Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: pscocoa on 12 November 2013, 15:44:27
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Whilst my kitchen saga goes on I absolutely refuse to sign an agreement until I am ready and have got to the bottom of the high prices that appear to be the norm in the kitchen supply business. SWMBO is not being obeyed and this will not be installed by Christmas - which sends a better message to suppliers.
I really can understand why the price bubble exists and people get into debt because clearly these kitchen guys seem to be expecting that the money to pay them with is borrowed via personal loan or mortgage. People must just be getting the quotes doing a bit of cross checking (but not much) and then getting low interest funding to commit to a huge cost for a kitchen.
The game is to discount the appliances but load the granite. Discount the granite and load the appliances. Most companies say they cannot do both - I am now talking sensibly to one who might do both.
One quote is £45k and I am targetting £20k with one supplier currently at £26k and one at £30k.
Language promulagted around is "the kitchen is the most expensive room in the house" - "most kitchens are £15 to £25k".
Our design has some specials so I am ok to spend a bit more but the whole process seems as though the kitchen suppliers are used to extracting alrge amounts of cash on the basis that it is the norm.
And before you weigh in on me - I am not going to lift a finger in any of the work - too busy and past it. I know some of you have done "great things on little money" - which was an oft used phrase by my late father.
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I used to be in the building trade. Drip feed them the money as the job progresses and keep an eye on every stage of the job. Let them know this will be the arrangement before they start. 20-25K is a fair old wodge of cash and they need to understand that you had to earn it and so will they.
I'm not sure if the job is quite big enough to warrant it but consider a contract between you, it saves any dispute once the job has started.
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Are you not able to to do the sourcing (little overhead)?
E.g., source required units, sub con a fitter, spark, plumber, source the worktops and appliances?
My experience is that the cheapest place for applances and worktops is never a kitchen supplier and yet many still buy everything from them
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One quote is £45k and I am targetting £20k with one supplier currently at £26k and one at £30k.
Language promulagted around is "the kitchen is the most expensive room in the house" - "most kitchens are £15 to £25k".
WOW ! Some of these numbers scare me crapless. I am hoping to buy a big old house that pretty much has no kitchen, just big room with a tiled floor an old Rayburn type cooker and nothing else, nothing.
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One quote is £45k and I am targetting £20k with one supplier currently at £26k and one at £30k.
Language promulagted around is "the kitchen is the most expensive room in the house" - "most kitchens are £15 to £25k".
WOW ! Some of these numbers scare me crapless. I am hoping to buy a big old house that pretty much has no kitchen, just big room with a tiled floor an old Rayburn type cooker and nothing else, nothing.
This sounds like a pretty high-end kitchen, Rog. You could get a small semi up here for that. ;D
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And I thought it was expensive when my folks said they beat the supplier down from £12k to £6k.. ;D
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One quote is £45k and I am targetting £20k with one supplier currently at £26k and one at £30k.
Language promulagted around is "the kitchen is the most expensive room in the house" - "most kitchens are £15 to £25k".
WOW ! Some of these numbers scare me crapless. I am hoping to buy a big old house that pretty much has no kitchen, just big room with a tiled floor an old Rayburn type cooker and nothing else, nothing.
This sounds like a pretty high-end kitchen, Rog. You could get a small semi up here for that. ;D
A quid for a terrace in scouse land and nick the kitchen :y :D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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One quote is £45k and I am targetting £20k with one supplier currently at £26k and one at £30k.
T
Language promulagted around is "the kitchen is the most expensive room in the house" - "most kitchens are £15 to £25k".
WOW ! Some of these numbers scare me crapless. I am hoping to buy a big old house that pretty much has no kitchen, just big room with a tiled floor an old Rayburn type cooker and nothing else, nothing.
This sounds like a pretty high-end kitchen, Rog. You could get a small semi up here for that. ;D
A quid for a terrace in scouse land and nick the kitchen :y :D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
When was the last time you had a small semi, Cleggy? ;D
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Are you not able to to do the sourcing (little overhead)?
E.g., source required units, sub con a fitter, spark, plumber, source the worktops and appliances?
My experience is that the cheapest place for applances and worktops is never a kitchen supplier and yet many still buy everything from them
This would be a classic way forward but tradesmen round here ain't cheap. I have some prices for some of the jobs but this is why I say you have to understand how the kitchen companies work. They sub out the civil works allegedly at cost and make their money on the cabinets. My idea is to get a contribution from their gross profit on the cabinets into my civil works.
