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Chat Area => General Car Chat => Topic started by: vauxsull on 13 February 2014, 23:14:09

Title: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 13 February 2014, 23:14:09
What would i expect to pay if i wanted it removed and resealed ( only couple of months old but suspect it needs re seating and sealing..)
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: jonny2112 on 13 February 2014, 23:35:06
Not fancy trying it yourself? It's not too difficult (I managed it!!) but time consuming.
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 00:02:25
Been  mentioned its a basket case of a job plus i don't have torque wrench and ability to remove the so called "bastard bolt" ..
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Nick W on 14 February 2014, 00:28:20
If it's been apart recently, then splitting the housing and transfer tube shouldn't be a problem. That's the 'hard' part of the job. A torque wrench isn't that important, I wouldn't put off doing this job for not having one. The bastard bolt is fiddly, and possibly time consuming, but is nothing to really worry about.
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 00:34:47
I would rather pay someone to do it to be honest as its a time and confidence thing for me... I can do many jobs on these cars but when it comes to dismantling the engine it brings me out in a rash haha.... I'm not certain it is the themowotsit but everything else in the area has been changed or cleaned or resealed but leak is still there so fingers pointing to re doing thermowotsit again.
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: jonny2112 on 14 February 2014, 00:41:29
If you remove the plenum it should be obvious if the leak is from the stat. If you can manage to get this far it would be worth checking first without having to pay someone. If you're not confident with that, then I suggest a fellow OOF er would be the best bet if possible.
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 14 February 2014, 01:19:12
Given that both the thermostat-block and thermostat-transfer pipe are sealed with rubber seals, I would be concerned if it was leaking...

Where do you think it is leaking from? What evidence? If from the transfer pipe, then is the Bstard bolt present?  If that wasn't refitted correctly, the transfer pipe could separate from the thermostat housing. If coolant is leaking from the top of the engine then I would be looking at the oil cooler plate, not the thermostat  :-\

Either way, I wouldn't be using that garage again :-X
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: chrisgixer on 14 February 2014, 09:39:35
I think it's worth finding the exact fault, first off. :)

Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Johnny English on 14 February 2014, 09:52:09
What would i expect to pay if i wanted it removed and resealed ( only couple of months old but suspect it needs re seating and sealing..)

If I were you I would check when the leaking gets start as possible that it's occuring only after stat opening. If yes then no need to change anything but "O" rings of transfer pipe.  :y Worth checking again I say. ;)
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 11:18:54
The thermostat and transfer pipe where changed together by elite Pete last summer... He's since removed coolant bridge ,cleaned up surfaces and replaced with new washers.. Oil cooler was replaced and resealed using gm sealant but we never checked or noticed the thermostat but in hindsight maybe should have unbolted and resealed but we never...
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 11:21:39
Seems to get worse when car parked on an incline as if coolant is running out of the back onto exhaust.. The smell of coolant coming into car through vents makes me feel sick.
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: tigers_gonads on 14 February 2014, 11:31:17
If you have a spare coolant bottle cap, nip down the local tyre fitters and grab a shroader valve off them and fit it to your spare cap.

Swap with the one on your bottle and pressurise the coolant system with a few pumps of a bike pump.
If you have a leak, you should be able to see it pishing out  :y :y
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Johnny English on 14 February 2014, 11:35:25
Seems to get worse when car parked on an incline as if coolant is running out of the back onto exhaust1.. The smell of coolant coming into car through vents2 makes me feel sick.

1 Steam onto the exhaust? Make compression rate measuring

2 a pressure check of coolant

If you have a spare coolant bottle cap, nip down the local tyre fitters and grab a shroader valve off them and fit it to your spare cap.

Swap with the one on your bottle and pressurise the coolant system with a few pumps of a bike pump.
If you have a leak, you should be able to see it pishing out  :y :y

 :y
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Sir Tigger KC on 14 February 2014, 11:54:02
So the thermostat, coolant bridge and oil cooler have all been done recently and you still have coolant leaking down the back of the engine.   :(

Given that everything else has been changed have you checked the HBV?  ???  ;)
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 14 February 2014, 12:16:49
So the thermostat, coolant bridge and oil cooler have all been done recently and you still have coolant leaking down the back of the engine.   :(

Given that everything else has been changed have you checked the HBV?  ???  ;)
Was just thinking the same ::)

If you had said that Elite Pete had done the work then two things would have happened...

1. You would have been directed straight to the HBV.

2. I would not have make my comment about the garage :-[

There are several people here who cannot be bested when it comes to working on Omegas. Elite Pete is definitely one of them :y
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: I_want_an_Omega on 14 February 2014, 13:38:04
So the thermostat, coolant bridge and oil cooler have all been done recently and you still have coolant leaking down the back of the engine.   :(

Given that everything else has been changed have you checked the HBV?  ???  ;)
Was just thinking the same ::)

If you had said that Elite Pete had done the work then two things would have happened...

