Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: tigers_gonads on 03 December 2014, 17:52:09
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As you lot know, i've had some fun with the front bearings.
That's all sorted now so its time to get the front setup properly.
I'm not traveling down to a WIM dealer this time because it will all need doing again when I start messing about with the suspension next year so i've booked it into Hi Q in morning to get the front wheels pointing in the right direction :y
Mentioned WIM to them and talked about the settings they use.
They are quite happy to use what settings I tell them SO what are the settings that WIM use for the front end ?
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In one of my posts on the other frontwheel bearing thread iirc :y
If you can't find it let me know and I can scan my printout and email it you...
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Op has mv6 though Al, so differant (ride height and) front camber. -1.15
Although -1.10 works just as well for non sports driving, so to speak.
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Op has mv6 though Al, so differant (ride height and) front camber. -1.15
Although -1.10 works just as well for non sports driving, so to speak.
Got it :y not had the Oxymoron set up yet... ::)
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So I should ask for the front camber to be set up too -1.15
Have I got this right ?
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So I should ask for the front camber to be set up too -1.15
Have I got this right ?
Here do...
From tother thread...
Ideal is 1°10 1°15, with castor of around 5° and toe in of 0°05 at the front. (Castor might vary from side to side slightly, and only shifting the subframe can sort it, all the other dimensions must be symetrical though)
Rears will fall where you can get them, but target for 1°30 camber and toe as close to 0°05 as you can get it. Whatever the rear ends up at, the thrust angle MUST be 0°.
Edited to allow for lower MV6 ride height :y
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So I should ask for the front camber to be set up too -1.15
Have I got this right ?
If your a "progressive" driver, yes. If not -1.10 works perfectly well.
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Cheers lads for your help ............. mucho appreciated :)
Chris, when i've got the mutt / missus & mini me in the car I drive quite quick without chucking it around too much.
When its just me, shall we say I do like to challenge myself point to point down roads I know well if at all possible :-X ;)
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1°15 it is then... ;D
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:o :o :o - not going to WIM, but using their settings :o :o :o - I got aggro over doing this, yet you get people giving you the "secret" settings :o :o :o ::) ::)
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:o :o :o - not going to WIM, but using their settings :o :o :o - I got aggro over doing this, yet you get people giving you the "secret" settings :o :o :o ::) ::)
There's definitely something in the water up ther you know! ;D
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Oh dear, what have I started now ::)
TB's inbox will be full by now :-X :D
Right, front end was miles out.
Rear is crabbing slightly so that will be the reason why it always seams to be tail happy when I load up the back end when turning right :-\
The lads at Hi Q had a hell of a job getting the front end to move but managed it eventually with some help from Mr Oxy Acetylene :D
Front is now setup as per WIM but they want me to drive it around and take it back on Saturday morning for a final tweak when everything been moved around and cooled off properly.
Upto now, If you can't get to WIM I can highly recommend these lads :y
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I'd ask to see the final figures, but somebody might get upset ;D
Re tail happiness, Iirc you've done your rear donuts? Are they fitted with correct orientation? Or are the rear of subframe bushes by dif seperated? ....or indeed has the new setting fixed it?
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Oh dear, what have I started now ::)
TB's inbox will be full by now :-X :D
Right, front end was miles out.
Rear is crabbing slightly so that will be the reason why it always seams to be tail happy when I load up the back end when turning right :-\
The lads at Hi Q had a hell of a job getting the front end to move but managed it eventually with some help from Mr Oxy Acetylene :D
Front is now setup as per WIM but they want me to drive it around and take it back on Saturday morning for a final tweak when everything been moved around and cooled off properly.
Upto now, If you can't get to WIM I can highly recommend these lads :y
Glad youre sorted mate - there are other people out there capable of carryng out full geo :y
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Ah, but you say that without seeing the secret figures. ;D
Certainly that crowd you recommended up in Huntingdon can't manage anything better than -1.45 by all accounts. So it's not really a case of being capable, but accurate. ;)
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Ah, but you say that without seeing the secret figures. ;D
Certainly that crowd you recommended up in Huntingdon can't manage anything better than -1.45 by all accounts. So it's not really a case of being capable, but accurate. ;)
Not in Huntingdon ;) Got my camber to "OOF spec" - get your facts straight before continually running people down >:(
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Facts aye? I'm not talking about you. Or yours. ;D dear oh dear.... ::)
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And it's Wim spec. Just to be fair to them. :y
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Ah, but you say that without seeing the secret figures. ;D
Certainly that crowd you recommended up in Huntingdon can't manage anything better than -1.45 by all accounts. So it's not really a case of being capable, but accurate. ;)
Facts aye? I'm not talking about you. Or yours. ;D dear oh dear.... ::)
Yep facts - the "crowd" I "recommended up in Huntingdon" aren't in Huntingdon, and your sweeping statement that they "can't manage anything better than -1.45", I assume for camber, was on one member's car - on mine they achieved correct figures.
But at the end of the day you know it all and are always right ::)
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Well seeing as "they" are some sort of big secret known only to you, I couldn't possibly know could i...?
So your wrong there ;D ;D
Anyway, hope it works out locally. It's a long way to Wim. :y
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Well seeing as "they" are some sort of big secret known only to you, I couldn't possibly know could i...?
So your wrong there ;D ;D
Anyway, hope it works out locally. It's a long way to Wim. :y
Not a big secret known only to me, just not known to you ;D ;D Quite a few OOFers are well aware of this company.
