Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: albitz on 22 January 2013, 09:50:48
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ONS has announced public sector borrowing has risen another £600 million to £15.4 billion at the end of December. :o :o
Dont this lot realise that the only thing they were ever going to have going for them was stopping the lunacy of Labours borrow and spend mentality,which has put the country on the road to ruin ?
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these lot just make more dept than labour :y :y
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The longer they keep their heads in the sand,the more savage the cuts will have to be when reality finally bites.
Thers no way round it,the country has to stop spending money it doesnt have.Its going to be very tough on a lot of people,but theres no avoiding it.
I have no doubt that if/when Labour get back in they will be even worse.They will finish the job of ruination that they started,even faster than the current lot will.
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I don't think we'll ever be back in the black - we've borrowed so much and our GDP is shrinking so much that short of shutting down the NHS, firing 90% of all the civil servants, closing all the state funded schools and announcing marshal law, there's no way we're ever going to fix it..
All we have to look forward to is an eventual default and/or the whole world becomes communist and we all forget about the concept of money.
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Stock up on beans and bullets. :y ;D
The point is,traditionally Labour spend money like its going out of fashion,the economy ends up in a mess,so the Tories get elected to fix it.They take the hard decisions,get things straightened out,but piss people off in the process so lose power,and the whole vicios circle starts again.
Not this time though.No-one could expect the debt to be paid off and all aspects of the economy to be rosy in a couple of years,but they are actually borrowing much more than the other shower were.The only crumb of comfort is that the rate of accelleration of the borrowing has slowed to some extent,but that aint going to keep the ship afloat for long.
I think they are so focussed on not being labelled the nasty party,they are scared of doing what needs to be done.
Do the job,let the facts speak for themselves and earn the respect for doing it is the only method to try imo.well,that and outlawing socialism - thinly veiled or not. :)
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The rate of acceleration of debt borrowing maybe is slowing but the debt itself is just getting bigger. A lot of folk are sitting at home thinking the government have got it all under control- they have not. All Osborne has achieved is to keep Britains AAA rating so vital to keep government borrowing interest rates down. Fitch will be downgrading Britain later this year.
As Rods2 says triple dip recession in Spring (blamed no doubt on reduced spending due to bad winter).
It is all looking "good" for my prediction of Britain being in the euro in less than five years time.
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Once that AAA rating goes we wil be on a slippery slope.Whats happening in Greece today could easily be happening here in 5 years time.Possibly the only thing currently keeping the wolves from the door is our much hated financial sector.
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The longer they keep their heads in the sand,the more savage the cuts will have to be when reality finally bites.
Thers no way round it,the country has to stop spending money it doesnt have.Its going to be very tough on a lot of people,but theres no avoiding it.
I have no doubt that if/when Labour get back in they will be even worse.They will finish the job of ruination that they started,even faster than the current lot will.
I'll go with that. Trouble is no politician of ANY party will take the really draconian steps that are needed for the simple reason that they would be deeply unpopular and result in lost votes and possibly civil unrest a-la Greece.
Also . . . . .
Austerity,what austerity ?
Just try getting a table for a decent restaurant in London at a weekend, and they are not all foreign tourists. There are still a lot of UK people with cash to spend.
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Once that AAA rating goes we wil be on a slippery slope.Whats happening in Greece today could easily be happening here in 5 years time.Possibly the only thing currently keeping the wolves from the door is our much hated financial sector.
That will be a nice jewel in Barrosa's crown when Britain adopts the Euro following accepting a bailout. Nice EU cash cow. ;D :y
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The longer they keep their heads in the sand,the more savage the cuts will have to be when reality finally bites.
Thers no way round it,the country has to stop spending money it doesnt have.Its going to be very tough on a lot of people,but theres no avoiding it.
I have no doubt that if/when Labour get back in they will be even worse.They will finish the job of ruination that they started,even faster than the current lot will.
