Omega Owners Forum
Chat Area => General Discussion Area => Topic started by: Varche on 07 January 2015, 17:14:21
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I for one am not surprised that the NHS is in crisis. I am deeply sorry that it isn't performing as it should.
This current A and E crisis - that is the right word for it is a culmination of factors.
Can you see a GP when you are ill in the UK? Yes but in a few days time when you have navigated the 8.30 call hurdle.
Hospital beds full of old people who statistically ten years ago would have been dead by now. Why are they there ? Social services has been cut to the bone by successive governments despite there being an ever bigger need.
How can a poor country like Spain be able to offer next day and often same day appointments through an efficient one number serves a whole province service/Internet booking? How can they offer hospital procedures much quicker than the Uk which let us not forget is a very rich country?
What has changed since we were young? Then when you needed to see a doctor you rang the surgery and got an appointment the same day. If you were too ill to attend the surgery, a doctor would come to you at home. If you needed a doctor at two in the morning or any time Saturday or Sunday, one would be there for you.
Varche's solution. Well for a start I would make greater use of Chemists for minor ailments. They get paid a fantastic amount of taxpayers money even if they only make ONE prescription a year. Then I would bring doctors into line with industry. One day closed in the week and one open at weekend (normal pay). NHS. I would get them to do a cost of failure anaysis. There is loads of waste. Just think missed appointments for one. I would also bring in charging . That would encourage people to attend their appointment. In fact maybe £300 (like other countries) toward the cost of an operation. On the same tack £10 for a doctors consultation too. I would charge for IVF and other cosmetic procedures. It isn't a right to have children but it is important to try and maintain the health and wellbeing of existing humans. I know that the NHS is supposed to be free but something has to give. Maybe some tiers of managers could go.10% more with 10% less like Private industry does every year.
Will it happen? No because for some unfathomable reason the NHS is a sacred cow and is now going to get tossed around like a political football. .Beggar, I did say it wouldn't be political.
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£300 for an op? Assuming that includes diagnostic procedures I'd have elected to carry on sh.. pooping blood & blood clots rather than pay that to have a camera stuffed up there which (so far) has ultimately told me nothing is wrong (except the obvious that there's clearly no medical cause for… hmm!)
Or I'd have gone private and paid my £100 excess ;) ;D
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£300 for an op? Assuming that includes diagnostic procedures I'd have elected to carry on sh.. pooping blood & blood clots rather than pay that to have a camera stuffed up there which (so far) has ultimately told me nothing is wrong (except the obvious that there's clearly no medical cause for… hmm!)
Or I'd have gone private and paid my £100 excess ;) ;D
Some people ( Tory politicians?) are more than happy to pay to have 'foreign implements' shoved up their arse.
However...that is another thread. ;)
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Charging £10 for missed appointments may help to concentrate the mind. :y
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Well, it does not take much thinking about the basic causes......
Bigger population....living longer, immigration, etc
Closing A and E units
Increasing managers/white collar staff
Closing Hospitals and closing wards
Reducing Nursing staff over the years
All the above are contributory factors. Obviously, idiots that go to A&E for stupid reasons don't help.
I would have thought that any sensible person could work out, for example, closing the A&E and Maternity departments from my two closest hospitals and putting them to Stoke Mandeville does not help SM with their
capabilities. I expect some hospitals in other areas have been dumped on Stoke Mandeville too >:(
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Dont forget the Bi££ions we give to the EU every year and people are living longer , more and more families are taking in their own parents due to care home costs so its not that >:(
Should be a charge for drunks wasting A&E time as well >:( >:(
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I'm not so sure it's as bad as the media make out, TBH (apart from all the waste).
My doctor's surgery irritate me because they won't allow me to book non-urgent visits to my GP in advance. If I phone them, they insist on giving me an appointment later that day or next day, when there's insufficient notice to arrange work commitments around it. ::)
Pharmacies are taking an increasing workload from the NHS. My local chemist has offered me NHS flu jabs while I've been collecting prescriptions the last couple of winters, saving an appointment at the surgery, and they can now carry out reviews for certain conditions, again, saving an appointment at the surgery.
