brakes feel fine and I must admit having only had the car dropped off late last night I haven't had chance to do any more than start it this morning - it started first turn of the key, so quite impressed there.

Oh and the sunroof reprogrammed perfectly - so more good news.

With regards to TheBoy's comment about the keyfob - total agreement with you there, the one I have bought is the type that integrates with a key - and won't play ball at all! Bugger!  

The exhaust does not appear to be leaking - very quiet. No noticable loss of fluid under the car, but will check under the bonnet shortly.

Right, the management light.
This appears to have taken a long and much wanted holiday. No evidence of the bulb lighting up at any time - as I said previously, am very fond of Vauxhalls, so know that it should light on and just before engine start, but it is noticable by its absence. Possible bulb blown - or something more mysterious - ie removed. Hope only bulb blown, need to strip the dashboard out - anyone know how to do that? Done it on a '96 Vectra before, but unsure about this car as am always worried about the airbags.

Will check the breather system - the rocker cover has leaked oil out and this is apparent on the engine and a small amount on the gearbox from this leak. Highly suspicious of blocked air throughway.

Any other ideas?

Cheers

Andi

[Bo Bo]

There's a "how to" in the maintenance section, click here, only takes a few minutes.

[nixoro]

When you have the engine management light working I would be tempted to try the paperclip test mentioned in the FAQ section

May show some new or old codes affecting the running.

http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/YaBB.pl?num=1152601768

[Andiman]

Thanks for that Bo Bo, will go and have a play in a few minutes. Question.... is it best to drop the power to the battery to do this as I know on Vectras the airbag warning light can come on and stay on otherwise.

I am thinking this would be wise to do anyway?

cheers

Andi

[nixoro]

Thanks for that Bo Bo, will go and have a play in a few minutes. Question.... is it best to drop the power to the battery to do this as I know on Vectras the airbag warning light can come on and stay on otherwise.

I am thinking this would be wise to do anyway?

cheers

Andi

I usually do this with the battery disconnected also make sure you have the radio code handy and also you will need to reset the one touch windows and the sunroof.

Make sure the car isn't run at any time with the dash missing as when its all back together the airbag light will show.

HTH

[Andiman]

Nice one guys,

Am now armed with a toolkit and some butter knives - and a missus howling "No, no, it is fine, leave it alone' - she has so much faith in me  

Will be back on here shotly - will swap the bulb out with the dash headlight bulb - don't need that one for the moment. Never got spare bulbs when you need them  

Be back shortly.

Cheers

Andi

[TheBoy]

I fear the bulb is missing to hide a fault...  ....there are some scumbags out there  

[Andiman]

I agree!

The bulb was missing - replaced it with the headlight bulb.

Did the test.

Oh fun!

16

135

61


Found 16 - knock sensor signal circuit fault (what the hell is that?) - I know what the knock sensor is, but reading no voltage change  

135 - not a clue!

61 - Fuel tank vent valve low voltage - not a clue.

BTW now the computer isn't working! Never had a radio in it when I got it, so computer side doesn't work, but now no date or time!

ARSE!  


Andi  

[TheBoy]

Fix knock sensor first - that will really hold it back, the other codes may disappear.

Rare for knock sensor itself to fail, often the cable damaged.

Sorry, not sure where it is on 4 pot engines...

[TheBoy]

Computer will work without radio.  Possibly the movement having dash out has caused the old bulbs in display to blow...

[Andiman]

Update to my last post -

Just realised that this car runs the Motronic as it is the 8V - so I now know what the 135 is - it says the EML light is not working! HA HA that is like the old PC joke on startup - no keyboard present, press f1 to continue!


Question, I think TheBoy is right, the knock sensor is either playing up, knackered or not plugged - but how do I totally reset the ECU to clear all faults and start again?

Appreciate the input so far guys  


Andi

[TheBoy]

The codes will slowly disappear (30 clean starts iirc).  But EML will not come on when faults fixed.

(knock sensor won't bring EML on until 2 - 3k rpm)

[STMO123]

The 61 fuel valve vent valve could be the answer to your lack of power. As you empty the tank the vacuum created needs to be replaced with air, if not, the fuel delivery will be slow.

[Andiman]

Sounds interesting...

However, don't currently have a copy of the Haynes manual, so really don't know

1. How to access the fuel tank - is there access through the boot or the back seat?
2. Where the knock sensor actually is.

can anyone shed any light on these for me?