I'll go with that. Trouble is no politician of ANY party will take the really draconian steps that are needed for the simple reason that they would be deeply unpopular and result in lost votes and possibly civil unrest a-la Greece.
Also . . . . .
Austerity,what austerity ?
Just try getting a table for a decent restaurant in London at a weekend, and they are not all foreign tourists. There are still a lot of UK people with cash to spend.
Civil servants spending our taxes ;D ;D ;D
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Once that AAA rating goes we wil be on a slippery slope.Whats happening in Greece today could easily be happening here in 5 years time.Possibly the only thing currently keeping the wolves from the door is our much hated financial sector.
That will be a nice jewel in Barrosa's crown when Britain adopts the Euro following accepting a bailout. Nice EU cash cow. ;D :y
Its the only reason they want us in the club at all imo. :y
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It would be interesting to know how much of our borrowing is for paying interest on borrowing for others that have borrowed from us (e.g. Greece, Spain, Ireland etc)
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It would be interesting to know how much of our borrowing is for paying interest on borrowing for others that have borrowed from us (e.g. Greece, Spain, Ireland etc)
Indeed. However on paper it would make great sense for the Uk to borrow say 5billion at 3% and lend it to a country at 6% assuming they can pay it back of course. What makes less sense is the likes of Spain and Italy having to borrow money at 6% in order to (jointly with other countries) fund the bailouts of Greece where everyone knows they will default and will do so again. If the ordinaruy man in the street could see the paper trail for all this borrowing and cross funding of public debt (national and other countries) they would probably have a heart attack.
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It would be interesting to know how much of our borrowing is for paying interest on borrowing for others that have borrowed from us (e.g. Greece, Spain, Ireland etc)
Even more interesting would be to know EXACTLY how much of our borrowing is to pay the interest on both the borrowing of the previous government and its attempts to "purchase" the votes of folks by ridiculous spending .. which now has to be paid for.
Just remember .. this mess happened BEFORE the present government came to power ... at least they are trying to sort it out... albeit slowly it seems .. however the grabbers and graspers combine to prevent progress at every turn.
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No doubt the previous lot acted with irresponsibilty which should have been treated as criminal.
My point is that the current lot,so far,are borrowing even more than they did,by quite a margin.Imo they need to grow a spine and do what needs to be done,regardless of the opinion polls.They have little chance of getting re-elected anyway,so they might as well do whats right for the country while they are in there.
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. . . . If the ordinaruy man in the street could see the paper trail for all this borrowing and cross funding of public debt (national and other countries) they would probably have a heart attack.
Me nah, I think that . . . . . . . .
(http://i77.photobucket.com/albums/j74/Old_Mosher/ECGFlatLine_03_zpsa8d1ba8b.jpg)
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No doubt the previous lot acted with irresponsibilty which should have been treated as criminal.
My point is that the current lot,so far,are borrowing even more than they did,by quite a margin.Imo they need to grow a spine and do what needs to be done,regardless of the opinion polls.They have little chance of getting re-elected anyway,so they might as well do whats right for the country while they are in there.
Indeed. It'll be another round of Liebore buying votes next... and we think we're up the creek without a paddle now. :(
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Stock up on beans and bullets. :y ;D
The point is,traditionally Labour spend money like its going out of fashion,the economy ends up in a mess,so the Tories get elected to fix it.They take the hard decisions,get things straightened out,but piss people off in the process so lose power,and the whole vicios circle starts again.
Not this time though.No-one could expect the debt to be paid off and all aspects of the economy to be rosy in a couple of years,but they are actually borrowing much more than the other shower were.The only crumb of comfort is that the rate of accelleration of the borrowing has slowed to some extent,but that aint going to keep the ship afloat for long.
I think they are so focussed on not being labelled the nasty party,they are scared of doing what needs to be done.