1. You would have been directed straight to the HBV.

2. I would not have make my comment about the garage :-[

There are several people here who cannot be bested when it comes to working on Omegas. Elite Pete is definitely one of them :y

+ 1  :y
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 14:38:24
The hbv has been done too last july... Just popped into local garage and gave them all info as to what's been done and when... He tells me its the matrix?? Without lookin at it just going on what i told him
.. I have no wet carpets but can smell coolant inside car when stationary..
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 14:43:33
Lincs rob... Where you under the impression i was not happy with Pete doing the work on my car???? If so your much mistaken... He knows this car better than i do..
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 14 February 2014, 15:27:24
Lincs rob... Where you under the impression i was not happy with Pete doing the work on my car???? If so your much mistaken... He knows this car better than i do..
You missed the point ::) in your opening post you suggested you had a leak from a recently fitted thermostat, and that the work had been done by A N Other garage.

Had you said that Pete had fitted the thermostat and oil cooler then we would have pointed straight to the HBV rather than suggesting the garage had screwed up.

Elite Pete is widely acknowledged for being one of several Omega gurus. That was my point, and Rob was simply agreeing with it :y

As for the leak... Might be a split/perished hose, but... Was the HBV genuine/new pattern/second hand? If either of the last two, then a year isn't bad... buy a genuine new one from a Vauxhall dealer rather than ebay :y

Almost certainly not the heater matrix if you can only smell it when stationary. If the heater matrix leaks into the car, the aircon cannot deal with the extra moisture, so ends up constantly steamed up :-\
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 15:31:06
I see.. I must have misunderstand the comment... Pete is a mate of mine and as i said he knows car better than i do..... Anyway hbv is a GM part and it doesn't appear to be leaking as it looked dry to me when Pete stripped it down the other week... Is there a suspect core plug behind there??
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 15:34:17
Air on needs gassing too so can't cope with damp clothing in car so it is steaming up in this present whether
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 14 February 2014, 15:41:13
Don't think so :-\

Did Pete mention anything untoward? Could be as daft as a weak jubilee clip or a pin hole in a hose :-\
Air on needs gassing too so can't cope with damp clothing in car so it is steaming up in this present whether
Ok... mine has working aircon and a leaking matrix... carpet was sodden, ripped out last weekend along with all the foam underneath. Floor pan all dried and with the heater set low, it barely steams up at all.

The HBV doesn't leak at any set temp, they all vary... pressurising the system is probably your next step by the sound of it :-\
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 15:52:37
Pete pressurised it with the modified cap a while back and no leak was evident... Only seems to appear when car is warm/hot...
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 14 February 2014, 15:58:12
How much is it losing :-\
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 15:58:55
Over a ltr per week
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 14 February 2014, 16:01:34
What temp settings on the heater panel?
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 16:02:59
I keep on or about 28
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 16:05:17
Just bought another 3 1ltr bottles of coolant which in all told is about 15ltrs which made up a 50/50 mix so have topped up about 30ltrs since troubles began
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 14 February 2014, 16:09:40
Drop it down to 18, set same both sides and see if that improves the amount you're losing :y
If it improves then the problem could be either the heater or the hbv, if it gets worse then it's almost certainly the hbv :y

If you clean and dry the windows and apply some RainX anti fog, then that will help with the misting :y
Drop the rear windows a touch or crack open the sunroof to help with the airflow through the car as well...
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Marks DTM Calib on 14 February 2014, 16:28:53
Toc chekc heater bypass valve, observe it and set the climate on 'lo', then repeat with the climate set to 'Hi'
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 16:30:07
Or i could just scrap it ...... Even though ive spent a grand on it since the summer
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 14 February 2014, 16:40:40
Or i could just scrap it ...... Even though ive spent a grand on it since the summer
You don't want to do that :o
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 16:43:16
Ya think !!! Don't mind spending money on regular maintenance but when its an on going thing like this it saps ya so ;Dul hehe
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 14 February 2014, 16:44:56
Ya think !!! Don't mind spending money on regular maintenance but when its an on going thing like this it saps ya so ;Dul hehe
The weather doesn't help matters :-\
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 16:55:17
Nor does 10 hour working days
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Shackeng on 14 February 2014, 17:27:09
What would i expect to pay if i wanted it removed and resealed ( only couple of months old but suspect it needs re seating and sealing..)

Were the transfer pipe and/or pipe seals changed at this time?
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 14 February 2014, 17:35:13
Yes all changed using GM stuff... Drain tube too
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 16 February 2014, 11:13:12
Before i pour this stuff in to the expansion tank am i making a mistake or have nothing to lose? I have bought a bottle of Holts sealit coolant leak repair.. Says its permanent and guaranteed.... Thought i would try it to solve this on going coolant loss ... Thoughts guys !!!
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Bigron on 16 February 2014, 12:13:29
I have had good experiences of K-Seal (www.eurocarparts.com/ecp/p/car-accessories/engine-oils-and-car-fluids/car-additives/cooling-system-treatment/?542770100&0&cc5_171), which DOES work and can be left in the coolant system permanently without harm, just waiting to deal with the next leak!

