Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: pscocoa on 15 July 2013, 15:24:45
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A loud mouthed circa 50 year old American in a cafe/bar in Farnborough yesterday - "if it hadn't been for us they's all be speaking German" - overhead by my son's mother in-law who glared at him. After getting the evil eye he continued along same theme but just to his 6 mates and not the rest of the people present.
Moron.
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Yes we have a lot to thank the Yanks for. ;D ;D
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Should have reminded them that WW2 started in 1939 but they didn't turn up until 1941.
Did they get lost ?
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He should have had it explained to him that, if it wasn't for us, he wouldn't exist. Oh, and could he stop bastardising the ENGLISH language we gave him please.
Also, it should have been explained that the cowardly bastards only joined in because Japan bombed the shite out of Pearl Harbor, which is also spelled incorrectly. ;D
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Sorry, can't agree. We were getting materiel assistance from Roosevelt -against Congress' wishes - long before they declared war, and, IMHO, without them, we would have lost. It is true they extracted a high price from us, which we only paid off within the last year or so. :y
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Sorry, can't agree. We were getting materiel assistance from Roosevelt -against Congress' wishes - long before they declared war, and, IMHO, without them, we would have lost. It is true they extracted a high price from us, which we only paid off within the last year or so. :y
For sure. But there are certain types over the Pond that like to bang on about it. No tact or finesse whatsoever.
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This is what surprised me - I have been to the US many times and never heard this line of thinking before. Maybe I need to get out more.
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After the battle of Britain it was unlikely we would be invaded and lose the war, but we were never going to be strong enough to win it on our own.
Once Hitler invaded Russia and failed to capture Moscow, they were in the unenviable position of having to fight a war on two fronts. Once Russia gained the initiate on the Eastern front, it was inevitable they would lose, but we would then have had a Russian dominated Europe.
So what did the yanks do for us: They provided us and Russia with vital war equipment, but for us under lend-lease at the cost of our empire, and once they were actively involved with the fighting they helped to shorten the war.
So they help save Western Europe from Soviet domination. But if Roosevelt had taken the much tougher line that Churchill wanted at the Yalta Conference then Eastern Europe MAY not have been as dominated by the Soviets as it was.
Their participation in WWI was probably more critical to the allied success, where the Germans broke through the English / French line in a spring 1918 offensive into open country, and it required the US troops as a reserve to stem the tide. After this initial setback 1918 was a year of victories for the allies.
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Regardless of the rights and wrongs of the American involvement in WW2, what you don't do is come as a visitor to this country and insult the 'natives', but I don't think its an 'American' problem. I'm afraid there are bigoted, rude, ill informed, people everywhere in the world (even here at times!), luckily they are outnumbered by the reasonable majority.
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I wonder when we'll get paid back from trotting off behind them on their "war on terror"? ::)
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Should have reminded them that WW2 started in 1939 but they didn't turn up until 1941.
Did they get lost ?
The same with WW1.......or the 1917-18 war as the yanks call it. ;D ;D
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And let us not forget the Marshall Aid plan after WW11, which was aimed at preventing a recurrence of what happened after WW1, and, arguably, as a result of which, has led to a more or less, war free -cough cough- Europe since. :y
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Regardless of the rights and wrongs of the American involvement in WW2, what you don't do is come as a visitor to this country and insult the 'natives', but I don't think its an 'American' problem. I'm afraid there are bigoted, rude, ill informed, people everywhere in the world (even here at times!), luckily they are outnumbered by the reasonable majority.
Fat, Pat.......you forgot FAT. ;D
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You should have reminded him that if it was not for us then they would be speaking German too. In the early days of the newly independent America they were speaking a number of different languages but the main ones were English and German. They had a vote to decide which would be their one official language and thanks to a little influence from us they chose English by the narrowest of margins.
Not many Americans will know of this fact :y
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You should have reminded him that if it was not for us then they would be speaking German too. In the early days of the newly independent America they were speaking a number of different languages but the main ones were English and German. They had a vote to decide which would be their one official language and thanks to a little influence from us they chose English by the narrowest of margins.