I have found info on the fuel valve which states that either cleaning the contacts or buying a new one repairs the problem (!!!) - hte former would be preferable at the mo as am skint!

Cheers to all

Andi

[Ken T]

Hi Andi,
According to Haynes, the knock sensor is mounted on the centre of the right hand side of the cylinder block. However the picture, viewed from the front of the car, shows it to be on the left side (!), and about 1" above the end of the starter. It says easiest to get access from under the car. The cable apears to go into the loom which has the starter solenoid cable. You can access the fuel tank pump and gauge sender via a flap in the boot floor, but I can't find anything on the fuel valve.
Cheers Ken  

[Martin_1962]

Fuel Filter - when you have gas you won't bother running much on petrol.

Bulbs - just buy a full set for the dash - not too expensive and worth doing, someone here will have the list

[Andiman]

Ken, thanks for that info - getting darkish and wet here so will attempt to tackle / check those tomorrow.

Martin, interesting idea - hadn't thought of that at all. What do you think are the chances of the fuel filter causing the cut-out / power-down going up-hill? Am still going to check the otehr things mentioned by the guys on here as well. Is the fuel filter easy to get to and easy to replace?

Cheers

Andi

[TheBoy]

Ken, thanks for that info - getting darkish and wet here so will attempt to tackle / check those tomorrow.

Martin, interesting idea - hadn't thought of that at all. What do you think are the chances of the fuel filter causing the cut-out / power-down going up-hill? Am still going to check the otehr things mentioned by the guys on here as well. Is the fuel filter easy to get to and easy to replace?

Cheers

Andi

If that knock sensor fault is still valid (and not old stored code) that really will cause you a prob....  ....sort that out, hopefully other stuff will then fall into place.

Of course, no harm in changing consumable stuff like fuel filters...

[Martin_1962]

Fuel filter restricts flow of go juice so when you need the fuel it isn't there.

Fix the fault codes first, then get some gas

[mark68710_0]

If I remember rightly 135 is wrong voltage on bulb for the engine management light.
Are the dash and eml bulbs the same?

[mark68710_0]

Sorry just caught up with page 2.

[Andiman]

Ok folks, an update!

After sitting on my arse for a few days, reading everything I can find, listening to you guys and dissecting an old TIS that I found (from a previous Vectra that I owned a few years ago) I discovered all I could about this knock sensor.

So I waited for it to stop raining and reset the ECU by dropping the battery for 24 hours and then turning ignition on until all lights (except the EML) go out then turning it off 30 times (without starting it). I had a fiddle and couldn't work out where the cable to the knock sensor went. I d/c the ECU (after dropping the battery again) and reseated it. I pulled gently on the sensor cable and then pushed that lovely (sic) protection plastic over it - and guess what?

It worked! Light off, revved the nuts off it, no light! Took it for a spin - perfect! No missing or hissy fits! Not tackled a hill yet tho... Next week will be attempting that I hope.

Right, found that the clutch is hydraulic - a surprise as I had no idea they weren't cable driven. Got to get it bled I think, may solve the problem. Optionally I have been told that the clutch pedal may be on a ratchet system that auto adjusts and may need re-adjusting in the footwell - not sure about that!

Not much more to do then I hope we will be home free!

Watch this space for the next series of the Andiman bursting into tears and rocking in the corner, dribbling over more financial outlay!

Cheers

Andi

[STMO123]

Thats more or less what happened to me Andi. It was a break in the cable leading to the knock sensor. Had to replace it in the end.

[Markjay]

Hi Andi,
According to Haynes, the knock sensor is mounted on the centre of the right hand side of the cylinder block. However the picture, viewed from the front of the car, shows it to be on the left side (!), and about 1" above the end of the starter. It says easiest to get access from under the car. The cable apears to go into the loom which has the starter solenoid cable. You can access the fuel tank pump and gauge sender via a flap in the boot floor, but I can't find anything on the fuel valve.
Cheers Ken  

Haynes' right-and-left are when viewed from the driver's seat (that's a standard in the motor industry apparently).

[Markjay]

Ok folks, an update!

After sitting on my arse for a few days, reading everything I can find, listening to you guys and dissecting an old TIS that I found (from a previous Vectra that I owned a few years ago) I discovered all I could about this knock sensor.