One told me yesterday that 15% gross profit was no use to him as his bosses would be unhappy.
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A similar activity happens with gas boilers - with BG charging mega amounts just to justify their stupid TV advertising.
I've probably mentioned this before, but the BG quote for my new boiler 2 years ago was well over £9k. I eventually got the job done by a good local guy for £2,600.
You are right about the finance though - they twisted it around to say that if I couldn't afford it then they had an easy finance package - or could offer £450 off the price if I signed within a week of the quote.
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I worked for a kitchen company a few years ago as a 'Kitchen
Designer Salesman' and the margins were huge! ::)
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Whilst my kitchen saga goes on I absolutely refuse to sign an agreement until I am ready and have got to the bottom of the high prices that appear to be the norm in the kitchen supply business. SWMBO is not being obeyed and this will not be installed by Christmas - which sends a better message to suppliers.
I really can understand why the price bubble exists and people get into debt because clearly these kitchen guys seem to be expecting that the money to pay them with is borrowed via personal loan or mortgage. People must just be getting the quotes doing a bit of cross checking (but not much) and then getting low interest funding to commit to a huge cost for a kitchen.
The game is to discount the appliances but load the granite. Discount the granite and load the appliances. Most companies say they cannot do both - I am now talking sensibly to one who might do both.
One quote is £45k and I am targetting £20k with one supplier currently at £26k and one at £30k.
Language promulagted around is "the kitchen is the most expensive room in the house" - "most kitchens are £15 to £25k".
Our design has some specials so I am ok to spend a bit more but the whole process seems as though the kitchen suppliers are used to extracting alrge amounts of cash on the basis that it is the norm.
And before you weigh in on me - I am not going to lift a finger in any of the work - too busy and past it. I know some of you have done "great things on little money" - which was an oft used phrase by my late father.
What ? :o :o :o people here buy homes with that money nearly ???
send an invitation or search for Turkish firms :y dont know cargo costs but prices here are 1/5 or less if your kitchen is not enormous size..
mine cost around £4K including granite and all equipments.. ;D
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One quote is £45k and I am targetting £20k with one supplier currently at £26k and one at £30k.
T
Language promulagted around is "the kitchen is the most expensive room in the house" - "most kitchens are £15 to £25k".
WOW ! Some of these numbers scare me crapless. I am hoping to buy a big old house that pretty much has no kitchen, just big room with a tiled floor an old Rayburn type cooker and nothing else, nothing.
This sounds like a pretty high-end kitchen, Rog. You could get a small semi up here for that. ;D
A quid for a terrace in scouse land and nick the kitchen :y :D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
When was the last time you had a small semi, Cleggy? ;D
I'll give you that one ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D ;D
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Are you not able to to do the sourcing (little overhead)?
E.g., source required units, sub con a fitter, spark, plumber, source the worktops and appliances?
My experience is that the cheapest place for applances and worktops is never a kitchen supplier and yet many still buy everything from them
This would be a classic way forward but tradesmen round here ain't cheap. I have some prices for some of the jobs but this is why I say you have to understand how the kitchen companies work. They sub out the civil works allegedly at cost and make their money on the cabinets. My idea is to get a contribution from their gross profit on the cabinets into my civil works.
One told me yesterday that 15% gross profit was no use to him as his bosses would be unhappy.
Fly some in from Poland :y
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a plumber was working next door recently and his trainee under some sort of scheme was a Ghurka. Maybe this is the "new" Polish tradesperson
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this is one of our famous firms experienced in kitchens.. and their prices never reach even 1/3 1/4 of your prices
http://www.emlakjet.com/haber/foto-galeri.php?imaj_id=45284#foto_td (http://www.emlakjet.com/haber/foto-galeri.php?imaj_id=45284#foto_td)
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this is one of our famous firms experienced in kitchens.. and their prices never reach even 1/3 1/4 of your prices
http://www.emlakjet.com/haber/foto-galeri.php?imaj_id=45284#foto_td (http://www.emlakjet.com/haber/foto-galeri.php?imaj_id=45284#foto_td)
Looks very German eg Schuller brand
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I know you don't want to do it yourself, but the savings to be had are tremendous once you source everything at trade price. I have fitted 6 kitchens in various houses - mine and offspring - over the years. Only trades brought in were leccies (sometimes) and worktop fitting for specialist cutting. DIY has the added advantage that you can design it such that if necessary you can remove units easily for access to W.H.Y., which kitchen fitters, on a time clock, will not usually do:y
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A kitchen comprises of a kitchen table, and a cooker for the lady of the house to slave over.
