Omega Owners Forum
Omega Help Area => Omega General Help => Topic started by: Omega russ on 30 October 2016, 07:42:01
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Hi I'm having a problem with my 2.5 v6 it's low on power Till it goes over 3000 rpm then it goes as it always does
I've fitted new plugs
Coolant temperature sensor
I've also tried another air flow meter
Nothing showing up on my vaux com
Or my mates tech 2
Has anybody else had a problem like this?
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My first thought was,are the multi rams working? I could be way off on this and no doubt someone will be along later to shoot me down and advize better!
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Check your compression, should be between 12 - 15 bar and no more than 1 bar difference between cylinders :y My HGs went stripped it and the cylinders where coked up and the valves needed a decoke and lapping compressions are now up and equal :D
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My first thought was,are the multi rams working? I could be way off on this and no doubt someone will be along later to shoot me down and advize better!
Good shout, especially if it's a sudden fault ;)
Recheck recent work done and be sure that the various vacuum pipes are properly connected.
There's a guide for testing the multirams :y
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Thanks everyone will look at it today
An let you no how I get on
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Ok I've checked the muti ram that looks to be working ok
I've put a new fuel filter on an it looks like the old 1 has collapsed lots of s#*t coming out of it an it rattling inside
So I checked inside the tank for bits that maybe in there but it looks ok
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Ok I've checked the muti ram that looks to be working ok
I've put a new fuel filter on an it looks like the old 1 has collapsed lots of s#*t coming out of it an it rattling inside
So I checked inside the tank for bits that maybe in there but it looks ok
Both of them?
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Yes both moving
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Ok :y
Manual or auto?
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It's an auto
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What rpm should the rear multi ram open at?
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http://www.omegaowners.com/forum/index.php?topic=90513.msg1155347#msg1155347
:y
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I might have a intermittent fault with my rear 1 by the looks of it
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I was surprised when you said Multirams were fine, to be honest. It really is classic Multiram failure.
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If you want to whip your plenum off, you can replace/swap fairly easily the actuator/solenoid witht he one on the front intake, or alternatively, the SAI system, they're all, handily, the same. In theory, the SAI only kicks in on startup, so gets lots less use than the others. :)
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Does anybody know the part number or where I can get a new solenoid from?
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Not off the top of my head but as I say - swap it over, which will do two things...
1 confirm (or not) that you have faulty multirams
2 cure the problem (for free) because the SAI (Secondary Air Injection system) is considered a completely redundant system. Many, myself included, remove it completely.
:y
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Ok will try the 1 off there
Thanks very much for the help :y
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Obviously if you're confident that the front one works well, then swapping it with that one, also it worth doing, methodically.
Just be aware that when replacing the plenum it is very easy to trap a hose, wiring loom, or even accidentally knock on o-ring, all of which can then cause a vac leak, and dodgy running. Very common accident, I've been there! ;)
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check them dang vacuum boxes too (covered on a guide here somewhere). i had one not working. full power restored afterwards :y
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Ahh,. Mr Webby speaks truth. I'm getting spares when I see them, these days. Same here.
The 'check' and malady should be searchable on here (plenty of people have had the issue) but it goes something like this - bonnet open, run/stop the engine, pull off the thin vac hose that goes into the vac reservoir at the front of the engine.
(this is a rounded black box, mounted on the air intake at the front of the engine, with two tubes going into it) as below
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTIxNVgxNjAw/z/vFoAAOSwsFpWTx~s/$_1.JPG)
You should hear a 'hiss' as air escapes. If you have a leak/fault non-return valve, then no hiss. I don't recall which is the one you need to be pulling off, but it'll take a maximum of two goes to find out! :D
There is another vac reservoir inside the scuttle, which is harder to get to, but think about it logically and you don't pull the vac hose off the vac tank itself, but trace where they go, and pull them at the other end. If any of this has gone a bit too in-depth / technical, just say. Sounds complicated, as easy as sucking a drinking straw. :y
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Quick update I've got 2 solenoids to try on the multi ram this weekend see if they solve the problem
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Quick update I've fitted another solenoid to the rear multi ram it seems better but still plays up now an again
Has anybody got any ideas what I could try next?
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Ahh,. Mr Webby speaks truth. I'm getting spares when I see them, these days. Same here.
The 'check' and malady should be searchable on here (plenty of people have had the issue) but it goes something like this - bonnet open, run/stop the engine, pull off the thin vac hose that goes into the vac reservoir at the front of the engine.
