Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: Rob James on 08 April 2008, 09:39:25
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I don't know if any of you have seen the email doing the rounds at them moment about opening your car with your mobile phone?
Basically you stand by your car with your phone, ring someone who has another set of keys (as you have locked yours in your car). This person presses the unlock button on the key and this transmits the signal from their mobile phone to yours, your phone then transmits the signal and it unlocks your car! See http://www.wsdmag.com/Article/ArticleID/13453/13453.html
We didn't believe it at work so we tried it, and it works (only mobile to mobile). Anyone have any ideas how this works?
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I really don't believe it does work. I have worked on the signalling stacks used in mobile phones for 16 years and there is no mechanism by which it can "relay" the output of the key fob to another mobile.
How far away was the fob when you tried this? Does it work if it's a mile or two away?
Kevin
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I don't believe this for one second - it assumes that for whatever reason, the 'transmitting' mobile phone would pick up a frequency from the keyfob and see fit to piggyback it through the transmitters.
still, I'm going to try it for sh*ts and giggles ;D
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I work for a leading telecoms company
i have a comprehensive understanding of how voice is transmitted via radio on mobiles and on landlines
mobiles use a 9.6k this is preety bad which is why you can tell the differnence in voice on mobile vs landline mobiles also use TDMA which mean when you stop talking the network closes the cct down for a milisecond to save bandwidth on the cell
it wont work simple as that not even over a 64k pstn line the signalling mobiles use is designed to carry voice and can handle data but barely!!!
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Did an expreriment on the TV the other week and it just did not work
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Did an expreriment on the TV the other week and it just did not work
You were on TV? ::)
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I was very sceptical, but I assure you it worked! When I read it I dismissed it out of hand, but one of my colleagues persuaded me to give it a go.
The only thing I can think of is that the aerial picks it up, encodes it, sends it across the mobile network and the the receiving phone decodes and transmits it. I don't know if it will work for all cars, or even with all mobile phones. One thing I did find was that I had to press the key fob a couple of times. I suggest you give it ago and see what happens (if you can find a willing volunteer to help you!).
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I was very sceptical, but I assure you it worked! When I read it I dismissed it out of hand, but one of my colleagues persuaded me to give it a go.
The only thing I can think of is that the aerial picks it up, encodes it, sends it across the mobile network and the the receiving phone decodes and transmits it. I don't know if it will work for all cars, or even with all mobile phones. One thing I did find was that I had to press the key fob a couple of times. I suggest you give it ago and see what happens (if you can find a willing volunteer to help you!).
That would require a dedicated transceiver in side the mobile at the key fob frequency of 433 MHz (there are several others too, 418, etc...) and also an infrared transceiver compatible with the fobs in case you've got an old style fob. It would require software to decode and recode the key fob signal and also some means to transfer it between the phones. I can assure you that none of this exists inside a mobile phone.
As has been mentioned a speech coder is used to transfer speech from mobile to mobile and it has no provision for multiplexing in this type of data in with the speech.
Kevin
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its not a speech coder its a timeslot on a 2mbit that gets sent through a voice switch and sent on its route through the operators transmission bearer network C7 signalling info would also have to be modified in order to carry this data and theres no chance that it has been set up to do it you would have to have some serious kit to transmit a 433mhz signal via a wireless speech path
my opinion is its nonsense
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its not a speech coder its a timeslot on a 2mbit that gets sent through a voice switch and sent on its route through the operators transmission bearer network C7 signalling info would also have to be modified in order to carry this data and theres no chance that it has been set up to do it you would have to have some serious kit to transmit a 433mhz signal via a wireless speech path
my opinion is its nonsense
I totally and wholeheartedly agree !! ( what with I have no idea !! :) )
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the conversations in the link is really funny ;D
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wasnt there a watch a while ago that used to be able to pick up on car alarm signals, it also changed tv channels too. casio i think it was
i had a mobile a few yrs ago that used to be able to run the bath for me and get the dinner on the table when i sent a text to a certain set of 11 digits. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
richie
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the conversations in the link is really funny ;D
Yeah, you're right, actually. ;D
This one was good and to the point, I thought:
Can you hear the signal from your key fob? Does your keyfob make a sound?
NO is doesn't therefore it is not generating a sound wave, therefore the microphone cannot pick it up and cannot turn it into a signal that it can generate and send!...how hard is that to comprehend?