Anything more is excessive.
Budget £1000 tops. :y :y ::) ::) ::) :P :P :P :P :P :P
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A kitchen comprises of a kitchen table, and a cooker for the lady of the house to slave over.
Anything more is excessive.
Budget £1000 tops. :y :y ::) ::) ::) :P :P :P :P :P :P
Is that what them downstairs get My Lord? ::) ::) ::)
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A kitchen comprises of a kitchen table, and a cooker for the lady of the house to slave over.
Anything more is excessive.
Budget £1000 tops. :y :y ::) ::) ::) :P :P :P :P :P :P
You forgot the kitchen sink.....so she can do the washing up :y ;D
Me, ive a dishwasher as the lady of the house refuses to do it....plus they dont do doggy marigolds ;D
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Christ, have you tried Howdens? ;D
No seriously.
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My folks have a pretty small kitchen (I'll dig up a pic later if anyone is remotely interested .. so probably not ;D) - Homebase quoted £14k, B&Q about £16k and Wren about £12k.
Homebase refused to budge on price, B&Q came down about £4k and Wren halved it to £6k - bear in mind the only appliance involved is a dishwasher (they're using their existing cooker, fridge etc).
The prices are eye watering - I dread to think what a quote to do mine would be, especially as it would include knocking out the remainder of a wall and fitting a steel, rewiring, replastering, skim the ceiling, all new appliances.. I better start looking for second mortgages ;D
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this is one of our famous firms experienced in kitchens.. and their prices never reach even 1/3 1/4 of your prices
http://www.emlakjet.com/haber/foto-galeri.php?imaj_id=45284#foto_td (http://www.emlakjet.com/haber/foto-galeri.php?imaj_id=45284#foto_td)
Looks very German eg Schuller brand
ask the Germany price and see the difference ;)
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I would think that a new kitchen is a relatively simple job for a half-decent D.I.Yer.
As so much of the cost is made up of labour I'd be tempted to give it a go myself. :y :y
I designed and built a complete soakaway system for our septic tank.........total cost for parts about £280 including the hire of a mini-digger. The cheapest quote we were given was over £4,000 :o :o :o :o
Man, that was a shit job if ever there was one. :'( :'(
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There not hard to fit, kitchen units by thier very nature are designed for ease of adjustment (e.g. adjustable legs and mounting brackets).
Similarly, if you have the tools, worktops are not to challenging (given a worktop jig and decent router to do the masons mitres).
But for some people its time is an issue.
My challenge is that I am yet to get a job done by a third party which meets my expectations (with the exception of plastering now I think about it) or is to the same standard as I would do myself.
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My challenge is that I am yet to get a job done by a third party which meets my expectations (with the exception of plastering now I think about it) or is to the same standard as I would do myself.
That definitely falls under "Jobs I will (no longer) attempt myself" .. unless I want it to end up looking like I've covered the walls in fondant icing using a palette knife.. ;D
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Yep, once into the swing of it, fitting a kitchen is not too bad, although, if I ever have to fit another worktop, I'll get a router that actually fits my cutting jig - just to calm the blood pressure during the cutting process. ::)
I think it's something people imagine will be beyond DIY capabilities and the fitting companies take advantage of that fact, then charge a fortune to send a couple of muppets round to do the job.
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It think the op is considering granite work tops?
But yes routering wood work tops is very doable. Takes some for thought for the router direction, and it helps if ones router insert does actually centre the router in the jig ::) ;D plus be prepared for a lot of lifting in and out.
Oh, and don't expect rooms and hence units to be square. So routed joints may need to be something other than 90degrees >:(
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I may be crap as an Omega mechanic but I'm pretty accomplished when it comes to D.I.Y around the house, even prepared to take on quite major operations.
In fact, In the last five years I've designed and added two further bathrooms.
The one in the bedroom is some six feet by three but is easily large enough to hold a toilet, a sink, and walk in shower. Total cost about £1200.
The second extra bathroom measures about 12x10 and comes with another bath which brings the total to three......total cost less than £1000.
Connecting the water was my main concern. :y :y
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It think the op is considering granite work tops?