Do the job,let the facts speak for themselves and earn the respect for doing it is the only method to try imo.well,that and outlawing socialism - thinly veiled or not. :)
And custard ::) ::) :y We are all doomed :(
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Stock up on beans and bullets. :y ;D
The point is,traditionally Labour spend money like its going out of fashion,the economy ends up in a mess,so the Tories get elected to fix it.They take the hard decisions,get things straightened out,but piss people off in the process so lose power,and the whole vicios circle starts again.
Not this time though.No-one could expect the debt to be paid off and all aspects of the economy to be rosy in a couple of years,but they are actually borrowing much more than the other shower were.The only crumb of comfort is that the rate of accelleration of the borrowing has slowed to some extent,but that aint going to keep the ship afloat for long.
I think they are so focussed on not being labelled the nasty party,they are scared of doing what needs to be done.
Do the job,let the facts speak for themselves and earn the respect for doing it is the only method to try imo.well,that and outlawing socialism - thinly veiled or not. :)
And custard ::) ::) :y We are all doomed :(
Not necessarily; if we :
1) get rid of the nonsense that is Trident (and it's successor)
2) cut our armed forces to the bone (the govt. has listened to me on this one ;)
3) get our forces out of Afghanistan and Iraq
4) stop international aid to countries who should be able to feed their own population (thinking of India with their space program costing £1.3B and yet we give them £1b in aid in effect subsidising their space program :o ))
5) Stop trying to police the world as we just can't afford to - leave it to the U.N.
Should save us a few trillion quid over the years :y
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The Conservatives had a limited window of opportunity to get the country's finances under control. At the beginning of the coalition the Libdems wanted no tax rises and 100% cuts while the Cons wanted 20% tax rises and 80% cuts.
They have relied on it being a short recession and a return to growth to cover the excessive spending of the last Government rather than making tough but necessary decisions. The fact that the Overseas Aid budgets and green subsidies, which are discretionary spending items have not been touched and in fact Overseas Aid has gone up by £2bn for useless windmill in Africa, shows that those in charge aren't serious about getting the debts under control.
The best figure for our real financial position are the OECD as they use internationally recognized methods of calculating spending and debt. On their figures, Government spending is 49% (UK Gov 43%) of GDP and debt is about 100% (UK Gov 85%). Taxes this year will be 42.6% of GDP, the highest I can ever remember. OECD have found for every 0.5% of GDP tax rise there is a 0.8% to 1.7% drop in GDP, this is why we have no growth only stagflation.
If you consider UK PLC as a business in distress, then you would cut ALL discretionary spending, cut wages and costs and concentrate on the things that are absolutely necessary and make money for the business to survive. The fact that the last Government got us into this complete mess, does not exonerate this Government as once you are in power it is your sole responsibility to make the correct decisions, to get us out of this mess and they have not have the experience, skill, drive or determination to do this. This means there is now only going to be one outcome and that is financial ruin and default. Personally, where I follow economics, where it is currently the biggest threat to our country and way of life since 1940, I can't see any other outcome, which is why I'm selling up and moving somewhere more favourable.
If you have any assets or savings, you will find when things get desperate, the Government will confiscate these to try and save the country. So don't leave all your eggs in one basket, by having assets and savings outside of the UK and UK banks. Where is what anybody with money is asking, but it is the case of finding the least worse place and is not so much the return on the money, but the return of the money that counts!
A frank account of out current financial position appeared recently in Money Week and they have a very good record of calling things correctly before they happen. It is going to be tough and it is going to be ugly and it will happen in the next 5 years, so being forewarned is being forearmed.
http://www.moneyweek.com/endofbritain (http://www.moneyweek.com/endofbritain)
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And I'm not the only one leaving:
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9819096/Two-million-quit-Britain-in-talent-drain.html (http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/politics/9819096/Two-million-quit-Britain-in-talent-drain.html)
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If you consider UK PLC as a business in distress..
.. and the fact of the matter is, who currently in government would have the experience to sort out a business in distress, let alone a country? They are sitting on their hands and hoping things will improve because they are out of their depth.