Not many Americans will know of this fact :y
Shoot 'em up if you go to live there, Matt. ;D
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You should have reminded him that if it was not for us then they would be speaking German too. In the early days of the newly independent America they were speaking a number of different languages but the main ones were English and German. They had a vote to decide which would be their one official language and thanks to a little influence from us they chose English by the narrowest of margins.
Not many Americans will know of this fact :y
Shoot 'em up if you go to live there, Matt. ;D
I hear it's all the rage in Florida ::) :-X
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Pah if it wasn't for those pesky Yanks, we'd have had an efficient postal system and the trains would run on time! :-X ;D
... and no speed limits on the autobahn motorway!! 8)
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what irritates me is the number of WW2 films based on real missions, that involve americans , who were never in fact involved at all.....
(one's grandfather on the other hand, very much was..... )
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I wonder how many yanks know that Barack Obama is George Washington's 9th cousin 6 times removed.
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I wonder how many yanks know that Barack Obama is George Washington's 9th cousin 6 times removed.
Not true! He's not even American, he's an alien plant! ::) ;)
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I wonder how many yanks know that Barack Obama is George Washington's 9th cousin 6 times removed.
Not true! He's not even American, he's an alien plant! ::) ;)
TIS TRUE TOO!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
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Was that Cem, or an echo? ;D ;D ;D
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Wehrmact lost most of its power fighting in Russia especially at Leningrad and Stalingrad .. Hitlers decision of dividing its forces for multiple attack points on very wide lands and resuming a war at Russian winter was a fatal mistake..
On the other side the air war at Englands skies was costly that Luftwaffe had to stop it.. and used that v bombs instead..
US forces even hardly beat the remains of Wehrmacht ;D
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I just love it when we have to explain what SPAM means :-X :D
Not the brightest are our cousins across the pond ;D
Also ask them how many wars the have actually won without us ;)
Grenada doesn't count even though they had some very sharp sticks (and knew how to use them) ;D
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WW2 was a farce at times---my Grandad's group fought for a town in France-and had to go around it so yanks could go in and get all the glory---didnt win Korea.Vietnam or any other war have they :y :y Was surprised they didnt side with Hitler after all they are just the same---Saluting the flag all the time---reminds me so much of how Germany was in 1930's :-\ :-\ Kept supplying Noraid-IRA until 9/11-then they got a taste of what we put up with here
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Wehrmact lost most of its power fighting in Russia especially at Leningrad and Stalingrad .. Hitlers decision of dividing its forces for multiple attack points on very wide lands and resuming a war at Russian winter was a fatal mistake..
On the other side the air war at Englands skies was costly that Luftwaffe had to stop it.. and used that v bombs instead..
US forces even hardly beat the remains of Wehrmacht ;D
The Americans took quite a beating by Rommel's desert army in Tunisia. During the liberation of France the Germans had the better army and generally better equipment. The Sherman tank was known as the Ronson as it would light first time every time! But what sums up the situation was when a German officer asked what had happened as an 88mm anti-tank gun crew retreated, one replied, we ran out of shells before they ran out of tanks! Nobody could match the quantity of US equipment and production capacity.
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Leaving Irish / American patriotism apart for the moment, I just wonder how well some of the statements in this thread sit with OOF members in the US & beyond ???
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Leaving Irish / American patriotism apart for the moment, I just wonder how well some of the statements in this thread sit with OOF members in the US & beyond ???
Well. They started it. ;D
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Leaving Irish / American patriotism apart for the moment, I just wonder how well some of the statements in this thread sit with OOF members in the US & beyond ???
Tis nothing but a laugh / banter ;)
Even across the pond, they have such a thing.
I know, I have traded plenty with them over the years while drinking pish American beer and Jack Daniels :-X :-X :-X
You can't go threw life worrying about everything you say just incase it pishes off somebody on the other side of the world.
Anybody who can't take a bit of banter should avoid if they don't understand the context.
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Wehrmact lost most of its power fighting in Russia especially at Leningrad and Stalingrad .. Hitlers decision of dividing its forces for multiple attack points on very wide lands and resuming a war at Russian winter was a fatal mistake..
On the other side the air war at Englands skies was costly that Luftwaffe had to stop it.. and used that v bombs instead..