(this is a rounded black box, mounted on the air intake at the front of the engine, with two tubes going into it) as below
(http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTIxNVgxNjAw/z/vFoAAOSwsFpWTx~s/$_1.JPG)
You should hear a 'hiss' as air escapes. If you have a leak/fault non-return valve, then no hiss. I don't recall which is the one you need to be pulling off, but it'll take a maximum of two goes to find out! :D
There is another vac reservoir inside the scuttle, which is harder to get to, but think about it logically and you don't pull the vac hose off the vac tank itself, but trace where they go, and pull them at the other end. If any of this has gone a bit too in-depth / technical, just say. Sounds complicated, as easy as sucking a drinking straw. :y
My 1994 PFL only had one reservoir. My 2003 FL has two.
My 1994 PFL behaved as described and I think the problem was caused by air leaks in the heater controls. My assumption is that the second tank was added to later cars to isolate the vacuum for the multirams from the vacuum for the climate controls :-\
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I've tried both boxes an getting the hiss of air out of both
The problem is still there
Has anybody got any other things I could try?
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I've tried another ecu on the car now but it's still doing the same thing
Can anyone suggest anything else I can try?
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Does anybody think it Could this be injector related possibly
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Does anybody think it Could this be injector related possibly
No.
Go over the vacuum system again, ensuring that it's piped correctly and that there are no leaks as that is by far the most likely cause of your problem.
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I've tried another ecu on the car now but it's still doing the same thing
Can anyone suggest anything else I can try?
Basic maintenance really:
Check the cam belt timing
Check the air filter
Check that the throttles actually open fully when the pedal is floored
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Really stuck with what to try next
Car now has a splutter underload then clears at higher revs
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Yes both moving
Both moving, you say. I had a similar problem on a 2.5. I found it hard to check the movement of the plenum dual ram. This one has to be open at idle, then close at low revs to give low rpm torque, and open at high revs to give max power. If it's stuck open it will cause poor torque at low revs. Eventually I found the butterfly was stuck open. I changed it and full performance was restored.
Are you sure the plenum butterfly is closing at low revs?
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What's the best way to see if the butterfly is opening?
When I deck the throttle from idle the arm on the rear of the inlet goes in.
is that right?
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Dis pack... is the scuttle foam wet?
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Fuel pump?
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I relocated the dis pack to the front of the engine so it's not that
Is there any way of test the fuel pump or is it just a case of changing it
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I relocated the dis pack to the front of the engine so it's not that
Is there any way of test the fuel pump or is it just a case of changing it
Have you checked, or are you presuming? All the leads checked/tested? Any water/oil in the plug wells?
When the 3.2 misfired, it would rev well once above 3000rpm, because the engine was spinning fast enough for dropping one cylinder not to matter...
I pretty much guarantee that it isn't fuel related as the engine revs...
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What's the best way to see if the butterfly is opening?
When I deck the throttle from idle the arm on the rear of the inlet goes in.
is that right?
Terry is refering to the front multiram... pop the two rubber elbows that feed the plenum off and look down if the plate between the two is vertical, then it's closed, if it's horizontal then it's open... valve is the same part as one in the plenum.
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Really stuck with what to try next
Car now has a splutter underload then clears at higher revs
How big are the spark plug gaps?
When my 2.5 did this I fitted new plugs and that cured it.
I didn't take a photo on that occasion, this photo is from when I changed the plugs in my 2.6 to illustrate how much erosion occurs in normal use.
(http://homepages.nildram.co.uk/~aholter/PICT4771A.JPG)
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What's the best way to see if the butterfly is opening?
When I deck the throttle from idle the arm on the rear of the inlet goes in.
is that right?
Terry is refering to the front multiram... pop the two rubber elbows that feed the plenum off and look down if the plate between the two is vertical, then it's closed, if it's horizontal then it's open... valve is the same part as one in the plenum.
I was referring to the plenum multiram. On an earlier V6 car the idle control valve feeds air to the 2-4-6 (left hand) side and can only get to 1-3-5 pots via the open dual ram. Once the throttle is opened dual ram butterfly closes, opening again above 3000rpm.
Having said that, watching plenum ram
behaviour on my 2.5 I cannot see it move. Perhaps on a cold engine it does not close; must try again when engine is hot.
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Thanks for the help everyone :y
I will have another look over everything weekend and let you know how I get on
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I've had a look the flap it vertical
It's clean and free moving
I've try another solenoid that I no works and it's still the same
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I now have a splutter under load all the time
It's fine top end and on idle
Can anybody suggest anything it could be?
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Spark plugs
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Thanks Andy h will put them on the list of things to check weekend going to take the inlet off an go over everything I can think of checking
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Quick update the cars been at 2 garages now
Had a smoke test for air leaks found the seals on the breather box leaking sorted them but the car is still spluttering under load intill it's at high revs
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Have you pulled leads out and check if they're being boiled by oil in the wells? Or water ingress as per gollums earlier post?
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Yes checked them and the spark plugs all fine