I agree that those who are no-shows at surgeries, or present for time-wasting reasons, should pay a penalty. It should be free at the point of use to those who don't waste resources, however.
Both of my parents have had episodes requiring surgery in the last 3 months. In my Dad's case it was not life threatening but completely debilitating. He was operated on the day after presenting himself at casualty. In my Mum's case it was potentially cancer (but thankfully didn't turn out that way) and she got various scans, a biopsy then straight into Guy's for a major operation within a couple of weeks.
I don't doubt that some are failed by the NHS, but I've yet to personally experience care that could be improved in any way, TBH.
It does come at an enormous cost, of course, and, like most things in the public sector, the government risk a huge revolt if they dare to try to make it more efficient.
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It is enormous cost, and not trying to be political, and continuing emd's post, our taxes/monies are being spent wrongly.
Overseas aid, HS2, etc are other projects that should be second after getting our own house in order. There are many other areas where home should come first, but it always falls on deaf ears.
As regards the 'living longer' I would be interested to know what the death rates are today for all ages
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This A & E crisis that the media is getting all worked up about is all about targets.
In England 95% of A&E admissions have to be seen within 4 hours, but at my local A&E (Dorset County Hospital, Dorchester) something like 94.6% were seen within 4 hours during December, so it is classed as failing or in crisis! Really? :-\
Maybe the 5.4% who had to wait longer than 4 hours, were those who could or should have waited to see their GP later in the day or even the following day! ::) :-\
Maybe Triage Nurses should have the power to send people away with instructions to make an appointment with their GP! ;) I bet that would help things along somewhat! :y
Also the statistics are much worse in Wales where 83.8% got seen within 4 hours during November. So why aren't the BBC and Labour getting in a lather about those figures? Maybe it might have something to do with the fact that the Welsh NHS is run by the Labour Welsh Government! :o ::) Ooops! :D
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This A & E crisis that the media is getting all worked up about is all about targets.
In England 95% of A&E admissions have to be seen within 4 hours, but at my local A&E (Dorset County Hospital, Dorchester) something like 94.6% were seen within 4 hours during December, so it is classed as failing or in crisis! Really? :-\
Maybe the 5.4% who had to wait longer than 4 hours, were those who could or should have waited to see their GP later in the day or even the following day! ::) :-\
Maybe Triage Nurses should have the power to send people away with instructions to make an appointment with their GP! ;) I bet that would help things along somewhat! :y
Yes, this might well be part of the problem. As soon as you have targets, they distort the motivations of the staff away from pure clinical need. Once someone is in the "system", the clock starts ticking and they need to be "seen" within 4 hours, and telling them to sling their hook and stop being so silly doesn't register as "seen" so a worthy patient gets to lie on a bed in a corridor until they can think of something to prescribe to the time waster.
Besides, it's a busy time of year, as we're all told. If the system was meeting its' targets at all times, busy included, there's be unacceptable wastage at slack times of the year.
Not that I'm an expert in hospitals, but I've seen reliance on metrics over common sense @rse up plenty of other systems.
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To those of you who blame immigrants for the problems in the NHS. I agree, to a point but, unfortunately, if we sent them all home there wouldn't be any doctors at all. ;D
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This A & E crisis that the media is getting all worked up about is all about targets.
In England 95% of A&E admissions have to be seen within 4 hours, but at my local A&E (Dorset County Hospital, Dorchester) something like 94.6% were seen within 4 hours during December, so it is classed as failing or in crisis! Really? :-\
Maybe the 5.4% who had to wait longer than 4 hours, were those who could or should have waited to see their GP later in the day or even the following day! ::) :-\
Maybe Triage Nurses should have the power to send people away with instructions to make an appointment with their GP! ;) I bet that would help things along somewhat! :y
Waiting up to four hours at A and E to be seen? I think that is outrageous. I would expect to be seen within minutes of arriving with a genuine problem not my tattoo hurts. I only have two experiences thank goodness of A and E in Spain. Both those were waiting time of less than five minutes AND I suspect someone eyeballed the incomers to drop what they were doing.