US forces even hardly beat the remains of Wehrmacht ;D
The Americans took quite a beating by Rommel's desert army in Tunisia. During the liberation of France the Germans had the better army and generally better equipment. The Sherman tank was known as the Ronson as it would light first time every time! But what sums up the situation was when a German officer asked what had happened as an 88mm anti-tank gun crew retreated, one replied, we ran out of shells before they ran out of tanks! Nobody could match the quantity of US equipment and production capacity.
agreed with one exception :y
however, I must note that although number of equipment/ships/planes plays an important role , more than that it, depends how and where you use them.. One good example is that Russians were always crowded on total numbers but German attacks on strategic points with arms having better technical properties and management always gives better results unless Hitler tried crazy suicides for his army
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Leaving Irish / American patriotism apart for the moment, I just wonder how well some of the statements in this thread sit with OOF members in the US & beyond ???
Well. They started it. ;D
;D ;D :y
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Wehrmact lost most of its power fighting in Russia especially at Leningrad and Stalingrad .. Hitlers decision of dividing its forces for multiple attack points on very wide lands and resuming a war at Russian winter was a fatal mistake..
On the other side the air war at Englands skies was costly that Luftwaffe had to stop it.. and used that v bombs instead..
US forces even hardly beat the remains of Wehrmacht ;D
The Americans took quite a beating by Rommel's desert army in Tunisia. During the liberation of France the Germans had the better army and generally better equipment. The Sherman tank was known as the Ronson as it would light first time every time! But what sums up the situation was when a German officer asked what had happened as an 88mm anti-tank gun crew retreated, one replied, we ran out of shells before they ran out of tanks! Nobody could match the quantity of US equipment and production capacity.
agreed with one exception :y
however, I must note that although number of equipment/ships/planes plays an important role , more than that it, depends how and where you use them.. One good example is that Russians were always crowded on total numbers but German attacks on strategic points with arms having better technical properties and management always gives better results unless Hitler tried crazy suicides for his army
Yep, Hitler was one of the best weapons for beating Germany that the allies had. As a Corporal playing at being a Field Marshall he was a disaster, his no retreat policy meant the annihilation of several German armies. When he called upon his drug addict friend Goering for assistance he always fell short from Dunkirk, the Battle of Britain, through to ferrying supplies to the army cut off at Stalingrad.
The Russian approach was brute force which showed in their casualty figures. When Russian armies attacked, retreating Russian soldiers were generally shot, so it was better to continue attacking until you were killed. :o :o :o :o Russian equipment improved with the best all round tank in terms of materials and performance with its sloping armour being the T34, but the best tank was the Tiger and Super Tiger., which outgunned all other tanks, but it was an expensive complex design to manufacture, so was never available in sufficient quantities. Allied tanks were always a generation behind where they need to be, with the war over before our next generation which would have competed on equal terms making it to the battlefield.
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Sorry, can't agree. We were getting materiel assistance from Roosevelt -against Congress' wishes - long before they declared war, and, IMHO, without them, we would have lost. It is true they extracted a high price from us, which we only paid off within the last year or so. :y
Very true! :y :y
Without the assistance of the Americans both before 7th December 1941, and very much thereafter we could not have won the war. Churchill knew it, and we know it now. No if's, no but's, that is the very real historical fact :) :) ;)
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For those who still like to bash the 'Yanks', I commend Churchill's History of the Second World War, which is a great read. Agreed it is written from his perspective, but certain facts are a matter of record. :y
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Sorry, can't agree. We were getting materiel assistance from Roosevelt -against Congress' wishes - long before they declared war, and, IMHO, without them, we would have lost. It is true they extracted a high price from us, which we only paid off within the last year or so. :y
Very true! :y :y
Without the assistance of the Americans both before 7th December 1941, and very much thereafter we could not have won the war. Churchill knew it, and we know it now. No if's, no but's, that is the very real historical fact :) :) ;)
Agreed it was true. But what a high price we paid for their tardiness and what a high price we paid for their aid. I am sorry to say I am still of the camp that our special relationship is and always was a bit one sided for the size of the nation.
Just one snippet of aid nonsense. The Belgians received real hard aid from us to rebuild their country. We received from them....vegetables. We already had enough from our superb dig for victory efforts so accepted them and then quietly tipped them in the North Sea. Who signed that off rather than cash so we could pay the Yanks off? (Rhetorical question.)