But yes routering wood work tops is very doable. Takes some for thought for the router direction, and it helps if ones router insert does actually centre the router in the jig ::) ;D plus be prepared for a lot of lifting in and out.
Oh, and don't expect rooms and hence units to be square. So routed joints may need to be something other than 90degrees >:(
I think my poxy router would certainly baulk at granite. ;D So yes, best let the pro's fit those.
Got the tea shirt on everything else, though. Can't remember who it was who turned up innocently for a Tech 2 session when I was at the "a lot of lifting in and out" stage, but I do owe an favour to an OOF'er for that. ;D
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There not hard to fit, kitchen units by thier very nature are designed for ease of adjustment (e.g. adjustable legs and mounting brackets).
Similarly, if you have the tools, worktops are not to challenging (given a worktop jig and decent router to do the masons mitres).
But for some people its time is an issue.
My challenge is that I am yet to get a job done by a third party which meets my expectations (with the exception of plastering now I think about it) or is to the same standard as I would do myself.
Exactly how I feel Mark. A friend and neighbour recently had a top quality kitchen fitted, everything new, I don't know exactly what it cost, but in the region of £50k, and it is not well fitted, they have had to come back half a dozen times with glitches, and Mrs neighbour is not at all happy with it. :-X
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It think the op is considering granite work tops?
But yes routering wood work tops is very doable. Takes some for thought for the router direction, and it helps if ones router insert does actually centre the router in the jig ::) ;D plus be prepared for a lot of lifting in and out.
Oh, and don't expect rooms and hence units to be square. So routed joints may need to be something other than 90degrees >:(
I think my poxy router would certainly baulk at granite. ;D So yes, best let the pro's fit those.
Got the tea shirt on everything else, though. Can't remember who it was who turned up innocently for a Tech 2 session when I was at the "a lot of lifting in and out" stage, but I do owe an favour to an OOF'er for that. ;D
2woody ? He may have mentioned it? Once or twice ;D
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I may be crap as an Omega mechanic but I'm pretty accomplished when it comes to D.I.Y around the house, even prepared to take on quite major operations.
In fact, In the last five years I've designed and added two further bathrooms.
The one in the bedroom is some six feet by three but is easily large enough to hold a toilet, a sink, and walk in shower. Total cost about £1200.
The second extra bathroom measures about 12x10 and comes with another bath which brings the total to three......total cost less than £1000.
Connecting the water was my main concern. :y :y
What's that one for Mrs Opti and the other for all of your downstairs staff to use?
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Kitchens and bathrooms are a doddle to fit :y just don't expect me do do tiling or plastering ::)
My brothers kitchen came from John Lewis, and three years later, the only issue has been a cracked glass hob, but otherwise still looks as new, cost less than 10k including services and appliances. Room was originally a sitting room, so was fitted from scratch.
Ours was an MFI one and cost less than three, but starting to look thirteen years old...
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John Lewis for £10k is good. Cabinets probably built by Mereway in Midlands.
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I should add that they work for the partnership, so probably closer to £12/14k in real terms :-\ but as said that was all the plumbing and electrics from scratch plus floor and wall tiling and appliances. Was a couple of weeks work iirc, a chunk of which was allowing the floor to set :y
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Kitchens and bathrooms are a doddle to fit :y just don't expect me do do tiling or plastering ::)
My brothers kitchen came from John Lewis, and three years later, the only issue has been a cracked glass hob, but otherwise still looks as new, cost less than 10k including services and appliances. Room was originally a sitting room, so was fitted from scratch.
Ours was an MFI one and cost less than three, but starting to look thirteen years old...
You should try it Al, its very easy for anyone good with their hands, and very satisfying. :y
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Yeh, tiling is a doddle, a good adhesive spreader and grout float are the key
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Yeh, tiling is a doddle, a good adhesive spreader and grout float are the key
Electric tile cutters make things easier as well. ;)
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Yeh, tiling is a doddle, a good adhesive spreader and grout float are the key
Electric tile cutters make things easier as well. ;)
Yep, I do use one for more complex cuts (obviously not straight cuts) but also use an angle grinder with a good diamond blade in it to
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I did all the plumbing and fitted the units etc ::) someone else can have a go ;D
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I did all the plumbing and fitted the units etc ::) someone else can have a go ;D
If you did all that, tiling is much easier! :y
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Probably is, but I never really got on with it tbh :-[