Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: philsteward on 28 January 2013, 21:06:23
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Help! Zafira went in for an MOT Friday, failed as the horn was inoperable. Garage put a fuse in, it blew straight away. They tried a different horn and they said it was on constantly. They have tested the wires going to the horn and there is a constant 12v feed to it.
They tried removing the airbag, and checking the switch, they said that worked fine (not sure how they tested that though). Only thing they can suggest is fitting a little push button on the dash for the horn, not happy about that though!
Any ideas what it might be? They recon it might be an alarm fault, does that sound plausible? If so would that show up when connected to the diagnosis software? They have told me the software is "My Naff Code Reader", I thought it should be Tech 2?
Any help much appreciated.
Cheers in advance
Phil
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Zafira b?
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And if it is a B do you have a REC? (Rear electrical centre, fuse box type thing in passenger side of the boot)
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Sorry, yes Zafira B.
It is a 2007 1.9CDTI (120)
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And if it is a B do you have a REC? (Rear electrical centre, fuse box type thing in passenger side of the boot)
Oh, no idea, can have a look tomorrow. Why?
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Makes a difference, what spec is it? Do you have rear electric windows?
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It is a Life - no rear electric windows.
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If lower spec then check the relay in the UEC (under hood electrical centre). Its K4 which I think is right hand row third from the bottom. Pulling it will prove
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Thanks Mark, what will happen when it is pulled? Will the horn stop?
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It should yes, its most likely the relay contacts have welded shut as a result of the extra current from a failed horn
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Oh yes, horns are plentiful so second hand is no issue and the better spec cars had a twin horn which has more presence than the single pea whistle
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Thanks a lot (again) Mark! Will ask the garage to try that in the morning.
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... and the better spec cars had a twin horn which has more presence than the single pea whistle
Even my almost poverty spec Astra LS had twin tone horns ::)
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The Life spec is the lowest of the low, I know I drive one. That said, it is fun to source and add better bits to it. That way you can personalize the car more IMHO. Wife has the Design model, in reality better than the Elite model many say. It has all the toys but no real way of improving the top models without making them look at bit boy racerish
Before the complaints start. Elite V Design. The Elite only has full leather seats with heated fronts over the Design. The elite seats are less comfortable than the Designs half leather seats. Yes it is still down to personal taste but when a poll was done on the Astra forum (covers Zafira) the Design came out on top.
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Elite has a few more bits than that.
It also has Climate control, GID screen, cruise control (was not standard on later design models), heated seats, leather seats, some additional sound deadening but to name a few. :y
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Elite has a few more bits than that.
It also has Climate control, GID screen, cruise control (was not standard on later design models), heated seats, leather seats, some additional sound deadening but to name a few. :y
2004 Design has all of that. Not sure if some of it was "extras" at time of purchase. The only thing she does not have is heated leather seats.
I assume like most cars spec changes as the years go by :y
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If lower spec then check the relay in the UEC (under hood electrical centre). Its K4 which I think is right hand row third from the bottom. Pulling it will prove
Tried this, stopped the horn. Replaced it with another switched relay, and it came back on again. Any other suggestions? If it is an alarm fault, would it show on "My Naff Code Reader"?
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Elite has a few more bits than that.
It also has Climate control, GID screen, cruise control (was not standard on later design models), heated seats, leather seats, some additional sound deadening but to name a few. :y
2004 Design has all of that. Not sure if some of it was "extras" at time of purchase. The only thing she does not have is heated leather seats.
I assume like most cars spec changes as the years go by :y
Its had one hell of a lot of options then, Design spec only ever had the cruise as an additional feature on the early models.
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If lower spec then check the relay in the UEC (under hood electrical centre). Its K4 which I think is right hand row third from the bottom. Pulling it will prove
Tried this, stopped the horn. Replaced it with another switched relay, and it came back on again. Any other suggestions? If it is an alarm fault, would it show on "My Naff Code Reader"?
How good are you with the code reader, can you read live data with it?
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If lower spec then check the relay in the UEC (under hood electrical centre). Its K4 which I think is right hand row third from the bottom. Pulling it will prove
Tried this, stopped the horn. Replaced it with another switched relay, and it came back on again. Any other suggestions? If it is an alarm fault, would it show on "My Naff Code Reader"?
How good are you with the code reader, can you read live data with it?
Only just noticed what it is doing when I am writing the name of the software the garage are trying to use!!! It is with them, it is their software and I have no idea how good they are, probably rubbish! I only have a super cheap one which won't show live data, so no use. Sounds like it needs a Tech 2 session, but can't drive it anywhere as MOT expired!
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Elite has a few more bits than that.
It also has Climate control, GID screen, cruise control (was not standard on later design models), heated seats, leather seats, some additional sound deadening but to name a few. :y
2004 Design has all of that. Not sure if some of it was "extras" at time of purchase. The only thing she does not have is heated leather seats.