So I waited for it to stop raining and reset the ECU by dropping the battery for 24 hours and then turning ignition on until all lights (except the EML) go out then turning it off 30 times (without starting it). I had a fiddle and couldn't work out where the cable to the knock sensor went. I d/c the ECU (after dropping the battery again) and reseated it. I pulled gently on the sensor cable and then pushed that lovely (sic) protection plastic over it - and guess what?

It worked! Light off, revved the nuts off it, no light! Took it for a spin - perfect! No missing or hissy fits! Not tackled a hill yet tho... Next week will be attempting that I hope.

Right, found that the clutch is hydraulic - a surprise as I had no idea they weren't cable driven. Got to get it bled I think, may solve the problem. Optionally I have been told that the clutch pedal may be on a ratchet system that auto adjusts and may need re-adjusting in the footwell - not sure about that!

Not much more to do then I hope we will be home free!

Watch this space for the next series of the Andiman bursting into tears and rocking in the corner, dribbling over more financial outlay!

Cheers

Andi

Clutch – friction plate wear or air in the system will typically result on low engagement, not high. Have you compared this with another Omega? I haven’t driven a manual Omega so can’t comment, but I had another car long time ago with hydraulic clutch, and the feel was very different to a normal cable-driven one – it did feel high and ‘notchy’ rather the progressive. So this could be normal – maybe someone else here with a manual can advise.

Otherwise it could be that non-OE clutch was fitted, maybe with different thickness or pressure plate or other part of the mechanism that is different than the original unit - but I am guessing here.

[Markjay]

Considering that the hill-climbing problem only happens with petrol and not with gas, it is likely to be the fuel system that is at fault… and the fact that it only happens uphill and not when accelerating hard on level ground, suggests fuel system is probably having difficulties pumping up the fuel against gravity.

I would start with replacing the fuel filter (as suggested before), then checking the fuel pump – though you will need some kit to check the pressure in the fuel system. Also, again as mentioned before, maybe the fuel tank vent could be at fault. But start with Fuel filter… it is located underneath the car in the rear just in front of the fuel tank.

[Markjay]

As for anti-freeze smell from the blower, this suggests a leak in the heater matrix… check the expansion bottle carefully, are you loosing any coolant at all? Getting to the heater matrix is a pain, but needs to be done (or disconnect it) because left to its own devices it will eventually result in a wet carpets…

[TheBoy]

Ok folks, an update!

After sitting on my arse for a few days, reading everything I can find, listening to you guys and dissecting an old TIS that I found (from a previous Vectra that I owned a few years ago) I discovered all I could about this knock sensor.

So I waited for it to stop raining and reset the ECU by dropping the battery for 24 hours and then turning ignition on until all lights (except the EML) go out then turning it off 30 times (without starting it). I had a fiddle and couldn't work out where the cable to the knock sensor went. I d/c the ECU (after dropping the battery again) and reseated it. I pulled gently on the sensor cable and then pushed that lovely (sic) protection plastic over it - and guess what?

It worked! Light off, revved the nuts off it, no light! Took it for a spin - perfect! No missing or hissy fits! Not tackled a hill yet tho... Next week will be attempting that I hope.

Right, found that the clutch is hydraulic - a surprise as I had no idea they weren't cable driven. Got to get it bled I think, may solve the problem. Optionally I have been told that the clutch pedal may be on a ratchet system that auto adjusts and may need re-adjusting in the footwell - not sure about that!

Not much more to do then I hope we will be home free!

Watch this space for the next series of the Andiman bursting into tears and rocking in the corner, dribbling over more financial outlay!

Cheers

Andi

Glad that seems to have solved it, though it may be worth thinking about replacing it (around £40 for part IIRC).  Also, worth following Markjay's advice with fuel filter...

[Andiman]

Hi folks,

Thanks for coming back to me and not giving up!

Not had a chance to try it on Gas yet Markjay, will be doing so when the car is road legal (hopefully next week). Will change the fuel filter as matter of course I think.

With regards to the fuel vent, I have found the cover in the boot, but the gas bottle is well and truly bolted down on top of it! The thought of having to unbolt and move the cannister before playing in that area fills me with dread, but as there is no light on at the mo, I am oing to keep an eye on it and see if one is not tied in with the idea.

Watch this space - and thanks again for all your help.

Andi