;D
Kevin
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wasnt there a watch a while ago that used to be able to pick up on car alarm signals, it also changed tv channels too. casio i think it was
Casio PC-Unite? I had one for a while. Got fed up with it cos it was so rather hard to tell the time let alone do anything else with it.
i had a mobile a few yrs ago that used to be able to run the bath for me and get the dinner on the table when i sent a text to a certain set of 11 digits. ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
richie
Yeah, I've got one of them. Not very reliable though. Every so often it seems to throw a hissy fit and then the voice activation fails for a couple of days. Seems to do this about every 28 days... :-/
;)
Kevin
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I agree completely, as far as I can understand it shouldn't work - however having tried it and seen it working I know that it does work.
the conversations in the link is really funny ;D
Yeah, you're right, actually. ;D
This one was good and to the point, I thought:
Can you hear the signal from your key fob? Does your keyfob make a sound?
NO is doesn't therefore it is not generating a sound wave, therefore the microphone cannot pick it up and cannot turn it into a signal that it can generate and send!...how hard is that to comprehend?
;D
Kevin
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had to try it so me and my son have just tried it with our mobiles.
guess what the result was???
NO WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
richie
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I'm going to have to try it again. Next time I'm in the office with someone who wants to have a test I'll give it another go. When I did it I had to have the fob right against the phone.
had to try it so me and my son have just tried it with our mobiles.
guess what the result was???
NO WAY!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
richie
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Sometimes i park the car on the drive, press the keyfob to lock it then walk to the house pointing the key @ the front door only to unlock the car again but not the house!!!!!! I do really......D'oh!!!!!!!!! ;D
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Sometimes i park the car on the drive, press the keyfob to lock it then walk to the house pointing the key @ the front door only to unlock the car again but not the house!!!!!! I do really......D'oh!!!!!!!!! ;D
LMAO, I've never done that honest. ;) ;)
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well have to say we had a vectra witch i taxied and was about to go on a job while i was getting the keys out of my pocket along with my phone,the phone rang and the car opened,so i got the other lads out to see if it was the phone that done it,and it was,it seemed to be when right befor it rang like it makes the radio go when you know your mob is going to ring .
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Well just tried it and, IT WORKS!!...
Well sort off, come to the conclusion only works on the old ETAC system and not GSM or PCN. tried it using my SE K800i no joy, so having now locked the keys in the Car tried it with my old ETAC NEC 9A brick.
Job done, ..lots of glass every where though.
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^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
lol!
The omega remote locking is sh$t at the best of times so I would be rather surprised at this! ;D
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Well just tried it and, IT WORKS!!...
Well sort off, come to the conclusion only works on the old ETAC system and not GSM or PCN. tried it using my SE K800i no joy, so having now locked the keys in the Car tried it with my old ETAC NEC 9A brick.
Job done, ..lots of glass every where though.
;D ;D ;D
Mobiles have come a long way. When I first started working with them every one was a potential offensive weapon. These days, sit down with them in your back pocket and they snap in half.
Kevin
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The only thing I can think of is that the phone transmitter stage is picking up the fob RF signal and effectively boosting it......would be an interesting test with 3-4miles between the phones and car.....
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The only thing I can think of is that the phone transmitter stage is picking up the fob RF signal and effectively boosting it......would be an interesting test with 3-4miles between the phones and car.....
They do have pretty broadband PAs in them. :-/
If they were that susceptible to picking up radiated emissions and amplifying them I'd wonder how they remained stable though.
Kevin
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Surely something of an 'urban myth'; I`m with P.T Barnum on such matters :y....look how even someone of the stature of Eric Laithwaite fell for one! :o
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I'd suggest sending it in to MythBusters (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/MythBusters) for analysis but it's a bit boring. I'd rather watch them blow something up. :y
Kevin
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As an aside why does the range of the rf fob seem to extend when you hold it to your head and operate it?
Is my brain an rf amp??? ;D
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As an aside why does the range of the rf fob seem to extend when you hold it to your head and operate it?
Is my brain an rf amp??? ;D
.....probably not! ;D
But it may be a receiver: I have heard that some folk`s noggins will receive instructions from aliens (or deities)! :o
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As an aside why does the range of the rf fob seem to extend when you hold it to your head and operate it?
Is my brain an rf amp??? ;D
.....probably not! ;D
But it may be a receiver: I have heard that some folk`s noggins will receive instructions from aliens (or deities)! :o
Ahhh that'll be the voices then, wondered where they came from. ;D ;D
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As an aside why does the range of the rf fob seem to extend when you hold it to your head and operate it?
Is my brain an rf amp??? ;D
.....probably not! ;D
But it may be a receiver: I have heard that some folk`s noggins will receive instructions from aliens (or deities)! :o
Ahhh that'll be the voices then, wondered where they came from. ;D ;D
......You hear `em too?
......`even the ones about buying an axe! :o
;D ;D
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......`even the ones about buying an axe! :o
;D ;D
That's nothing...
Mate of mine once had a dream about lining up all his mates on the school playing field and gunning them down with a machine gun.
He's now a tactical firearms officer. :o
Kevin
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......`even the ones about buying an axe! :o
;D ;D
That's nothing...