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Good news then. :y
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Good news then. :y
:y :y
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I'd ask to see the final figures, but somebody might get upset ;D
Re tail happiness, Iirc you've done your rear donuts? Are they fitted with correct orientation? Or are the rear of subframe bushes by dif seperated? ....or indeed has the new setting fixed it?
The donuts never got done in the end Chris. 3 guesses for the reason :-[ :( but I did have a good look / tried to move them about when I replaced the rear springs for the MOT and couldn't see anything untoward.
One of the rear bearings has been flagged up on the last 2 mot's.
There is a tiny bit of movement in it so its on the list when funds allow.
Thrust angle is currently reading at 0.14 deg. Is that a big problem ?
I'll post on here the before / interim / finish settings over the weekend when I get it tweaked :y
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If the steering wheel is level I wouldn't worry about the thrust centre.
If it's mot level and the front settings are correct that's the first place look for a cause, as the rear is constantly steared 0.14 to one side, you may notice constantly correcting that with the steering wheel.
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As Chris says, thrust angle does this:
(http://taleb.xsdv.com/content/Pages/Thrust_Angle.gif)
You really want it to be 0º 0'
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Did they complain the rear track rod adjustors where seized..?
You could try regular soakings of penetrating oil to help them. In the slots of the adjustors clamps might give it a chance.
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If the steering wheel is level I wouldn't worry about the thrust centre.
If it's mot level and the front settings are correct that's the first place look for a cause, as the rear is constantly steared 0.14 to one side, you may notice constantly correcting that with the steering wheel.
...not...
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Car has always tended to drift into the curb on anything but a perfectly flat surface.
Also tends to pull initially left under braking then stabilises and stops in a straight line.
All front brakes are VX and new.
Front callipers stripped and cleaned.
Calliper carrier was cleaned on a wire wheel to ensure no corrosion whatsoever then light film of copper slip applied were the new pads sit.
No knocks, clunks or rumbling whatsoever from the drivetrain as far as I can tell :-\
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Steering idler play? Or failed wishbone bushes? Or loose wishbone bolts?
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Steering idler play? Or failed wishbone bushes? Or loose wishbone bolts?
I'll have a look Chris, cheers for that :y
I'm of the opinion that the knackered discs finished that hub bearing off in quick time BUT if I find anything else loose of worn out, I will be having words with the lad who did my MOT back in September.
Don't mind the MOT man being generous because we go back years BUT if something's wrong, I want to know >:(
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At the wim open day, several years ago now, 13 cars attended.
Only 11 of those cars where fit for set up due to various failed components. Every single one of those cars had a valid mot obviously.
We simply can not rely on mot testers to fault find correctly. They are more interested in filling quotas according to guidelines than what's actually wrong with the car.
Your bushes are of least importance, as a failed bush is 1) difficult to spot as they usually test wheels loaded 2) not going to result in bits falling off.
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A lot of good points there Chris
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Okay, just a quick update on this
The car now goes around corners much better and no longer scares me when I flick it around a roundabout in the wet. In fact, it actually corners and feels like my first mig (2.5 manual saloon) which is the one that got me hooked on the big engine / rear wheel drive thing :D
Right, here is the crap bit >:(
The car still twitches initially to the left when I stab or brake hard.
I know that one of the rear discs is badly scored due the self-abuser who I bought it off telling porky pies about the locking wheel nut key being in the car and one of the rear pads getting down the rivets before I could get the wheel off so i'm thinking that this might have something to do with it >:(
I have also been reminded that this really started getting out of hand after I had the back end jacked up for the spring change / all the weight was on the front end for a couple of days :-[
My scanner isn't working at the moment so i'll post up the geo settings when I get it fixed.
Must say the lads at Hi Q saw me right.
Only charged my 42 quid for adjusting front and back over 3 visits :y
Also another question if I may, the 2 bolts which need to loosened to adjust the castor should be elongated bolts iirc. Are these fitted as standard or do I need to buy them separate when I change the front shocks ?
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Camber bolts will be fine.
Also check steering idler, wisbone bushes, and wishbone bolts for tightness. Don't rule out tyre wear either although that's more of a drift if it's uneven.
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Camber bolts will be fine.
Also check steering idler, wisbone bushes, and wishbone bolts for tightness. Don't rule out tyre wear either although that's more of a drift if it's uneven.
Can the wishbone bolts be tweaked with the car on the ground or should the car be up in the air with the weight off the wheels ?
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Camber bolts will be fine.
Also check steering idler, wisbone bushes, and wishbone bolts for tightness. Don't rule out tyre wear either although that's more of a drift if it's uneven.
Can the wishbone bolts be tweaked with the car on the ground or should the car be up in the air with the weight off the wheels ?
Tweaked? 120nm plus 30 degrees then 15degreees.
If you have poly it doesn't matter. If normal rubber bushes then it needs to be done wheels loaded. Do you have ramps? And Jack that will go high enough to place the ramps under...?
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Camber bolts will be fine.
Also check steering idler, wisbone bushes, and wishbone bolts for tightness. Don't rule out tyre wear either although that's more of a drift if it's uneven.
Can the wishbone bolts be tweaked with the car on the ground or should the car be up in the air with the weight off the wheels ?
Tweaked? 120nm plus 30 degrees then 15degreees.
If you have poly it doesn't matter. If normal rubber bushes then it needs to be done wheels loaded. Do you have ramps? And Jack that will go high enough to place the ramps under...?
No polys yet, just rubber.
Yes I have ramps but the front spoiler catches and the jack is only a 2 ton one so wont lift that far.
I'll see if I can dig out a plank or 2 to reduce the angle on the ramps or maybe some blocks of wood for the jack :y
Cheers Chris :)