You have to have targets otherwise it cannot be managed. maybe the targets need refining.
I like the Triage on your bike idea for non A and E cases.
Another thing that should be charged is drunks with a double charge for violent drunks. I would have separate units for them (in the old days they were called police cells) and they would be funded by a tax on drinks companies.
I currently have an aunt in law in hospital waiting for care(4 times a day) to be available so she can go home. 15 weeks of which the bed blocking might be 8 or 9.
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The money UK plc pay on overseas aid and EU membership etc would make the square root of sod all difference.
2 problems affect the NHS - inefficiency and the way society use A&E instead of GPs (I accept GPs (or rather the bloody receptionists) do make it difficult, as Kevin Wood says, they are only interested on targets).
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This A & E crisis that the media is getting all worked up about is all about targets.
In England 95% of A&E admissions have to be seen within 4 hours, but at my local A&E (Dorset County Hospital, Dorchester) something like 94.6% were seen within 4 hours during December, so it is classed as failing or in crisis! Really? :-\
Maybe the 5.4% who had to wait longer than 4 hours, were those who could or should have waited to see their GP later in the day or even the following day! ::) :-\
Maybe Triage Nurses should have the power to send people away with instructions to make an appointment with their GP! ;) I bet that would help things along somewhat! :y
Also the statistics are much worse in Wales where 83.8% got seen within 4 hours during November. So why aren't the BBC and Labour getting in a lather about those figures? Maybe it might have something to do with the fact that the Welsh NHS is run by the Labour Welsh Government! :o ::) Ooops! :D
Really! I had to visit Dorchester A&E a few years ago, to have a dressing changed on my hand...l got seen to in 10mins!!!
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The money UK plc pay on overseas aid and EU membership etc would make the square root of sod all difference.
2 problems affect the NHS - inefficiency and the way society use A&E instead of GPs (I accept GPs (or rather the bloody receptionists) do make it difficult, as Kevin Wood says, they are only interested on targets).
When I book an appointment they always ask what the problem is.
I always reply. I'll discuss that with the doctor thanks, not you.
Most of these women seem to be 'enjoying' the menopause. I'm not about to trust them with ahem...ahem.....delicate medical details. Discreet they are not.
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I fail to see how £13billion a year paid to the EU would not make any difference if given to funding the NHS :-\
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I'm not so sure it's as bad as the media make out, TBH (apart from all the waste).
My doctor's surgery irritate me because they won't allow me to book non-urgent visits to my GP in advance. If I phone them, they insist on giving me an appointment later that day or next day, when there's insufficient notice to arrange work commitments around it. ::)
Pharmacies are taking an increasing workload from the NHS. My local chemist has offered me NHS flu jabs while I've been collecting prescriptions the last couple of winters, saving an appointment at the surgery, and they can now carry out reviews for certain conditions, again, saving an appointment at the surgery.
I agree that those who are no-shows at surgeries, or present for time-wasting reasons, should pay a penalty. It should be free at the point of use to those who don't waste resources, however.
Both of my parents have had episodes requiring surgery in the last 3 months. In my Dad's case it was not life threatening but completely debilitating. He was operated on the day after presenting himself at casualty. In my Mum's case it was potentially cancer (but thankfully didn't turn out that way) and she got various scans, a biopsy then straight into Guy's for a major operation within a couple of weeks.
I don't doubt that some are failed by the NHS, but I've yet to personally experience care that could be improved in any way, TBH.
It does come at an enormous cost, of course, and, like most things in the public sector, the government risk a huge revolt if they dare to try to make it more efficient.
And they also go the other way...of being unhelpful and then cost the nhs more....
Example....im diabetic....every pharmacy ive been too....asking for 'whatever' ....then ask me if im diabetic...when I reply yes.....refuse to sell me anything and refer me to docs surgery....
Result....I was prepared to buy the item off the pharmacy....my surgery writes a script for the same thing and as im diabetic I get it free!!
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I fail to see how £13billion a year paid to the EU would not make any difference if given to funding the NHS :-\
The NHS treats a million people every 36 hours, that's 243333334 people each year :o
£13 billion equates to £53 per NHS patient. Doubt it would go very far...