Mate of mine once had a dream about lining up all his mates on the school playing field and gunning them down with a machine gun.
He's now a tactical firearms officer. :o
Kevin
:o So-much for Psychometrics eh? :o
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As an aside why does the range of the rf fob seem to extend when you hold it to your head and operate it?
Is my brain an rf amp??? ;D
There are a number of theories, the main one I can sort of get my head round is that your skull is acting as a cavity which either works as a matching device to the remotes internal aerial or the RF waves are getting inside your skull and are being directed by your eye sockets towards the car.......
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As an aside why does the range of the rf fob seem to extend when you hold it to your head and operate it?
Is my brain an rf amp??? ;D
There are a number of theories, the main one I can sort of get my head round is that your skull is acting as a cavity which either works as a matching device to the remotes internal aerial or the RF waves are getting inside your skull and are being directed by your eye sockets towards the car.......
::) I`ve some metal-coated shades; I feel a definitive test is called for!.....I might condider a change of name if it works: Ann Tenna, Dai Pole or Miss Yagi;D
......but please; no jokes about 'Base-Loading': "Does my balun look big in this?"
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As an aside why does the range of the rf fob seem to extend when you hold it to your head and operate it?
Is my brain an rf amp??? ;D
There are a number of theories, the main one I can sort of get my head round is that your skull is acting as a cavity which either works as a matching device to the remotes internal aerial or the RF waves are getting inside your skull and are being directed by your eye sockets towards the car.......
::) I`ve some metal-coated shades; I feel a definitive test is called for!.....I might condider a change of name if it works: Ann Tenna, Dai Pole or Miss Yagi;D
......but please; no jokes about 'Base-Loading': "Does my balun look big in this?"
I guess that might be the best approach.....one other option was to not look at the car but, how would you know if it had worked or not....
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As an aside why does the range of the rf fob seem to extend when you hold it to your head and operate it?
Is my brain an rf amp??? ;D
There are a number of theories, the main one I can sort of get my head round is that your skull is acting as a cavity which either works as a matching device to the remotes internal aerial or the RF waves are getting inside your skull and are being directed by your eye sockets towards the car.......
::) I`ve some metal-coated shades; I feel a definitive test is called for!.....I might condider a change of name if it works: Ann Tenna, Dai Pole or Miss Yagi;D
......but please; no jokes about 'Base-Loading': "Does my balun look big in this?"
I guess that might be the best approach.....one other option was to not look at the car but, how would you know if it had worked or not....
So now i'm a sort of ray gun. How cool is that.
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I guess that might be the best approach.....one other option was to not look at the car but, how would you know if it had worked or not....
.....don`t start-me on that 'fridge-light' thing again; `only just off the tablets! ;D
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So now i'm a sort of ray gun. How cool is that.
First name; Ronald? ;D
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So now i'm a sort of ray gun. How cool is that.
First name; Ronald? ;D
Well he'd be very good at it, loads of room for the signal to bounce around inside that large void of a skull. ;D
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I guess that might be the best approach.....one other option was to not look at the car but, how would you know if it had worked or not....
.....don`t start-me on that 'fridge-light' thing again; `only just off the tablets! ;D
Ah yes, one of those Schroedinger's Cat type questions....
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Ah yes, one of those Schroedinger's Cat type questions....
Paradoxically, yes (and No!)....but not if you`re looking! ;D
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Ah yes, one of those Schroedinger's Cat type questions....
Paradoxically, yes (and No!)....but not if you`re looking! ;D
Unfortunately, being an engineer, I would have put a window in the box!
But then in a parralel existance the light bulb in the room might fail and your back to square one!
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Last time this was posted I tried it .........and it works with my Motorola when set to speakerphone with my Mrs at the other end of her Motorola. She's with Orange and I'm Vodafone as if it matters .
This was through 3 walls which didn't work under the control test of pushing the fob alone - it opened the boot too 8-)
I've tried to recorded as a voice note and play it back but that's no good. :-/
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Ok, being slighty bored and up for a laugh I tried it..............
It unlocked and lock the car easy, I can't believe it works!!
I'm shocked :o
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Phew, someone else who has got it to work. I was beginning to think I was going mad!
Last time this was posted I tried it .........and it works with my Motorola when set to speakerphone with my Mrs at the other end of her Motorola. She's with Orange and I'm Vodafone as if it matters .
This was through 3 walls which didn't work under the control test of pushing the fob alone - it opened the boot too 8-)
I've tried to recorded as a voice note and play it back but that's no good. :-/
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next time you are a bit bored can you find out how it works - as, like others, I don't understand how (but I know it does having tried it).
Ok, being slighty bored and up for a laugh I tried it..............
It unlocked and lock the car easy, I can't believe it works!!
I'm shocked :o