Ron.
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 16 February 2014, 12:18:33
Before i pour this stuff in to the expansion tank am i making a mistake or have nothing to lose? I have bought a bottle of Holts sealit coolant leak repair.. Says its permanent and guaranteed.... Thought i would try it to solve this on going coolant loss ... Thoughts guys !!!
DO NOT PUT ANYTHING ALONG THOSE LINES IN YOUR COOLING SYSTEM. EVER

Doing so will block the heater matrix and oil cooler :'(
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 16 February 2014, 12:25:31
Haha do you feel strongly about that? Haha
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 16 February 2014, 12:29:16
Haven't put any in yet but cost me £11 haha.. Been looking at some nice Vectra's in the trader... Not sure i live this miggy anymore.
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 16 February 2014, 12:29:36
Love
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 16 February 2014, 12:39:01
Haha do you feel strongly about that? Haha
Haven't put any in yet but cost me £11 haha.. Been looking at some nice Vectra's in the trader... Not sure i love this miggy anymore.
First up, not my car, but rest assured you will 'not love' it even more once the cooling system packs up from using that.

Secondly, where on earth did you buy it at that price :o

Take it back and spend the £12 at Mcdonalds, it will be better for you ;D

Coolant leaks tend to happen in a smaller number of places on an Omega. Once located, fixing them is relatively straightforward :y

Given that EP is local, and knows the car, have him take another look at it :y
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 16 February 2014, 12:59:59
I paid that amount for it at a car accessory place called checkpoint.. Don't know if they're nation wide or not... Pete is aware of this reoccurring problem but wont be available for a while yet.... He's probably just as fed up taking my engine apart as i am watching him hehe
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 16 February 2014, 13:09:58
Don't want to get rid of this car as ive spent a small fortune on it and for an X plate has only covered just over 105,000 miles
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Elite Pete on 16 February 2014, 19:04:17
When Vauxsull bought the car it was evident that the cooling system hadn't been looked after. There was no heat in the cabin and the coolant was thick with crud plus the car wasn't getting up to temp. The system was flushed and a new thermostat was fitted and Vauxsull spent a weekend flushing the heater matrix which sorted the cold cabin problem but Vauxsull reported the smell of coolant so he came down and I removed the plenum, inlet manifold and sandwich plate and pressurised the cooling system which held the pressure for a good 10 mins without dropping. There was evidence of a leak in the V but couldn't tell if the leak was current or an old one so we decided to reseal the oil cooler plate and replace the seals on the coolant bridge which was done a couple of weeks ago.

 I can't look at Vauxsulls Omega again until the beginning of March because I have urgent jobs to do on my own car which I've put off for nearly 2 months and if I don't get them done it's going to cost me even more to put right plus i have commitments to other people but if Vauxsull can wait I'll gladly take another look :y
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 16 February 2014, 19:12:26
Took me half an hour to read all that Pete haha
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Jimbob on 17 February 2014, 08:52:01
The thought occurs its had radweld or similar in it in the past. My old blue one ran on it for a while due to similar issues which turns out to be a weeping core plug.
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 17 February 2014, 11:03:34
Is a core plug a bugger to do James? Whatever it is its gone beyond weeping.
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Andy B on 17 February 2014, 11:36:10
Is a core plug a bugger to do James? Whatever it is its gone beyond weeping.

Fitting a core plug is easy ... a quick thump with a hammer & suitable sized drift. The hard part is normally getting to them.  :y
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 17 February 2014, 12:10:27
And sods law says its tucked down the back behind pipes n stuff too
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: Elite Pete on 17 February 2014, 18:03:04
So the thermostat, coolant bridge and oil cooler have all been done recently and you still have coolant leaking down the back of the engine.   :(

Given that everything else has been changed have you checked the HBV?  ???  ;)
Was just thinking the same ::)

If you had said that Elite Pete had done the work then two things would have happened...

1. You would have been directed straight to the HBV.

2. I would not have make my comment about the garage :-[

There are several people here who cannot be bested when it comes to working on Omegas. Elite Pete is definitely one of them :y

+ 1  :y

Ahhhh cheers fellas, looks like i'll be spending a lot of time on my hands and knees the next time we meet :-* :-* ;D
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 17 February 2014, 18:13:18
Pucker up Pete hehe
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 04 March 2014, 10:42:49
Right then... The leak appears to be coming from somewhere above the oil filter housing... Are we looking at a core plug ?? At least i can now rule out matrix.
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: 05omegav6 on 04 March 2014, 10:52:41
Core plug above the oil filter would be obvious if it were leaking, as clearly visible from underneath iirc :-\

Is the bastid bolt still in place and tight? If that comes loose it allows the transfer pipe to move, which will allow coolant out, which could find its way to the oil filter. Top hose might have a pinhole in it? Is either pipe dry underneath  :-\
Title: Re: v6 thermostat
Post by: vauxsull on 04 March 2014, 10:55:31
Bastard bolt is tight yes... Pipes feel dry underneath too.. Losing over a ltr per week too