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243 million? There are only 70 million people in the UK and I haven't seen a doctor in ages. Who's getting my share? I should be able to save up all my appointments and be seen immediately when I am ill.
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My dad had to be rushed in on Sunday. Ambulance called at 12.45 ,didn't get to him until 3.45. Bloody hospital only a mile away. That was Blackpool Victoria.
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My dad had to be rushed in on Sunday. Ambulance called at 12.45 ,didn't get to him until 3.45. Bloody hospital only a mile away. That was Blackpool Victoria.
Sorry to hear that :( How is he doing?
Does raise the question as to why he wasn't taken there rather than waiting three hours...
I understand there might be very good reasons why not, and mean nothing by it, merely asking the question.
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According to the BBC a major reason for the A&E crisis is that patients are complaining they can't get an appointment at their local GP, so go to A&E instead!
Labour renegotiated about 10 years ago a new contract with GP's it doubled their wages from about £100k to £200k and relieving them of working out of hours. The other side of the coin was that in return, they would take much more of the workload including minor ops to make regular NHS crises much less likely. Obviously, it is working well. ::) ::) ::)
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According to the BBC a major reason for the A&E crisis is that patients are complaining they can't get an appointment at their local GP, so go to A&E instead!
Labour renegotiated about 10 years ago a new contract with GP's it doubled their wages from about £100k to £200k and relieving them of working out of hours. The other side of the coin was that in return, they would take much more of the workload including minor ops to make regular NHS crises much less likely. Obviously, it is working well. ::) ::) ::)
I am not sure that is a fair critique of GP's from my experience. We have two elderly relatives in difficulties at the moment. One was visited out of hours to make an assessment (care home or continue at his home with carers) . The GP then called after the visit to give their prognosis including recommending a specific care home that would suit his needs.
We are able as next of kin to have Email discussions about these relatives. Often quite detailed.
The other person , the GP took time out and made an appointment to ring us to discuss in length their situation - after hours
I think people overlook three basic givens
1. There are more people in the UK.
2. More of those people are living longer and throwing up auxilliary health problems that wouldn't have been there twenty years ago (that age group would have been dead then)
3. Social Services has been slashed despite and ever increasing number of olds that need their care.
Interestingly Holland has initiated "care in your family" policies. In other words YOU will be responsible for looking after your parents , aunts etc when they need care. God help the UK if Cameron Boris Johnson latches onto it and initiates that in the UK. Great money saver!!
Like I said at the beginning the whole NHS needs a root and branch reform and charging brought in (with auto debits from your bank acct for missed appointments for example). Will any government do it? No, four yearism.
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£300 for an op? Assuming that includes diagnostic procedures I'd have elected to carry on sh.. pooping blood & blood clots rather than pay that to have a camera stuffed up there which (so far) has ultimately told me nothing is wrong (except the obvious that there's clearly no medical cause for… hmm!)
Or I'd have gone private and paid my £100 excess ;) ;D
Did you opt for sedation when they did that or have it done "as is"?
If the latter, you need to become an MP or a priest ;D
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They gave me 2mg of something, but given how everyone described the sedation to me I'm not convinced it did a lot! I felt completely normal, not even like I'd had a drink..
It wasn't too bad except when she was trying to navigate around the bends...
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And they also go the other way...of being unhelpful and then cost the nhs more....
Example....im diabetic....every pharmacy ive been too....asking for 'whatever' ....then ask me if im diabetic...when I reply yes.....refuse to sell me anything and refer me to docs surgery....
Result....I was prepared to buy the item off the pharmacy....my surgery writes a script for the same thing and as im diabetic I get it free!!
There was a chemist near my office who was like that. Went out of business in the end. ::)
He always gave me the Spanish inquisition when I picked up a prescription, as if the docs wouldn't have told me what it was for, how it worked and how much to take when, what side effects to expect, etc. Just the sort of nonsense you want to spend half your lunch hour hearing when you're picking up a prescription you've been on for 30 years.
Anyway, I was moaning to a female colleague about this once. Her response "You don't ever have to go there and buy a box of Tampons". :o ;D