I assume like most cars spec changes as the years go by :y
Its had one hell of a lot of options then, Design spec only ever had the cruise as an additional feature on the early models.
The only thing that may make a difference to the spec is it was a Motability car when purchased new. So as there are no adaptations to the steering/pedals, I wonder if there a medical reason for the spec ? If that is the reason they did not keep the car for very long. We bought it fairly new (for us) from a Vauxhall dealer.
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What they should be doing is checking the live data in the CIM to see if the system is registering the horn button as being pressed.
Similarly they should then be carrying out an actuator test in the REC to prove the horn can be turned on and off.
Both simple basic fault finding steps :y
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What they should be doing is checking the live data in the CIM to see if the system is registering the horn button as being pressed.
Similarly they should then be carrying out an actuator test in the REC to prove the horn can be turned on and off.
Both simple basic fault finding steps :y
Okay. Do not think they have done any of that, but may have, will ask. They have just called to say that they have removed the fuse board in the engine bay (nearside next to the batter) and have said that it was all green underneath and damp. They have cleaned all the connectors on the board and refitted it. The horn now works, BUT the EML and ABS lights have come on. Other strange electrical things are happening as well, including when the horn is pressed the EML goes out!
They have suggested the fuse board needs replacing? Sound a sensible option? Any idea on price? Would a 2nd hand unit be worth a try?
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Sounds like its had some serious water ingress at some time.
Replacement is not easy as they are coded, I would be re-visiting what they have done with some contact cleaner and a tooth brush.
If it was a water issue then I would have expected a shed load of fault codes related to the CAN bus.
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Sounds like its had some serious water ingress at some time.
Replacement is not easy as they are coded, I would be re-visiting what they have done with some contact cleaner and a tooth brush.
If it was a water issue then I would have expected a shed load of fault codes related to the CAN bus.
Okay. Will try and get it back off them maybe and have a look myself. It did have the car with spanner light on, they did the typical garage thing and cleared the codes without recording them . There were 6 apparently.
Will any other software other than Tech 2 code the fuse box?
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Mark,
If I were to get a 2nd hand fuse box, would I be able to drive to you and install it and get you to code it in?
Cheers
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Mark,
If I were to get a 2nd hand fuse box, would I be able to drive to you and install it and get you to code it in?
Cheers
I would need to check, I suspect it would need divorcing first which could be challenging althoguh the reset ecu function should clear the coding.
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I have found a couple of 2nd hand ones which say they have been Tech 2 removed from the original car, so that might help.
I have spoken again with the garage, and they have managed to get the car back to it's original situation, horn on all the time. They have suggested cutting out the CIM and running a direct feed from the horn switch on the steering wheel to the horn. So it would work as normal. They have said however that the alarm would then no longer sound, as it uses the horn. Does this sound feasible? They have said they think there is a fault with the CIM as well, but not sure how they got to that conclusion.
This would enable the car to get through an MoT so would be very helpful!
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I have found a couple of 2nd hand ones which say they have been Tech 2 removed from the original car, so that might help.
I have spoken again with the garage, and they have managed to get the car back to it's original situation, horn on all the time. They have suggested cutting out the CIM and running a direct feed from the horn switch on the steering wheel to the horn. So it would work as normal. They have said however that the alarm would then no longer sound, as it uses the horn. Does this sound feasible? They have said they think there is a fault with the CIM as well, but not sure how they got to that conclusion.
This would enable the car to get through an MoT so would be very helpful!
So what they are actulay saying is they removed the UEC and didn;t re-fit it properly ;D
It needs proper diag which is clearly beyond this garage you are using.
Yours is a Life so very much doubt its got an alarm
And no, the direct running of a horn wire wont work as the microswitches on the steering will never handle the horn current.
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Just had another update. They got the horn working direct from the switches using a relay, worked fine, but the car is very upset now. Lights won't work, won't start all sorts of issues. They reverted it back and it was back to before, horn permanently on. They have discovered that the slightest movement or touch on the fuse box causes something different to happen. They have tried cleaning it again, but no difference and they say it is badly water damaged.
Next step is to fit another one. I can get one, but would prefer someone who knows what they are doing a bit more to programme it, are there any trusted Tech 2 bods up in Leeds? Bear in mind the car has no MoT so cannot be driven unfortunately!
Any help much appreciated. And a special thanks to Mark for all his help so far...just wish you lived further north!
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Me again.
Just wondering if someone could confirm which of these numbers are important for sourcing a replacement unit?
(http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l510/Phil_Steward/IMG-20130201-WA0002_zpsb8df78dc.jpg)
Close up view
(http://i1121.photobucket.com/albums/l510/Phil_Steward/IMG-20130201-WA0002-1_zpsf419c8d4.jpg)
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KA is the variant code.
As said before though, it needs proper diag before changing bits
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KA is the variant code.
As said before though, it needs proper diag before changing bits
Know anywhere I can get it done up in Leeds?